Posted on 07/10/2004 1:49:22 AM PDT by thoughtomator
How right you are, apart from politics, terrorism and national security are paramount and should be the kernel of governance.
Instead the Republicans forced the vote before it was ripe and succeeded in losing the issue as well as the vote. McCain and the other RINOs have given Daschle and Kerry cover to dodge a wedge issue. Brilliant. All those on these threads who thought the election would turn as the vast heartland rose up in indignation about this issue are simply wrong. The issue is lost for effective purposes.
I am not sure that the Wilson story of deceit will have much resonance with the mushy middle because it does not affect their lives. They affect a cynicism to mask their ignorance of current affairs. They do not know the facts of the Wilson matter, nor do they care but they do not want to be exposed as ignorant of something important so they say a pox on politicians, you are all corrupt. To get past this defensive screen of indifference is very difficult especially in the face of media bias. To use the Wilson story under these circumstances, a full court press must be exerted and the media must be humiliated into covering it. You can only go into full attack mode on a few issues, is this one of them?
The economy does affect the lives of the mushy middle which decides elections and that brings us back to jobs. On this issue Bush must prevail if he is to carry Ohio and not lose the election. So far the administration has not presented a good case well. I have said we have a good story to tell but we cannot tell a story good. Here is where the election can turn but the triumph of tax cut economics has simply not been trumpeted. Bush's father lost in '92 because the electorate thought the economy was in recession when it had recovered but jobs, always a lagging indicator, had not fully recovered, The media took up Clinton's cause and led the evening news with man on the street examples of families ruined for want of work. Bush Sr, never effectively countered. Those of us who are pessimistic about this election see a similar pattern in this and other issues.
The gay marriage vote has shown that Bush cannot rely on the Senators of his own party. The 9/11 Commission has revealed that he cannot rely on apparachiks in his own party. The Senate Intelligence Committee report has revealed that he cannot rely on his own senators again. This is a lesson Trent Lott could have told him about. Or Newt.
I beg your pardon? Your one posting here has more insults than any I have made. I haven't called anyone a bore or a boor (or even a boar - the male chauvinist kind), I haven't accused them of being lonely and having alterior motives, I haven't called them "poor dear", I haven't said they have a disease (ouch!, I feel a headache coming on).
Are these the kinds of comments that passes for rational discourse in your "set"? It sounds more like venom, devoid of any substantive point, ejected more to inflame than to promote rational deliberation.
It also seems like the final sputterings of a frustrated debater, one whose tank has run dry of logic and had to fall back into vituperation and shrillness. Are you saying in the end this is all one can expect of a "live poster"?
Not only are you and I in a dead end thread, a thread that was not about live events to start with, but until piasa offered some calming words I thought we were probably the only ones reading this.
I do not plan to buy into cable or satellite, unless you wish to send money. You will be happy to hear that I do, my dear, have a TV, two in fact. Both used mostly for playing video tapes - you know, all the favorites like John Wayne, Clint Eastwood, Randolph Scott, Audie Murphy, or "Have Gun, Will Travel", and "Avengers", and "Inspector Morse" and "Sherlock Holmes" episodes, war movies, Biblical and Roman epics, that sort of thing. And Xavier basketball in the NCAA playoffs, and the occasional football game. Now surely that list can inspire some more spit and dribble.
You can beg,but it's still no pardons. LOL
JUNE 27, 2004 : (APPROXIMATE 1,100 TONNE DISCREPENCY BETWEEN LIBYA'S URANIUM STASH AND THE RECORDS OF ITS MAIN SUPPLIER, NIGER, ON URANIUM TRADE, ACCORDING TO IAEA ) This may have been the method being used by Libya before it agreed last December to abandon its secret nuclear programme. According to the IAEA, there are 2,600 tonnes of refined uranium ore - "yellow cake" - in Libya. However, less than 1,500 tonnes of it is accounted for in Niger records, even though Niger was Libya's main supplier. -- "Evidence of Niger uranium trade 'years before war'," by Mark Huband, FT, (Financial Times UK), Published: 06/27/04, Last Updated: June 27 2004 21:56, http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1087373295039&p=1012571727085
Actually I'm more partial to beer, it can be used in many situations. As to re-reading this thread, I find that experience in my case more deserving of a celebratory use of beer than otherwise. You might want to stick with the towel.
You can beg,but it's still no pardons
This seems to belie a difficulty with polite (dare I say gentlemanly) discourse, a difficulty which is apparent from your posts. So does the "nopardons" handle mean you tend to lean away from good manners and calm reason?
I am calm,I am civil,but I can't be "gentlemanly",as I am a LADY. Howsoever,if you are a male,you have not been "gentlemanly" and if a female,you've been most unladylike.:^)
Watered down beer!!?? None of that metro-sexual ladylike stuff for me, give me Guiness, or most good little village home brew German beers. When there's big time celebrating to be done, only the best will do. Iron shots are all right too.
As for your feelings being hurt, then keep your hands out of the fire. There is always the memorable words of Rhett Butler - FMDIDGAD
My "feelings" are far from hurt,but you seem to be awfully lonesome...go find someone to talk to,who cares. ;^)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1173794/posts
"The Wilson-Plame Affair (Cont'd)"
Washington Post ^ | July 18, 2004 | Michael Getler
Posted on 07/18/2004 1:54:31 PM PDT by NavySEAL F-16
Thanks for the ping and link.:-)
He is the one who outed himself--
I've often wondered if Wilson himself was responsible for the "leak", just to divert attention from the real issue at hand. I wouldn't put anything past these power-hungry neo-crats.
"On the guest list of the 1999 state dinner hosted by President Clinton for President Jerry Rawlings of Ghana,was Valerie Wilson, the wife of Joseph C. Wilson IV, Clinton's top White House Africa analyst from 1997 to 1998.
Thanks so much for the ping. There is a lot of good stuff here.
If you have a chance, I would love to see if you have anything on the question I posed in post #41 on the other thread:
When And Why Joseph C Wilson IV Outed Valerie Plame
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1802289/posts?page=40
BUMP!!
Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS), formed in January 2003 "to speak out on the use of intelligence to justify the war,"
VIPS Steering Group
* Kathleen McGrath Christison, Santa Fe, NM
* William Christison, Santa Fe, NM
* David MacMichael, Linden, VA
* Raymond McGovern, Arlington, VA
* Richard Beske, San Diego, CA
* Patrick G. Eddington, Alexandria, VA
Other Alleged VIPS Members
* Eugene Betit[4]
* Ray Close[5]
* Larry Johnson[6]
# 19 May 2003: VIPS Letter sent via fax to Kofi Annan, Secretary General of the United Nations: "We Are Perplexed at the US Refusal to Permit the Return of UN Inspectors to Iraq" (published in Dissident Voice, May 21, 2003).
# 25 May 2003: VIPS: Opinion: "U.N. needs inspectors to return to Iraq", Birmingham News.
# 14 July 2003: "Cheney Must Go", an open letter to Pres. Bush published by Salon.com.
******
March 10, 2004
We established our group, Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, in January of last year. Before that several of us had been writing op-eds, and we had been giving each other sanity checks, because the conclusions we were coming up with were pretty far out -- that the President and the Secretary of State were lying through their teeth.
RM: Exactly, and from virtually all the agencies, not just CIA. We're hearing from some very distinguished operations officers, and from the FBI, Defense Intelligence, from the NSA, Army Intelligence, and from the State Department.
not getting their point, nor any of these hindsight critics.
Both the executive branch and Democrats in the senate request an NIE from Tenet, prior to the JR vote. despite claims of minimized dissent in unclassified versions, it key judgements were clear. It’s preposterous to expect lawmakers to discard 90 pages of a report, and its ultimate conclusions, and latch onto a minority dissent paragraph on a minor issue on page 58.
Due to the intelligence reform act of 1980 neither branch could have undue influence on the content of that NIE, as each pout in a request and they have by law independent conduits for intelligence finished products-and cannot view raw intel.
The use of this war to forward democrats agenda makes me want to puke. On a war critic. Sure it’s been ugly. People got hurt. Died. More so because some told Iraq’s insurgents the soldiers were there on lies.
Joe Wilson was the single bridge from bad intel to just plain lies, and it’s obvious he did it for a career change. From civil servant to politician. Young men and women died for his treachery, and Kerry’s.
Of course Bush was litle better, he allowed it and the “finding WMD is everything” whiners to cast aspersion on the whole mission.
He had to. Dems demanded a wholesale pullout in early summer ‘03. Remember “we’re not occupiers, give them back their soveriegnty!”
Uh-huh. With Saddam loose and France, China and Russia eager to reinstate drilling contracts, and us needing a shooting gallery for Al Qaeda?
Make us look feeble, hapless, “we’re only staying as long as they NEED us to!”
I remember them saying we were unable to keep the IED’s off of a 5 mile stretch of the Baghdad highway- most important blacktop in the country, green zone to Saddam int’l. I knew the whole thing was sandbagged from that day on. My ass, we had UAV’s in the air 7/24 overhead, if a gopher pops his head up we knew about it. Let alone some 15 yo boy buggering Iraqi dirtbag digging a hole and burying a bomb.
The world would never let us sit on top of all that oil after such an ass kicking on Saddam. However, look feeble, inept, like we were too hapless to do any better, and even America is the victim, lied to by Bush who goes home in 2009.
Masterful. I think it’s obvious Dems tried to tank the war for a platform in 2004. Question is, was Bush in full cooperation? We’ll never know, he told woodward. It goes from God, to George, to Bob, to us. Dick’s in there somewhere.
Everyone knows all this now, right?
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