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Research: Pig Manure Can Become Crude Oil
Yahoo ^ | 04/13/04 | JIM PAUL

Posted on 04/13/2004 10:24:01 AM PDT by m1-lightning

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To: snopercod
How much oil did you say a ton of pig shit would make?

The turkey plant in Carthage produces 500 barrels a day from 200 tons of turkey waste. So that is 2 1/2 barrels per ton. The estimated cost is $15 a barrel, but that isn't the end all be all of the financial side. They also produce tons of high nitrate fertilizer, tons of methane (used by the plant for heating, so cost to purchase fuel for heating would be partially offset) and they reduce the landfill destined waste by a large percent (80% or more) saving transport and storage fees for the turkey plant.

151 posted on 04/13/2004 1:55:58 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: BOBTHENAILER; Grampa Dave; SierraWasp; Hodar
If you do a little research on the board of Changing World Technologies, the people behind TDP, you see a cross section of the American power elite. An ex CIA director, some ex-State Department types, Merrill-Lynch directors, etc. These are most definitely not some kids in a garage.

Powerful, serious people with the clout to get in on the ground floor of a good thing and with the muscle to run interference. No, this isn't a scam.
152 posted on 04/13/2004 2:00:23 PM PDT by Sam the Sham
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
Your b$ quota has just been filled for the day and probably the week.

When valid alternative energy sources are out there, we investors will beat a path to the doors. Hell, I might camp on the doors to buy some stock.

Snooper Cod has used the hard nosed engineer's audit of the Pig $hit Energy $ham:

"To: Hodar; SierraWasp

Start by sealing the container, and heating it to ~400 F

Let's see, ignoring the cost of the heating equipment and the ASME pressure vessel, it would take roughly 106 BTUs of heat to heat up a ton of pig shit to 400F and an equal amount to heat up the pressure vessel. It would probably take another million or four to get it up to 600F and hold it there for long enough for the reaction to take place.

So just to heat up 2000# of the mess would cost from $50 to $125 in fuel costs alone. Fuel cost calculator

How much oil did you say a ton of pig shit would make?

(The above analysis ignores the labor costs of the thousands of pig shit shovelers.)


146 posted on 04/13/2004 1:44:47 PM PDT by snopercod (When the people are ready, a master will appear.)
153 posted on 04/13/2004 2:00:24 PM PDT by Grampa Dave (America can't afford a 9/10 John F'onda al Querry after 9/11.)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
Just in case someone making this calculation doesn't know, an oil barrel is 42 gallons, not the 55 gallons typically thought of as being in an oil drum.
154 posted on 04/13/2004 2:01:31 PM PDT by CedarDave (Democrat campaign strategy: Tell a lie often enough today and it becomes truth tomorrow.)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
most of the doubters on this site don't care about "science" or "facts"

I'm an engineer and former building contractor, and DO care about science and facts. What's more - unlike many of the alternative energy advocates here - I have actually tried some of these fairy-tale schemes back in my Mother Earth News days.

The fact is that most of them are uneconomical outside of any government-funded laboratory setting. When you start adding in equipment costs, property taxes, interest, permits, maintenance costs, repairs, etc... like those of us in the real world have to do, most of them just aren't worth it.

(I do advocate solar hot water if the climate is right, you have permanent solar access, and if you can build and maintain the system yourself.)

155 posted on 04/13/2004 2:01:38 PM PDT by snopercod (When the people are ready, a master will appear.)
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To: snopercod
OK, for the sake of argument, let's say your figures are accurate. The container loses 10 MBTU due to poor insulation, the 2000 lbs of pig waste requires 10 MegaBTU plus 4 MegBTU to hold the temp.

This is true for the FIRST batch. The second batch will require far less; for the super-heated water is used to pre-heat the next batch.

I cannot speak as to the efficiency of hog waste .... but quoting from the article on TDP it is 85% efficient for complex mixtures of turkey offal. That is to say, for 100 BTU of fuel produced, 15 BTU of energy is required to run the process. Link may be found here.

156 posted on 04/13/2004 2:04:21 PM PDT by Hodar (With Rights, comes Responsibilities. Don't assume one, without assuming the other.)
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To: Grampa Dave
I think I responded to him. But as usual, you would rather go with what you "feel to be true" rather than read the material presented.

You say, I don't believe it!

I say, ok, please read the material.

You say, I don't believe it!

What else can I say. If you won't read the material, there is nothing I or anyone else can do to convince you. You won't read the studies, you won't listen to those trained in the field, you won't believe it simply because you won't believe it.

