Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Firing on U.S. Citizens.
Vanity | Fithee

Posted on 03/01/2004 5:18:27 AM PST by Fithee

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-105 next last
To: American_Centurion
If you don't know what a person stands for and believes you shouldn't vote for them.

Voting is done by considering party affiliation, not principles. At least for themajority. Those who put principle above party are far too few in number to make any significant difference in an election.

51 posted on 03/01/2004 7:49:28 AM PST by templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: G.Mason
I have opinions, like all of us here, but I have no right to hold you up to ridicule. For that I apologize.

Not a problem G. I understand how divisive the party/principle threads are here and try to limit myself to addressing issues lately.

52 posted on 03/01/2004 7:51:11 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: Fithee
bttt
53 posted on 03/01/2004 7:53:19 AM PST by stainlessbanner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BabsC
Instead of Peace Keepers we have Law Enforcers working for a "criminal" justice system

Going to get a lot worse, imo. The PTB have the so called right and left hating each other so much they'll accept about any action of government as long as it's directed at the opposition. In the end it gives them increased power over us all, which of course is the goal to start with.

54 posted on 03/01/2004 7:59:49 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
About 25.
55 posted on 03/01/2004 8:02:49 AM PST by Eastbound
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: steve50
In the end it gives them increased power over us all, which of course is the goal to start with.

Total CONTROL of the people is the goal.
56 posted on 03/01/2004 8:11:16 AM PST by B4Ranch (Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.--Eleanor Roosevelt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: BabsC
"Instead of Peace Keepers we have Law Enforcers working for a "criminal" justice system."

I don't think justice is even in the picture anymore.

57 posted on 03/01/2004 8:14:15 AM PST by B4Ranch (Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.--Eleanor Roosevelt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: Fithee
Subject:
-> The Pentagon has Classified the results of a survey taken last May 10 at
-> a southern california Marines Corps base to determine if the servicemen
-> would
-> be willing to "fire upon U.S. citizens" in a Federal program to
-> confiscate privately-owned firearms. In addition, claims by the Navy
-> that the survey was given only to Marines at the California base appears
-> to be false.

-> 300 TOOK SURVEY

-> The 300 Marines who took the survey - on a voluntary basis according to
-> Hoffman {Judge Advocate at the base} - were asked whether they agreed,
-> disagreed or had no opinion regarding a number of situations or
-> scenarios, outlined on the survey, most of which dealt with serving in
-> multi-national or United Nations commands.
-> The final statement ,however, shocked Americans when they learned about
-> it (SPOTLIGHT, July 25).
-> The statement was : "The U.S. Government declares a ban on the
-> possession, sale and transfer of all non-sporting firearms. A thirty
-> (30) day amnesty is permitted for these firearms to be turned over to
-> local authorities. At the end of this period, a number of citizen
-> groups refuse to turn over thier firearms.
-> Consider the following statement: "I will fire upon U.S. citizens who
-> refuse or resist confiscation of firearms banned by the U.S.
-> government."

-> WHY A SECRET
-> The question which now arises from the incident is why the details of a
-> student's post-graduate studies, if indeed they are so "innocuous", have
-> been CLASSIFIED {ed-emphasis} by the Navy and the Marines.

-> The Navy claims that the survey was given only to Marines at Twentynine
-> Palms. However, last January the SPOTLIGHT and Modern Gun magazine
-> reported that a survey posing the same question about servicemens
-> willingness to shoot at American citizens in a gun confiscation program
-> was given to
-> elite Navy SEAL's. >From Army Special Forces sources, the SPOTLIGHT has
-> determined that the survey was first presented to Navy SEAL Team Six
-> last Sept. 15 and then to other SEAL units through the rest of
-> September and then in October {1993}. Last January 22 {1994} the
-> Internet,the huge nation wide computer network, carried a message
-> from SEAL Team Six Petty Officer 2nd Class, W. Kelly to a D.Hankins.
-> In the Internet message Kelly said the survey had been given to
-> determine, "if we would follow the orders of commanding officers
-> without question." "If you wish to find out how I answered," Kelly
-> continued, " I said YES, I WOULD FIRE AND KILL ALL PERSONS ATTEMPTING
-> TO RESIST. WE AREN'T AROUND TO BE THE GOOD GUYS.
58 posted on 03/01/2004 8:27:24 AM PST by MissAmericanPie
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: templar
Voting is done by considering party affiliation, not principles. At least for the majority.

I agree with you, in fact I am in that majority on almost all Federal elections. But that is because I am convinced that the Dems are truly enemies of freedom and the Republic.

The sad part is that corruption and lying are, at least to a certain extent,accepted characteristics of pols. Even when honesty and character are visibly displayed large numbers of people will readily believe that the pol is a liar.

