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Oprah Goes Back In Time In PBS 'Colonial House'
The Kanasas City Channel ^ | May 17, 2004

Posted on 05/18/2004 7:48:54 AM PDT by presidio9

Imagine one of the wealthiest people on Earth living without indoor plumbing.

Granted, she only lasted a few days, but Oprah Winfrey took that challenge. She sat down with KMBC's Kelly Eckerman to talk about what life is like without electricity, running water or modern conveniences of any kind.

Oprah and her friend, Gail, recently stayed in the PBS "Colonial House," where the pair agreed to live as people did 400 years ago.

Eckerman: "Were some people surprised you were anxious to do it?"

Oprah: "I come from a very poor family, so it was like going back in my own time for me. Gail, on the other hand, grew up with a maid and always had indoor plumbing."

There were many unforgettable moments for the television talk-show guru. Oprah seemed to take most tasks in stride, but Gail was another story.

Oprah: "First, you arrive and they make you strip all your underwear because women didn't have underwear in the 16th century. Just one of those facts, I guess I never knew that."

Eckerman: "I never thought about that."

Oprah: "You never think about it. The panties have to come off, bras off."

The chores were another big adjustment for Gail.

Oprah: "We're trying to cook bacon, gasping for air, and Gail says, 'I'd like mine extra crispy.' And I said, 'This is not the Fairmont Hotel, sister.'"

A rodent finally sent the pair packing -- that was where Oprah drew the line.

Oprah: "I'm not going to survive if a rat falls on my face!"

Oprah's said her stay was short, but priceless for "seeing how far we've come as women, as people, and all the people who did so much for us to have this exquisite life that we so often take for granted."

Oprah added that the most revealing thing about her colonial experience -- besides no underwear -- is how hard they had to work. The women, especially, never had a minute to themselves, Oprah said.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: colonialhouse; oprah; oprahspanties; pbs; smallpox
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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To: Corin Stormhands
Well fortunately we could go to the gym to shower. But it was still frustrating to be without hot water - and with cold water that was contaminated for several days.

Thanks for the memories! Remember back in '93 when the midwest had severe flooding? Well, Des Moines was without water for ten days! It was contaminated when the river flooded the water treatment plant, so it was entirely shut off...in a city proper of around 200,000 people (at the time).

We had to line up to get gallon jugs filled by the National Guard water tanks. Those of us lucky enough to know someone in the suburbs could go there every couple of days to shower...but then the suburban water systems became overloaded and ran low so that ended.

We couldn't wash dishes or laundry, and "showered" by pouring water over our heads; and flushed by pouring buckets of water into the toilet to "force" it down. There was even a saying regarding the latter, coined by our water works director, "if it's yellow...let it mellow; if it's brown flush it down"....YUCK!

We ALL became immediately thankful for that we had. And the funniest part was that as the days wore on, people started looking worse and worse. By day ten, it was ponytails, baseball caps, and shorts and t-shirts...even in the most esteemed of businesses. After the fact, they reported that the CDC had people in town monitoring the medical situation. They EXPECTED an outbreak of disease...but it didn't happen, thankfully. I still think about that sometimes when I turn on the water!

101 posted on 05/18/2004 10:33:55 PM PDT by garandgal
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To: nopardons

I can't stand the narrator, who says the same crap over and over again just to speak.

I don't care about your damn facts you stupid woman.

Tell me something interesting please or just let the people there tell the story PLEASE.


102 posted on 05/18/2004 10:35:31 PM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: nopardons

Hmm....well, maybe they will be later. Whenever the next installment is...the title is "Regime change" or something.


103 posted on 05/18/2004 10:37:33 PM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: rwfromkansas
I said PURITANS,not Pilgrims.As a matter of fact,nowhere,in my reply,did I mention the word Pilgrim. I said "early settlers" and Puritan.:-)

I didn't go into conjugal rights and pleasures,but hinted at all you said.Yes,I know about what the Puritans were like.Please reread my earlier post. Thank you.

104 posted on 05/18/2004 10:38:37 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: nopardons

I thought I replied to mondoman, not to you.

You seem to have a good handle on things.

Maybe my eyes are not working well tonight (finals week...)


105 posted on 05/18/2004 10:40:01 PM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: rwfromkansas

This is NOT one of my "pet" historical periods,but apparently I know far more about it than most.LOL


106 posted on 05/18/2004 10:42:26 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: af_vet_rr
Check out "Guns, Germs and Steel", it is a good read, if a little left-leaning. It gives a good breakdown of disease and the basic assertion is that since Europeans lived close together and with animals, they were fairly disease resistant
107 posted on 05/18/2004 10:43:22 PM PDT by Unassuaged (Respect the delicate ecology of your delusions.)
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To: rwfromkansas

Oh,now I see...you replied to me and it should have been to another poster.That's okay,that sort of thing happens all the time.


108 posted on 05/18/2004 10:44:14 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: rwfromkansas
That's okay...no biggie.:-)

I'm particularly interested in clothes,food,daily life, of other times,so that's why I know about this kind of thing.Due to T.V. and movies,most people tend to have a rather confused,at best,idea of what it was REALLY like to live in other eras.

Good luck with your finals!

109 posted on 05/18/2004 10:48:42 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: Unassuaged

That IS an interetsing book.


110 posted on 05/18/2004 10:49:29 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: nopardons

We'll have to keep this thread going as the series progresses. They are repeating tonight's episodes this hour so I'm trying to pay a little more attention


111 posted on 05/18/2004 10:52:55 PM PDT by wolficatZ (___><))))*>_ \0/___/|___)
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To: wolficatZ
Both are good ideas.:-)

I tried to surf FR and watch,the first episodes and had to get off line and then watch the repeats.It's one show you can't watch with one eye.

112 posted on 05/18/2004 10:56:42 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: wolficatZ

I hope they have a boxset *lol* I'll need to play catchup.


113 posted on 05/19/2004 4:12:32 AM PDT by cyborg
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To: rwfromkansas
Tell me something interesting please or just let the people there tell the story PLEASE.

It did get annoying. How many ways can one say "things in 1628 were much more harsh and strict than 21st century Americans are used to"?

I do think the people told a very good, if subtle, story last night.

When the governor was complaining that many didn't want to follow the laws and were acting like children, a little flag started waving in the back of mind.

These are the types of attitudes and laws that eventually led to the founding of our nation. People that were like "the heck with this, I'm not going to live under such an oppressive government". As more and more had children in the colonies, and their children had children, you had more and more people that had no connection with England and were wondering why they should have to follow some of the harsh laws that were around.

You also got a slight glimpse of why those drawing up the Constitution were very adamant about the seperation of Church and State. Back then, the Church was used to keep people in line and was basically an extension of the monarchy, to an extent. The atheist and her family showed their liberal leanings when they caved into authority and went to church, even though they didn't believe in it.

As an experiment, it's not a very good one. In the 1620s, they would have considered themselves subjects, and were born under the rule of a king/queen, and were used to having much of their behavior dictated. It took generations before things reached a point where action was taken. The "rebellion" your seeing on the show is basically an accelerated version of this, because it's coming from people who were used to being free and then having harsh laws imposed upon them, rather than the other way around.

114 posted on 05/19/2004 6:24:55 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: af_vet_rr
Everybody knew up front they'd have to live under some harsh laws at some point, and the producers had made it clear there would be an adjustment period and then the laws would be implemented.

They made the governor look like a jerk in that it looked like he was the one making the laws (although the voiceover did remind you that the laws he was coming up with were in place in 1628). By extension, because he's a Baptist preacher, it painted a somewhat grim picture of of Christians, even though he wasn't actually making the laws, but was reading documents that the producers gave him, and was just roleplaying.

There are people in this country that think many Christians would love nothing better than to return to the kinds of laws and lifestyle of the 17th century.

115 posted on 05/19/2004 6:29:13 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: GunsareOK
Heat and humidity--plus several layers of clothes. Clothes that don't get washed after every wearing--chemise, corset, petticoats (usually two or three petticoats, frock, apron. Cap on your head to try to keep the grease and smoke and dust out of your hair...no screens on the windows.

Very uncomfortable. Even with an army of servants--far less comfortable than our society.

116 posted on 05/19/2004 6:30:04 AM PDT by Mamzelle (for a post-neo conservatism)
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To: dfwgator
It's probably a cake walk compared to what the people in "Frontier House" had to put up with.

