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Hillary Short-circuited JFK Jr. Senate Run
Newsmax ^ | 3/17/03 | Limbacher

Posted on 03/17/2004 9:40:17 AM PST by Tumbleweed_Connection

Before he died in a tragic plane crash in July 1999, John F. Kennedy, Jr. was weighing a decision to run for Senate in New York. But according to a new book, then first lady Hillary Clinton short-circuited the plan by declaring her interest in the same office.

"John watched with growing dismay as Hillary subtly insinuated herself into what he considered his state," Laurence Leamer writes in "Sons of Camelot."

Leamer says Kennedy was considering abandoning his job as publisher of George Magazine to make his first run for office - and had begun polling on the prospect of replacing then incumbent Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan.

Fox News chief Roger Ailes - a one-time GOP strategist - was sounded out on the idea of a Kennedy run. And according to the New York Post, he concluded that Kennedy would be "a viable candidate."

But when Hillary signaled she wanted to make the run herself, Kennedy quietly shelved the idea.

"He was too much of a gentleman" to object, Leamer told the Post.

Privately, however, the heir to the Kennedy political dynasty was "upset" that Mrs. Clinton had elbowed him out of the race, contends Leamer.



TOPICS: Front Page News; Politics/Elections; US: New York
KEYWORDS: hillary; jfkennedy; jfkjr
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1 posted on 03/17/2004 9:40:17 AM PST by Tumbleweed_Connection
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Actually the plane crash pretty much short-circuited the run.
2 posted on 03/17/2004 9:42:24 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
the heir to the Kennedy political dynasty was "upset" that Mrs. Clinton had elbowed him out of the race, contends Leamer.


I wonder if Mrs. Clinton had him "elbowed" out of his plane as well!
3 posted on 03/17/2004 9:42:28 AM PST by JustPlainJoe
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Schmucky Chucky Schumer sure got the hint -didn't he. Why he went from senior senator to poodle in a NY minute. Disgusting performance on his part.
4 posted on 03/17/2004 9:46:16 AM PST by Bedford Forrest (Roger, Contact, Judy, Out. Fox One. Splash one.<I>)
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To: dfwgator
And not a minute too soon. While Hillary is a miserable POS and a threat - I was really dreading the People Magazine Candidate getting his way into the Senate and then beyond. He was not qualified to be a leader, except by virtue of the media gloss and myth he was wrapped in. Took 4 tries to pass the NY Bar, and yet, had he run, the fawning press would have treated him as a towering intellect. Sounds terribly mean - but when I heard the news I was relieved that we were not going to have to face a Sen. JFK, Jr. and then a presidential run and all the rest.
5 posted on 03/17/2004 9:51:13 AM PST by Wally_Kalbacken (Seldom right, never in doubt!)
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
What you said.
6 posted on 03/17/2004 9:53:35 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
Aren't there any decent candidates at all in New York?



7 posted on 03/17/2004 10:16:28 AM PST by BushisTheMan
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
Still, JFK Jr. would have been preferred to the hildabeast though, right?!

Back in 1997, I heard a low rumor that JFK Jr. was scouting for potential "future" campaign headquarters in NYC...then I heard nothing, and even demodimwits acted like pre-programmed "stepford" people and dismissed the idea. Then I smelled something awful, and by golly, hitlery was in the race!

8 posted on 03/17/2004 10:31:36 AM PST by Donna Lee Nardo
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To: BushisTheMan
"Aren't there any decent candidates at all in New York?"

If you mean among dem candidates, then you know the answer is no; there are no decent dem candidates anywhere on earth.

Rudy Giuliani was the best candidate, but it seems we needed him for 911 and its aftermath more.... Rick Lazio was a great candidate, but the little people of NY voted for the lying, evil, fat lady and her nebulous promises anyway.

9 posted on 03/17/2004 10:40:21 AM PST by Donna Lee Nardo
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
now how many political enemies of theirs have died in plane crashes?
10 posted on 03/17/2004 10:41:21 AM PST by Walkingfeather
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
sigh. I wish Hillart would look into pilot's lessons. I'm going to send her a gift certificate....
11 posted on 03/17/2004 10:43:45 AM PST by presidio9 (the left is turning antisemitism into the new homophobia)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
Bomb in luggage compartment of JFK Jr plane, had a timer to explode at certain altitude.
12 posted on 03/17/2004 10:46:35 AM PST by shield
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To: Walkingfeather
Are you implying--horrors--Arkancide?
13 posted on 03/17/2004 10:48:27 AM PST by RightWingConspirator (Glad that Ted the Drunk, Hitlery the Witch and John Fonda Kerry are not my senators.)
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To: Bedford Forrest
Chucky doesn't fancy Arkancide
14 posted on 03/17/2004 11:04:42 AM PST by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon liberty, it is essential to examine principles - -)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I wonder what made Junior think the people of New York would prefer a carpetbagger from Massachusetts over a carpetbagger from Arkansas?