59 posted on 03/01/2004 9:40:14 AM PST by American_Centurion (Daisy-cutters trump a wiretap anytime - Nicole Gelinas)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: Blood of Tyrants
Anyone STILL think that the WOD is worth it?

Just the WOD people. No price is too great to pay, no loss of liberty too extreme, to fight the WOD in their minds.

I flatly don't understand the WOD mindset, but I see no real difference between it (the WOD mindset) and the anti-gunner mindset.

60 posted on 03/01/2004 9:50:52 AM PST by templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: MissAmericanPie
I hope that SEAL Team Six Petty Officer 2nd Class, W. Kelly is no longer part of our armed forces. I also hope that he is entirely ATYPICAL of those serving with honor in both the armed forces and in the various special forces.

BTW, where did you get this information?
61 posted on 03/01/2004 10:14:24 AM PST by Ancesthntr
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 58 | View Replies]

To: steve50
"I understand how divisive the party/principle threads are here and try to limit myself to addressing issues lately."

You have something there.

Think I will lay off also.

Just no sense in tearing each other up. After all, we (Freepers) really want what's best for the United States, no matter how we individually see that end, or for that matter, which of our problems should be the most prominent one to be remedied in that pursuit.

Not being of the same cloth as our Founding Fathers, who railed against each other while forming this great experiment, who am I to even think I should know the answers.


I do wish us all good luck.


regards

62 posted on 03/01/2004 10:49:13 AM PST by G.Mason ("We will never seek a permission slip to defend the United States of America" G.W. Bush)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: steve50
Be more interesting to see if we got rid of the twenty six percent who said yes.

At this point I'd say it's more likely they were promoted.

We know of one who was promoted, retired and was a candidate for the Democrat Presidential nomination.

63 posted on 03/01/2004 11:02:25 AM PST by FreePaul
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: FreePaul
Clark has said he would fire on US citizens who refuse to give up their arms? I must have missed that.
64 posted on 03/01/2004 11:13:54 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 63 | View Replies]

To: G.Mason
Not being of the same cloth as our Founding Fathers, who railed against each other while forming this great experiment, who am I to even think I should know the answers. I do wish us all good luck.

As do I George, after all, as Red Green says "we're all in this together". It's a shame things got so out of hand here a couple years back, the place lost some pretty good thinkers along with the alleged disruptors.

65 posted on 03/01/2004 11:32:22 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 62 | View Replies]

To: steve50
"As do I George, after all, as Red Green says "we're all in this together". It's a shame things got so out of hand here a couple years back, the place lost some pretty good thinkers along with the alleged disruptors."

We have lost some good ones, you are right.

Red Green Show ... sigh ... Now that was entertainment!

66 posted on 03/01/2004 11:37:03 AM PST by G.Mason ("We will never seek a permission slip to defend the United States of America" G.W. Bush)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 65 | View Replies]

To: G.Mason
Yeah, it's always easier to blame the voters instead of the leaders, isn't it?
67 posted on 03/01/2004 12:40:56 PM PST by Henrietta
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Henrietta
"Yeah, it's always easier to blame the voters instead of the leaders, isn't it?"

To which particular reply do you refer?

68 posted on 03/01/2004 12:57:50 PM PST by G.Mason ("We will never seek a permission slip to defend the United States of America" G.W. Bush)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 67 | View Replies]

To: G.Mason
twenty three
69 posted on 03/01/2004 1:15:17 PM PST by Henrietta
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 68 | View Replies]

To: steve50
...be interesting to see what the numbers are now.

Indeed, especially given the increasing number of non-citizens serving in the armed forces.

70 posted on 03/01/2004 1:54:21 PM PST by inquest (The only problem with partisanship is that it leads to bipartisanship)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Ancesthntr
Did a google search and it came up. I know what you mean, we certainly hope our servicemen are more than paid mercenaries and that they are as pro-fellow countrymen, as the Russian soldiers were in St Petersburg when they refused to fire on the demonstrators or roll their tanks over them.

Hard to tell anymore.
71 posted on 03/01/2004 2:10:30 PM PST by MissAmericanPie
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: steve50
Clark has said he would fire on US citizens who refuse to give up their arms? I must have missed that.

You didn't miss it. Remember Waco? He and his subordinates were involved in that.

72 posted on 03/01/2004 4:23:08 PM PST by FreePaul
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 64 | View Replies]

To: FreePaul
You didn't miss it. Remember Waco? He and his subordinates were involved in that.

Hey, that's right. We got a guy or two this administration promoted that was involved with that as well.

