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Southern Lawmakers Working On Compromise To Bush Immigration Plan
SignOnSanDiego ^ | February 29, 2004 | ASSOCIATED PRESS

Posted on 03/01/2004 10:49:55 AM PST by yonif

WASHINGTON – Conservatives balking at President Bush's proposal to grant illegal immigrants three-year work permits are floating a counteroffer that would hamper his efforts to woo Hispanic voters in November's election.

It's a dicey political predicament for the president, one that seems likely to push a final vote on key elements of his plan into 2005, well after the November balloting.

Rep. Charlie Norwood, R-Ga., and Sens. Zell Miller, D-Ga., and Jeff Sessions, R-Ala., are conditioning their support for Bush's plan on Congress agreeing to also broaden the power of state and local police to arrest suspected illegal residents.

"If they don't have this in it, they'll pass that bill over my cold, dead political body," Sessions said of Bush's proposal.

Sessions, Miller and Norwood say they speak for thousands of conservatives who believe stronger enforcement of immigration laws must accompany any plan that would let illegal immigrants remain in the country legally.

Because federal immigration agents are stretched too thin, they argue, 650,000 local police officers should be given the authority and resources to go after immigrants still undocumented after Bush's plan takes effect. Immigrant advocates say the distrust that would raise between Hispanics and police would erase any political advantage the president might hope to gain.

"Latinos very much support law enforcement, which is why we think making police officers immigration agents is a terrible idea," said Cecilia Munoz, vice president for policy at the National Council of La Raza. "If the victim of domestic violence feels she can't be calling police because they might be asking for papers, that's bad for the public safety."

Many Senate Democrats agree that conditioning the work permits for illegals on deputizing local police to help enforce immigration laws would do more harm than good.

"Our police officers have gone about the business of protecting their communities, and left the federal government to enforce civil immigration laws," said Vermont Sen. Patrick Leahy, senior Democrat on the Senate Judiciary Committee. "The division of labor makes a great deal of sense, and the burden faced by those who would change it should be awfully high."

Norwood said his Clear Law Enforcement for the Criminal Alien Removal Act could actually be popular among Latinos because it targets law breakers, particularly those identified as crime suspects in a national computer database.

"If you got tough with the enforcement of our laws, I honestly believe you would get more votes from the Hispanic community," Norwood said.

Administration officials are treading carefully on the concept of local enforcement, but supporters of the Norwood and Sessions bills are interpreting some of their recent comments to mean they might be open to the idea.

Questioned by Sessions at a recent hearing, Asa Hutchinson, the Homeland Security Department's undersecretary for border and transportation security, conceded there are not enough federal agents to go after illegal immigrants every time the police call them in.

Hutchinson then pointed out that Bush is asking Congress to double work-site enforcement, detention and removal facilities in the 2005 budget.

At another hearing, Sen. Larry Craig, R-Idaho, asked Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge to consider forging "cooperative law enforcement agreements" with local police rather than spending money on training new federal immigration agents.

Ridge said Craig's idea had gotten mixed reviews on the local level, but he didn't rule it out.

"Part of the reason may be philosophical, others may be fiscal," Ridge said. "Either way, you've got 650,000 men and women in local law enforcement that should be viewed as a potential asset and resource in enforcing the new law, whatever it might be."

Craig, who is co-sponsoring Sessions' bill, is also pushing one of his own that would establish an agriculture worker program. Although he said he doesn't care whether the enforcement proposal passes first or last, he acknowledged that conservatives may block other immigration plans without it.

"In a broad-based approach of the kind the president is talking about, that linkage might be necessary," Craig said.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: aliens; craig; gop; illegals; immigration; immigrationplan; miller; norwood; sessions

1 posted on 03/01/2004 10:49:55 AM PST by yonif
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To: yonif
It's still a cloaked amnesty, no matter how they try to dress it up. It shouldn't even be considered, let alone dressed up. It is estimated that 70% of Americans are strongly against this. Who is President Bush representing, 30% of America? That wasn't in the deal when we elected him.
2 posted on 03/01/2004 10:58:40 AM PST by janetgreen (MR. PRESIDENT - ENFORCE THE EXISTING IMMIGRATION LAWS!!!)
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To: yonif
Immigrants who want to do the jobs americans dont want to do - should work for their welfare by picking up the garbage from our roads, and helping america recycle by doing the dirty, expensive job of sorting our trash.

Recycling is expensive. With immigrant-run recycle centers, we could clean our environment and help immigrants keep their dignity by WORKING FOR the opportunity they are currently handed!

Im for NO immigration of any kind, but if they want in - they ought to not only be humble but REALLY do the job americans dont want to do!

PS the RNC keeps bugging me because my donations have lapsed. They are not listening to my answers to their correspondance: Bush gives up amnesty or he gives up my money _ HIS CHOICE!
3 posted on 03/01/2004 11:20:12 AM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore! FIGHT FOR FREEDOM!)
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To: gubamyster; HiJinx; madfly
ping
4 posted on 03/01/2004 11:43:50 AM PST by Libertarianize the GOP (Ideas have consequences)
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To: janetgreen
You are correct....you can't rewrite an evil bill!
5 posted on 03/01/2004 12:16:44 PM PST by international american (Kerry has hired a full time clerk to keep track of his lies..........)
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To: yonif
Administration officials are treading carefully on the concept of local enforcement, but supporters of the Norwood and Sessions bills are interpreting some of their recent comments to mean they might be open to the idea.

Certainly they are open to the idea.

The president said "we must strengthen control of the borders!"

This is but posturing by the lawmakers, and is the norm.

This bill is hardly in it's infancy as of yet.

6 posted on 03/01/2004 1:05:20 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: international american
What evil bill?

Presidents don't write bills, congress does.
Senators Miller and Sessions are just starting their bill - is that the one you're calling evil?
7 posted on 03/01/2004 1:11:52 PM PST by EllaMinnow (The best days of America lie ahead GWB 2/23/04)
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To: janetgreen
If you voted for him in 2000 then you did support this. It was in every campaign speech he gave.
8 posted on 03/01/2004 1:28:14 PM PST by cksharks (quote from)
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To: redlipstick
Certainly amazing that so many judgments are made about something that has yet to be written.

Totally dismissed out of hand, before it even sees the light of day!

Worse than that, the disparaging remarks have made there way to the millions of potential illegal aliens who now believe that there is going to be an "A-word").............................

9 posted on 03/01/2004 1:28:19 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: Iron Matron
I guess your family were just incubated here.
10 posted on 03/01/2004 1:30:13 PM PST by cksharks (quote from)
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To: wirestripper
There=their........ooops
11 posted on 03/01/2004 1:30:23 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: janetgreen
It's still a cloaked amnesty

Cloaked? So much for the frivilous blanket.
Say it enough and you'll believe it one day.

12 posted on 03/01/2004 1:31:39 PM PST by PRND21
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To: yonif
*yawn* Smoke screen. Local police have always had authority to detain suspected illegal aliens. Court case after court case has supported that; in the early 70's, it was commonplace in the Southwest to see a local cop calling in the BP vans for a car that had just been stopped.

The only reason the practice ever stopped was because of chanting from the Ford Foundation supported reconquista groups, who just repeated over and over again that "eeemeegration is a federal matter, the local police have no jurisdiction". Nonsense, but they got a lot of cops to believe it.

We can talk about guest worker programs when:

In other words, end the Welfare State, end the Ethnic Identity Inequality which disenfranchises Americans, and prevent the hiring of foreign nationals to engage in wage competition, and then we'll talk.

Since the likelihood of any of these happening is ZERO, I know that I'm safe in suggesting them as a precondition for a "guest worker" program. But if the Senators truly wanted to use this issue to get something, they could insist on it.

13 posted on 03/01/2004 1:48:34 PM PST by Regulator (Immigration + Affirmative Action = Annihilation)
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To: Regulator
Have you seen H.R. 3534 (introduced by Rep. Tom Tancredo)? We need to support this bill by writing our Congresscritters instead of wasting our breath complaining about Bush's plan. Bush knew his plan wasn't going anywhere, it was part pandering and part throwing down of the gauntlet to Congress to take action...IOW, all politics.
14 posted on 03/01/2004 1:56:22 PM PST by ravingnutter
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To: cksharks
I guess your family were just incubated here

My family has never taken a government hand-out. We WORK for a living, paying taxes and contributing to the general welfare of this country.

