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Vietnam Remains the Only War That America Can't Quit Fighting
The Omaha World-Herald ^ | May 10, 2004 | David M. Shribman

Posted on 05/10/2004 8:47:06 PM PDT by quidnunc

The baby boomers are gray and nearing retirement, the nation is involved in two conflicts abroad, the economy is moving into a new, uncertain phase, officials are worrying about terror strikes at home, there's a huge debate about civil liberties raging in the country, scientists are concerned about eroding American superiority in technology, and what are we doing in May 2004? We're fighting over Vietnam. Again.

The war ended almost three decades ago. Lyndon Johnson is dead. Richard Nixon, too. William C. Westmoreland is 90 years old, Eugene J. McCarthy is 88, Robert S. McNamara will be 88 next month, Jane Fonda is about to turn 67. The United States lifted its trade embargo with Vietnam a decade ago.

This is the war that never ends. We think it fades away, and then it comes back again. In pieces I've written over the years I've personally pronounced Vietnam over, politically and emotionally, twice — first when the United States and its allies defeated Iraq in Gulf War I and then, again, when Washington established diplomatic relations with Hanoi in 1995 — only to be proved wrong both times. So much for my powers of observation.

The war's not over. It may never be.

"We're just haunted by Vietnam," says Stanley Karnow, author of a popular history of the war. "It doesn't go away."

-snip-

(Excerpt) Read more at omaha.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News
KEYWORDS: babyboomers; growupalready; vietnam

1 posted on 05/10/2004 8:47:06 PM PDT by quidnunc
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To: quidnunc
Vietnam Remains the Only War That America Can't Quit Fighting

errrrr....you mean DemocRATS don't you?

2 posted on 05/10/2004 8:51:42 PM PDT by Texas Eagle (If it wasn't for double-standards, Liberals would have no standards at all)
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To: quidnunc
"Part of this is healthy," says Thomas J. Vallely, a Marine in Vietnam who now directs the Vietnam Program at Harvard's Kennedy School of Government.

"The campaign aspect - whether Kerry will vote like Jane Fonda and whether the president skirted his duty - is almost beside the point. But the intellectual side - whether this war is like Vietnam - is helpful. It's actually useful to wonder about dominoes again. Pakistan is a potential domino. Iraq is a potential domino. And if you think the main lesson of Vietnam is hubris, we have to remember that hubris is dangerous. We also have to remember that we are again in a place that we don't understand."

Vallely is the guy who was arrested along with John's brother Cameron breaking into an opponent's campaign headquarters during John Kerry's first congressional run.

Bit of a conflict of interest, wouldn't you think?

3 posted on 05/10/2004 8:55:24 PM PDT by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: quidnunc
There's a rumor floating about the 'net that suggests that John Kerry served in Viet Nam.

If true, I'd think that Kerry would want to use that as one of his many campaign themes.

4 posted on 05/10/2004 8:55:37 PM PDT by hole_n_one
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To: quidnunc
.

JOHN KERRY came back from the Vietnam War to call us American Soldiers fighting for Freedom there ..rapists and..


...TERRORISTS

http://www.TheAlamoFILM.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1320



MEL GIBSON came back from filming our real Vietnam War story "WE WERE SOLDIERS" so inspired that he decided he finally had to make his ultimate story of Love and Sacrifice...


.."The PASSION of the Christ"

http://www.TheAlamoFILM.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=39081



I wonder who got it right..?



Signed:.."ALOHA RONNIE" Guyer / Veteran-"WE WERE SOLDIERS" Battle of IA DRANG-1965

http://www.lzxray.com
(Website)

http://www.lzxray.com/guyer_collection.htm
(Photos)
5 posted on 05/10/2004 8:56:58 PM PDT by ALOHA RONNIE (Vet-Battle of IA DRANG-1965 http://www.LZXRAY.com)
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To: quidnunc
No kidding. I can't wait til all of the Vietnam era people are DEAD! Note to Republicans and Democrats, Gen X doesn't CARE about Vietnam. That is 30 years ago. Give it up already. What Gen X cares about is not what you did 30 years ago for the nation, but what the next 30 years will bring us...
6 posted on 05/10/2004 9:01:42 PM PDT by xrp
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To: hole_n_one
There's a rumor floating about the 'net that suggests that John Kerry served in Viet Nam.

You mean in the military? Citation, please...

