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***Breaking*** Kerry Continued to Represent the VVAW after November, 1971
WinterSoldier.com ^ | 03/18/2004 | Interesting Times

Posted on 03/18/2004 5:35:06 PM PST by Interesting Times

March 19, 2004 -- **BREAKING** WinterSoldier.com has obtained solid evidence that John Kerry continued to represent the VVAW well after the infamous November 12-15 1971 meeting at which that organization voted on whether to commit political assassinations. See our new "So when did John Kerry leave the VVAW, anyway?" links in the Documents, Film Clips, Audio and Cartoons section.

For example, the New York Times identified Kerry as "spokesman for Vietnam Veterans Against the War" in this article on January 11, 1972. In fact, as late as April 22, 1972, Kerry was still being identified in press reports as a "leader of the Vietnam Veterans Against the War."

Senator Kerry says he quit the VVAW sometime before November 12, 1971.

Senator Kerry has some explaining to do.


TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 1971; 2004; assassinationplot; darkplot; johnkerry; kerry; vvaw
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To: Interesting Times
"It's interesting to see how other people's work product gets splashed around as other people's breaking news.
Please provide evidence that I took any of the documents posted on this thread from your work, or be so good as to withdraw that comment.

It's clear that you believe this topic is your very own property, but that turns out not to be the case."

I guess you have a guilty conscience--but I did not say you took this material from me. (Though, of course you have used my material heavily in the past.)

But I have been in constant touch with Tom Lipscomb on this story, as you might imagine. And I was told by him that he and someone else from the NY Sun had chased down this EXACT information.

When I asked TL about whether he had given the info to you, he said he had not. I'm sure it is a coincidence. LOL
151 posted on 03/18/2004 8:50:21 PM PST by Hon
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To: woodyinscc
Kerry is going down too quick, he will never make it to the convention.!!

I'm not so confident the GP will even hear about this.

152 posted on 03/18/2004 8:57:26 PM PST by stands2reason ( During the cola wars, France was occupied by Pepsi for six months.)
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To: VadeRetro
"Kerry is caling VN, "Nixon's war."

Nixon took office January 20th, 1969.

It was Johnson that sent Kerry to Vietnam.

It was Richard Nixon who brought him home----and fast!!!

John Kerry is probably the only officer in the history of the Navy who shipped out to war without a clue as to who the CinC was.

Of course, Monsieur Kerry isn't that stupid. It's just that his life is all about vitriolic posturing, so he tries to re-write history in sour script. And the Jennings, Brokaws and Rathers of the world are reading from the same bitter page, so they don't even notice how idiotic his mistatements are.

153 posted on 03/18/2004 9:11:11 PM PST by cookcounty (John Flipflop Kerry ---the only man to have been on BOTH sides of 3 wars!)
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To: Hon
When I asked TL about whether he had given the info to you, he said he had not. I'm sure it is a coincidence. LOL

So? Obviously multiple people are working on the same stuff. So much the better.

We are receiving information at WinterSoldier.com from a variety of sources, and are putting it in one place for easy access.

We plan to keep on doing this, even if it offends the occasional jealous antifreeper.

154 posted on 03/18/2004 9:21:11 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: A_Niceguy_in_CA
" Did you all hear that John Kerry won 5 medals for his service in Vietnam?"

And all of them nominated by John himself. How convenient. Oh, actually we don't know for certain who nominated him. All we really know for certain, is that it's one of John's most dear and precious secrets.

155 posted on 03/18/2004 9:22:33 PM PST by cookcounty (John Flipflop Kerry ---the only man to have been on BOTH sides of 3 wars!)
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To: blanknoone
Not necessarily. Reporters are notoriously lazy.
156 posted on 03/18/2004 9:27:01 PM PST by The Old Hoosier (Right makes might.)
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To: Interesting Times
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see you folks are doing something at long last. I just think you should give credit where credit is due. Especially when you ask for contributions on every other page.

