The Real Spartacus

historyinfilm.com ^ | Professor Barbara McManus

[AngrySpud]

Spartacus: my all-time favorite movie, even if it diverged a bit from historical accuracy.

[vbmoneyspender]

Thanks for posting that.

[Destro]

I wish there was a history section on FreeRepublic.

[FreedomCalls]

One of my favorites as well. Thanks.

[Cincinatus]

Colleen McCullough (whose Roman Republic novels are masterpieces of historical research) claims that the real Spartacus was not "Thracian" but that honorific indicated the type of gladiator he was (or style of fighting -- Thracian gladiators were heavily armored, versus the lighter armed "Gallic" or "Celtic" gladiator.) She further claims that the real Spartacus was a Roman centurion, sold into gladiatorial service after a mutiny, thus explaining his apparent tactical genius against the legions sent against him.

[Destro]

The name is a giveaway to his origins - Spartacus. This article claims he may have been a Greek auxiliary to the Romans rather than a centurion. I think auxiliary makes more sense. It could have been an inside joke for the Romans too, a "Thracian" fighting as a Thracian. I could imagine the fight bill!

The gladiator games had a religious significance to them. They were a form of human sacrifice (even if no one was killed) and the fighting styles of the gladiators were highly stylized to act out some sort of quasi-religous cosmic play.

[txzman]

If you have an interest in this period of history, please give yourself a treat and pick up the highly readable 'Cicero' about the greatest orator and politician Rome knew, and whose contemporaries were Pompey and Julius Ceasar.

It is a relatively short book, and was a NYT best seller for many months.

[Tacis]

Yeah, but wasn't the movie written by one of those commie traitors who refused to identify others commie traitors? He went to Hollywood and despite the effort of brave and loyal Americans, was helped by other cell members. For all we know, he used/uses the revenue from this movie to continue to support the destruction of America. Just as an act of self-discipline and remeberence of enemies still with us, I don't watch this movie.

[Riverman94610]

Howard Fast,I believe.

[ExSoldier]

"I don't watch this movie."

I show Spartacus every year whenever I teach world history. I show this film because there so few content appropriate movies that I can show that are anywhere near the actual history.

But I also show "The Devil's Brigade" with William Holden for WWII and "The Green Berets" with John Wayne for Vietnam. In none of these cases are my liberal fellow teachers very pleased. They don't like Spartacus because it shows slaves rising up with violence against their masters and to them violence under any circumstances is a B-A-D thing. The John Wayne film especially turns their stomachs.

[mrustow]

The novel was by Howard Fast; the screenplay for the 1960 film, however, was by Dalton Trumbo, of the notorious Hollywood Ten. That is who Tacis was referring to. Trumbo also wrote the screenplay to Lonely are the Brave (1962), one of the most heartbreakingly beautiful westerns, nay movies, ever made. Spartacus and Lonely were both produced by, and starred, Kirk Douglas. Paths of Glory (1957) was also written by Trumbo, and produced by and starred Douglas.

Paths was directed by a young Stanley Kubrick. Spartacus was initially directed by Anthony Mann, but he and Douglas had a falling out, and Douglas replaced him with Kubrick. Kubrick later disowned the film, which his devotees saw as indubitable proof that the movie stunk. However, if you compare the work Kubrick did for Douglas to the work he did as an independent producer-director, you see the Douglas films suffused with a humanity that Kubrick's "classic" independent films were bereft of. It wasn't Kubrick who saved Douglas, but the other way around.

Although I have been an anti-communist since I was a child, and I fully understand the political subtext of Spartacus as an attack on the then recently-deceased Tailgunner Joe, I cannot hate Douglas, or even Trumbo, two men who have brought so much joy and beauty to my life.

[mrustow]

Spartacus is one of my 100 favorite movies. I saw The Devil's Brigade as a kid, and enjoyed it. I was a big Bill Holden fan, and hadn't yet seen The Dirty Dozen, so I didn't know that Brigade was a ripoff of Dozen. (I still recall the scene in which big Claude Akins gets thrown head first into a huge plate of pasta by a bespectacled soldier who, unbeknownst to him, is a martial arts instructor.) But The Green Berets?! I saw it for the first time a few years ago, and it is a stinker! The older I get, the more I admire Wayne as an actor, but late in his life, as his great, longtime directors (most notably John "Papa" Ford) started retiring and/or dying off, he made an awful lot of clunkers.

