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Solana hits back after stormy Kosovo trip
AFP via Yahoo ^ | Thu Mar 25, 9:54 AM ET | AFP staff

Posted on 03/26/2004 6:39:48 AM PST by wonders

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To: getoffmylawn
Yes. OK. That does make sense, especially regarding the time line.

Looking back, then, the commentary was correct as far as the structures necessary for bringing law and order aren't rigid enough to stop it.

Right now the foxes are in charge of the henhouse, and the EU, in this case Solano, are telling the hens that they're a major part of the problem.

It's probably time to let the hens defend themselves rather than have the UN pretend to do it for them. They'll do a better job.

longjack

41 posted on 03/27/2004 4:27:25 PM PST by longjack
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To: longjack; getoffmylawn; MarMema
There was practically no crime in Yugoslavia back in the '70s and early '80s, under the old socialist regime, as far as I recall. Yes, the Dalmatian coast was a hot vacation spot for German tourists. When I was a kid back in the early '70s, my family returned from Greece back to Switzerland via Macedonia, Kosovo, Dalmatian coast (we went down to Greece via Italy, took the ferry across). Lots of Europeans did that, especially Germans.

There was crime in Albania, but I think it was mainly thievery. We were sternly warned not to wander over the border into Albania (crime in Albania was notorious at the time). Just two weeks before, a British tourist family had mistakenly crossed the border and were murdered by Albanian thieves, their car completely stripped. We nearly did the same, as we somehow wound up driving along an unpaved goat track in the mountains near the Kosovo-Alabania border, but the local people kindly helped us keep on track and inside the border.

The crime problems in Yugoslavia in the 90s had to do with economic problems, the sanctions (sanctions always spawn mafia activity in and around the target country), the civil wars. I don't know much about crime, if any, in the late 80s.

The turning point, as far as the organized crime concerning Albanians from Kosovo was around late 1997/early 1998, I think. Oh, here we go, I found this (from The San Francisco Chronicle:

The rise of Kosovar bosses to the pinnacle of the drug trade -- and the sudden, simultaneous appearance of the KLA -- dates from 1997, when the Berisha government fell in Albania amid nationwide rioting over a collapsed financial pyramid scheme that destroyed the savings of millions and wrecked the economy. In the unchecked looting that followed, the nation's armories were emptied of weapons, explosives and ammunition.

It's a long article with lots of info.You can read it here: KLA Linked To Enormous Heroin Trade Police suspect drugs helped finance revolt

Thanks again for your help and translations, and for taking an interest in the Balkans issues. :)

42 posted on 03/27/2004 5:19:01 PM PST by wonders (Whoever said "All's fair in love and war" probably never participated in either.)
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To: jpsb; MarMema
Russia did not need a passage through Eastern Europe -- they could have landed on the Montenegrin coast and dropped their troops and supplies flying through FRY's territory. If there is a will there is a way.

Right now, there is a will. I think, Putin is making careful steps at winning the hearts and minds first, without appearing interventionist while letting the Kosovo fiasco play itself out.

Besides, until recently, the Serbian government was completely oriented towards Washington and totally committed to desconstructing the nation into an amorphous non-entity palatable to the ilk at the International Crisis Group.

43 posted on 03/27/2004 5:48:09 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: wonders; MarMema; FormerLib; Destro
It's the disease of the last decade of the 20th and the 1st decade of the 21st century: never take responsibility for what you do.

And Solana is just one of the many public figure jerks who will deny that anything he or his ilk do wrong is somehow their fault?

"Misanalyzied" the Kosovo Albanian thugs? Whose fault is that? These mental midgits who run public and political affairs nowadays are infantile enough to think that pouring money into soemthing will somehow spirtiually and culturally change it. "Buying peace" and "Buying friends" is their approach to "solutions" in the world.

The fact is, all these interventions are proving to be monumental failures, one after another, for creating death and desrtuction and solving nothing. In fact, these interventions have only created fertile grounds for further disruption, violence and death to come.

If someone needs a qualified person to do a simple job of leading a worker's party, or teaching a class, and turns out he or she who applied for the job is not qualified because he or she is incapable of controlling the workers or the children, and -- when questioned -- charge that "the fault is with the children in the class" there is something seriously mentally wrong with such a person.

Take for instance the incident of burning the mosque in Belgrade by angry mobs and the failure or unwillingness of the police to stop it. What did the Serbian authorities do? Simple: they fired the police chiefs on whose watch this happened! No one ever thought of saying the police chiefs are not at fault because the fault is with the mob!

BTW, Serbian youth organizations personally apologized to the mufti of Belgrade for the dispicable act of vandalism committed by some Serbs. They took the reponsibility of a small group upon their conscience to apologize. It is quite clear who is adult and who is not in this world. And it ain't career scumbags like Solana and his spineless ilk in the so-called international community.

44 posted on 03/27/2004 6:10:46 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: starys
Any clue why?

Old German friendships, like Croatian nationalists, Slovene servitude, and so on. The WWII buddies -- the Nazi Veteran's Club is kept alive. The Germans never forgave the Serbs for spoiling their dreams in the 20th century.

History is very much alive and present in most of the world. Dismissing history and part of the present is what causes Americans to "misanalyze" these situations consistently. The old Latin saying says Historia est mater studiorum (history is a mother of learning). We are a product of our past experiences, individually and collectively.

45 posted on 03/27/2004 6:17:41 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: MarMema
The Russians will never get anywhere

And where is the West going? To Mars? Is that like a little bee going from a beehive to the next pranch on a tree? How significant is that compared to the rest of the earth?

It's that Western self-aggrandizement, deification of mankind, we can do anything and everything...really deep, and completely laughble and false.

The plain simple truth is, perhaps Russians will never go anythere, ...as they observe the German frantically running in an activity cage trying to convince the Russian that the German is actually going somewhere because he is running while the Russian is standing.

46 posted on 03/27/2004 6:27:13 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: wonders
Kosovo has been a United Nations (news - web sites) protectorate since 1999

The UN is a total failure. Without the US totally in charge, everything they touch turns to.....well......you know.

47 posted on 03/27/2004 6:35:09 PM PST by McGavin999 (Evil thrives when good men do nothing!)
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Comment #48 Removed by Moderator

Comment #49 Removed by Moderator

To: wonders
when the Berisha government fell in Albania amid nationwide rioting over a collapsed financial pyramid scheme that destroyed the savings of millions and wrecked the economy.

This was the massive depression I was thinking of, the reason, supposedly, that they moved across the border in hordes.

50 posted on 03/27/2004 7:34:07 PM PST by MarMema (Next Year in Constantinople!)
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To: Dr.Deth
How much longer can they try to hide how miserably wrong they were? How quiet is the media here when the proof has been put out into the open now? Liars and murderers trying to cover their past lies and misplaced trust, or general stupidity, I am not sure which.
51 posted on 03/27/2004 7:37:29 PM PST by MarMema (Next Year in Constantinople!)
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To: McGavin999
I'll grant you, the UN is far from perfect. However, in this case, the US was in charge of instigating this entirely predictable fiasco with its bombing campaign on behalf of the UCK/KLA in 1999 (and no, there was no UN support for this bombing, in fact it was in violation of the UN Charter -- NATO Charter, too for that matter). The UN is there for window-dressing and to act as a handy scapegoat. US/NATO (KFOR) has all the military power in-theatre and they're under US/NATO command, not under UN command. UNMIK is strictly civilian.
52 posted on 03/27/2004 7:57:35 PM PST by wonders (Whoever said "All's fair in love and war" probably never participated in either.)
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To: kosta50
Well said as usual, Kosta. Bravo and thank you.
53 posted on 03/27/2004 8:10:48 PM PST by wonders (Whoever said "All's fair in love and war" probably never participated in either.)
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To: wonders
the US was in charge of instigating this entirely predictable fiasco with its bombing campaign on behalf of the UCK/KLA in 1999

And what a huge coincidence that here in the US the media has been completely silent on this. I recall the hours on end of Albanian refugee pics on CNN or whatever. I recall having a target on my van (remember those?) and people at work either ridiculing me or shouting angrily at me. I don't mean this for my personal vindication, I don't work there anymore. I just want all those people to know the truth. Or at least have a chance to make a decision from the facts...and it really kills me how they are selectively silent. It doubles the victimization of the Serbian people.

54 posted on 03/27/2004 8:43:20 PM PST by MarMema (Next Year in Constantinople!)
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To: kosta50
Old German friendships, like Croatian nationalists

That was my first thought. But I thought the Germans were horrified by the Croats after WW2 and had distanced themselves. Perhaps not.

55 posted on 03/27/2004 8:45:16 PM PST by MarMema (Next Year in Constantinople!)
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To: kosta50
And where is the West going?

Funny thing that, it was back in 1996 or so on a Lufthansa flight that this discussion took place. How things have changed since then.

56 posted on 03/27/2004 8:46:38 PM PST by MarMema (Next Year in Constantinople!)
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To: wonders; Wraith; Kate22; DTA; GeraldP
Tito did not allow the Serbs to return to their homes after the war and present boundaries had been established. (I honestly don't remember, if I ever knew, about the Roma, whatever Roma were left alive in 1945.)

The Roma population stats of Kosovo and Metohija is pretty difficult to pin down. Even in the most tolerant to times they list themseleves as anything BUT Roma (Egyptian, etc).

Evidently, there was a campaign during the last widespread census to count many Roma as Albanian.

Some Roma sources suggest something on order of 500,000 Roma lived in KosMet pre-1999.

I have noted that in the June 1999 ethnic cleansing many Roma who were attacked by the KLA had names which normally would be attributed as Albanian.

57 posted on 03/29/2004 5:32:50 AM PST by vooch
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To: vooch
>>>>Some Roma sources suggest something on order of 500,000 Roma lived in KosMet pre-1999<<<<

500,000 is perhaps exagerated, but 200-300 000 is probably correct. Kosovo Shqiptars on purpose boycotted 1991 census to make population breakdown impossible.

They lied through the teeth about Kosovo and Metohia being 90% Albanian. Most likely, it was 65-70% Albanian in 1991.

In the 1980s Kosovo Shqiptars did not hide the fact they want to eradicate all others from Kosovo.

the awkward term "ethnic cleansing" came into english from "ethnically clan Kosovo", a Shqiptar 1980's political term.

The racism of the statement is striking - as long as there are other nations, for Kosovo Shqiptars, Kosovo is dirty.

Not surprising, having in mind Shqiptar NAzi past.

What is surprising is the fact that in Kosovo case, NAZIS were rewarded by international community, mostly by U.S.

58 posted on 03/29/2004 7:05:21 AM PST by DTA (feja e shqiptarit eshte terorizm)
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To: DTA
They are the cancer of Europe.
59 posted on 03/29/2004 7:13:50 AM PST by junta
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To: DTA; GeraldP; wonders; *balkans
They lied through the teeth about Kosovo and Metohia being 90% Albanian. Most likely, it was 65-70% Albanian in 1991.

The 60-70% figure includes illegal aliens as far as I can recall. Given that illegals were something on order of 200k, what would that make the Albanian percenatage of KosMet ?

60 posted on 03/29/2004 7:49:40 AM PST by vooch
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