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Progress in Iraq dampens demonstration fuse
National Business review ^ | 3/21/04 | NBR Ltd

Posted on 03/20/2004 4:54:27 PM PST by Mark Felton

As the turnover date for the governance of Iraq nears -- and an independent poll shows that overwhelming numbers of ordinary Iraqis want Coalition forces to stay on, at least until a stable government is established -- anti-war protests around the world yesterday drew smaller crowds than anticipated.

The global protests were organised for the one-year anniversary of the day the Coalition began the attacks on an Iraq then under the thumb of Baathist dictator Saddam Hussein.

In New Zealand, a few hundred activists gathered in Wellington and Auckland, with smaller numbers in other locations.

The messages sent by organisers rang curiously hollow since many emphasised the importance of self rule for Iraq, a goal that is already part of the core Coalition agenda.

"It is hoped that this march will send a clear message to the government that New Zealanders do not want to be a part of these unjust occupations. Instead we call for self determination for the peoples of Afghanistan and Iraq," said one New Zealand organiser in a pre-march press release.

Where hundreds of thousands marched in protests a year ago, only thousands showed up yesterday, but the demonstrations in some cities made for impressive television nonetheless.

A few big centres of activity, like Rome, took in bus and train loads of protesters from all over Europe, but still fell well short of the numbers that filled the streets there last February, before the war actually commenced.

Rome officials put the turnout at 250,000 but organisers inflated those figures to upwards of 2 million.

Last year, anti-war demonstrations in Rome were the largest of the many seen in Europe, with more than 2 million involved.

Paris managed a turnout of 2,500. Amsterdam saw 3,000 in the streets according to one source (and "a few hundred" according to another), while Paris managed to gather 25,000. Germany reported 1,600 in Berlin.

The low turnouts in countries that have been loudest in their opposition to the war may indicate that the issue is losing steam in the popular imagination as Iraq moves toward political autonomy.

In Spain, where one journalist discounted the much lower than anticipated turnout as the result of demonstration fatigue, 150,000 people demonstrated in Barcelona.

Spanish Prime Minister-elect Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, a staunch opponent of the war, has called it a "disaster" and said he will withdraw Spain's 1,300 troops from Iraq by June, the date already tentatively set for the proposed turnover of Iraq's administration, unless the occupation receives a mandate from the United Nations.

MSNBC said that "thousands" marched in Madrid and noted that while "no crowd estimate was immediately available" the numbers "paled" in comparison to the mass demonstrations that had taken place all over the country following the bombings of Madrid's trains.

That story also put the numbers of demonstrators in Middle Eastern capitals at "hundreds" and said "tens of thousands" took to the streets in London.

The left-leaning, "alternative voice" Inter Press Service News Agency noted that organisers were "clearly disappointed with the turnout estimated by the police at no more than 25,000" in London. An organiser told media representatives that one reason for the low turnout was that "the weather isn't great." More than a million demonstrated in London last before the war last year. 21-Mar-2004


TOPICS: Breaking News; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: iraq; losers; oifanniversary; progress; rebuildingiraq
These are not "peace protestors", they are anti-American protestors.

The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.

Both faiths dampen the spread of socialism and Islam.

1 posted on 03/20/2004 4:54:27 PM PST by Mark Felton
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To: Mark Felton
The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.

How do you figure that? Would you say the root of anti-Mexicanism is hatred of Catholics?The root of anti-Germanism is hatred of Lutherans? The root of anti-Turkism is hatred of Muslems?

There were times when there was very little anti-Americanism in the world (leastways compared to now). But we have always been a Christian country. Why are people so worked up about our being a Christian country today, as opposed to say 50 or 100 years ago?

2 posted on 03/20/2004 5:06:34 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: Mark Felton
The messages sent by organisers rang curiously hollow since many emphasised the importance of self rule for Iraq, a goal that is already part of the core Coalition agenda.

The real message sent is that they are not for us but against us.

Let them make their message known, for Dubya has made his message very clear!

3 posted on 03/20/2004 5:06:43 PM PST by EGPWS
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To: Mark Felton
BTTT
4 posted on 03/20/2004 5:08:56 PM PST by Fiddlstix (This Space Available for Rent or Lease by the Day, Week, or Month. Reasonable Rates. Inquire within.)
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To: StarFan; Dutchy; alisasny; BobFromNJ; BUNNY2003; Cacique; Clemenza; Coleus; cyborg; DKNY; ...
As the turnover date for the governance of Iraq nears -- and an independent poll shows that overwhelming numbers of ordinary Iraqis want Coalition forces to stay on, at least until a stable government is established --anti-war protests around the world yesterday drew smaller crowds than anticipated.

Please FReepmail me if you want on or off my infrequent ‘miscellaneous’ ping list.

