Posted on 05/21/2004 10:15:03 AM PDT by TERMINATTOR
It comes down to the stupid legal system. If they explicitly forbid carrying of weapons, then they are not liable for what an employee does in defiance of policy. A lawsuit stemming from a defensive shooting by an employee is expensive to defend against. For the policy to remain a defense against lawsuits, it must be enforced with zero tolerance
The basic rule is: if he's still standing with a weapon in his hand, he's still a threat, keep firing.
If he's down but still attempting to lift his gun, he's still a threat, keep firing.
When he's no longer a threat to your life, THEN you stop firing
I admit, I'm a velocity junkie. No sense hitting em, if your bullet bounces off their armor coating!
"What is not mentioned in the article is the coroners report that Brown was so high on meth or crack that he would not have reacted to the initial half dozen gunshot wounds."
A tweaker or a pipe head? Attempting a robbery? I am SHOCKED!
Look, I'm sorry for the guy. I'm a recovering alkie myself. Clearly, though, this cat was way out of control, and the driver had every right to take him down. I'm also disgusted that Pizza Hut wouldn't get behind their employee and support his decision. Think I'd ever drive for them? Not a chance if they expect me to die to support the drug habit of a passer-by.
Policy's the same everywhere.
You find a pizza delivery outfit that doesn't have that policy and let me know, okay?
Doesn't matter.
There are many locally owned non franchised Pizza places everywhere.
They don't have such policies. I will just buy from them. They make better pizza than the chains anyway.
If you find one, let me know.
So what's so bad about delivering pizzas? I know people who have done it for years, both part time and full time. If you know what you're doing, you can make darn good money.
FAL I wouldn't worry too much about that information becoming widely known. Every high-school aged thug wannabe with a Lorcin .380 that jams every 3rd round knows that we are on our own out here.
Delivery drivers nationwide have had enough and we're doing something about it. There are 3 ways to fight corporations like Pizza Hut. Litigate, Legislate, and Organize.
Some 3 years ago a small group of us decided to start fighting back in every legal way we could.
Early this year we shelled out the money for the big .50AE to use on them. We chartered a labor union. Forget what you think you may know about traditional, established labor unions. That's what many of our members think too. We decided we could up the ante and do it our way. Companies like this deserve the unions they wind up having to deal with.
The cold-blooded individuals are the people who run the pizza industry that have allowed these things to happen on their watch, and not take steps to address the problem.
You all seem to understand the hazards of the job, but did you realize that almost all of them require the driver to put big lighted "ROB ME" signs on top of their cars? I believe there is a very good argument that companies that do this are in many ways RESPONSIBLE for driver's deaths.
If I marked you as a target for a crime, that would make me an accessory to the crime. This is essentially what they are doing to us by requiring the use of cartops.
A cell phone can do more for a pizza driver than a gun. Not that I don't advocate the right to carry, I EXERCISE it. But a phone can be used to avoid trouble before a driver steps in it. If you need a firearm, you've already screwed up REAL bad. The best thing for a driver to do is to be smart and take every precaution to assure the avoidance of trouble
Companies could provide cell phones, and teach drivers to call customers from a locked vehicle as they approach the delivery address. There is nothing wrong with a driver asking a customer to come to the door or outside and escort (or just watch) them from the car to the house, and back to the car.
Introduction of a NEXTEL system in pizza shops could virtually eliminate robberies, if used properly. But the chain pizza shops and their franchisees universally refuse to make the investment in equipment and training required to avoid situations that put lives in jeapordy. Those that do to have equipment or a system either don't go far enough, or don't use them properly for one rason or another.
We've spoken out on these and other issues addressing the industry in industry press and on the internet for years. It has had no bearing on the policies of these companies.
Now we're taking action. Drivers are filing class action lawsuits, organizing and filing authorization cards with NLRB. We absolutely will not stop as long as the status quo is maintained.
One post here asked how many drivers go armed I believe...
It turns out that many Indy pizza shops allow their drivers to go heeled.
http://www.ofcc.net/printarticle2242.html
I see that as usual in firearms forums, this topic degenerated at some point into .45 vs 9mm. It just had to happen.
I can break that down for ya. It don't matter what ya got, shoot what ya brought. Hit the right spot, and hit it a lot!
Once in Arlington, TX, I witnessed two cops shoot a car thief who crashed, ran, and fired on them. They must have fired about 30 rounds from 9mms at him from a distance of less than 20 feet. It took him longer to fall than it did for them to empty their magazines.
In Macon, GA this year, Pizza Hut driver Eric Bass got 5 rounds off at his attacker with a .45 hitting him 4x. The driver caught one from an unknown (to me) weapon and died. The guy he hit recovered to rat out his homies.
The gist of it all is that anything is better than nothing. I personally find a snub 686 .357 to be the most comfortable to live with jumping in and out of a car 40x a night. If that won't do it I guess I can always mount my NHM-91 and it's drum to the top of my car, and get a rider to stand up through the sunroof to cover me.
Hopefully it won't come to that. ;)
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