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1 posted on 06/10/2004 2:26:53 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Then, on Oct. 27, a Soviet Whiskey-class sub suddenly and very publicly ran aground on the rocks inside a Swedish military base, using a route that had been used previously by another Soviet intruder, these sources said.

Ah yes, 'Whiskey on the Rocks'.

2 posted on 06/10/2004 2:39:24 PM PDT by Riley (Need an experienced computer tech in the DC Metro area? I'm looking. Freepmail for details.)
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To: struwwelpeter; archy; Allan; Mitchell; marron; gaspar; Thud; aristeides

Interesting items here.


3 posted on 06/10/2004 2:54:20 PM PDT by Shermy
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To: Tailgunner Joe

So much for the flat out lies of the left that "Reagan had nothing to do with the Soviet Union's collapse".


4 posted on 06/10/2004 3:04:18 PM PDT by AmericaUnited (It's time someone says the emperor has no clothes.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Another reason to love our 40th President.


8 posted on 06/10/2004 3:22:41 PM PDT by wjcsux ("Communists read Marx and Lenin, Anti-Communists understand Marx and Lenin" -R.Reagan)
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To: Tailgunner Joe; First_Salute
No mention of the covert destruction of the Trans-Siberian oil pipeline? I love that story, and wonder why it was left out of this article.

The explosion was so big that our satellites thought a nuclear device had gone off.

9 posted on 06/10/2004 3:26:30 PM PDT by snopercod (I am still waiting for the rebirth of wonder.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

"Then, on Oct. 27, a Soviet Whiskey-class sub suddenly and very publicly ran aground on the rocks inside a Swedish military base... it was decided at the Swedish-Weinberger meetings to trap and detain a Soviet submarine.

These sources also said U.S. technology was able to manipulate the sub's instruments, causing them to exhibit "false readings" until it was misled and went aground. "We had that sort of technology," one of the former intelligence officials said."

WOW back then !!


13 posted on 06/10/2004 3:56:57 PM PDT by traumer
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To: Dark Wing

ping


15 posted on 06/10/2004 4:06:14 PM PDT by Thud
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To: Tailgunner Joe

All those clueless idiots like alterman who say it was gorby who should get most credit. What a joke


16 posted on 06/10/2004 4:09:08 PM PDT by Monty22
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To: Tailgunner Joe

bmp


17 posted on 06/10/2004 4:09:11 PM PDT by shield (The Greatest Scientific Discoveries of the Century Reveal God!!!! by Dr. H. Ross, Astrophysicist)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Great great great great article!
18 posted on 06/10/2004 4:10:38 PM PDT by doug from upland (Don't wait until it is too late to stop Hillary -- do something today!)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

I also read an article a few months ago that Reagan authorized the CIA to turn over vital weapons and technology material to the USSR...with viruses in it. Some things would work for a week and collapse, some would blow up. The Soviets got so jumpy that they nearly stopped all espionage activities because they were afraid what they were getting was garbage.


21 posted on 06/10/2004 7:45:49 PM PDT by nonliberal (Bush 2004: He is better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Other measures included covert support for the mujahideen in Afghanistan who were resisting Soviet forces that had occupied the country in 1979. Covert measures included strikes by jihadis on Soviet soil, these former senior sources said.

Charlie Wilson's War: The Extraordinary Story of the Largest Covert Operation in History
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0871138549/102-8879353-0207323?v=glance
Book Description
From an award-winning 60 Minutes reporter comes the extraordinary story of the largest and most successful CIA operation in history—the arming of the Mujahideen in Afghanistan.
"In little over a decade, two events have transformed the world we live in: the collapse of our Cold War nuclear foe, the Soviet Union; and the discovery, after 9/11, that we face a new global enemy in the form of militant Islam," writes author and 60 Minutes producer George Crile in the enclosed Author's Note to Charlie Wilson's War. Here, we see the "missing chapter"-that connects the two events-in the politics of our time.

Charlie Wilson's War is the untold story of how the Central Intelligence Agency armed the Afghan Mujahideen in what became the CIA's largest and most successful campaign in history. It profiles the men who conceived it and the journey they took to see it through. At its core, it tells of an unorthodox alliance-of a scandal-prone Texas Congressman named Charlie Wilson and an out-of-favor CIA operative named Gust Avrakotos-that armed and sustained the Afghan jihad and turned Afghanistan into the Soviet Union’s Vietnam.

As incredible as anything in the pages of Tom Clancy or John le Carré, Charlie Wilson's War is a gripping story of international intrigue, booze, drugs, sex, high society and arms deals. It is indeed one of the most detailed and compulsively readable accounts of the inside workings of the CIA ever written.

Along the way, we meet:

· The charismatic Congressman Charlie Wilson. While Ronald Reagan and William Casey were unable to persuade Congress to give them a mere $19 million to fund the Nicaraguan Contras, Wilson was procuring hundreds of millions of dollars to support his Afghan "freedom fighters" through back-room machinations that would have made even LBJ blush. A colorful man of many contradictions, he worked hard and played hard, earning the reputation as the "wildest man in Congress" while representing an archconservative Bible-belt district in Texas.

· The out-of-favor CIA operative, Gust Avrakotos, whose working-class Greek-American background made him an anomaly in the patrician world of American spies. Nicknamed "Dr. Dirty", this blue collar James Bond was an aggressive agent who served on the front lines of the Cold War where he learned how to stretch the Agency's rules to the breaking point.

· The eccentric staff of CIA outcasts hand-picked by Avrakotos to run the operation. Among them were "Hilly Billy", the logistics wizard who could open an un-numbered Swiss bank account for the U.S. government in 12 hours when others took months; Art Alper, the "devilish" tinkerer from the Technical Services division who roamed the world creating such novelties as exploding typewriters and developed portable amplifiers that spread propaganda among the Soviet troops; and especially Mike Vickers, the former Green Beret so junior in status that he couldn't send his own cables. His military genius allowed him to single-handedly redesign the CIA's war plan. Through his highly specific blueprint, he created a systematic plan that turned a rabble of shepherds and tribesmen into an army of techno Holy warriors who gave the legendary Red Army their greatest defeat. Today, Mike Vickers is consulting for the Pentagon on the War on Terrorism and war planning for Iraq.

· The many women who shared the Congressman's jihad. It all began with a Houston socialite, Joanne Herring who enlisted Wilson to the Afghan cause via her deep-seated hatred of Communism and her influence in Pakistan. Carol Shannon, Wilson's personal belly dancer who he took with him to the jihad. Charlie's Angels, Wilson's female staffers so strikingly beautiful that they became a legend on Capitol Hill. And finally, Annelise Illschenko, aka "Sweetums", the former U.S. representative in the Miss World competition who traveled with Wilson deep into the Islamic world in outfits that were not the most appropriate attire in the eyes of Muslim men

· The Pakistani dictator Zia ul Haq, who early on realized that the way to millions of dollars in American aid was through Charlie Wilson and his covert war in Afghanistan. A dictator whom many held personally responsible for the execution of his democratically elected predecessor, Zia used his favorable status as an ally of the U.S. against the Soviets to divert attention from his own nuclear weapons program while providing the all-important safe haven and operations center for the CIA's Afghan operations .

Charlie Wilson's War is the CIA and Congress as you have never seen them before, engaged in the last great battle of the Cold War. Along with its page-turning pace, this is an important book that has direct implications for today’s world situation.


22 posted on 06/10/2004 8:36:29 PM PDT by Valin ("Well..there you go again" R. Reagan)
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To: Tailgunner Joe

Schweizer's book Victory is the source of all this...Great book, but I must have been one of the handful who bought it.

Where is the history of how the US government ROLLED BACK communism with covert support for dissidents inside Russia and the Baltics, Armenia, Moldova, etc.? You know what. You CAN'T FIND IT. Why not?

Oh you can find how the Catholic Church played a role (but only in Poland) and how other groups did this and that, but the USG was a practical non-entity in promoting and agitating and financing opposition INSIDE THE USSR and Eastern Europe. I should know, I was one of those NOT on the govvie payroll providing support for dissidents in places like Latvia and Armenia, and I knew many others like me (including quite a few young American [non-emigre] idealists whose deeds may ultimately go largely unknown). There were networks of anti-Communist and nationalist resistance fighters that were not supported by the left-wing and anti-nationalist dominated foreign policy and intelligence bureaucracies in the USG (Liberal State and World Federalist CIA). Quick -- tell me who led the protests in Latvia in 1986. Who led the insurgencies in Armenia and Azerbaijan? Who led the protests that led to force being used in Tbilisi? Who led the ethnic Romanian organization in Moldova? Who financed it all? Not Uncle Sam. It all happened due to a thousand different groups both internal and external (from around the world) that had the courage to act where the US government did not (and because the USG was not involved most folks tend not to read or hear about their contributions unfortunately).

Why not? President George H. W. Bush revealed part of the reason in his infamous "Chicken Kiev" speech in 1991 in which he castigated "suicidal nationalism" -- "world order builders" and anti-nationalists in the president's Cabinet urged a policy of backing GORBACHEV! He was already history by that point, but it did not stop James 'Screw the Carter Doctrine' Baker, and his ilk from pushing the president to take the WRONG SIDE OF HISTORY. Worse, during the Reagan era, the CIA was penetrated to the hilt with social democratic and Liberal left-wing degenerates (Cord Meyer was a World Federalist and left a number of his new world order buddies in the DO, while the head of economic analysis now "comments" on left-wing Pacific Radio, no wonder they missed the barn by a mile when it came to estimating the %GDP spent on defense -- Akhromeyev said "25% maybe more," while the CIA and other suckers in the West were debating half that), you had Ames and Hansen destroying what feeble attempts there were to build military and political intelligence networks, and you also had the former DO trainee in Leningrad who was a turncoat, and of course you had intel flowing to Russia via other countries with penetrations.

Where was the effort to promote a political opposition inside the USSR, apart from some radio broadcasts? We were doing it in every place from Afghanistan to Angola, but there is very little evidence substantial support came from official and intelligence channels for political opposition groups inside the USSR, Romania, Bulgaria, etc. The fact was that while Reagan spread the message and did a fantastic job of taking the aggressive war option off the table for Gromyko, Chebrikov, etc., so that they had no option but to take a chance on Gorbo for an opportunity to acquire technology from the West, the USG was filled with people who had not caught up to Reagan and realized that the era of bi-polarism and "convergence" theory was OVER -- it was us or them, as the Soviet empire headed towards a crisis. Even the Soviet Politburo, post-Poland 1979-1981, understood that (according to memoirs). The only issue on the table was whether they would go down in flames and take us with them, or simply GIVE UP (on a regime that Lenin and Stalin said was premised on and held together only by "revolutionary terror") and implode.

Regan is famous for declaring his "we win, they lose" war aim, but the bureaucratic cowards in Washington reporting to him never advanced a doctrine of "ROLLBACK" that carried beyond the Third World into Eastern Europe and the Soviet empire. Understandably people were focused on containing expansion and promoting "freedom fighters," and they too were "catching up" to the emerging strategic realities, but there was a clear policy of limited engagement inside Eastern Europe and the Soviet empire. It was a monumental failure in strategy that worked out in the end only because the unexpected happened -- the Old Guard in power just couldn't pull the trigger any more, or when they did, as in Romania and during the coup in Russia (8/91), few followed orders. Heck, even one of the coup leaders in August 1991 chose to get drunk instead of finishing the job. Who would've thought? A great tragedy and collapse of Reagan’s strategy by cowardice in the USG and the White House was averted by…and you have to cringe at the irony – cowardice. Pure luck. We’ll all take it, but history should record how close we came to having a series of rolling military crises in Europe if the coup plotters had succeeded.

By the way, Gorbachev did not promote this outcome – he fought it every step of the way by promoting "reform" as an alternative to liberty, and was a fool by all accounts who kept talking until the last moment about preserving socialism and the Soviet empire. Gorbo is LAUGHING STOCK in Russia today on a par with Michael Dukakis here -- so why are there so many to praise this guy and give him a nice residence in the Presidio (San Fran)?

It was Gorbachev's stupidity and weakness, combined with a rising popular FAITH that the West finally "got it" -- that the Soviet Union was the world's largest prison of nations and a murderous " evil empire" that had to be EXTERMINATED for the betterment of mankind, which emboldened millions to TAKE A CHANCE and kick the edifice over. Where were the careerists in the CIA during these "world-historic" (to borrow the Soviet phrase) struggles in the Heartland of Eurasia? AWOL by and large! Just like they went AWOL in the war on Islamic terrorism in the 1990s.

To this extent, my critique is to illustrate how Reagan overcame bureaucratic and widespread TREASON (even in Congress, ranging from Senator Kennedy's attempt to make a "back channel" via a KGB officer to Congressman Lantos sucking up to Ceaucescu, according to someone who should know, our former ambassador there Mr. Funderburk who wrote about it in a book, which also went directly to the library shelves like Victory). Such readiness to accept that the Soviet Union was always going to be around, and worse, was so pervasive in Reagan's days that we can thank God that the Soviets went for reform instead of war. It also helps to dispel the myth that one man can't change the world -- Ronald Reagan did, against all obstacles, both foreign and domestic. Jesus Christ showed the world the light. Ronald Reagan literally saved the world.


28 posted on 06/10/2004 10:47:26 PM PDT by CaptIsaacDavis (.)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Same article here.
32 posted on 06/10/2004 11:02:54 PM PDT by Torie
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