5 posted on 03/20/2004 5:11:09 PM PST by nutmeg (Why vote for Bush? Imagine Commander in Chief John Fin al-Qerry)
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To: Mark Felton
The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.
Both faiths dampen the spread of socialism and Islam.

I agree that this is part of it. And many groups openly cite support for Israel as their major reason for hating America.

6 posted on 03/20/2004 5:23:05 PM PST by Jorge
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To: nutmeg
I was at the Bush campaign kickoff in Orlando (Florida) today. Three sallow, incredibly ugly young persons (2, I believe, were female, and one may have been male, or maybe something else) were escorted out as they were shouting and unfurling a flag with a "peace sign" on it! Yes! After 30 years, these kids have rediscovered that stupid symbol, which looks as dorky now as it did in the 60s and 70s.
7 posted on 03/20/2004 5:49:16 PM PST by livius
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To: DentsRun
" There were times when there was very little anti-Americanism in the world"

That was before the ascendancy of socialist globalism and the New World Order. Modern globalism is driven by the socialists. Their full fledged success is denied as long as there are people who believe in the Supremacy of God over Man rather than the Supremacy of the State over Man.

The stronghold of men who believe in the Supremacy of God is the USA. There is no other nation which has dedicated itself so strongly to that proposition.

Undermine that bastion through cultural attack and the path is created for a greater socialist state in the USA and therefore the world.

It is no coincidence that the world socialists and the Islamofascists have the same enemy, the USA.

8 posted on 03/20/2004 6:03:07 PM PST by Mark Felton (People do not muster for hate, they muster for hope.)
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To: livius
I was at the Bush campaign kickoff in Orlando (Florida) today.

How cool... I'm envious! Dubya's speech was fabulous. Thanks to FReepers' posts here, I watched this event live on C-SPAN today. Glad to hear the unwashed peaceniks were "escorted" off the premises!

Just curious... how did you get tickets to this event?

9 posted on 03/20/2004 6:56:52 PM PST by nutmeg (Why vote for Bush? Imagine Commander in Chief John Fin al-Qerry)
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To: Mark Felton
"Their full fledged success is denied as long as there are people who believe in the Supremacy of God over Man rather than the Supremacy of the State over Man."

They are all fundamentalists who oppose the U.S.

The radical Islamists, of course, are no surprise. The Euro-Socialists, on the other hand, are Secular Fundamentalists...and their opposition to us stems primarily from that new brand of radicalism.

10 posted on 03/20/2004 7:03:32 PM PST by Southack (Media bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Mark Felton
So many have now learned a new slogan, "Give War a Chance" And, how, when done by a just nation, it can be carried out to better and to save lives.
11 posted on 03/20/2004 7:37:03 PM PST by FreeAtlanta (never surrender, this is for the kids)
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To: DentsRun
Why are people so worked up about our being a Christian country today, as opposed to say 50 or 100 years ago?

Because 50 or 100 years ago, European nations were Christian as well. That is now very far from being the case, and modern Europeans see Christianity as a peculiarly alien force, a pernicious and puzzling influence upon the United States.

12 posted on 03/20/2004 7:49:16 PM PST by SedVictaCatoni (The Pledge of Allegiance was written by a rabid socialist. Look it up.)
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To: FreeAtlanta
No liberty, no peace.



13 posted on 03/20/2004 7:56:59 PM PST by Mark Felton (Welfare pacifies. Pacifists slave.)
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To: Mark Felton

14 posted on 03/20/2004 10:31:48 PM PST by Texaggie79 (Did I just say that?)
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To: Texaggie79
Where was that Commie photo taken? That's just the kind of stuff I used to see in Argentina.
15 posted on 03/20/2004 11:05:28 PM PST by Choose Ye This Day ("The look in the kangaroo's eye made me feel that I knew I was in trouble.")
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To: MNLDS
Where was that Commie photo taken? That's just the kind of stuff I used to see in Argentina.

They have a PCR in Uruguay too, and of course Brasil but the sign is in Spanish.

I think the commies in Spain are called the PCR as well but have never met one.
16 posted on 03/20/2004 11:21:17 PM PST by InABunkerUnderSF (Comunistas Fuera Del Mundo!)
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To: Jorge
If you go back and read three decades of Saddam's speeches, what you find is someone who inherited a Nazi ideology through Michel Aflaq, the founder of the Ba'ath Party who believes in genocide as a racial tool, who believes that it is his mission to have an apocalyptic confrontation with the U.S., and who believes, as he says over and over again, that he wants to be remembered 500 years from now as someone who brought the U.S. to destruction, someone who created an Arab regime or an Arab civilization which dominated the U.S. civilization.