7 posted on 05/10/2004 9:04:42 PM PDT by Interesting Times (ABCNNBCBS -- yesterday's news.)
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To: qam1; ItsOurTimeNow; PresbyRev; tortoise; Fraulein; StoneColdGOP; Clemenza; malakhi; m18436572; ...
Xer Ping

Ping list for the discussion of the politics and social aspects that directly effects Generation-X (Those born from 1965-1981) including all the spending previous generations (i.e. The Baby Boomers) are doing that Gen-X and Y will end up paying for.

8 posted on 05/10/2004 9:08:02 PM PDT by qam1 (Tommy Thompson is a Fat-tubby, Fascist)
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To: xrp
I feel the same about you as you feel toward the Viet Nam era people.

Your parents can feel proud of you.

You make scum bags respectful.
9 posted on 05/10/2004 9:09:47 PM PDT by sport
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To: Texas Eagle
Vietnam Remains the Only War That America Can't Quit Fighting

The Civil War would seem to qualify as well.

10 posted on 05/10/2004 9:14:42 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: sport
Cry me a river.
11 posted on 05/10/2004 9:15:36 PM PDT by xrp
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To: xrp
No kidding. I can't wait til all of the Vietnam era people are DEAD! Note to Republicans and Democrats, Gen X doesn't CARE about Vietnam. That is 30 years ago. Give it up already. What Gen X cares about is not what you did 30 years ago for the nation, but what the next 30 years will bring us...

I've been on this forum a very long time and I'd be hard pressed to come up with a more despicable post than what you just spit out.

12 posted on 05/10/2004 9:17:15 PM PDT by hole_n_one
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To: sport
You saved me the trouble....Thanks sport!
13 posted on 05/10/2004 9:17:33 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: Texas Eagle
I always tell Democrats that it was their war, they managed it and should therefore be fully aware of how bad it was!
14 posted on 05/10/2004 9:20:42 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: xrp
Would you jump in it and drown?
15 posted on 05/10/2004 9:25:34 PM PDT by sport
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To: xrp
Hey xrp, pull up your baggy loaded pants, hook up some Nirvana on your MP3 player, hop on your sick skateboard and haul your ass down to the tattoo parlor to spend some more of that money you stole from your hated parents.
16 posted on 05/10/2004 9:25:41 PM PDT by battlegearboat
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To: Admin Moderator
Save us a lot of time and trouble and remove xrp from FR.

Please.

17 posted on 05/10/2004 9:28:23 PM PDT by battlegearboat
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To: sport
No, you?
18 posted on 05/10/2004 9:30:25 PM PDT by xrp
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To: xrp
.....I can't wait til all of the Vietnam era people are DEAD!

They don't come any more ignorant than you, do they?

19 posted on 05/10/2004 9:36:22 PM PDT by hole_n_one
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To: quidnunc
Protestwarrior.com

If "Iraq" is Arabic for "Vietnam" then "Vietnam" is Lefty for "hippie mid-life crisis".

20 posted on 05/10/2004 9:40:53 PM PDT by qam1 (Tommy Thompson is a Fat-tubby, Fascist)
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To: qam1
Is John Kerry even eligible to run for President?
21 posted on 05/10/2004 9:47:58 PM PDT by Jack Black
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To: All
xrp is sending out private replies.

I got mine.

He's drunk in Kansas again.

The poor fellow has no more money for porn so he's hanging out at FR until he can sell some more X and pay to pound his pud.

From what I gather from his private reply, he's a real peter pumper.

The poor fellow is broke and depressed.

He never has had a real job; nothing to show for his short sorry life other than huffing away nightly in his circle jerk society meeting.

It's all our fault.

22 posted on 05/10/2004 10:01:32 PM PDT by battlegearboat
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To: Texas Eagle
Corrected headline:

''Vietnam Remains the Only War That America the Anti-American Traitorous Left-Wing Self-Indulgent Baby-Boomer Draft-Dodgers Can't Quit Fighting''

Rather too long for a proper headline, of course, but -- since they can't be bothered with fact, I suppose grammar and style have no place in their ''lives'' either.

23 posted on 05/10/2004 10:02:22 PM PDT by SAJ (So, ya wanna buy a bridge, eh? Lemme see what I've got in stock...)
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To: battlegearboat
xrp is sending out private replies.

I got mine, but there's no way I'm gonna open it.....until now, I never knew a FRail could look sticky.

24 posted on 05/10/2004 10:05:21 PM PDT by hole_n_one
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To: hole_n_one
Not to worry sez I.

I took the precaution of putting on my latex exam gloves before opening mine.

You just can't be too careful when dealing with "Gin-Xers"!