Have a great day! I'm sure you will, after all, I'm told ignorance is bliss.
157 posted on 04/13/2004 2:05:22 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: snopercod
The fact is that most of them are uneconomical outside of any government-funded laboratory setting.

Ummm, materials cost is zero. Thus, any costs incurred are due to equipment, manpower and process expenses. With a zero materials cost, the feasability becomes much greater. I would encourage you to take a look at the link I provided.

158 posted on 04/13/2004 2:06:32 PM PDT by Hodar (With Rights, comes Responsibilities. Don't assume one, without assuming the other.)
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To: Sam the Sham; Liz; BOBTHENAILER; SierraWasp; CedarDave
Your posting name and this reply bring a real big smile to my face.

You noted: "the people behind TDP, you see a cross section of the American power elite. An ex CIA director, some ex-State Department types, Merrill-Lynch directors, etc. These are most definitely not some kids in a garage.

"Powerful, serious people with the clout to get in on the ground floor of a good thing and with the muscle to run interference. No, this isn't a scam."

As Liz knows, one of my requirements re investing in a company or mutual fund is to totally avoid left wing lunatic controlled companies. How many of these power people are card carrying rats, rat donors and rat voters? If GW is reelected their fairy tales/scams will not come true.

God forbid if Kerry gets elected, I may have to start investing in companies controlled by lunatic lefties. They love to get really creative with their books and their auditing companies. You have to buy quick and sell before the bubble of reality bursts with these companies.

159 posted on 04/13/2004 2:09:08 PM PDT by Grampa Dave (America can't afford a 9/10 John F'onda al Querry after 9/11.)
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To: Rebelbase
The irony of the possibility of destroying Islam's economy by using the feces of one of its most reviled animals is outstanding.

If this comes to pass, I shall bust a gut laughing! And send out many a taunting e-mail to the Saudi embassy!

160 posted on 04/13/2004 2:09:31 PM PDT by Mackey (I fervently hope that OPEC is going to the hogs :))
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To: snopercod
I like to cover my bases and use words like "most"! I encourage you to read the material on this process and see who is invested (ConAgra is the big partner, but some petro companies are also interested). I have a friend who worked for Monsanto at the time send me the first information I heard about this. He was impressed and he hates the "ethanol people". I figured, if he thought it had promise, it must be good chemistry.

When the plant went up in Carthage last year, it confirmed to me that this was probably going to be big since ConAgra was hooking it up to their own big commercial plant (Butterball Turkey) and not some small out of the way trial farm.

I just encourage people to read up on it and see for themselves.
161 posted on 04/13/2004 2:10:38 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: snopercod
The fact is that most of them are uneconomical outside of any government-funded laboratory setting. When you start adding in equipment costs, property taxes, interest, permits, maintenance costs, repairs, etc... like those of us in the real world have to do, most of them just aren't worth it.

That's where both economy of scale and efficiency come in. These aren't going to be built everywhere (except maybe on land a city already owns and is already used for their landfill or WWTP). However, if the process works and efficiency is high, they could easily pay for themselves in an area like Dodge City, Kansas where gigantic cattle feed lots generate equally gigantic piles of BS. And if it does generate usable quantities of oil and producing oil fields are nearby, crude oil pipelines can be used to transport it to refineries.

162 posted on 04/13/2004 2:11:08 PM PDT by CedarDave (Democrat campaign strategy: Tell a lie often enough today and it becomes truth tomorrow.)
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To: biblewonk
Greenpeace is very pro windpower.

They should be. Their spokespeople generates a whole lot of it.

163 posted on 04/13/2004 2:13:56 PM PDT by L.N. Smithee (Just because I don't think like you doesn't mean I don't think for myself)
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To: Rebelbase
The irony of the possibility of destroying Islam's economy by using the feces of one of its most reviled animals is outstanding.

Well, I think we may have found the perfect execution for Muslim terrorists -- death in the porcine gas chamber!!!

164 posted on 04/13/2004 2:16:25 PM PDT by L.N. Smithee (Just because I don't think like you doesn't mean I don't think for myself)
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To: Grampa Dave; SierraWasp; Hodar; snopercod; Anitius Severinus Boethius
The insiders are already there and have taken the best seats. That tells you something. The kind of people who if you scam them, you will have an untimely heart attack or a sudden compulsion to go moonlight swimming in the middle of the ocean.

What excites me about this is that this could do for the Northeast and Midwest what the invention of air conditioning did for the Sunbelt.
165 posted on 04/13/2004 2:17:49 PM PDT by Sam the Sham
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To: CedarDave
I just read something that reminded me of one of the other benefits of the Changing World Tech program. This is there military calling card of intent. The oil is mostly a side benefit. They want to address the nasty chemicals like PCB's and other organics that play heck with disposition strategies.

"Changing World Technologies Inc. (CWT) identifies emerging technologies that address specific needs and problems in the energy and environmental arenas.

Our cornerstone technology known as the Thermo Depolymerization and Chemical Reformer Process ("TDP") can convert even the most difficult wastes and organic materials into naturally occurring chemical compounds (natural resources). The "TDP" technology converts all organic and inorganic waste streams into high quality marketable end products. The process utilizes basic physics, chemistry, and technology in a completely enclosed circulating system emulating a naturally occurring process. The TDP duplicates the earth’s natural process at subduction zones using only water, temperature, and pressure to chemically reform the material.

Thermo-Depolymerization and Chemical Reformer

All organic waste is transformed into useful resources
Oils - To be sold to fuel blenders or used on site
Gases - To be used to make electricity
Carbons - To be sold as fuel or activated carbon
MISSION:

To provide energy and environmental solutions for all military facilities anywhere organic material is produced.

All branches of the military
Troop Bivouacking
Military bases and ships
Logistic field support for advancing troops
Mobile or remote units such as radar installations
All remediation or demilitarization efforts
BENEFITS:

No ocean dumping (maritime laws)
Additional storage for supplies, weapons, equipment, ammunition
Fuels produced (diesel, methane) for immediate use
Reliable supply to meet base power needs
Logistics’ benefit (clean-up sites, movements free of evidence, protect soldiers & sailors)
Personal protection, pollution free environment
Readiness – ensures responsiveness, doing military tasks not waste related tasks
Modernization – maintains leadership in development and use of new technology
Converts any organic feed including mixed plastics which allows purchasing of materials on RFP’s, to what is needed, not what can be disposed of. "

Fascinating aspect, in addition to the oil!

DK
166 posted on 04/13/2004 2:18:04 PM PDT by Dark Knight
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To: Sam the Sham; Grampa Dave; SierraWasp; Liz; CedarDave
No, this isn't a scam.

Makes me wanna say "Hey there little Red Riding Hood". Just kidding.

I'm not kidding about my belief in somebody, somehow, someway, creating energy any other way than good ol' God given coal, oil, natural gas and nuclear.

WITHOUT SUBSIDIES, the investment road is littered, as Gramps put it, with all the solar, wind, landfill, ethanol, oilshale (billion $ loser for Exxon), tar sand (loser in Canada at below $30 crude),fecal scams known to man.

Despite the clout of the people you refer to, this thing does not DEFY the laws of physics. Given the clout, political muscle and huge subsidies absolutely necessary, you might have a WINNER, BUT we're ALL GONNA pay TO MAKE IT WORK. My money stays in oil & gas. I know that works.

167 posted on 04/13/2004 2:26:47 PM PDT by BOBTHENAILER (One by one, in small groups or in whole armies, we don't care how we do, but we're gonna getcha)
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To: m1-lightning
It would be exquisitely IRONIC if the wacky Middle Eastern oligarchs are finally defeated by...pig crap.

Where can I buy some shares and futures on barrels of pig sh#t crude???

And what about horse, sheep, goat, and chicken sh#t? Does that work as well?

168 posted on 04/13/2004 2:40:27 PM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
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To: BOBTHENAILER
I'm not kidding about my belief in somebody, somehow, someway, creating energy any other way than good ol' God given coal, oil, natural gas and nuclear.

Great, then you should like this process. They take God-given animal guts and plants. And then they boil them to create oil. And then they refine that to produce gasoline.

The usual way is to take God-given animal guts and plants. And then reduce them slowly over a period of millions of years. And then they refine that to produce gasoline. This process speeds it up a bit.

This isn't geothermal, solar, tide power, windmills, french fry grease, or any other kind of "alternate energy". It's oil.

It's hillarious to watch the usually pro-entrepreneurship Freepers screaming about how this must be a trick by the Democrats or the Freemasons or the Martians or something. Some genius has figured out a way to convert one kind of carbon (animal tissue) into another (crude oil), just like somebody once figured out a way to convert one kind of carbon (crude oil) into another (gasoline). But, no, this kind of engineering and hard work is suspect somehow.