73 posted on 03/01/2004 6:08:13 PM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 72 | View Replies]

To: MissAmericanPie; harpseal
pinging harpseal - Comments??
74 posted on 03/01/2004 6:23:20 PM PST by AFreeBird (your mileage may vary)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 58 | View Replies]

To: AFreeBird
A person was working on a post graduate degree and distibuted a questionaire at Twenty-nine palms supposedly. Also supposedly the person conducting the survey got an overwhelming negative response from noncoms and officers but a more positive response from lower enlisted rates.
75 posted on 03/01/2004 7:43:14 PM PST by harpseal (Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 74 | View Replies]

To: Henrietta
"twenty three"

Oh ... okay.

I'm not blaming anybody, just saying it as I see it.

After all, who am I to have all the answers?

I meant to cast no "stones" and have aplologized for the ones I did.

All of us here have strong opinions. Some, like me, get carried away, from time to time, but with no malicious intent.

The fact is we, here, all want what is best for our counrty, and have different ideas on which problems are a priority, and just how those problems should be rectified. Else we wouldn't be here, would we?

Though politics is my fervent hobby, alas, I am no diplomat in my pursuit of it.

For that I apologize.

76 posted on 03/02/2004 4:48:45 AM PST by G.Mason ("We will never seek a permission slip to defend the United States of America" G.W. Bush)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 69 | View Replies]

To: steve50
For some reason the current administration seemed willing to assume the burden of the previous administration as to many of the appointees and hangers on. Since the Bush group didn't make a clean sweep they have to accept blame for anything that happens now as well as sharing the responsibility for misdeeds of the past.
77 posted on 03/02/2004 5:12:44 AM PST by FreePaul
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 73 | View Replies]

To: G.Mason
Post away. I have no idea what your point is anyway. Doubt if any else does either.

I had initial thoughts of posting some of their names here, and decided, in the intrest of FR, not to do so.

78 posted on 03/02/2004 5:20:38 AM PST by DManA
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: DManA
"Post away. I have no idea what your point is anyway. Doubt if any else does either."

Being both tired of replying to this post and embarrassed by the placement of my "foot in mouth", I will point you to the post replies. The history of which should be living proof that I am mere mortal man.




"Sometimes I wonder if I'm patriotic enough. Yes, I want to kill people, but on both sides" ... John Handey

79 posted on 03/02/2004 5:47:04 AM PST by G.Mason ("We will never seek a permission slip to defend the United States of America" G.W. Bush)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 78 | View Replies]

To: FreePaul
For some reason the current administration seemed willing to assume the burden of the previous administration as to many of the appointees and hangers on.

I believe efforts to promote Army people involved in this goes far beyond the "hangers on" excuse.

80 posted on 03/02/2004 6:03:32 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 77 | View Replies]

To: steve50
"Going to get a lot worse, imo. The PTB have the so called right and left hating each other so much they'll accept about any action of government as long as it's directed at the opposition. In the end it gives them increased power over us all, which of course is the goal to start with."

Agreed. Divide and conquer, right?
81 posted on 03/02/2004 9:56:21 AM PST by Henrietta
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
"I don't think justice is even in the picture anymore."

Me neither. The State needs bodies, a continual stream of them to justify the existence of programs and personnel designed to keep us "safe," all while convincing us to give up ever more of our liberties.

The Senate voted to extend the AWB today. Feel safer?
82 posted on 03/02/2004 9:58:10 AM PST by Henrietta
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 57 | View Replies]

To: Henrietta
Agreed. Divide and conquer, right?

When you take a close look at history it seems to have always been the case. As long as we're lynching each other we're not going after the real crooks.

83 posted on 03/02/2004 10:00:05 AM PST by steve50 ("Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." -H. L. Mencken)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: harpseal
Thanks, I was specifically looking for a comment on #58, which mentioned SEALS.

Would you say that was indicitive of thinking amongst the lower ranks, even in the SEALS?

Just curious.

84 posted on 03/02/2004 10:35:20 AM PST by AFreeBird (your mileage may vary)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 75 | View Replies]

To: AFreeBird
How one answers such a survey and how one actually behaves are really two seperate issues. I personally am convinced that the majority of memebrs of the teams would very much turn their weapons on those giving the orders. I could be wrong but that is just y opinion. They also realize they too will become civilians at some point.
85 posted on 03/02/2004 12:56:45 PM PST by harpseal (Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 84 | View Replies]

To: templar
"Just the WOD people. No price is too great to pay, no loss of liberty too extreme, to fight the WOD in their minds. I flatly don't understand the WOD mindset, but I see no real difference between it (the WOD mindset) and the anti-gunner mindset

Consider that a majority of the conservative base is rooted in Judeo-Christian ethics. Now ask, would Christ sooner be anti-gun, or anti-drug? Probably the latter ("Let him carry a sword"), considering the Old Testament's stance against drunkenness.