25 posted on 05/10/2004 10:17:52 PM PDT by battlegearboat
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To: hole_n_one
How ironic. The "soldier" Kerry, who denounced his participation in Viet Nam is now PROUD? of his military service.

But I forget - he was against the war in SE Asia before he was for it.
26 posted on 05/11/2004 3:44:08 AM PDT by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: xrp
It must be cold where you are.

Afterburners - seg five!
27 posted on 05/11/2004 3:48:42 AM PDT by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: quidnunc
Jane Fonda may be 67 years old but she's still a traitor and a stupid bitch.
28 posted on 05/11/2004 6:22:29 AM PDT by Moleman
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To: xrp
Thunder stolen, thank you.
29 posted on 05/11/2004 6:24:42 AM PDT by Moleman
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To: battlegearboat
The poor fellow has no more money for porn so
Then hes not real bright, there's plenty of FREE porn on the internet :-)
30 posted on 05/11/2004 6:28:59 AM PDT by Moleman
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To: All
RE: we were too worried about Watergate

Who was "worried" about it? The Nixon haters were getting their rocks off. "Holiday." That's the word I've been trying to think of all these years. It was a holiday -- an extended holiday -- for millions. Some evening TV "news"casts were nothing but Watergate. It was like they were celebrating and reporting how we had just won the World Cup. Those people and some who I worked with were ecstatic.

RE: We haven't succeeded in doing that about Vietnam.

Vietnam was not about Vietnam. It was about the Soviet Union ("wars of liberation"). According to Kennedy friend James "Scotty" Reston it was about Kennedy needing to prove that he was not a wimp after Khrushchev humiliated him in Vienna in 1961. It was about preventing a worse confrontation. The way Washington handled it of course made it a worse confrontation. That is a lesson. That is a reason we "fight" the war over, dummy.

Confronting our enemies sparked violence against the U.S. by our "enemies within."

We are not "fighting the war" over and over, dummy. We are talking about our "enemies within."

We are trying to say look at what happened HERE in the U.S. Look how politics as usual (spying BY BOTH PARTIES on each other and covering it up) was used to destroy a wartime administration of the Party figthing our enemies. Look how it continues, dummy.

I personally post often about one battle in Vietnam, the Tet Offensive. Not to talk about the battle over there but to remind people about what happened HERE, dummy.

It's not surprising that the Civil War and the Vietnam will not "fade away," they are connected. There were two major efforts (at least) to start Civil War II (or revolutions) in those days. One was civil rights radicals and the other pro-communist.

"I don't need no lessons from history, I'm living now." Sure, dummy.

31 posted on 05/11/2004 6:31:02 AM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (Benedict Arnold was a hero for both sides in the same war, too!)
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To: quidnunc
I believe that we won every "battle" that we fought in Viet
Nam, but because we were afraid of what Russia might do, we
lost the war.
32 posted on 05/11/2004 7:51:31 AM PDT by upcountryhorseman (An old fashioned conservative)
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To: quidnunc
Don't forget the Civil War - where the North kicked butt & b*tch slapped a whole lot of rebels.
33 posted on 05/11/2004 7:56:58 AM PDT by familyofman
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To: quidnunc
In your case, I thought 1812 was the war that won't end!

;^)
34 posted on 05/11/2004 8:00:58 AM PDT by headsonpikes (Spirit of '76 bttt!)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
The Civil War would seem to qualify as well.

You mean "The War of Northern Agression", aka "The Late Unpleasantness"?

35 posted on 05/11/2004 9:23:20 AM PDT by talleyman (We haven't refought this in several hours, now...)
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To: quidnunc
It won't go away until paunchy, grey haired leftists either die or cease pining for their 'salad days'.
36 posted on 05/11/2004 9:29:53 AM PDT by skeeter
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To: familyofman
Don't forget the Civil War - where the North kicked butt & b*tch slapped a whole lot of rebels.

With comments like that, we'll surely remember you with the fondness you so richly deserve...

37 posted on 05/11/2004 9:34:25 AM PDT by talleyman (American by birth, Southern by grace of God.)
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To: talleyman
"...we'll surely remember you with the fondness you so richly deserve..."

Not to worry, I have no problem with the facts.