What was there about NY that made it "his" state?
15 posted on 03/17/2004 11:42:21 AM PST by Redbob (ultrakonservativen click-guerilla)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
This really points out that all the media spin on Rangal talking her into running, was just more Clinton BS.!
16 posted on 03/17/2004 11:49:46 AM PST by woodyinscc
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To: Redbob
His dad was from Mass and JFK Jr. was born there. After the assassination, the family lived in Greece and NY. He did make his home there for many years prior to his death. He did not move there on purpose to run for Senate. I remember he and Senator D'Amato seemed to like each other quite well; I bet JFK Jr. would have been more centrist than we think. I consider Calif my state, although I was born in Massachusetts.
17 posted on 03/17/2004 11:51:55 AM PST by merry10
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
and then she had him killed for good measure
18 posted on 03/17/2004 11:54:36 AM PST by The Wizard
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
There are intelligent, respectable conservatives who have said that they found JFK Jr to be a sharp and intelligent man. Ann Coulter among them. Lots of people struggle with the bar. I wouldn't put too much faith in that reporting. Remember, it's the same press that praises Hill as the most intelligent woman to grace our public path. I don't find her unintelligent, but she is certainly not as brilliant as she is portrayed to be. I would far father have had a JFK Jr in office than any Kennedy or Clinton.
19 posted on 03/17/2004 11:56:54 AM PST by twigs
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I liked JFK Jr. As much as is possible to tell from the media, he seemed a decent person. However, he certainly had no business even thinking of going into politics if he could not fight for what he wanted. The Clintons used him when they ran our flag at half mast at his death. In the end, I guess that John Kennedy served his party after all, just not in a way he would have chosen.
20 posted on 03/17/2004 11:56:56 AM PST by mountainfolk
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To: twigs
Don't get me wrong - I hope to read soon that Hillary is getting her pilot's license. I detest her.
21 posted on 03/17/2004 1:23:14 PM PST by Wally_Kalbacken (Seldom right, never in doubt!)
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To: dfwgator
Hitlery left nothing to chance.
22 posted on 03/17/2004 1:31:22 PM PST by ambrose ("John Kerry has blood of American soldiers on his hands" - Lt. Col. Oliver North)
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Comment #23 Removed by Moderator

To: Donna Lee Nardo
Remember after the crash, all the ugly rumors about JFK jr's marriage trouble & his wife's drug use? Was there any truth to that?
24 posted on 03/17/2004 2:52:47 PM PST by Ditter
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To: twigs
I cannot imagine anyone else who could have failed the bar so many times (I think it was three), still kept his job as a prosecutor in NYC, had a pretty undistinguished career there, been deterred from an acting career by his mother, gone on to run a magazine that by all accounts was on its last legs, and then have been determined to be Senate material. Even if he was a "sharp and intelligent man," that hardly makes him a viable Senate candidate. His primary qualification was being the son of Kennedy... in fact, since his death I've seen articles pining for a Caroline Kennedy Schlossberg candidacy. It's strange to me that the Democrats, for all their talk about President Bush's family advantages, etc., think that being a Kennedy automatically qualifies you for public office. To me, it is the height of arrogance... JFK, Jr. deciding to take the Senate office that apparently was deemed his birthright. No matter how intelligent, the man had a pretty undistinguished legal career and a mediocre publishing career at best. As for failing the bar so often, you are right that it doesn't actually prove anything; however, I also keep in mind the advantages JFK, Jr., had in taking it. He didn't have to work full time, worry about paying his bills or keeping his job if he failed, he could afford any tutor or bar review course he wanted...
25 posted on 03/17/2004 2:56:25 PM PST by GraceCoolidge
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To: twigs; Donna Lee Nardo; JustPlainJoe; Joy Angela; conservogirl; Ragtime Cowgirl; BKO; ...
.


JFK Jr = Worried about HILLARY (Author Laurence Leamer)


http://www.Freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1097731/posts
(3-14-2004)


.
26 posted on 03/17/2004 3:54:40 PM PST by ALOHA RONNIE (Vet-Battle of IA DRANG-1965 http://www.LZXRAY.com)
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To: Walkingfeather
Way too many for it to be coincidental!
27 posted on 03/17/2004 4:51:37 PM PST by CyberAnt (The 2004 Election is for the SOUL of AMERICA)
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To: Walkingfeather
ask senator wellstone, he is in a position to take a head count.
28 posted on 03/17/2004 4:55:48 PM PST by cajun-jack
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To: ALOHA RONNIE
Excellent thread; thanks so much for the link ping! ;)
29 posted on 03/17/2004 6:02:29 PM PST by Donna Lee Nardo
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To: Ditter
See Aloha Ronnie's excellent post here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1097731/posts
30 posted on 03/17/2004 6:06:06 PM PST by Donna Lee Nardo
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To: dfwgator; ALOHA RONNIE; Pagey
The weather reports on the day of the crash were also supposedly "wrong" and the media fed us the line that JFK Jr. had reports of clear skies, but the FAA "tape" was playing the wrong tape...because "really" the skies were overcast and cloudy!

We all bought into that...

But, here's the truth. The skies WERE clear.

I saw a website that showed the weather for that day, and this means the "report" of the wrong FAA tape was ...yes, I'll say it...a coverup.


Dear JFK Jr. What made you crash that day?

Are you looking down from Heaven?

When you see Hillary Clinton do you see
the same Evil that killed your father?

31 posted on 03/17/2004 7:36:48 PM PST by Joy Angela (They call her "Hitlery" and She Likes It.)
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
"Took 4 tries to pass the NY Bar"

And they call the guy who placed last on his medical boards "Doctor" too.
32 posted on 03/17/2004 7:42:12 PM PST by Rebelbase (Guess who admitted she was happy at hearing the news of JFK's assissination?)
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To: Rebelbase
Before this thread, It never even occurred to me that Hillary stood to gain from JFK Jr.'s death. That's the problem with the Clintons. There are two if them. One is diurnal, and the other, nocturnal. They're at it 24-7. They don't have to work to hard either. They have mega-bucks, and a slew of dirty underwear boys and girls, who either owe them favors, or could be bought, and or do their bidding for any number of reasons. What they did today, won't be clear for years, if ever. The whole thing would make a great coat-of-arms though, a great two-headed black snake, rising from a pile of dirty laundry -- coiled around a broken alarm clock, some interns, and eight smashed model airplanes.
33 posted on 03/17/2004 10:31:38 PM PST by chickens (imagine a chicken with a tiger by the tail -- there's a plan.)
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To: chickens
I loved how Hillary and Bill showed up at that last minute at Jr.'s funeral .. UNINVITED!!

Hmmmm? Guilt?
34 posted on 03/18/2004 1:26:29 AM PST by CyberAnt (The 2004 Election is for the SOUL of AMERICA)
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To: Joy Angela; The Wizard; shield
I remember the day's weather. It persisted all along the east coast. It was a typical hazy, hot and humid afternoon, only maybe worse than normal. I've flown that route out of Newark many times. He took off out of Teterboro, I believe. To me there is no mystery other than the permanent grin it put on Hillary's mug.

JFK Jr. got behind the aircraft on decent and developed spacial disorientation (vertigo) from which he was unable to recover and three people died.

He took off at sunset. By the time he got above the temperature inversion it would have still been bright and very clear. The Sun at his back would have appeared higher in the sky than when he took off. The temperature inversion level below and scud below that would have looked like the surface of a frozen, snow covered lake. When he started down things would have happened very fast. Flying away from the sun, it would have gotten dark very quickly as he descended into the haze layer. An experienced pilot would have automatically transitioned to instrument flight. I believe JFK Jr. was still flying by the seat of his pants. Within in minutes (maybe less) he was in a turn that his mind refused to believe. It only got worse as he failed to recover, stalled, and spiraled out of control into the water.
35 posted on 03/18/2004 2:19:55 AM PST by leadpenny
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection; All
Some interesting reading here: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001212X19354&key=1

The noninstrument-rated pilot obtained weather forecasts for a cross-country flight, which indicated visual flight rules (VFR) conditions with clear skies and visibilities that varied between 4 to 10 miles along his intended route. The pilot then departed on a dark night. According to a performance study of radar data, the airplane proceeded over land at 5,500 feet. About 34 miles west of Martha's Vineyard Airport, while crossing a 30-mile stretch of water to its destination, the airplane began a descent that varied between 400 to 800 feet per minute (fpm). About 7 miles from the approaching shore, the airplane began a right turn. The airplane stopped its descent at 2,200 feet, then climbed back to 2,600 feet and entered a left turn. While in the left turn, the airplane began another descent that reached about 900 fpm. While still in the descent, the airplane entered a right turn. During this turn, the airplane's rate of descent and airspeed increased. The airplane's rate of descent eventually exceeded 4,700 fpm, and the airplane struck the water in a nose-down attitude. Airports along the coast reported visibilities between 5 and 8 miles. Other pilots flying similar routes on the night of the accident reported no visual horizon while flying over the water because of haze. The pilot's estimated total flight experience was about 310 hours, of which 55 hours were at night. The pilot's estimated flight time in the accident airplane was about 36 hours, of which about 9.4 hours were at night. About 3 hours of that time was without a certified flight instructor (CFI) on board, and about 0.8 hour of that was flown at night and included a night landing. In the 15 months before the accident, the pilot had flown either to or from the destination area about 35 times. The pilot flew at least 17 of these flight legs without a CFI on board, of which 5 were at night. Within 100 days before the accident, the pilot had completed about 50 percent of a formal instrument training course. A Federal Aviation Administration Advisory Circular (AC) 61-27C, "Instrument Flying: Coping with Illusions in Flight," states that illusions or false impressions occur when information provided by sensory organs is misinterpreted or inadequate and that many illusions in flight could be caused by complex motions and certain visual scenes encountered under adverse weather conditions and at night. The AC also states that some illusions might lead to spatial disorientation or the inability to determine accurately the attitude or motion of the aircraft in relation to the earth's surface. The AC further states that spatial disorientation, as a result of continued VFR flight into adverse weather conditions, is regularly near the top of the cause/factor list in annual statistics on fatal aircraft accidents. According to AC 60-4A, "Pilot's Spatial Disorientation," tests conducted with qualified instrument pilots indicated that it can take as long as 35 seconds to establish full control by instruments after a loss of visual reference of the earth's surface. AC 60-4A further states that surface references and the natural horizon may become obscured even though visibility may be above VFR minimums and that an inability to perceive the natural horizon or surface references is common during flights over water, at night, in sparsely populated areas, and in low-visibility conditions. Examination of the airframe, systems, avionics, and engine did not reveal any evidence of a preimpact mechanical malfunction.

The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:

The pilot's failure to maintain control of the airplane during a descent over water at night, which was a result of spatial disorientation. Factors in the accident were haze, and the dark night.

Full Narrative here: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20001212X19354&ntsbno=NYC99MA178&akey=1

36 posted on 03/18/2004 2:34:46 AM PST by leadpenny
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To: twigs
Being socially charming and witty with the women is far different from having the skills required to pass the bar.

The fact is that reporting on his exams precedes the Clintigula arrival on the national scene. Spy Magazine reported at the time that his fourth and successful try was taken alone in an upstate judge's office.

How many candidates for the bar get that treatment?

JFK Jr did not have the drive and will that his father had. Sr. would have arranged for screaming headlines in all the NY papers denouncing the interloper and would have managed to have someone named "Hilly C. Linton" placed on the ballot.

37 posted on 03/18/2004 2:52:21 AM PST by metesky ("Brethren, leave us go amongst them." Rev. Capt. Samuel Johnston Clayton - Ward Bond- The Searchers)
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To: Joy Angela
If conditions are right it can indeed be "clear" in NY and Boston and the Islands shrouded in fog at the same time.
38 posted on 03/18/2004 2:56:42 AM PST by metesky ("Brethren, leave us go amongst them." Rev. Capt. Samuel Johnston Clayton - Ward Bond- The Searchers)
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To: leadpenny
I think that's exactly what happened too -- vertigo. Here's the rub though. JFK Jr. wasn't so inexperienced that he wouldn't have gone to instruments, had the fog layer lasted any longer than a few seconds. My intuition then, as now, says something other than inexperience prevented him from doing just that. JFK Jr. knew his aircraft was no ultralight. He had all the instrumentation right there -- unless those gages weren't lit or had otherwise failed. How easy is it to tamper with something as basic as cockpit lighting devices -- something as simple as a fuse?
39 posted on 03/18/2004 9:07:01 AM PST by chickens (imagine a chicken with a tiger by the tail -- there's a plan.)
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To: leadpenny
Thanks for that thorough post!
40 posted on 03/18/2004 11:12:23 AM PST by Pagey (Hillary Rotten is a Smug and Holier- than- Thou Socialist)
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To: Wally_Kalbacken
The party was firmly behind Nita Lowey. She had the chops. I doubt they would have backed Jr. just because, although I confess that I didn't follow this too closely. I would like to know though how they got the Rev. Al to sit it out.
41 posted on 03/18/2004 11:17:05 AM PST by wtc911 (Doesn't matter if your head is in the sand or up your a**, the view is the same.)
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To: leadpenny
I would hope this is the way it happened, as you stated. However, there was a FBI report on their web site for a very short period of time regarding JFK Jr's crash. The report stated bomb in luggage compartment, exploded at certain altitude. I will see if I can find that report.
42 posted on 03/18/2004 11:17:14 AM PST by shield
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To: shield
I will see if I can find that report.