Why do you say that? The "Frontier House" people had two more centuries of progress plus a store where they could go to buy stuff!
117 posted on 05/19/2004 6:30:50 AM PDT by HostileTerritory
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To: presidio9

I wathed it for a short while last night until the gay guy came out of the closet. It was obvious that he was gay, why did they have to ruin the show by making a big deal out of his sexuality? It had nothing to do with the premise of the show but was simply another attempt by the left to castigate conservatives. After that I turned it off as worthless tripe.


118 posted on 05/19/2004 6:39:03 AM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: flying Elvis; little jeremiah; EdReform

Homosexuals are a cancer to any society. As the Van Whatstheirnames pointed out, nobody is having sex in the one-room communal houses anyway. Therefore, one's sexual preferrence is completely irrelevant. The only thing he accomplised was making some members of the community uncomfortable in his insistence for acceptance.


119 posted on 05/19/2004 6:52:18 AM PDT by presidio9 (Islam is as Islam does)
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To: rwfromkansas

So sorry to correct you, but I grew up in New England where Pilgrim lore is much a part of school history. From a quick search on Ask Jeeves:

Women; Women's hair was always worn up and pulled tightly back, and worn under a coif (bonnet) or hat.

Common colors include  red, earthy greens, browns, blues, violets, and grays.  Contrary to popular myth, black and white clothing was clearly not the most common colors worn.  An examination of the probate inventories of many early Plymouth women reveal a large variety of colors.  Mary Ring, a long-time member of the Pilgrim's church in Leyden, and married to one of the more prominent members of the church, had her estate inventory taken in 1631.  She had in her possession at that time: one waistcoat "of mingled color", two violet waistcoats, three blue aprons, two white aprons, one black apron, a red petticoat, a violet petticoat, white stockings, blue stockings, and also had some red cloth, grey cloth, and blue cloth ready for sewing.  Desire (Gorham) Howland, daughter of Mayflower passenger John Howland, had a green apron, red stockings, white apron, and black cloak in her estate inventory.

Men: Whites, beiges, blacks, earthy greens, and browns were the predominant colors in men's clothing.  Contrary to popular stereotype, buckles were not worn on hats, shoes, belts, or anywhere else, nor was black the predominant color except for on Sunday or formal occasions.  From the probate inventories of Plymouth Colony, we learn that Governor William Bradford had a green gown, violet cloak, lead colored suit with silver buttons, and a red waistcoat. Elder William Brewster had green drawers, a red cap, a violet coat, and a blue suit.  And Mayflower passenger John Howland had a red waistcoat listed in his inventory.

SOURCES:

The Thanksgiving Primer, by the Plimoth Plantation Museum, 1991.

A Little Commonwealth, by John Demos, 1970. (Available in the Mayflower Web Page bookstore).

Estate Inventories of the Pilgrims, reprinted in various issues of the Mayflower Descendant as well as in Charles Simmons, Plymouth Colony Records: Wills and Inventories, 1633-1669, Picton Press, 1996.


120 posted on 05/19/2004 7:44:00 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: rwfromkansas
From the previews of next weeks episode, it appears as if the Baptist preacher's family will have to leaver for 21st Century reasons, leaving a leadership void at the top. Since the PC representatives (A-A, Atheists, Liberal lay ministers and wife, will remain) it will be interesting to see how they fare with dwindling food supplies (also previewed).

The producers will probably succeed in making the conservative a laughing stock, and lack of supplies will be the conservative governor's fault.
121 posted on 05/19/2004 7:55:21 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: Redcoat LI

Once PBS brought the gay guy out of the closet I could not watch the rest of the usual PBS political correctness.

Backbeat
Survivor: 1628
http://www.newsreview.com/issues/chico/2004-05-13/backbeat.asp

Chico State profs go back in time for reality TV series

By Devanie Angel

TIME TRAVELER Carolyn Heinz said the women enjoyed the challenge of coming up with creative meals using minimal supplies.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/colonialhouse/

Thirteen/WNET, the production company that filmed Colonial House for PBS, wants all press inquiries to "cast members" to go through its New York office, but the News & Review and the Heinzes chose to disregard that.When some professors take time off, they travel to an exotic locale or enjoy some mind-easing down time. Don and Carolyn Heinz spent their "vacation" in 1628 colonial New England.

As participants in Colonial House, the sixth installment in PBS's series that takes a couple of dozen people and thrusts them into a snapshot of history, the Heinzes spent nearly five months in rural Maine, on a "set" constructed to mimic the lives of settlers, right down to how they ate, slept and took care of bodily needs.