This same Nazi mindset is part of the ideological cook book being used by the world socialist conspiracy to win the masses. The Hitler regime developed the formula to control and win over the masses. These socialist political technicians are using the same techniques and, when you look below the surface, you will find that they are doing it for money and power.
17 posted on 03/21/2004 1:34:20 AM PST by jonrick46 (jonrick46)
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To: livius

The Footprint of the American Chicken!

18 posted on 03/21/2004 2:24:10 AM PST by Old Sarge
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To: Old Sarge
Good one! I'd forgotten about that great description of it.

Does anybody else find it a little weird that John F(lip-flop, 'kn, etc.) Kerry seems to be stimulating a revival of 1968? These kids were certainly not even a gleam in their sperm-donor's eye in 1968 - but they looked as if they had been vacuum sealed at an anti-Vietnam demostration and dropped into our midst almost 40 years later.
19 posted on 03/21/2004 2:44:20 AM PST by livius
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To: nutmeg
The tickets were distributed through the county Republican party. It was a little inconvenient, because I don't live in that county (it's 2 hours away), and people were supposed to pick up their tickets in advance. But it turned out that they could be picked up early on the day of the event, so I drove down the night before, stayed overnight and was at the conference center just after 7:00 a.m. to pick them up.

If you get in touch with your local GOP organization, they will probably have a mailing list or e-mail list that can notify you of things like this. If you have a Young Republicans group, sometimes they're more energetic than the old-line groups (who strike me as a real weak point in the campaign, because they are not good at informing people or at using volunteers well).
20 posted on 03/21/2004 2:48:50 AM PST by livius
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To: Mark Felton
The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.

The root of anti-Americanism doesn't have to be religious hatred. Most of these "peace" protestors are low-life ananrchists who want to see this country do as Spain- - -relinquish individual initiative and free enterprise and move to socialism. It's the same thinking that fueled the anti-war movement in the Viet Nam era....with some of the same participants..

21 posted on 03/21/2004 5:06:43 AM PST by stanz (Those who don't believe in evolution should go jump off the flat edge of the Earth.)
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To: Mark Felton
Oops.. make that " anarchists."
22 posted on 03/21/2004 5:08:36 AM PST by stanz (Those who don't believe in evolution should go jump off the flat edge of the Earth.)
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To: DentsRun
"There were times when there was very little anti-Americanism in the world (leastways compared to now). But we have always been a Christian country."

So who has changed, then, the USA or the anti-Americans? As Europe becomes more and more socialist and secular, anti-Americanism grows. It's our constitution. It's the most anti-socialist document in the world. It' ain't us, it's them.
23 posted on 03/21/2004 6:08:42 AM PST by Tricorn
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To: Mark Felton
Is this another"Million Man March"load of Bu**Sh*T?
24 posted on 03/21/2004 8:26:50 AM PST by bandleader
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To: livius
Thanks so much for that advice, livius. GOP groups are pretty quiet up here in liberal CT, but I'll see what I can find out.

Your long drive and overnight stay in the Orlando area to see Dubya at that fabulous rally sure sounds worth it to me! :-)

25 posted on 03/21/2004 8:43:37 AM PST by nutmeg (Why vote for Bush? Imagine Commander in Chief John Fin al-Qerry)
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To: Tricorn
So who has changed, then, the USA or the anti-Americans? As Europe becomes more and more socialist and secular, anti-Americanism grows. It's our constitution. It's the most anti-socialist document in the world. It' ain't us, it's them.

My previous response was to someone who had said that anti-Americanism was a response to our being a Christian nation. I was just pointing out that there are a lot of Christian nations (Canada, Mexico, Belgium, New Zealand) that aren't hated by anyone. I don't think our Christianity has anything to do with their not liking us. The whole non-Arab world sympathized with our loss on 9-11. The question is, why has world opinion shifted so much in the last three years? I don't think it's because Europe is socialistic. They've been socialistic for as long as I can remember. This isn't something that just happened in the last three years.

26 posted on 03/21/2004 12:38:38 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: DentsRun
"I was just pointing out that there are a lot of Christian nations (Canada, Mexico, Belgium, New Zealand)"

I'm just curious, what makes you think of these nations as Christian?

Seriously.

Mexico, for example, has had one ultra-anti-Catholic government after another since before Russia became Communist. Even the current government, which is no longer the -rabidly- anti-Catholic party that was there for decades, is still hardly friendly to them.

Qwinn
27 posted on 03/21/2004 12:47:16 PM PST by Qwinn
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To: DentsRun
"This isn't something that just happened in the last three years"

Look for the pattern here: Hated during Reagan, loved us during Clinton, hated us during Bush...

And I won't even respond to "the whole non-Arab world sympathized with our loss on 9-11." ::Roll eyes::
28 posted on 03/21/2004 1:12:45 PM PST by Tricorn
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To: DentsRun
The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.