Is this what you were looking for?

FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION PRELIMINARY REPORT ON THE RECOVERY OF PIPER SARATOGA AIRCRAFT OF JOHN F. KENNEDY, Jr.

1. No declassificatin until 7/22/2029.

2. This is in deference to the wishes of a senior member of the Kennedy family.

3. Also in deference to the order of the national government and in respect to certain foreign intelligence agencies having reciprocal agreements with the U.S.

4. POTUS order and national security findings attached.

5. The recovered aircraft shows evidence of an explosive device having been glued or affixed within the tail luggage compartment.

6. Device was apparently actuated by a barometric trigger. Radio signals not ruled out.

7. Tail of aircraft was dismembered from the plane making it front heavy.

8. Study of radar shows the plane fell in excess of 6,000 feet per minute up to radar cutoff.

9. Satellite images supplied by the National Reconnaissance Office record an outbursting flash from the aircraft just prior to it going into perpendicular descent.

10. Tail structure was dismembered just prior to descent.

11. Recovery of a piece of luggage from beyond the flight path of the aircraft correlates with it being hurtled out of the tail luggage compartment at outburst.

12. Preliminary examination of the aircraft shows residue of an explosive device the Laboratory identifies as being the type used by certain foreign intelligence agencies. Refer to POTUS order and findings.

13. Study of Air Traffic Control and other radio signals shows no Mayday report from the aircraft, explained by rapidity of descent.

14. Investigation and examination has been strictly compartmentalized.

15. A short, perfunctory examination of the recovered bodies was completed. Examination revealed that Carolyn Bessette Kennedy was in third trimester pregnant, the fetus a boy. The four bodies were transferred to a senior member of the Kennedy family. The Bureau was not informed whether the bodies were actually cremated. Indirect advisories report that the bodies may have been shipped in untagged containers to foreign destinations. Reliable assets are to submit reports.

43 posted on 03/20/2004 11:49:08 AM PST by acehai
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To: acehai
This is the most stunning post I have yet to see on any subject at all at FR!

Had been sucpicious of sabotage in JFK Jr. crash from almost immediately after it happened.

Assuming that the FBI is accurate - there is no reason do doubt it - the likely M. O. is that the sabateur did his dirty work by infiltrating the ground maintenance crew at the airport (presumably Teterboro) where the plane underwent "routine" pre-flight maintenance and inspection.
44 posted on 03/23/2004 11:10:56 AM PST by justiceseeker93
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To: leadpenny
after reading post #43, that bomb going off didnt help too much either.
45 posted on 03/23/2004 11:17:36 AM PST by isom35
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To: Walkingfeather
Numbers that large are usually denoted in scientific notation.
46 posted on 03/23/2004 11:25:34 AM PST by TXBSAFH (KILL-9 needs no justification.)
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To: isom35; acehai
I'd think twice before accepting at face value a memo that could have been typed by anyone and spammed all over the world. Need substantiation before I read it a second time.
47 posted on 03/23/2004 4:00:40 PM PST by leadpenny
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To: leadpenny
I'd think twice before accepting at face value a memo that could have been typed by anyone...

Most people do think twice...Maybe three times...You're correct...It could have been typed by anyone. But then again, it could be for real...Who's to say??? But until you can refute it, you might want to look into it further...What can it hurt? Huh?

48 posted on 03/23/2004 4:26:38 PM PST by acehai
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To: acehai
Okay, I'd start with this:

Where did you get it?

49 posted on 03/23/2004 4:29:35 PM PST by leadpenny
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
and probably screwed with his plane, too
50 posted on 03/23/2004 4:35:42 PM PST by The Wizard
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