For the married Chico State professors, whose prior reality show experience was watching a couple of episodes of Survivor three years ago, it was all about the intellectual experience.

"What interested us as intellectuals was that we could actually enter a historical period that one reads about and lectures about but doesn't live in," said Don Heinz, who is partially retired from teaching religious studies. His wife teaches anthropology.

The trip back in time wasn’t even their idea; it was their daughter Susan's.

"She applied for us, and we didn't know anything about it," said Carolyn Heinz. The producers were especially eager to get Don Heinz on board. As a real-life Lutheran pastor, he was cast as the colony's lay preacher and assistant governor.

The series' filming ended in October 2003, but before it was over the Heinzes had tried to pull out of the project more than once.

They were already forgoing professors' wages to participate (PBS paid them $10,000 apiece), and the couple began worrying that they were the only ones in it for the historical experience. "We were afraid we would be the schmucks who were taking it seriously," Carolyn Heinz said. "Nobody's heads were in the 17th century."

Also, the producers told the preacher they would allow him no books, even though his research of the time showed that someone in his position would have a large library. And they told Carolyn Heinz she couldn't keep a journal.

"It was going to be five months with no books and nothing to write on," she said, and that was a deal-breaker.

Eventually the producers relented, and the Heinzes were back in--Don with a copy of Pilgrim's Progress and Carolyn with some sheets of period-correct paper and a feather quill for a pen.


Photo By Tom Angel

When Don Heinz was named governor of the colony, he was able to draw from his academic studies for a historically accurate representation.



The only other exceptions to historical accuracy were the addition of bug repellant, sunscreen and tampons. The producers allowed toothbrushes after participants threatened to sue if the flavored twigs they were using caused dental bills.

"There were endless discussions and arguments off camera with the production crew," Don Heinz said.

Because of the head-butting and the close-quarters intensity that drives reality shows, the couple is somewhat worried about how the producers will portray them through editing. It may be PBS, but it's still television.

The series will air May 17, 18, 24 and 25 from 8 to 10 p.m., and online synopses make frequent mention of the Heinzes, going so far as to derisively characterize Don Heinz, who has extensive knowledge of early religions, as "somewhat of a history buff."

"We felt to some extent they trivialized us," he said of the 20- and 30-something producers. "They were annoyed that we were always correcting them and challenging them. I think they probably thought we were something of a pain in the butt."

The Heinzes are suspending judgment until they see what airs, and they're not sure they even want friends and family over for their first viewing.

"It was a very intense social community," Carolyn Heinz said. "But in the end, it is reality television, and what they want is a good show that is going to get a lot of people watching it.

"It was pretty clear the cameras were after the quarrels and the struggles among the [people] rather than authenticity."

The show’s cast was primed for the experience by spending two weeks at the Plimouth Plantation, where actors, always in character, taught what it was like during the time of the Massachusetts Bay Colony. (The Colonial House residents weren't supposed to play-act, but rather maintain their own personalities in the context of the time.)

In spite, or perhaps because of, the fact that the Heinzes, who are in their early 60s, were the most senior members of the "cast," they had little trouble adjusting to the physical demands of colonial life. They didn't mind washing their hair once a month, eating moldy meat or going without toilet paper.


Photo By Tom Angel

PREACHER MAN While colonists of the 17th century would have been subjected to a full day of worship, lay preacher Don Heinz kept his sermons to less than two and one-half hours. He planned his addresses over the course of each week; one of his favorite topics was the struggle to build communities in difficult times.



"Half the world lives that way today," said Carolyn Heinz, who has resided with less-developed cultures as part of her academic work.

The biggest surprise--and disappointment--for the Heinzes was that the environment stifled rather than piqued creative thought.

"It suppressed creativity," Carolyn Heinz said. "I felt myself fading intellectually. There was no sharing of ideas. We were hunkered down to endure."

Two months into the filming, they almost left again, sick of the sheer tedium of it all.

But even through the monotony, drama was unfolding among the colonists.

Don Heinz was irked that, even though it was the law of the time that everyone attend church services, he was forced to deal with a handful of modern-day atheists who refused to play along.

In the midst of what the preacher called "the Sabbath wars," one participant skipped church to go skinny dipping--an historically unlikely escapade that earned her the punishment of being bound and paraded around by her husband.

It's that type of clip that the Heinzes are sure will make it to the final edit as the producers condensed 700 hours of film into eight hours of air time.

The Heinzes also had an indentured servant, 24-year-old Jonathon Allen, who did chores by day and slept on a straw mat at the foot of their bed by night.

One day, at a church service, Allen revealed that he was gay--an emotional moment for him in part because he wasn't "out" in real life.


Photo By Tom Angel

HOUSE RULES Carolyn Heinz, shown with her husband, Don, in their Chico home, convinced Colonial House producers to allow her to keep this journal. During filming, participants were allowed to receive mail twice, under the pretext that it had come by ship from the "Old World."



The news didn't faze the Heinzes. "You're talking to two Northern California liberals here," Don Heinz said. However, it did bother him from the perspective that "it's not the way anything would have happened in the 17th century."

Partway into the series, the colonists, all of whom were furnished with "back stories" about their lives in Europe, were joined by a man from the English homeland checking on the "investment." (The colonists were supposed to be making money off their work on the land.)

That threw the settlement's structure on its ear, and, when the governor's family had to leave after a real-life emergency, Don Heinz became acting governor.

"I think I had been chaffing to be governor all along," he admitted.

The PBS Web site also claims that Carolyn Heinz was "hell-bent on serving as de facto governor via her husband, an arrangement that would have been highly unlikely in the 17th century."

"I simply had ideas about how things should work," she countered. "There would have been strong-minded, opinionated women who had to live in patriarchal societies."

When the cameras weren’t filming, the participants, who included several children, talked freely about the outside world. Many of them became friends.

The Heinzes have kept in touch with Allen, their indentured servant, via e-mail, even helping him get into graduate school. Recently, he drove to Chico from South Carolina for a visit.

At the end of the series' filming, the cast members were asked if they'd do it again. "There weren't many people who said yes," Don Heinz said. "I suppose we're glad we did it, but we would not do it again."



122 posted on 05/19/2004 11:34:18 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: Redcoat LI

She is a typical Fema-Nazi.


123 posted on 05/19/2004 11:36:54 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: Ronaldus Magnus Reagan

I watched that too. I do remember the rich guy complaining more than once that they couldn't hunt and that the real frontier people did. It was also Montana's law that they couldn't hunt out of season. But they had a Native American hunt for them one time. Indian Nations could hunt anytime.


124 posted on 05/19/2004 11:53:34 AM PDT by stevio
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To: mondoman

We are going to have to agree to disagree I guess; this is the area I like to research a lot.

I will concede your point that the Pilgrims did not always wear black and white, however.

But, they did not like the Puritans for their colorful clothes and "lace."


125 posted on 05/19/2004 12:13:37 PM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: KeyLargo

Strange. Devanie Angel's article makes the wacko CA leftists out to be the center of the story and completely ignores the Baptist preacher, governor, and his family who were really in the center of the series. I watched the first 2 days but it was going down hill fast and don't think I can watch them replace the only leader they had with a leftist wacko.


126 posted on 05/19/2004 12:19:58 PM PDT by plain talk
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To: rwfromkansas

Pilgrims Suck!


127 posted on 05/19/2004 12:32:11 PM PDT by Redcoat LI
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To: KeyLargo

That wen't downhill in a hurry.

P.B.S loaded it with Liberal Flakes, the only stable people are that Family from Texas.

I'm surrounded by these liberal hippy bastards every day,I' can't stand them.

They should have done it with Freepers, all the work would be done,and we could cross-breed Oprah with the goats and sell the offspring to the Natives

I've never seen so much whining in my life.

I'm glad I watched the Hockey game instead.


128 posted on 05/19/2004 12:46:08 PM PDT by Redcoat LI
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To: atomicpossum

Yeah, right after they fought off the Indians, cleared and plowed the land, sowed the crop, weeded the crop, harvested the crop, fought off the indians, and took care of hundreds of other farm chores.


129 posted on 05/19/2004 12:46:40 PM PDT by dljordan
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To: mondoman
He will leave next week and we will meet an administrator from the "Company"

The new family is Christian as well (the one sharing the house with the Governor), but we will have to see what "kind".
130 posted on 05/19/2004 1:50:40 PM PDT by CyberCowboy777 (Veritas vos liberabit)
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To: Redcoat LI

lol


131 posted on 05/19/2004 3:36:04 PM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: KeyLargo; rwfromkansas
I've had some time to think about some of the lessons that can be observed from this show.

1. This is "Reality TV programing " PBS style

2. The Pioneers NEVER would have succeeded in the wilderness had they not subsumed their personal desires and philosophies to the community.

3. The role players in this series don't have to take this experiment "life & death" seriously, therefore it is OK to "do your own thing", and carp about those in authority attempting to keep the colony alive and prospering.

4. The role players brought and maintained their own world view to the experiment. Notice how everyone woke at 9 am, lots of game playing, until the Governor returned and got everyone back on track, and thereafter encountered resistance from elements of the colony who began demanding their own wills be heard.

Isn't it interesting to see how when anarchy and liberalism is practically applied it breaks down community cohesion and undermines the critcial order of priorities: security, shelter, food, contemplation, recreation...
132 posted on 05/20/2004 9:04:23 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: mondoman

"...The Pioneers NEVER would have succeeded in the wilderness had they not subsumed their personal desires and philosophies to the community."...

That is the same kind of crap like the "Army of One" slogan trying to sell military service to young people today. Whether it is the military or in business if you have a bunch of people that want to "do their own thing" then the military mission and business mission will surely fail.


133 posted on 05/20/2004 9:46:05 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: mondoman

Good thoughts!

I admit I probably would have been the "don't wake up until 9 a.m" folks...any excuse to sleep in and it would just be maybe 2 hours lost there.

But, the rest of the stuff I would have a hard time with if I was there.....people just playing games and skinny dipping would not go down well.


134 posted on 05/20/2004 10:22:59 AM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: mondoman

"savages"?


135 posted on 05/24/2004 10:40:55 AM PDT by zimdog
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To: Aggie Mama; zimdog; rwfromkansas; KeyLargo
Watched the conclusion last night:

• 10% ROI to the investors capital
• 4 fish
• 50% return on the corn seed.
• Most of the food from imported supplies (salt cod, beef, dried grain)
• L6 of Furs for L8 of trade goods (L=pounds sterling)
• No defensive palisade
• Lots of 'plans and dreams' for creative thought (which never kept out the Indians and put food in the belly).

And, the evaluators considered the Colony A SUCCESS !?!? I guess they agreed with the Lay Minister's wife, Carolyn, that the colony was a success because they were "confident". I could not understand how, except for political correctness, the evaluators could possibly consider this colony a success.

It's almost an allegory for our public school systems which "doesn't want to hurt Jonny's self esteem" and passes him along, even though he is failing 3rd grade.
136 posted on 05/26/2004 7:17:19 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: af_vet_rr
Hmmm, do you think there was a little subtle planning to 'defame' Christians from the producers by selecting a conservative Southern Baptist as the Governor?

I did find the post interview with the Baptist interesting. Seems even he felt uncomfortable imposing religion on others...
137 posted on 05/26/2004 7:39:07 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: presidio9; martin_fierro; cyborg; mountaineer; Zack Nguyen; Redcoat LI; noexcuses; ...

Ping

any comments now that the series is completed?


138 posted on 05/26/2004 7:52:49 AM PDT by mondoman (si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: mondoman

The atheist woman was a whiner. I thought the take on why the black man left was pretty interesting though.


139 posted on 05/26/2004 8:00:18 AM PDT by cyborg (tit for tat butter for fat hillary is ugly that's a fact)
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To: mondoman
Hmmm, do you think there was a little subtle planning to 'defame' Christians from the producers by selecting a conservative Southern Baptist as the Governor?

I did find the post interview with the Baptist interesting. Seems even he felt uncomfortable imposing religion on others...

No, actually I felt it was natural to select him as the Governor. Those colonies were very religiously oriented (not the best way to say it) and he seemed like a very natural leader. Due to the fact that we saw only 8 hours out of 700+ filmed, and the personal tragedies that led to his family having to leave, I don't think you ever really got to see him reach his stride.

As far as the post interview and him saying it bothered him that some were leaving Europe to escape religious intolerance only to fall back into it here, I found that to be very interesting/signficant, however it's not surprising.

Consider this - he, a Republican/Conservative Christian, felt uncomfortable imposing religion on others (after all he wouldn't want it imposed upon him). Natural reaction for a true Conservative. We want to worship as we see fit, not as the State determines.

The liberal/democrat Christian, on the other hand, wanted mandatory church attendance for all. Some would defend him and say he was just trying to act the part of the 1620s, and they would be partially right. However, any sane/rational person would know that this would be one 21st century belief that probably shouldn't be touched upon too much. I believe he probably understood it was sensitive, but maybe he wanted to do some kind of personal study to see just how far he could push others in regards to religion. I don't know.

If this was a real colony facing real problems, I think Wyers, or Jack Lekza or Don Wood would have been much more capable leaders/governors than Heinz. Wood most of all. Besides the fact that he is a real carpenter and used to hard labor and and efficiency, he seemed to understand just what would have been at stake. He seemed like a better manager of people.

140 posted on 05/26/2004 8:49:56 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: mondoman
any comments now that the series is completed?

Eight hours out of 700+ filmed is not enough. Way too many people didn't get the credit they deserved. Human drama became more important than actual results and any lessons learned.

The part about Dominic relying on his faith, and realizing how important it was to him, and going back to study to perhaps join the clergy was a surprise.

I think they all pretty much sucked at fishing.

I think several proved they were more than capable at being able to survive back then - I was impressed by Don Wood, the girl who tracked the chicken/eggs, Jack the company guy, etc.

141 posted on 05/26/2004 8:55:34 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: mondoman

I agree that it would not have been a success in reality.

I watched last night as well (well, the last hour conclusion) and the evaluators even said they were a lot more inclined to "be nice" because everybody "stuck together."


142 posted on 05/26/2004 9:51:11 AM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: af_vet_rr

I had no blasted idea Dominic even was a believer!

I only heard about the faith of the Wyers.


143 posted on 05/26/2004 9:52:00 AM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: af_vet_rr

I did expect this to go on for a couple more weeks......so I was a bit shocked when I just happened to catch the show ending tonight.

It should have kept going for another couple weeks.

I could swear Pioneer House was longer than this!!


144 posted on 05/26/2004 9:53:04 AM PDT by rwfromkansas ("Am I not destroying my enemies when I make friends of them?" -- Abraham Lincoln)
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To: af_vet_rr
Regarding your post #114, thanks for that bit of sanity.

I think that very much needed to be said on this thread.

145 posted on 05/26/2004 10:32:59 AM PDT by freeeee ("Owning" property in the US just means you have one less landlord)
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To: mondoman

If the original colonists had that kind of success we would not be communicating now by internet but instead by smoke signals! I think that the show participants were smoking somthing in their clay pipes other than tobacco.


146 posted on 05/26/2004 10:33:28 AM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: rwfromkansas
I had no blasted idea Dominic even was a believer!

There were several that were that way (Jack, plus the other family of freeman, not the Vorhees/atheists). They either downplayed it, or more than likely, never had enough time. They say eight hours, but with all of the ads for future PBS specials, the behind the scenes, the credits, etc., it was probably more like 6.5 hours, and with large portions of that tied up with the ship at the beginning, the audit/grading at the end, the Wyers' tragedy, the bickering, the punishment, the governor stuff, etc. you really had little room to find out what people truly believed or how they were responding.

147 posted on 05/26/2004 10:56:14 AM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: mondoman

The leftists ruined it for me.

The atheists and the hen-pecked Hippie Governor and his insufferable wife took over the show.

The Colony lost money on trade with the natives.

The original Plymoth Colonists build a defensive stockade and other structure such as a blockhouse for defense of the Colony.

No Guns? Where were the Matchlocks? The original Colonists did not assume the Natives would be friendly, they would have trained with weapons,set up a watch,and an alarm in case of attack.

If there was a country called Woodstock, and they wanted to set up a Colony where everyone would get back to nature and sit around and talk about their feelings, this would have been it.

P.C-P.B.S needs to realise that History is not improved by Liberalism.

They would have been the first to go home,get slaughtered by the Natives,or be banished by the other Colonists.


148 posted on 05/26/2004 11:36:29 AM PDT by Redcoat LI (You Can Trust Me , I'm Not Like The Others.....)
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To: KeyLargo

bttt


149 posted on 05/26/2004 12:16:37 PM PDT by TEXOKIE (The Will of God is Good! Not my will, not my will, not my will, but Thine be done!)
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To: zimdog

On the "savages", the Wampanoags (the ones who stole a chicken and 2 eggs) didn't look very Indian to me--curly hair is uncommon in native Americans!


150 posted on 05/26/2004 2:48:56 PM PDT by kaktuskid
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