If I were still teaching, and wanted to show a movie about the war in Vietnam, I don't know what I'd do. I don't think there are any particularly accurate movies about that war. The Deer Hunter is the great masterpiece to come out of that war, and while John Ford would likely have approved of it, had he lived to see it, it is more a work of poetry than history. As for WWII, based on my late uncle, who served in WWII and Korea, and who used to speak of the tedium, I would think that the one movie that best captured what those servicemen who survived the war experienced, would be Mister Roberts.

[mrustow]

#12 may be of interest to you.

[ExSoldier]

The Green Berets is just about the only "appropriate" movie on Vietnam that I can show and not get into serious trouble for content, meaning that forbidden "R" rating. It's a propaganda piece and just about the only pro-Nam film ever made. But it is fairly realistic as to the role of SF in 'Nam. I guarantee you that every time an SF operator hears the song, it brings tears to their eyes, especially these days. Most of my own buddies in the SF have told me that they got into the outfit because of THAT movie and none other.

The Devil's Brigade might have been made because of The Dirty Dozen but it is pretty historically accurate as well, right down to the final assault on the mountain in Italy. They were made up of misfits from Americans and crack Canadian troops; and yeah there was a lot of Hollywood (like the training and brawling) but a lot was fairly accurate, too. The First Special Service Force never retreated and never lost a battle, but they took heavy casualties and were disbanded before the end of the war due to attrition.

[u-89]

Lentulus Batiatus (Peter Ustinov—won Academy Award for best supporting actor)

[ExSoldier]

"I would think that the one movie that best captured what those servicemen who survived the war experienced, would be Mister Roberts."

That depends on the service member, I would guess. I never knew that my wife's dad had a DFC and two bronze stars with "V" Device for valor until I literally stumbled across the awards cleaning out his garage. The old guy flew with "Pappy Boyington" and the Black Sheep. Also served in Blackburns Irregulars the sister squadron. His DFC says he attacked forty zero's by himself knocking down eight in the first ten minutes until help arrived. Doesn't sound like a lot of tedium to me. Shot down twice fished out of the drink by a sub both times. He never said a word and refused to discuss them with me until I got him a little tipsy one night. That to me, is the epitome of the word "hero."

[u-89]

I knew a man who was in Darby's Rangers in Sicily and Italy. He was one of the few who escaped the encirclement at Anzio. He was then assigned to the First Special Service Force and from there became part of the 474th. When the war ended they were doing mop up operations in Germany but suddenly sent up to Norway to head off the Russians who were coming in over the top from Finland - it came very close to a real battle.

The man did not like to talk about the war much but I talked to him a little here and there about it for years. He died before I could get him to really open up.

[u-89]

What about the movie "Paths of Glory" for your class? That should start some interesting discussions.

[ExSoldier]

I teach in the inner city. We're about eighty percent Haitian. I'm lucky if I can get them to pay attention to the "B" movies and dang few of them can string together a sentence let alone do some form of cogent analysis.

Thank God the school year is almost over. I've been in those trenches for the last seven years. That's forty thousand miles on my car in travel to work alone. I gotta transfer someplace nearer to my home to keep my zest for teaching. This is the first year I've been there that things have gotten truly dangerous. Three gun incidents this year, one threatening a teacher. Two teachers beaten this year, too. This past week, three kids cut, one requiring over forty stitches. Nobody gives a damn.

A few weeks ago, a friend of one of my students got really brazen and interrupted my class. Real thug, dread locks and gold teeth. Tried to just push inside the room and "take over." I planted myself in his way and he said I ought not to do that cause I might "get hurt." I told him: "You feel froggy? Anytime you want, just JUMP!" we locked eyes and his buddies ran up and dragged him out my room spewing apologies. I was cold as ice on the outside and shaking on the inside. I'm 47 next week, I don't need this. Thanks for letting me vent, lol.