Okay - just for fun, no offense intended. how many times have you had the Banana Boat Song sung to you; 'come Mr Talleyman, tally me banana'?
38 posted on 05/11/2004 9:39:15 AM PDT by familyofman
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To: talleyman
I refrained from dignifying that w/a reply....but you did it for me! LOL
39 posted on 05/11/2004 1:09:39 PM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common Sense is an Uncommon Virtue)
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To: talleyman
the Late Unpleasantness....that would be the Revolution (aka a civil war the rebels won)....
40 posted on 05/11/2004 1:11:24 PM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common Sense is an Uncommon Virtue)
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To: ALOHA RONNIE
JOHN KERRY came back from the Vietnam War to call us American Soldiers fighting for Freedom there ..rapists and.. ...TERRORISTS
MEL GIBSON came back from filming our real Vietnam War story "WE WERE SOLDIERS" so inspired that he decided he finally had to make his ultimate story of Love and Sacrifice...
.."The PASSION of the Christ"


You know, that's an interesting comparison. Something to think about...
(my money's on Mel Gibson, by the way, and patriotism has nothing to do with that choice!)
41 posted on 05/12/2004 12:25:10 AM PDT by KangarooJacqui (Australia.... halfway down the slippery slide to socialism - observe our deeds, and beware!)
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To: quidnunc
The United States stands at this time at the pinnacle of world power. It is a solemn moment for the American democracy. For with primacy in power is also joined an awe-inspiring accountability to the future. If you look around you, you must feel not only the sense of duty done, but also you must feel anxiety lest you fall below the level of achievement.

As true now as it was when Winston Churchill said it in 1946... (not to mention a great quote to pin on every American's memo board.)
42 posted on 05/12/2004 12:29:06 AM PDT by KangarooJacqui (Australia.... halfway down the slippery slide to socialism - observe our deeds, and beware!)
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To: KangarooJacqui
.

What I share, and what you have shared about it, I was blessed to share with the country on C-Span a couple of weeks ago during it's coverage of JOHN KERRY's 1971 Anti-American Soldier Testimony before Congress.

"WE WERE SOLDIERS" Director/Screenwriter RANDALL WALLACE has also been informed.
He was most pleased.
.
43 posted on 05/12/2004 8:07:43 AM PDT by ALOHA RONNIE (Vet-Battle of IA DRANG-1965 http://www.LZXRAY.com)
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To: quidnunc
From the article:

...Vice President Dick Cheney attacked Kerry's war record...

Gee, you'd think that the author would back up this claim with a direct quote or two. Maybe he just couldn't find one.

44 posted on 05/12/2004 8:16:05 AM PDT by Bob
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To: familyofman
Not to worry, I have no problem with the facts.

Nor do I. In the words of Lewis Grizzard, "If the North won the Civil War, how come we got Florida and they got New Jersey?"
The facts are one thing, tone of discourse is another. I will gladly look to General Lee as a model to emulate. I see you're more in the Ted Kennedy vein.

Okay - just for fun, no offense intended. how many times have you had the Banana Boat Song sung to you; 'come Mr Talleyman, tally me banana'?

I had the song in mind when I selected the screenname. But so far, no one else has been childish enough to think the reference would bother me.

45 posted on 05/12/2004 10:25:40 AM PDT by talleyman (American by birth, Southern by grace of God.)
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To: quidnunc
Vietnam Remains the Only War That America Can't Quit Fighting

That is because we LOST it!! The nation listened to the IDEALISM of YOUTH! The politicians forgot WWII and what it takes to win a WAR, the left LOVED communism, so it didn't fear them taking over the world.

That same YOUTH is NOW in charge in the political arena, the media, the press and our schools and Universities. It is NO WONDER we are a divided nation.

46 posted on 05/12/2004 10:32:58 AM PDT by PISANO (Our troops...... will NOT tire...will NOT falter.....and WILL NOT FAIL!!!)
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To: talleyman
"But so far, no one else has been childish enough to think the reference would bother me."

I didn't think it would bother you (not intended that way at all) - just a matter of curiosity. I've been asked a few times about mine - doesn't bother me either.

The relative merits of the states is debatable, and as far as I know none changed their geographic position as a result of the Civil War. Both NJ and FL stayed right where they always were located.
Your choice of Lee is good, mine would be more along the lines of a Lawrence Chamberlain (held Little Roundtop at Gettysburg), or even a W.T. Sherman - based on strategy and leadership.
47 posted on 05/12/2004 10:52:03 AM PDT by familyofman
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To: familyofman
Your choice of Lee is good, mine would be more along the lines of a Lawrence Chamberlain (held Little Roundtop at Gettysburg), or even a W.T. Sherman - based on strategy and leadership.

We shall be civil, then, and politely agree to disagree. (But I'd go light on the Sherman admiration in Georgia, if I were you.)

48 posted on 05/12/2004 11:54:17 AM PDT by talleyman (In the South, "YMCA" is a warning: "Yanks may come again.")
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