169 posted on 04/13/2004 2:42:36 PM PDT by SedVictaCatoni
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To: Dark Knight
Well, you can believe it. By the time everybody believes it, it will be too late to buy the stock....assuming they ever go public.

The only downside I can find so far in this process is that it sounds to good to be true.....not really a downside.
170 posted on 04/13/2004 2:47:59 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: m1-lightning
When pigs fly.....then again...maybe.

Red

171 posted on 04/13/2004 2:55:53 PM PDT by Conservative4Ever (EVIL.......thy name is Hillary)
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To: Sam the Sham
What I like about this process, is that it actually has a chance!

Companies like Exxon, etc can't complain because they can get oil cheap. Waste disposal companies can't complain because they will have an easy place to get rid of their waste.

All industry, except atomic, will have incentive to get this moving because of waste removal.
172 posted on 04/13/2004 3:01:12 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: m1-lightning
It's an absolutely hog wild idea.
173 posted on 04/13/2004 3:03:13 PM PDT by FourPeas
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To: TheLion
>>...it sounds to good to be true<<

So is this where our BS detectors go off?

DK
174 posted on 04/13/2004 3:05:15 PM PDT by Dark Knight
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To: m1-lightning
The guy who discovers how to train pigs to use little toilets is gonna clean up.
175 posted on 04/13/2004 3:08:43 PM PDT by searchandrecovery (If you can read this tagline you're too close.)
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To: Dark Knight
"So is this where our BS detectors go off?"

For many yes, but that has nothing to do with the process.
Assuming the process works, can you think of a downside?
176 posted on 04/13/2004 3:10:22 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: m1-lightning
I thought of the irony as well. To think that the animal that the Muslims most despise could be their actual downfall. Yes, Virginia there is a God, and He has a great sense of humor.
177 posted on 04/13/2004 3:21:01 PM PDT by timydnuc ("Give me Liberty, or give me death"!)
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To: TheLion
I think think this is one of those revolutionary things that will change our world view. $7/barrel oil from waste, garbage into oil, landfills as a resource for energy, nasty organic disposals (and this may include places like our chem weapons depots that are an accident waiting to happen), sewage into oil that list is long.

But if we had a resource that could supply the US with 25% of our energy needs at $7 per barrel, what would that do to OPEC? How about 50%? And it would not be just us, any country that has organic waste of any kind, like Japan or Israel. If the OPEC market went to 40% of it's current clients, what would they do?

DK
178 posted on 04/13/2004 3:27:21 PM PDT by Dark Knight
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To: Dark Knight
"If the OPEC market went to 40% of it's current clients, what would they do?"

For all I care, they can go back to riding camels!
179 posted on 04/13/2004 3:31:03 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: m1-lightning
good idea,

ALL aliens, illegal or not must live in pig-manure
heated homes until they become naturalized citizens.
180 posted on 04/13/2004 3:37:22 PM PDT by Future Useless Eater (FreedomLoving_Engineer)
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To: m1-lightning
Just one more step toward the collapse of the Arab world. All they do is sit on the oil. They don't refine it, the west does that. The western technology actually drills for and pumps their only asset. The west manages shipment and delivery of that asset. Of course we also use it. Sure, we could drill for our own in our own back yard, but the totalitarian, elitist, communist green weenies (with the help of the legislating judiciary) made sure we can't do that.

The Arab world has bribed, bullied, and killed their own best customers for far too long. Western intelligence,hard work and good old fashioned capitalism is going to put these douche bags out of business. They don't understand, the game will be played ONLY as long as WE are willing to play it. When, in the capitalist system, a thing becomes too expensive and inconveniently we simply invent another way to achieve the same purpose. It saves money for business, it makes money for other businesses, and the people enjoy a better standard of living. Well, ole Mohammed just ask the buggy whip makers and the lamp oil companies about that little fact. In a few years you might want to sell high colonics with your sweet crude, cause that's all it'll be good for.

My guess is that they got about 20 good years left....tops.

