Hussein ties to al Qaeda appear faulty

The Miami Herald ^ | 3/3/04 | By WARREN P. STROBEL, JONATHAN S. LANDAY AND JOHN WALCOTT

[justshutupandtakeit]

The writers of this hit piece can only make this absurd claim by ignoring most of the information discovered since the invasion which does indeed indicate links between AQ and Saddam. And they must also ignore the Al Queda group Saddam allowed to operate in Northern Iraq against the Kurds.

But ignoring the facts and trumpeting falsehoods are the standard operating procedure of the RATmedia and the anti-Bush claques.

[ravingnutter]

Why should there be any updates on that story? The Marines found what they found and AP reported it at the time. Yes, the original "reports" about Salman Pak came through the INC...BUT I don't believe that Lt. Col. Michael Belcher, who was mentioned in the article I posted is a member of the INC. The original reports from the INC are backed up by the fact that the Marines DID find what the INC and defectors said they would find. And I am not relying on those you say may have been duped...I am relying on the AP story about the operation and what was found there that was widely circulated.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Your friend sounds like he has missed the boat wrt understanding Iraq. Saddam did not have any problem with AQ within Iraq and, in fact, aided them and allowed them to set up shop to fight the Kurds in Northern Iraq. Nor were the killing fields used to dispose of AQ sypathizers or members.
Most of the victims were Shiite which were the major concern of Saddam.

AQ never tried to overthrow Saddam. Where did he come up with that howler? Nor did either "hate" the other though mutual wariness certainly existed. AQ members were trained at Salman Pak though kept isolated from Iraqi intelligence and military elements as much as possible.

In addition the danger AQ poses for Americans in Iraq is wildly overstated and shows every indication of diminishing day by day. Recent attacks against the Shiites is evidence that it is failing to retain any power or to gain more. The recent letter showed just how desperate AQ is and its laments will not become less intense as days go by.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Thanks for the background on these liars. Of course, any discerning reader could tell they were RATS from the lies they print and the truths they conveniently ignore.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Yeah but who are you going to believe, US Marines or RATliars and those who bring their lies here?

[ravingnutter]

Why hasn't Bush made this allegation?

One word: Lawyers.

Insight Magazine
Sep 29, 2003

Senior investigators and analysts in the U.S. government have concluded that Iraq acted as a state sponsor of terrorism against Americans and logistically supported the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States - confirming news reports that until now have emerged only in bits and pieces. A senior government official responsible for investigating terrorism tells Insight that while Saddam Hussein may not have had details of the Sept. 11 attacks in advance, he "gave assistance for whatever al-Qaeda came up with." That assistance, confirmed independently, came in a variety of ways, including financial support spun out through a complex web of financial institutions in Switzerland, Liechtenstein, Italy and elsewhere. Long suspected of having terrorist ties to al-Qaeda, they now have been linked to Iraq as well.

Insiders say the failure to assign responsibility for the Sept. 11 attacks to Iraq, Afghanistan or any other nation-state is intentional. "The administration does not want the victims of Sept. 11 interfering with its foreign policy," says Peter M. Leitner, director of the Washington Center for Peace and Justice (WCPJ). Leitner says the Bush administration may be concerned that if other victims of the Sept. 11 attacks also filed lawsuits and won civil-damage awards it would reduce Iraqi resources that the administration wants to use to rebuild the country. Leitner and others say this explains Bush's reticence at this time to report the convincing evidence linking Saddam and al-Qaeda that has been collected by U.S. investigators and private organizations seeking damages. "The [Bush] administration is intentionally changing the topic," claims Leitner, and sidestepping the issue that "Iraq has been in a proxy war against the U.S. for years and has used al-Qaeda in that war against the United States."

Source

But I believe that the re-opening of OKC investigation is going to change everything.

[JohnGalt]

The CIA knew about the famous "fuselage" since the late 80s so I am unclear what your point is.

[bukkdems]

Everybody needs to take a step off the planet. We have a huge case of mass psychosis spreading like cancer among Muslims, due to their hideous existence. This is the belief that the US could be annialated through the power of Allah. A belief even more psychotic than the Nazi's dream of the third reich. A swift, decisive kick in the butt was called for, and delivered to the biggest bully in their midst. Accordingly, Arabs are coming to their senses, though slowly. I'm extremely satisfied, and your obfuscations are meaningless.

[azhenfud]

I repeat, as I said, I'm not agreeing my friend's POV was entirely correct, but it made me conclude NOT to expect "the smoking gun" proof on both issues, AQ and WMD.

Understood?

[JohnGalt]

The end justifies the means.

I appreciate your candor and your courage for stating in plain English what others fear to say.