Like I said, I'm sure it is just a coincidence that you mentioned exactly the same instances that TL mentioned to me yesterday that he and the Sun had uncovered. Funny how you missed the one I brought up and hadn't mentioned to Tom. LOL

157 posted on 03/18/2004 9:27:57 PM PST by Hon
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To: Interesting Times
I'm a frickin prophet... I saw Kerry going down in flames the moment he emerged as the nominee. Fear my priescence! (Or maybe I just read FR)
158 posted on 03/18/2004 9:28:21 PM PST by thoughtomator ("When I use a word," Humpty F. Kerry said, in rather a scornful tone...)
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To: Hon
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see you folks are doing something at long last. I just think you should give credit where credit is due. Especially when you ask for contributions on every other page.

Your veneer of honesty just evaporates when you get ticked off, doesn't it?

Like I said, I'm sure it is just a coincidence that you mentioned exactly the same instances that TL mentioned to me yesterday that he and the Sun had uncovered. Funny how you missed the one I brought up and hadn't mentioned to Tom. LOL

LOL all you like. I didn't get this material from TL or the New York Sun -- as you admit, he says this himself.

Let's see if you can muster the courage to directly accuse me of somehow stealing material from the New York Sun. At that point I will disclose my source to Jim Robinson, and ask that you are banned, yet again, from FR.

159 posted on 03/18/2004 9:34:39 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: Interesting Times
"LOL all you like. I didn't get this material from TL or the New York Sun -- as you admit, he says this himself."

I said no such thing. I said TL told me he didn't give it to you. I have no idea where you got it. It is just a happenstance that the very same articles were mentioned--and yet you missed the latest occurrence. Weird, huh?

I only know you are not much for legwork. But big on taking credit. LOL

I also take note of your threats to get me banned. I'm sure the other members appreciate how much you are helping the cause of conservatism. After all, you wouldn't have this story and so many others without my work. Would you?

160 posted on 03/18/2004 9:39:17 PM PST by Hon
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To: Piranha
"he led a group that wanted to kill Senators, and then he became one."

Can he join the Torch in jail...maybe he can run the dem machine from jail.......I guess if Martha is doing it he can too..

On other news .......DU on suicide watch

161 posted on 03/18/2004 9:39:21 PM PST by spokeshave (It is, as it was)
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To: FairOpinion
Thank you. I'll set my VCR. Last time I saw it, I was pretty bored with it. But then, I was about 9 years old at the time.
162 posted on 03/18/2004 9:42:07 PM PST by BykrBayb (Temporary tagline. Applied to State of New Jersey for permanent tagline (12/24/03).)
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To: Hon
I also take note of your threats to get me banned. I'm sure the other members appreciate how much you are helping the cause of conservatism. After all, you wouldn't have this story and so many others without my work. Would you?

Yes, we would.

I note that when called out, you lack the courage to state in public what you imply. And of course ther projection is obvious to everyone except yourself -- it's clear which of us cares, desperately, about who gets the credit...

Better stick to antifreeping. Around here, you actually have to substantiate your slander.

163 posted on 03/18/2004 9:44:35 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: Interesting Times
"Yes, we would."

LOL. Good one.

Hey, how many people do you have signed up for your latest cruise? I hear you are dispensing with speakers or any workshops.

Good thinking.
164 posted on 03/18/2004 9:48:27 PM PST by Hon
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To: Interesting Times
BTW, how DID you come up with these EXACT instances? Or would you put your source's life at risk? LOL
165 posted on 03/18/2004 9:52:51 PM PST by Hon
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To: Hon
BTW, how DID you come up with these EXACT instances? Or would you put your source's life at risk? LOL

I have only your word that the NY Sun has the same material.

And your word is meaningless.

166 posted on 03/18/2004 9:55:12 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: Hon; Admin Moderator
What is your aim, here on this thread?

It doesn't advance the cause of conservatism one bit, or shed any light on Kerry's candidacy, for you to behave badly. No excuses from you--that's just what you're doing. You've gotten the thread off track with your snide attacks.

Furthermore, you're making the forum look bad.



167 posted on 03/18/2004 9:57:16 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: Interesting Times
"But at the November 1971 meeting in Kansas City, the VVAW leadership actually voted on a proposal to murder 6 or 7 U.S. Senators who supported the war. This appears not to have bothered John Kerry all that much..."

Wonder if there are as many corpses as a result of mysterious circumstances among Kerry's acquaintances as there apparently are among those of the Clinton's?

168 posted on 03/18/2004 10:00:07 PM PST by LucyJo
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To: Interesting Times
Let the record show that you refuse to say where you got this information.
169 posted on 03/18/2004 10:02:51 PM PST by Hon
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To: Judith Anne
It doesn't help the cause of conservativism to have the people who are researching, working, developing and getting this story into print to have their thunder stolen either. Maybe that didn't happen here. But maybe it did. Since IT won't say where he got the material we are left to wonder.

For the record I first brought up this story more than a month ago and I have been working on it since and I have gotten it picked up by a couple of reporters--especially Tom Lipscomb. It's one of several stories about Kerry (and other subjects) that I have worked long and hard on. If you want to get an idea of some of them, please go check my bookmarks:

http://www.freerepublic.com/~hon/links?U=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.freerepublic.com%2Ffocus%2Fmy%2F
170 posted on 03/18/2004 10:06:22 PM PST by Hon
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To: Hon
Ah yes. "Having their thunder stolen."

I think we see where you're coming from now.

171 posted on 03/18/2004 10:09:45 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: Admin Moderator; Jim Robinson; Judith Anne; Interesting Times; Hon
Please review the Hon-Interesting Times exchange.

The thread's intent to expose Kerry's crimes is being hijacked by an emotional tantrum.

Or is it by design?

172 posted on 03/18/2004 10:11:04 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: Interesting Times
"Ah yes. "Having their thunder stolen."

Hey, I used that phrase instead of "work product"--which is probably more accurate. But suture yourself.

It is hilarious that you can't even tell us where you got this information.
173 posted on 03/18/2004 10:12:37 PM PST by Hon
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To: Interesting Times
You know, I rarely see someone so insistent on taking credit for something freely shared here on the forum. I resent the thread being hijacked for that, I really do.

Maybe it could all be put in an opus, all those stolen ideas, all that unappreciated hard work...yes, an opus would be just the place for it....;-D

When I think of all the hard work backhoe has done, and Mia T, and others, I just cannot get all worked up about somebody's claims on the Kerry assassination plot story, especially when so many of us posting on it...
174 posted on 03/18/2004 10:14:20 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: PhilDragoo
Your question is precisely to the point.

I resent hijackers. It's always about THEM.
175 posted on 03/18/2004 10:15:45 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: Hon
Most here will take the word of

Interesting Times

over the word of

MOJO

anyday.


176 posted on 03/18/2004 10:17:42 PM PST by Bob J (www.freerepublic.net www.radiofreerepublic.com...check them out!)
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To: Piranha
More flip flops...he led a group that wanted to kill Senators, and then he became one.

We have a winner!

177 posted on 03/18/2004 10:18:24 PM PST by Nick Danger (Give me immortality... or give me death.)
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To: Judith Anne
"Hon" has an agenda all his own. The last four years he's been trying to get FR shut down and Jim thrown in jail. He hates the Network and anyone associated with it.
178 posted on 03/18/2004 10:22:11 PM PST by Bob J (www.freerepublic.net www.radiofreerepublic.com...check them out!)
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To: Judith Anne
"When I think of all the hard work backhoe has done, and Mia T, and others, I just cannot get all worked up about somebody's claims on the Kerry assassination plot story, especially when so many of us posting on it..."

LOL! Good one! Right you are. It's everybody's story.

But before I give up all hope, let me try once more to point out that I am not complaining for myself. I'm merely pointing out that what has been posted above is EXACTLY what a reporter and his researcher told me yesterday that they had uncovered in the archives of the NY Times and elsewhere--practically word for word.

I'm wondering how IT came to post this same information, but he won't say. But it is a bizarre coincidence--at least.

But thanks for taking the time to straighten me out. And I'm sorry I hijacked a thread with such a silly question as to where the material came from. I'm off to mine the nuggets of Mia T's oeuvre!
179 posted on 03/18/2004 10:23:31 PM PST by Hon
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To: Bob J
Why am I not surprised.

"Work product"? I mean, really! Sounds like somebody is trying to claim FR is stealing their ideas...if I had a nickel for every FReeper comment I've heard echoed by somebody on FoxNews within 48 hours, I'd retire.