181 posted on 04/13/2004 3:37:42 PM PDT by timydnuc ("Give me Liberty, or give me death"!)
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To: Dark Knight
I'm no engineer or other "genious" but what pops into my mind is "mining" old landfills for biomass to convert into oil. Also I haven't seen anyone make the logical leap into talking about the waste from dairies. Currently many dairies spray their manure onto fields as fertilizer but the resulting product is only good for animal feed. Imagine being able to extract both oil and fertilizers. Even if the technology is a revenue neutral endeavor it would be worthwhile to cut down on garbage ending up in landfills or local watersheds.
182 posted on 04/13/2004 3:40:50 PM PDT by Tailback
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To: timydnuc
One more thing. We met a group of real fun folks on a cruise we took in March (Carnival Victory). They were hog farmers from Indiana. They had a BIG operation! So I'll say: Hey Wayne, if you're lurking Hi from Timy and Barbie. Look what you can do with all that piggy poop, brother!
183 posted on 04/13/2004 3:45:10 PM PDT by timydnuc ("Give me Liberty, or give me death"!)
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To: Tailback
I also forgot to mention the fact that I used to be a garbage man. Once a week my route was to pick up "yard debris" (grass clippings, trimmed hedges, etc...) and all that stuff could possibly be used in this process. I got anywhere from 10-20 cubic yards of highly compacted debris every week from approximately 650 homes.
184 posted on 04/13/2004 3:46:51 PM PDT by Tailback
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To: Tailback
I think it is even further than that. What would happen to the world if we started to think of what we currently call garbage as a resource?

Almost all of it is organics, plastics, animal, vegetable etc. Only the mineral stuff would be out of the loop as a source. And this process would take the mineral stuff out of what was there.

The water that comes out is critter free. Virusii (sp) bacteria, and other multicell creatures are processed, just like everthing else. You could put the nastiest HIV laden, Hepatitis C laden waste in, and have non nasty waste come out (but I would want strict testing on this stuff).

I'm sounding like a commercial again.

Better stop.

DK
185 posted on 04/13/2004 3:49:53 PM PDT by Dark Knight
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
"I'm told ignorance is bliss."

As are flights of total fantasy! Cold fusion, Bill Lears steam engine driven De Lorean, etc., etc., etc., yada, yada, yadaaaaaaaaaaaa... We've had to listen to Governor Moonbeam's verbal diahreah about reducing, reusing and recycling the "waste stream" for so long that we've learned these hogwash fairy tales are just more anti-capitalistic liberal rhetoric and have absolutely NOTHING to do with science, other than the theory stage!!!

186 posted on 04/13/2004 4:03:52 PM PDT by SierraWasp (John Fallujah Kerry! Now we REALLY know what HE meant, by "Bring... It... On!!!" He sure DID!!!)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
"Trust me, if they were not truly able to do this, they would not be running a plant...commercially."

"...it's enough that this will be profitable one day..."

It's either being run commercially, thus making a profit, or it is just an experimental pilot plant that's losing money! Since not even CWT-Carthage claims they are making a profit, why not just admit upfront that it is not yet a commercial process?

"[Look at] all the oil being produced consistantly...we may see a dramatic decline in imported oil with 10 years or so."

When it comes to feces, I'm afraid I'll have to yield to your self-proclaimed expertise in the field. However I would hazard a guess that even if we were somehow able to process 100% of America's human and animal feces, the resulting product would not put even come close to putting a 1% dent in our oil imports. "Dramatic decline", indeed!

LOL, talk about flat out over-selling a technology! And you wonder why we don't trust the "Trust me" whiz kids that come up with these hair-brained schemes!

It's not that we don't see the benefits of this technology, when applied to the waste treatment industry, it's just that we hate to be lied to so outrageously about it being some sort of miracle energy production technology (OMG, it's 85% efficient!) and that it will also free us from Middle East oil dependence.

--Boot Hill

187 posted on 04/13/2004 4:07:14 PM PDT by Boot Hill (Candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo, candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo!!!)
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To: SierraWasp
absolutely NOTHING to do with science, other than the theory stage!!!

Like the theoretical factory in Carthage that takes theoretical turkey waste and turns it into theoretical oil.

There is no convincing you if you won't allow the evidence to be presented. You are as bad as those who are convinced Bush had those planes crash into the WTC so he could steal Iraq's oil. No logic, no objectivism, no chance for converstation. You know it because you know it and facts and science be damned!

188 posted on 04/13/2004 4:11:42 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: BOBTHENAILER; Grampa Dave
Hmmmmm. Well, if they plan to get the manure from Democratic pigs, I might take a flyer on it. LOL.
189 posted on 04/13/2004 4:17:00 PM PDT by Liz
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To: m1-lightning; SierraWasp
"I don't understand why you have such bitterness towards relieving our foreign dependence on oil."

For you to make that statement, it presupposes that you have some idea of the total daily production of feces in America. Would you like to share that information with the rest of us? Along with a link, reference, source, etc.?

Unless I miss my guess, even if we were to convert 100% of America's total daily production of feces to energy products, it would only amount to "mouse nuts" when compared to the vast oceans of oil we import every day. So how is that going to free us from dependence on foreign oil?