How do you figure that? Would you say the root of anti-Mexicanism is hatred of Catholics?The root of anti-Germanism is hatred of Lutherans? The root of anti-Turkism is hatred of Muslems?

No to the latter, yes to the former. Actually I don't know what motivates their hatred. But, they don't like Jews and they don't like Americans. So does it matter what anybody thinks about Lutherans or Turks? Shall we just ponder while others kill?

29 posted on 03/21/2004 1:16:41 PM PST by jimfree (Neither a browser nor a lurker be.)
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To: Mark Felton
"It is hoped that this march will send a clear message to the government that New Zealanders do not want to be a part of these unjust occupations.

And what happens when Iraqis vote for a new government that does not get any where near 100% of the vote????

And what happens when that government asks for the continued presence of coalition troops to help keep the Islamofacists and non-Iraqi murderers at bay???

30 posted on 03/21/2004 1:33:36 PM PST by Calvin Locke
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To: Fiddlstix
"As the turnover date for the governance of Iraq nears -- and an independent poll shows that overwhelming numbers of ordinary Iraqis want Coalition forces to stay on, at least until a stable government is established -- anti-war protests around the world yesterday drew smaller crowds than anticipated."

this says it all and warms the cockles of my heart

31 posted on 03/21/2004 3:24:28 PM PST by raloxk
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To: DentsRun
I don't think our Christianity has anything to do with their not liking us.

I don't think so, either. The countries that dislike us the most (Germany, France, etc) have been becoming more Socialist for years. Their economies are in the tank. There is a growing gap between our prosperity and their lack of it. They blame us for it.
I hate to say it, but "it's the economy, stupid" is the answer to more than one question.

32 posted on 03/21/2004 3:30:37 PM PST by speekinout
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To: jimfree
The root of anti-Americanism is hatred of Christianity and Judaism.

You miss my point. Which is that there are lots of Christian countries that aren't hated. So the fact that America is a Christian country could hardly be the reason that America is so hated now. America has always been a Christian country but people didn't always hate us.

33 posted on 03/21/2004 3:30:38 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: jimfree
Shall we just ponder while others kill?

Well, be my guest. Grab your weapon and fly to whatever country offends you most and do your duty. As for your resenting people who "pomder" here. I just responded to the person who raised the issue, same as you did.

34 posted on 03/21/2004 3:38:21 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: Tricorn
And I won't even respond to "the whole non-Arab world sympathized with our loss on 9-11." ::Roll eyes::

Roll your eyes till the cows come home. I would too if I had no good answer to the assertion that, except for the Arab countries, the U.S. experienced a worldwide wave of sympathy for our loss on 9-11. The notion that Europe always hated us absurd. I hitchhiked around Europe when I was a college student. People gave me rides, took me home so their wives could cook me dinner, took me drinking at their favorite beer garden, introduced me to all their friends, simply because I was an American.

35 posted on 03/21/2004 3:46:25 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: speekinout
There is a growing gap between our prosperity and their lack of it. They blame us for it. I hate to say it, but "it's the economy, stupid" is the answer to more than one question.

Could be. Though there was a far greater gap between their prosperity and ours in the decades following WWII than there is now. And it seems to me that that was a golden age for Americans to travel around the globe. Actually I'm not comfortable with using the word "hate" to describe how the rest of the world feels about us. If people hate us so much why would they move here in a second if they had a chance? Is there any American embassy in the entire world where there isn't a long waiting list of people trying to emigrate here? If people hate us, why do they love our music, our movies, our culture and our blue jeans?

36 posted on 03/21/2004 3:55:37 PM PST by DentsRun
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To: DentsRun
They don't hate us - they're jealous. They come here and see all that we have, and blame us because they don't have the same standard of living.
Their standard of living was improving greatly in the period following WWII. That was a period of optimism.
But now their standard of living is going down, while ours is still going up. That has to mean that we're "cheating". Not.
But who doesn't want the best? We all do, too.
37 posted on 03/21/2004 6:14:44 PM PST by speekinout
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To: Qwinn
I'm just curious, what makes you think of these nations as Christian?

The people. The majority of them are Christian. Nothing else comes close.

38 posted on 03/22/2004 1:15:12 AM PST by DentsRun
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To: Old Sarge
Too funny,LOL!!!!!
39 posted on 03/22/2004 8:22:35 AM PST by ChevyZ28 (We can make the plans of our heart, but the final out come is in God's hands.)
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To: DentsRun
They are "christian" by inheritance, not by practice.

Europe has a very low rate of church attendance. If your read the European's comments regarding Bush's ourspoken Christian faith, it scares them.

Europe was Christian in the past.

That was then, this is now.

40 posted on 03/22/2004 2:22:03 PM PST by happygrl (We love life, and we love search-and-destroy.)
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