As far as I know, no FReeper "owns" any comment made here. Nobody gets a copyright on their internet forum posts. Ever.
180 posted on 03/18/2004 10:25:22 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: Bob J
You seem determined to stalk me.

BTW, wasn't Mojo banned for defending GHWB from charges that he was at the apex of the CIA's drug cartel and that that was why all of the wars since WWII had been fought?

That Mojo?

Also BTW, how's Conniesaliar? And Demedici? Still getting around? LOL
181 posted on 03/18/2004 10:28:16 PM PST by Hon
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To: Hon
Hon, there is so much information posted here in a month that you HAVE to realize that anybody can get anything.

You aren't the only one who can think around here, and your apology doesn't mean diddly to me. YOU WRECKED THIS THREAD, AND I WAS INTERESTED IN IT.

You can't undo what you did, your childish behavior is out there for everyone to see, and you have NO credibility. You peed all over the place, and now you say, "sorry" but it's as phony and insincere as Kerry EVER was.

I won't forget you, for this.


182 posted on 03/18/2004 10:29:07 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: Hon
Still making snide remarks? You don't care about the Kerry story at all. That much is clear from your posts.

183 posted on 03/18/2004 10:30:55 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: Judith Anne
"YOU WRECKED THIS THREAD, AND I WAS INTERESTED IN IT."

Huh? Are you serious? What else did you think was going to happen in this thread?

"I won't forget you, for this."

Well, I'm going to try to forget you as fast as I can.
184 posted on 03/18/2004 10:33:17 PM PST by Hon
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To: Hon; Bob J; Judith Anne; Interesting Times; Jim Robinson
And I'm sorry I hijacked a thread with such a silly question as to where the material came from.

What is apparent is that you hijacked the thread.

What is also apparent is that, rather than being sorry, you seemed to enjoy it.

185 posted on 03/18/2004 10:33:40 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: Interesting Times
Oh, yes it is. We should all be active in getting this out. Kerry hasn't changed--that's important. America can't afford him anywhere near the white house-- he is a danger and a disgrace.
186 posted on 03/18/2004 10:36:16 PM PST by faithincowboys (Go to www.punditstar.blogspot.com)
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To: Hon; Admin Moderator
This thread was fine until YOU WRECKED IT. Take a few minutes and check that out.



187 posted on 03/18/2004 10:36:25 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: faithincowboys
We should all be active in getting this out. Kerry hasn't changed--that's important. America can't afford him anywhere near the white house-- he is a danger and a disgrace.

Roger that.

He has been a consistently anti-defense, anti-intelligence, anti-American influence.

He is fit for the lowest level of Hell, not the highest office in the land.

188 posted on 03/18/2004 10:38:35 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: PhilDragoo
What is apparent is that you and Judith think hijacking a thread is more heinous than say hijacking someone's story that they had researched and hoped to sell for money. (And once again for the slow amongst us: "I'm not talking about myself.")

Please, post a few hundred more times about how I destroyed this thread. It certainly is a much worse crime than say burning one of the very few reporters or outlets who are willing to put into print stories that don't fit the liberal bias.

For the record I am now leaving the thread. Eventually the moderators will get around to removing all of my posts probably anyway--while leaving the insulting and slandering ones to me in place. Such is the reward for a good deed in a naughty world, I guess.

But I will check back--and mind you, I expect great things from you and Judith and the rest on this thread. I can't wait to see where it is going to go without my burdensome presence!
189 posted on 03/18/2004 10:41:39 PM PST by Hon
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To: Hon
Maybe you should stick to the work at a hand and quit targeting Network members.
190 posted on 03/18/2004 10:44:20 PM PST by Bob J (www.freerepublic.net www.radiofreerepublic.com...check them out!)
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To: Hon
Look guys, this is a silly argument. We are all on the same side. It is obvious that there are many people working on the same story and the sources of information are probably the same veterans because they are the only ones who know the truth. These veterans are probably talking to multiple people unless someone paid them for an exclusive story. If that's the case someone better just say it.
191 posted on 03/18/2004 11:12:52 PM PST by Eva
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To: Interesting Times
>>the protest at which where Kerry also told bogus tales of war crimes to the Senate.