Some numbers, sources and links, please.

--Boot Hill

190 posted on 04/13/2004 4:19:03 PM PDT by Boot Hill (Candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo, candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo!!!)
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To: Boot Hill
Most businesses aren't in the black for years, yet they are commercial enterprises.

The Butterball plant does not have to pay for transport, storage and processing of 200 tons of turkey waste a day now, they simply transport it across their property and turn it into oil, fertilizer, minerals and water.

How much do you figure they are saving by not having to deal with the turkey waste the way the EPA would mandate?

The "refinery" will pay for itself soon, so while it is in the red for the time being, it will eventually start turning a profit for the investors.

This plant will not only make them money by supplying saleable items, but it saves them money up front in reducing the costs of transport, storage, and treatment of hazardous materials.
191 posted on 04/13/2004 4:20:38 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
I just wish stock was available for small investors.

Also, the cost of such a facility is probably competitive with a sewage treatment plant. Something for a city to consider if they don't already have one and are thinking about building.
192 posted on 04/13/2004 4:29:16 PM PDT by Techster
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To: Boot Hill
http://www.changingworldtech.com/pdf/GenConfLasVegas3_3_04.pdf

This one plant will produce about 180,000 barrels of oil per year.
193 posted on 04/13/2004 4:32:23 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: m1-lightning
Ooooo, what a delicious thought! Tell big oil: adapt, or die. If it's feasible and cost-effective, then let's help transform the Mooslim's Number One weapon back into what it originally was: a stick for herding goats.


194 posted on 04/13/2004 4:45:41 PM PDT by Viking2002
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
"This one plant will produce about 180,000 barrels of oil per year."

Then you'll need about 1,000 more plants. Good luck with the Not In My Back Yard (NIMBY) crowd. They're mighty and they're MILITANT!!!

This whole thread is nuthin but sucker bait!!! Sorry you don't like that. Maybe someday you'll get over it. I certainly hope so for the sake of your sanity. You've been way... WAY oversold on this stinkin idea!!!

195 posted on 04/13/2004 4:49:43 PM PDT by SierraWasp (John Fallujah Kerry! Now we REALLY know what HE meant, by "Bring... It... On!!!" He sure DID!!!)
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To: SierraWasp
And you haven't read a single item that people have linked to, or read any studies about this, or anything else that might possibly give you even the slightest bit of factual information.

The "NIMBY" folks will actually love this. Instead of creating larger and larger landfills to store hazardous materials, there will be a place where waste is converted into usable materials.

But again, I apologize. You aren't interested in knowledge just your "feeeeelings". Just like the folks over at DU.
196 posted on 04/13/2004 4:54:34 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: SierraWasp
This is just another load the farmer hauled away... You could tell by the smell it wasn't hay... next it'll be scientific as fungschway...

LOL !

197 posted on 04/13/2004 5:04:07 PM PDT by Red Boots
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
"This one plant will produce about 180,000 barrels of oil per year."

Wow, am I impressed! Why that's a whopping 0.005% of our yearly imports! Heck, with only 200 more plants (and next-door turkey processors) just like this one, we'll import 1% less oil! By gum, that'll teach those nasty a-rabs and put a big dent in their income! (Of course we only import a 1/4 of our oil from the Persian Gulf!)

The only reason I can figure that you'd want to mis-represent this Rube Goldberg contraption as any kind of energy solution or a solution to foreign oil imports, is that you (they) intend to seek government subsidies to support this boondoggle. It is not an energy solution. It will not lower our dependence on foreign oil in any significant way.

The only advantage to this technology (and it is a substantial one) is its ability to efficiently treat waste products.

--Boot Hill

198 posted on 04/13/2004 6:01:24 PM PDT by Boot Hill (Candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo, candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo!!!)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
"The Butterball plant does not have to pay for transport, storage and processing of 200 tons of turkey waste a day now..."

So, it's your understanding of economics and the market place that, if Butterball had to pay (say) $100 per ton to dispose of their waste prior to the CWT-Carthage plant, that the CWT plant would charge Butterball $0 per ton to dispose of it now?

--Boot Hill

199 posted on 04/13/2004 6:12:48 PM PDT by Boot Hill (Candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo, candy-gram for Osama bin Mongo!!!)
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To: Meldrim
Illinois coal is bituminous, enviros got it all bottled up last I checked.
200 posted on 04/13/2004 6:13:37 PM PDT by junta
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