[zook]

Words have meaning, Galt. When Patrick Henry said, "give me liberty or give me death," he wasn't asking to be killed. Oops, I'm parsing words.

What's the difference between John Galt and a mafia loan collector?

The mafia loan collector makes you an offer you can't refuse. John Galt makes you an offer you can't understand.

[ravingnutter]

The CIA knew about the famous "fuselage" since the late 80s so I am unclear what your point is.

My point is that the Marines found exactly what we were told they would find by the defectors, a terrorist training camp. PBS Frontline did an interview in 2001 with one of the defectors and he even drew a map of the facility for them (a link to the map is at the above link). This guy was not with the INC:

Sabah Khodada was a captain in the Iraqi army from 1982 to 1992. He worked at what he describes as a highly secret terrorist training camp at Salman Pak, an area south of Baghdad. In this translated interview, conducted in association with The New York Times on Oct. 14, 2001, Khodada describes what went on at Salman Pak, including details on training hijackers. He emigrated to the U.S. in May 2001.

Everything that was found at Salman Pak by the Marines in the AP report was exactly as it was on the map. Therefore, for these fools to say that Salman Pak never existed is ridiculous.

[JohnGalt]

The defectors were supplied by the discredited INC, and further reports have Khodada denying his INC supplied interpreter translated what he said correctly.

Come on, it was hardly rock solid, it was out right deceit.

[azhenfud]

"Please note this post and its final paragraph, azhenfud:"

Please allow me to explain one thing. I WAS as diehard, stuck in the mud, convinced President Bush lied to justify war with Iraq when WMD's failed to appear as anyone. Then I realized, through my friend's suggestion, that OUR intelligence was based on what Iraqi's BELIEVED about Saddam. We thought he possessed WMD's because he chose NOT to admit to the world he did NOT have the capability and would not account for the known missing stockpiles.

If you recall, even the shell game was continued in the midst of the war as to WHO had WMD's and who was to be given the order to use them. Each battalion thought the next one had the capability when actually, it appears none did.

Recall also, Scott Ritter telling Congress Iraq possessed no viable WMD program, but Iraq still failed to be totally truthful, but no explaination from Iraq followed.

http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/congress/1998_h/ws915981.htm

Pay especially close attention to Ritter's last paragraph and this remark, "If recent history is any guide, there will be many pressures placed upon the Special Commission, most behind the scenes and as such out of public view, to make compromises of substance concerning Iraq's unfulfilled disarmament obligations."

Saddam offered to meet secretly with President Bush in '93 - but he would not because Saddam's interest was to remain in control of Iraq. It is likely Saddam would have admitted to President Bush the why's and how's of him not coming clean with the world.

http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/news/special_packages/7192639.htm

Certainly, I'm not running interference for Kerry or the left - I'm trying to understand how our intelligence could have been so WRONG. In light of what I see now, I don't believe President Bush was lying, but that the deceit was purposed in Iraq by Saddam and the CIA bought into the ploy. For whatever that's worth, that's how I see it NOW.

[11th_VA]

Nearly a year after U.S. and British troops invaded Iraq, no evidence has turned up to verify allegations of Hussein's links with al Qaeda

Really ? What about this:

Part of document found by Start Reporter Mitch Potter suggesting a meeting with Osama Bin Laden, whose name had been obscured.

Toronto Star Link: http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1051125568646&call_pageid=1045739058633

[JohnGalt]

I assume its crap.

[nightowl]

This article is a bunch of short sighted leftwing crap. If you don't believe that there was a link between Saddam & Bin Ladin, you have been drinking too much Paul O'Neil/Ted Kennedy Koolaid. The truth will prevail BEFORE NOVEMBER.

[MEGoody]

We know Saddam had ties to terrorists. He was very public about giving money to families of suicide bombers. Very clear he supported anything that might hurt the U.S. or Israel.

Whether the terrorists wore the name tag 'Al Queda' or not is beside the point. They all serve the same master in the end.

[MEGoody]

"A huge diversion of resources has occurred in Iraq and away from the clear and present danger al-Qaeda presented and continues to present to this country."

You may call it a 'diversion of resources'. I call it a long overdue house cleaning.

[justshutupandtakeit]

There have already been "smoking guns" discovered and quickly ignored. There have been forbidden weapons systems found, plans for forbidden systems, components of systems as well as official documents indicating a working relationship between AQ and SH. I did not attribute any mistakes/errors to you or imply you believed what he said though the fact that you posted his conclusions indicate some belief in their worth. Worth which escapes me.

His conclusions aren't not just not "entirely correct" but mostly incorrect. I pointed out the most egregious errors.