Illegal immigrants can not make that claim. Even legal immigrants do not have the fortitude to take care of their OWN countries (or they would have stayed and fought for their country like MY FOREFATHERS!). From what I've seen they are NOT LOYAL to the United States when they get here.

Having to actually be employees of the United States citizen (the citizen WHO PAYS FOR THEIR FOOD, MEDICAL, ETC) rather than come here and reap the benefits of MY HARD WORK while they sit on their. . . as I was saying,immigrants need to be a bit more humble about what they are getting for free.

Immigrants come here wanting FREEDOM for free. Freedom which my forefathers worked, fought and died for, they also want free food, medical, etc..and IM THE ONE WORKING FOR THAT!

Incubated or not - I WORK so should immigrants.
15 posted on 03/01/2004 2:03:16 PM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore! FIGHT FOR FREEDOM!)
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To: Iron Matron
Incubated or not - I WORK so should immigrants.

Work Visa is lost on you I guess.

Maybe they should call it "Really Work Visa"

16 posted on 03/01/2004 2:10:43 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: Iron Matron
What a stupid statement. It is also based on fiction.Your right you were dropped on your head when you were incubated. you must be one lof pats devils.
17 posted on 03/01/2004 2:14:23 PM PST by cksharks (quote from)
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To: ravingnutter
I think there is much to consider regarding the Tancredo plan.

When and if they sit down in committee and begin work on this, rather than posture, I am sure these code changes will get attention.

18 posted on 03/01/2004 2:14:54 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: yonif
"Latinos very much support law enforcement, which is why we think making police officers immigration agents is a terrible idea," said Cecilia Munoz, vice president for policy at the National Council of La Raza"

Now there is something to make you spit. wonder if Cecilia was at the Veterans cemetray in Cali when her La Raza group decided to beat up 70 year old veterans on Memorial Day for displaying the American Flag? Open the deportation of illegals to government regulated private enterprise. Some savvy Americans, layed off because of outsourcing or illegals running their wages down, will appreciate the opportunity for such a start up business as driving illegals to the border.

19 posted on 03/01/2004 2:38:08 PM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: cksharks
you must be one lof pats devils.


. . .and you must be fresh off the welfare roles.
20 posted on 03/01/2004 2:51:59 PM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore!)
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To: wirestripper
Maybe they should call it "Really Work Visa"


Thats right!

ANy immigrant here illegally, or just on a work permit needs to WORK and I mean work at what the TAXPAYERS want - not private business. Most illegals are too lazy to work, they get here on "WORK VISAS", then quit and draw their welfare. Kind of like the TERRORIST were on SCHOOL VISAS, but they sure were not in school!
21 posted on 03/01/2004 2:54:17 PM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore!)
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To: Iron Matron
ANy immigrant here illegally, or just on a work permit needs to WORK and I mean work at what the TAXPAYERS want - not private business.

OK, Now you have exposed your flank.

That idea is just plain ludicrous!

It would be one thing to encourage voluntary work like this, but what you suggest is not, and will never be considered,

It would be involuntary servitude......

The very thing that my forefathers fled to this country to escape!

Ludicrous!

22 posted on 03/01/2004 2:59:26 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: wirestripper
It would be involuntary servitude......


Not if they were getting paid!

I am having money INVOLUNTARILY STOLEN from me to support these yahoos. THAT IS SERVITUDE.

If my flank is exposed too bad- I dont claim to be politicallly correct!

Too bad we are protecting the feelings and failings of illegals rather than those that support this country for real.
23 posted on 03/01/2004 3:11:20 PM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore!)
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To: Iron Matron
Not if they were getting paid!

Conscripts and domestic servants and Even the French Foreign Legion were paid.

This is a free country!

We have no intention of turning the clock back over 200 years.

24 posted on 03/01/2004 3:32:33 PM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: cksharks
If you voted for him in 2000 then you did support this. It was in every campaign speech he gave.

I thought Al Gore would do something like this, but didn't think that Bush would get away with it.

25 posted on 03/01/2004 5:44:34 PM PST by janetgreen
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To: PRND21
Now, now, PRND, stop trying to argue with me. People will say we're in love...
26 posted on 03/01/2004 5:45:39 PM PST by janetgreen
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To: janetgreen
Our love is cloaked, too.
27 posted on 03/01/2004 5:48:50 PM PST by PRND21
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To: Iron Matron
I am having money INVOLUNTARILY STOLEN from me to support these yahoos. THAT IS SERVITUDE.

You bet it is, and this is exactly what is causing so much resentment in America. The takers outnumbering the givers and stealing from them.

28 posted on 03/01/2004 5:51:50 PM PST by janetgreen
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To: PRND21
Really, Really cloaked! Our marriage would never last... you're too old for me.
29 posted on 03/01/2004 5:54:01 PM PST by janetgreen
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To: janetgreen
:)
30 posted on 03/01/2004 5:56:16 PM PST by PRND21
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To: wirestripper
This is a free country

Yes it is, and immigrants are FREE to WORK instead of SUCKING their living from CITIZENS PAYCHECKS!

They are FREE to TRY and make it. A good living is not free, medical is not free.

I am suggesting that all immigrants be PROVIDED JOBS, that they MUST contribute - or GET THE EFF OUT!!!!! If we have to provide work for the MONEY THEY ARE TAKING fine - immigrants sure dont seem to be able to find work themselves!
31 posted on 03/02/2004 6:12:14 AM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore!)
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To: janetgreen
The takers outnumbering the givers and stealing from them.



My point exactly. Immigrants have no PRIDE, no PATRIOTISM, NO GRATITUDE, NO MANNERS. I say they should have NO AMERICAN MONEY unless it is WORKED FOR AND PAID BACK!
32 posted on 03/02/2004 6:14:06 AM PST by Iron Matron (Civil Disobediance? It's not just for liberals anymore!)
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To: Iron Matron; janetgreen
I was thinking of replying to this thread, but you two are doing a great job stating my position.

We don't need more folks coming here "yearning to eat free". "Bad" doesn't begin to describe Bush's proposal.
33 posted on 03/02/2004 6:36:28 AM PST by jimt
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To: jimt
but you two are doing a great job stating my position.

What, is "eat free" the new mantra of the anti-immigration contingent.

While it may be true that social services are indeed strained in some areas, the seasonal nature of the employment, the desire for work and a life made them cross with only the cloths on their backs.

Those same services still have a majority American citizen customer base and you know it.

Bush's proposal does in fact control this illegal alien problem, by tying the entry to a bonded job offer that has been vetted.

The line for these work visa's will be long, but the line will be in Mexico!

At the same time this is implemented, the ones left on the street with no paperwork will be disappearing as they leave a now hostile environment for a undocumented worker without a visa or a job.

Control of the employer is what this idea really does.

34 posted on 03/02/2004 9:52:04 AM PST by Cold Heat (In politics stupidity is not a handicap. --Napoleon Bonapart)
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To: wirestripper
What, is "eat free" the new mantra of the anti-immigration contingent.

I'm not anti-immigration, I'm anti-parasite !

Eliminate the welfare hammock (completely) for these folks, and most of my antipathy towards illegals ceases.

While it may be true that social services are indeed strained in some areas, the seasonal nature of the employment, the desire for work and a life made them cross with only the cloths on their backs.

So many errors in a single statement make it hard to respond.

Services are more than "strained" in some areas, American citizens are being crowded out by hordes of illegals.

"Seasonal" employment my rear end ! These folks come and stay, and bring their families. They put down roots, tapping every public benefit they run across, and at their income level, that's a lot of them.

Would that it was their desire for "work" that made them cross. It is in fact their desire to live better for less work that makes many come. Their "income" is substantially supplemented, else they couldn't live here, period. How do you support a family of five or six on ten bucks an hour? With state, local and federal subsidies, that's how.

And those come out of my pocket, and I'm damn tired of it.

Bush's proposal does nothing more than legalize those who're here, and act as a magnet for millions more to arrive, to be subsidized by taxpayers like me. It's a gift of taxpayer subsidized employees to business, and it sucks.

35 posted on 03/02/2004 2:04:39 PM PST by jimt
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