86 posted on 03/07/2004 10:00:37 AM PST by Windsong
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 60 | View Replies]

To: templar
"Just the WOD people. No price is too great to pay, no loss of liberty too extreme, to fight the WOD in their minds. I flatly don't understand the WOD mindset, but I see no real difference between it (the WOD mindset) and the anti-gunner mindset

Consider that a majority of the conservative base is rooted in Judeo-Christian ethics. Now ask, would Christ sooner be anti-gun, or anti-drug? Probably the latter ("Let him carry a sword"), considering the Old Testament's stance against drunkenness.

87 posted on 03/07/2004 10:02:06 AM PST by Windsong
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 60 | View Replies]

To: Fithee
February 26th, 1993: First World Trade Center Attack.

February 26th, 1993:Waco

88 posted on 03/07/2004 10:02:11 AM PST by ChadGore ("Maybe they thought Saddam would lose the next Iraqi election")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ChadGore
Opps, make that:

February 26th, 1993: First World Trade Center Attack.

February 28th, 1993:Waco

89 posted on 03/07/2004 10:03:11 AM PST by ChadGore ("Maybe they thought Saddam would lose the next Iraqi election")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 88 | View Replies]

To: Windsong
oops...
90 posted on 03/07/2004 10:03:32 AM PST by Windsong
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 87 | View Replies]

To: Windsong
. Now ask, would Christ sooner be anti-gun, or anti-drug

Christ didn't oppose slavery either. Was he on the South's side in the civil war? I believe it was Frank Buchman, a noted and highly influential Lutheran evangalist, that proclaimed Adolph Hitler to be Christ's answer to Communism back in the '30s.

I find it more personally productive to try to be on God's side than to try to invoke him to being on my side. And I don't see the WOD as being at all Godly in nature.

91 posted on 03/07/2004 12:34:19 PM PST by templar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 87 | View Replies]

To: templar
Well, I don't disagree with you there. At times I think he would be neither, since he obviously had a problem with man's narrow way of thinking. His statement "Reject the world and everything in it, for my kingdom is not of it" says a lot about our petty politics, IMHO. On Judgement Day, mankind will be judged according to the His word, not ours.

"And why dost thee care for that? Follow me, thou!"

92 posted on 03/07/2004 1:28:38 PM PST by Windsong
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 91 | View Replies]

To: steve50
13 % said they would fire on their own. There was talk of the 13% from each group being put together in units.
93 posted on 03/07/2004 2:08:01 PM PST by philetus (Keep doing what you always do and you'll keep getting what you always get)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Fithee
I remember that back in 1993
94 posted on 03/07/2004 2:09:05 PM PST by raloxk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Consort
I actually think Terezza could be worse than Hillary
95 posted on 03/07/2004 2:13:12 PM PST by raloxk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Fithee
"The Clinton Administration found some military 'suck ups' and 'kiss a$$es' to do its dirty work."

Wesley Clark?

96 posted on 03/07/2004 2:14:09 PM PST by raloxk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Ancesthntr; Travis McGee
I hope that SEAL Team Six Petty Officer 2nd Class, W. Kelly is no longer part of our armed forces. I also hope that he is entirely ATYPICAL of those serving with honor in both the armed forces and in the various special forces.

I sincerely doubt that "W. Kelly" was ever in SEAL Team Six--that name for the unit went out of use long before that email was sent. Additionally, operators assigned to the Naval Special Warfare Development Group (the correct name for the unit in question) are not known for being chatty about their work while they're in that assignment.

Frankly, I doubt that "W. Kelly" was ever a SEAL, or even a Petty Officer 2nd Class. (Note that the elusive Mr. Kelly didn't have a rate, such as bosun's mate, radioman, or any other job specialty.)

97 posted on 03/07/2004 2:22:06 PM PST by Poohbah ("Would you mind not shooting at the thermonuclear weapons?" -- Maj. Vic Deakins, USAF)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: Ancesthntr
I don't believe any SEALs ever took the survey. I believe LCDR Cunningham's version, that this was a one-time test given to 300 marines for his PHD thesis on operaions-other-than-war.
98 posted on 03/07/2004 9:33:43 PM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: harpseal
I think that anyone evil enough to begin confiscation would be aware of the dynamics, and would pre-select the unit based on their willingness to fire on citizens. They would avoid the unit conflict, by selecting the unit entirely from those who answered the survey in the affirmative.
99 posted on 03/07/2004 9:36:12 PM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies]

To: philetus
Eaxactly. See my last reply.
100 posted on 03/07/2004 9:37:04 PM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 93 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-105 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson