L.A. man shoots car thief, charged with murder

Yahoo News ^ | Wed Apr 7, '04 | unknown

[Stu Cohen]

I never said that they did, but it's easier, safer, and less expensive to secure your vehicle (or drive a less flashy one), than hope to be able to shoot the thief.

I dunno about that JJ.

The most stolen car in the USA is the humble Toyota Camry. Not really the flashiest of machines. I believe the Honda Accord isn't too far down the list. Again, not really a car that screams out "FLASHY".

They are fairly modest, practical, reliable cars that are very popular with consumers, and thus have a great demand for parts. Flash doesn't have much to do with theft rates. Quantity of ownership does.

The best thing you could do to prevent theft is to buy some obscure, old car with no demand for parts. Maybe a 1965 Volkswagon or something.

It's a damn shame that people have to consider these types of things.

If we had more people like Mr. Song ... we wouldn't have to spend so much time worrying about it, IMHO.

[jimt]

Prosecutors say Song came out of his house to find two car thieves pushing his customized Honda out of his driveway in the predawn hours on Monday and opened fire, hitting Martinez, 25, in the back. The second suspect got away.

"The fact that your car is being stolen isn't a legal justification for killing somebody," Deputy District Attorney Frank Somes said. "Generally, you're not allowed to kill people unless they are committing a violent felony or you are acting in self defense."

Song's actions would be perfectly legal in Texas - as they should be everywhere.

Song's customized Honda represents many, many hours of labor. The scum perps were stealing a part of his life. They deserve to lose theirs.

[Stu Cohen]

I never said that they did, but it's easier, safer, and less expensive to secure your vehicle (or drive a less flashy one), than hope to be able to shoot the thief.

The 10 Most Stolen cars in the USA in 2003:

1) Toyota Camry
2) Honda Accord
3) Honda Civic
4) Chevy Full Size Pickup
5) Ford Full Size Pickup
6) Jeep Cherokee
7) Olds Cutlass
8) Dodge Caravan
9) Ford Taurus
10) Toyota Corolla

I don't consider any of these vehichles particularly "flashy". They are all pretty much practical commuters, soccermom shuttles, or work vehicles. Sure, you could trick some of the Toyota's or Honda's out ... but I bet most of them weren't.

[jjm2111]

My guess is that he had a Honda that looked a little like this:

I'm acquainted with these types or vehicles and he may or may not have had some expensive equipment on it. Quantity of ownership applies to car thieves who sell their finds to chop shops. A decent amount of theives only steal vehicles to hold on to, or resell to other individuals.

While I can empathize with Mr. Song, he should have known the laws in his state better. He lives in LA, for crying-out-loud. He might have a decent shot with a temporary insanity plea, but in this instance, letting the perps steal his car would have been the wiser choice.

Actually, if he were a quick thinker, he should have shot the tire out on his own car.

[biblewonk]

This is sickening. Our 2nd Amend rights are under attack!

LOL, no it isn't.

[Stu Cohen]

I'm acquainted with these types or vehicles and he may or may not have had some expensive equipment on it. Quantity of ownership applies to car thieves who sell their finds to chop shops. A decent amount of theives only steal vehicles to hold on to, or resell to other individuals.

Read my reply which lists the most stolen vehicles in the country.

I've seen very few tricked out Dodge Caravan's or Ford Pickup Trucks.

"The prominence of Toyota and Honda on "most stolen cars" lists is, to some extent, testament to the popularity and quality of those vehicles, said Teri Vlasak, a spokesperson for the NICB. Many of them have been sold and many of remain on the road, available for thieves to steal, she said. "

[Stu Cohen]

While I can empathize with Mr. Song, he should have known the laws in his state better.

"CALIFORNIA CONSTITUTION ARTICLE 1 DECLARATION OF RIGHTS

SECTION 1. All people are by nature free and independent and have inalienable rights. Among these are enjoying and defending life and liberty, acquiring, possessing, and PROTECTING PROPERTY, and pursuing and obtaining safety, happiness, and privacy."

[jjm2111]

What's your point? Did Mr. Song put the club on his vehicle, put in a parking lot or garage, or was it on the street?

He may live in a neighborhood where owning a 10yr. old car is the prudent thing to do.

[newgeezer]

Hey! It says give him the cloak off your back. It says nothing about giving him your car! ;O)

[jjm2111]

That doesn't say it's okay to use deadly force to protect property.

[Stu Cohen]

What's your point?

That he did not deserve to have his car stolen.

Did Mr. Song put the club on his vehicle, put in a parking lot or garage, or was it on the street?

It was in his driveway. Read the article. It did not mention the club. I have no way of knowing.

Stealing cars from people's driveways is wrong.

[Stu Cohen]

That doesn't say it's okay to use deadly force to protect property.

If you can't use whatever force is necessary to protect your property, then you cannot effectively protect your property.

[Stu Cohen]

That doesn't say it's okay to use deadly force to protect property.

Not to mention the followup to the article stated that the perp had a gun, and that Mr. Song saw the gun.

[jjm2111]

I'm not saying he "deserved" to have his car stolen, or that car theft is somehow "okay", but Mr. Song was victim of an error chain on his part as well as car theft.

1. He probably owned a flashy car.
2. In full view of passerby on the street.
3. With no alarm or club like device.
4. and complete ignorance of the law wrt to deadly force to protect property.
5. and killed someone in the process of protecting his property.

Statutory law has trumped Constitutional provisions in many liberal states (much to my displeasure, mind you), but unless people rise up against this sort of thing, it won't matter what you or I think. Mr. Song will probably do 3-6 on Man-2.

Hopefully this case will receive some national attention and he might not go to prison, but he will probably be barred from ever owning a gun legally.

[TigersEye]

I've had two cars stolen. One was recovered. One was not. Both times, the insurance money didn't cover the payments I still had left, and I was out over $12,000.

But, but, but, it's just a car!!!! It's easily replaceable!!!! The insurance company will pay you back every penny, and give you an erotic massage as well. And your rates won't go up either! How dare you threaten this fine young man!

I see what you mean about class lines, Stu. bootyist is obviously living on the edge and couldn't afford to lose that $12k grocery getter. /sarcasm

I'll have to confess that when I was younger (much younger) I loved my truck so much I daydreamed about how I could put a charge of C-4 in it with a remote trigger in case it were stolen. I never dreamed up a way to keep a random signal from setting it off unintentionally. I also thought of electrifying it but then there would be lawsuits if someone touched it innocently. I still have that '59 Chevy, it will be 21 years in May since I bought it. So far no one has wanted to steal it. Come to think of it none of my vehicles has been stolen. I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I feel a little insulted really.

My '49 Chevy truck is in CO in pieces. I've had that for 29 years. The last time I drove it was 1990 but I put about 100,000 miles on it before that. I had a '65 Dodge Polara for about four years, a '64 Chevelle for three or four and a '72 Datsun wagon for a year and that covers my transportation since 1975. The '59 will be on the road again pretty soon. That's all I've had since I parked the '49 in '90.

What can I say? I guess it's tough titty for you poor folks. /sarcasm

Has anyone ever heard of ignition cutouts or driveline locks? Someone already brought up tracking devices.

[TigersEye]

Oh yeah, I forgot: You should have called the cops! They'll fix it. Who are these nasty people who claim that property owners must rely on themselves to protect their own belongings? Notice that he only had FOUR convictions, not ten. See, this proves the system works.

The justice system is broken, which belongs to and serves all citizens, but instead of knuckling down and fixing it let's just scrap law altogether and give ourselves the right to kill whoever offends us. Anarchy is great! The one with the biggest gun and the biggest cajones wins. Your sticks and rocks will be an evolutionary dead end in LA.

[TigersEye]

Stealing cars from people's driveways is wrong.

That's profound. Someone ought to write that in stone. 8^o

[Stu Cohen]

The justice system is broken, which belongs to and serves all citizens, but instead of knuckling down and fixing it let's just scrap law altogether and give ourselves the right to kill whoever offends us. Anarchy is great! The one with the biggest gun and the biggest cajones wins.

Hey, you just described the current state of affairs in inner-city Los Angeles.

Excellent analysis.

Now maybe, just maybe if all the little guys with the pea-shooters band together like the gangbangers ... who knows ...

[Stu Cohen]

The justice system is broken, which belongs to and serves all citizens, but instead of knuckling down and fixing it

And I think you keep forgetting how expensive it is to buy laws. Fixing it requires bribery. And the current tax rates make that prohibitively expensive for the middle class guy, and thus, nearly impossible.