I'd like to put it...

"Committed a felony by giving false testimony to the Senate,
(in addition to slandering all heroic Vietnam servicemen still fighting for our country)"

OR

"Committed a felony by failing to report all names and details
of known war crimes"
192 posted on 03/18/2004 11:14:02 PM PST by Future Useless Eater (Freedom_Loving_Engineer)
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To: Eva; PhilDragoo
So, is the thread unlocked?
193 posted on 03/18/2004 11:14:39 PM PST by Judith Anne (Is life a paradox? Well, yes and no...)
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To: FL_engineer
"Committed a felony by failing to report all names and details of known war crimes"

Reading the testimony from the Winter Soldier Investigation, it's obvious that the witnesses were extremely careful *not* to allege anything that could easily be verified or disproven. There are virtually no instances where names, dates and locations are available on these supposed atrocities.

It seems unlikely that this could have been an accident.

194 posted on 03/18/2004 11:23:24 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: Judith Anne; Eva; Interesting Times; MeekOneGOP; chance33_98; Grampa Dave; BOBTHENAILER; SAMWolf; ..
Thanks to chance33_98, I am able to present this proof Jong Foo Kerry met with foreign leaders.


195 posted on 03/18/2004 11:27:50 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: Interesting Times
It seems unlikely that this could have been an accident.

These "witnesses" made themselves scarce when the investigation was conducted, and would not provide details.

196 posted on 03/18/2004 11:30:08 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: PhilDragoo
It seems unlikely that this could have been an accident.

These "witnesses" made themselves scarce when the investigation was conducted, and would not provide details.

The "Witnesses" were told by Kerry and the VVAW to NOT cooperate with the Senate Investigation or the FBI.

Isn't that known as "obstruction of justice"?

Regards,

TS

197 posted on 03/18/2004 11:38:42 PM PST by The Shrew (RightTalk - The New NPR)
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To: Interesting Times; FL_engineer; Judith Anne
Reading the testimony from the Winter Soldier Investigation, it's obvious that the witnesses were extremely careful *not* to allege anything that could easily be verified or disproven. There are virtually no instances where names, dates and locations are available on these supposed atrocities.

Doonesbury and the Winter Soldier

But strangely, all those horrific accounts of rape, torture, arson and slaughter that the VVAW had recorded in Detroit seemed to evaporate once the real investigation demanded by Senator Hatfield began. As recounted in Guenter Lewy's 1978 book “America in Vietnam,” few witnesses agreed to talk with military investigators, even after being assured that they would not be asked about their own crimes. Many of those who did permit interviews turned out never to have been in combat. Some of the most gruesome claims came from men who were imposters using the names of real Vietnam veterans. One Marine who had been in combat eventually told investigators that a member of the Nation of Islam had helped prepare his statement, and admitted that he had never witnessed any of the atrocities he had testified to in Detroit. In the end, the Navy was unable to verify any of the hundreds of war crimes alleged by the Winter Soldier Investigation. Neither has anyone else during the 33 years since, including journalists, historians, and military and Congressional investigators.

198 posted on 03/18/2004 11:43:06 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: PhilDragoo
Poetry. Sheer poetry...
199 posted on 03/18/2004 11:56:07 PM PST by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: The Shrew
Isn't that known as "obstruction of justice"?

It's deja vu all over again.

Cue Mitch Ryder with "Devil In A Blue Dress".

Refresh:

1) Kerry won't release military records which would prove he self-cited his five awards and lacks witnesses to support them;

2) Kerry fraudulently separated to beat it back to the world;

3) Kerry thereupon uttered serial blood libel on two and a half million better men than he;

4) Kerry won the war for the Communists by helping to turn the American people against the containment of those Communists;

5) Kerry participated in a conspiracy to assassinate members of the U.S. Senate;

6) Kerry was derelict in failing to report to proper authority said conspiracy;

7) Kerry knowingly conspired with other imposters to lie about atrocities, and to deceive duly appointed Federal investigators;

8) Kerry continues to lie about the status of his membership in and leadership of the VVAW to this day.

200 posted on 03/19/2004 12:01:17 AM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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