Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


1 posted on 05/24/2004 4:42:38 PM PDT by churchillbuff
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


To: churchillbuff

Oh boy, what's a day without a Chamberlainbuff thread.


2 posted on 05/24/2004 4:44:27 PM PDT by CWOJackson
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

I find that description of neo-conservatism particularly uncompelling.


3 posted on 05/24/2004 4:48:31 PM PDT by MrShoop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

I'm a conservative and don't need the "neo" label to identify my persuasion. At the same time, I think conservatism is the stronger for the contribution of disaffected liberals, since we used to be them and know how they think. In no small part, the Left is infuriated by people who successfully steal the thunder out of their arguments. As a result, the Left has been left with nothing to say. In no small part, the neocons have helped to make America, in Micklewaithe and Wooldridge's apt phrase, "The Right Nation."


8 posted on 05/24/2004 6:05:22 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

I've seen a couple of definitions:
one is a conservative Jew;
two is a Reagan democrat.


10 posted on 05/24/2004 6:12:42 PM PDT by Chi-townChief
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
First, patriotism is a natural and healthy sentiment and should be encouraged by both private and public institutions. Precisely because we are a nation of immigrants, this is a powerful American sentiment. Second, world government is a terrible idea since it can lead to world tyranny. International institutions that point to an ultimate world government should be regarded with the deepest suspicion. Third, statesmen should, above all, have the ability to distinguish friends from enemies. This is not as easy as it sounds, as the history of the Cold War revealed. The number of intelligent men who could not count the Soviet Union as an enemy, even though this was its own self-definition, was absolutely astonishing.

Agree? Disagree?

Finally, for a great power, the "national interest" is not a geographical term, except for fairly prosaic matters like trade and environmental regulation. A smaller nation might appropriately feel that its national interest begins and ends at its borders, so that its foreign policy is almost always in a defensive mode. A larger nation has more extensive interests.

"The business of America is business." - Calvin Coolidge.

11 posted on 05/24/2004 6:25:21 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

code word for JOOZ


13 posted on 05/24/2004 6:36:52 PM PDT by cyborg (tit for tat butter for fat hillary is ugly that's a fact)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

I am just as sick of the likes of you as I am of the media.


19 posted on 05/24/2004 7:35:50 PM PDT by Howlin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff; holdonnow

If you can spare the time,this thread and the person who posted it,could REALLY use your reply to this.


65 posted on 05/24/2004 8:44:34 PM PDT by nopardons
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

Pity you are taking fire for posting an excellent article. Of course, it is your posting history, rather than the article, that attacks the fire. Handle it as best you can. By the way, I don't myself agree with most of what you post. But there is no justification for trashing you personally. I dissent from that.


72 posted on 05/24/2004 8:48:42 PM PDT by Torie
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

To sum it up, neo-cons believe that defending democracy and individual freedom goes beyond our borders, which I have to agree with because when we get to the point where the majority of the world does not believe in individual freedom and democracy we will not have any allies to call on.


111 posted on 05/24/2004 10:01:23 PM PDT by John Lenin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
Neocons do not feel that kind of alarm or anxiety about the growth of the state in the past century, seeing it as natural, indeed inevitable.

This is the major reason that I feel that neocons are dangerous.

146 posted on 05/25/2004 7:26:55 AM PDT by jmc813 (Help save a life - www.marrow.org)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

A neocon is an ex-democrat. If a democrat had any sense they would'nt even be a democrat, and sadly mostly they don't have any sense even they are not democrats either.


159 posted on 05/25/2004 10:14:37 AM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
QUESTION: Would you like to be a democrat, a Republican, or a Libertarian?"

NEOCON: "Yes!"
193 posted on 05/25/2004 11:59:15 AM PDT by FrankR
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
QUESTION: Would you like to be a democrat, a Republican, or a Libertarian?"

NEOCON: "Yes!"
194 posted on 05/25/2004 11:59:29 AM PDT by FrankR
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
QUESTION: What would you most like to be; a democrat, a Republican, or a Libertarian?"

NEOCON: "Yes!"
196 posted on 05/25/2004 12:02:29 PM PDT by FrankR
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff
Shallow puffery, to be sure. The man takes his pseudo-intellectual "persuasion" rather more seriously as a factor in political philosophy than anything in his article would suggest it capable of measuring up to. Let us take this profoundly arrogant, yet profoundly revealing statement of purpose, as an example:

Viewed in this way, one can say that the historical task and political purpose of neoconservatism would seem to be this: to convert the Republican party, and American conservatism in general, against their respective wills, into a new kind of conservative politics suitable to governing a modern democracy. That this new conservative politics is distinctly American is beyond doubt.

Note the predisposition towards "Democracy," the system Madison and the other Founding Fathers sought to guard against. And yet even in that predisposition, note the absurd contradiction. This poseur seeks to convert those of us who believe in traditional Americanism, as well as the Republican party, against our wills. That sure is Democratic! And the genius who can write such revealing commentary, just assumes of course that he is both doing us and America a favor.

The final sentence quoted further demonstrates the shallowness of Mr. Kristol as a political thinker. First of all, there is nothing Conservative about this "new conservative politics." It is duplicitous to call it that. And duplicity has been the hallmark of various forms of European politics--in each case also pretending to be much further to the right than it actually is--for over a hundred years.

First of all, consider the British Fabian Socialist movement, now running the British Government via the Labour Party under Tony Blair. Blair as his predecessors has always pretended to be far more moderate than he actually is. He like some of Mr. Kristol's admirers in America, also, refuses to protect the basic British stock--the British Nation descended from those who are responsible for English civilization, literature, science and influence--from hordes of uncongenial immigrants, still pouring into an already, long over-crowded island.

Second, consider the Nazi movement under Adolph Hitler. While he called his party "Socialist," as well as "Labour," he pretended to be of the Right. While he called for a "Classless, Casteless Society"--just as the Communists--he was basically engaged in converting the German Center and even some of the actual Right, "against their respective wills." And, he as brother Kristol, acted as though he was doing them a favor. He was saving Germany by revolutionizing its several cultures. We have all seen pictures of that benefit in the bombed out ruins. Herr Hitler was no more of the real Right than is Herr Kristol.

Europe in the days of the EU is full of phony Conservatives who do not seek to preserve, but like Mr. Kristol, seek to foist an ideology on people "against their respective wills," with varying degrees of success. Such forces of "Democracy," have all but destroyed the continuity of European culture and family values. Massachusetts, today, but apes Europe.

Anyone who has ever attended an Academy with serious intellectual pretensions, will have encountered in addition to the serious intellects that may actually be on campus, the numerous poseurs who seek to convince others of their profundity. We know the breed, Mr. Kristol represents, though not all of them are so pathetic as Mr. Kristol.

Sham Conservatism from a sham intellect!

William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site

316 posted on 05/25/2004 3:09:04 PM PDT by Ohioan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: nutmeg

read later bump


333 posted on 05/25/2004 3:31:38 PM PDT by nutmeg (Why vote for Bush? Imagine Commander in Chief John Fin al-Qerry)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

neo

- \Ne"o-\ [Gr. ? youthful, new. See New.] A prefix meaning new, recent, late; and in chemistry designating specifically that variety of metameric hydrocarbons which, when the name was applied, had been recently classified, and in which at least one carbon atom in connected directly with four other carbon atoms; -- contrasted with normal and iso-; as, neopentane; the neoparaffins. Also used adjectively.

con·ser·va·tive (kn-sûrv-tv)
adj.
Favoring traditional views and values; tending to oppose change.
Traditional or restrained in style: a conservative dark suit.
Moderate; cautious: a conservative estimate.

Of or relating to the political philosophy of conservatism.
Belonging to a conservative party, group, or movement.
Conservative Of or belonging to the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
Conservative Of or adhering to Conservative Judaism.
Tending to conserve; preservative: the conservative use of natural resources.

n.
One favoring traditional views and values.
A supporter of political conservatism.
Conservative A member or supporter of the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
Archaic. A preservative agent or principle.



ne·o·con·ser·va·tism also ne·o-con·ser·va·tism (n-kn-sûrv-tzm)
n.
An intellectual and political movement in favor of political, economic, and social conservatism that arose in opposition to the perceived liberalism of the 1960s: “The neo-conservatism of the 1980s is a replay of the New Conservatism of the 1950s, which was itself a replay of the New Era philosophy of the 1920s” (Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr.).


367 posted on 05/25/2004 5:23:42 PM PDT by ATOMIC_PUNK (Let your opponent point to you the way to overcome him.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

Father... and son.

Quote from Irving Kristol: "Ever since I can remember, I've been a neo-something: a neo-Marxist, a neo-Trotskyist, a neo-liberal, a neo-conservative; in religion a neo-orthodox even while I was a neo-Trotskyist and a neo-Marxist. I'm going to end up a neo- that's all, neo dash nothing."

405 posted on 05/25/2004 7:02:13 PM PDT by O.C. - Old Cracker (When the cracker gets old, you wind up with Old Cracker. - O.C.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: churchillbuff

Irv my how you go on.. Cut it short next time. You could have said this all in two paragraphs. Many will begin to think you write just to hear the keyboard click.. I on the other hand already know it. Irv, be brief. You're getting boring.. Talk, Talk, Talk and you never say anything meaningful, back to the shallow end of the pool. The deep water is for deep thinkers here at Free Republic.




436 posted on 05/26/2004 8:43:15 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson