The Evidence Is Clear: President Bush Is Blocking Assault Weapons Renewal, Says Brady Campaign

U.S. Newswire ^ | 7/22/2004

[Mr. Mojo]

WASHINGTON, July 22 /U.S. Newswire/ -- There are only six days left when Congress is in session before the expiration of the Assault Weapons Ban -- a law that President Bush pledged he'd renew as a candidate for President in 2000. "It makes no sense for assault weapons to be around our society," he said then. And another Republican leader made statements this week indicating the President can get a vote by simply asking for one.

"President Bush is blocking a vote on the Assault Weapons Ban," said Michael Barnes, President of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence united with the Million Mom March.

Here's a brief review of published comments since May. First, on May 12, The Hill newspaper wrote "an aide to House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) has said privately that if Bush pushes for it, the ban will probably be reauthorized. But if he doesn't, the chances of legislation's passing this year are remote."

Then, on June 24, the Boston Globe reported "Ken Lisaius, a White House spokesman, said Bush still supports the ban, but is waiting for the House to act."

Then, on July 11, the Washington Post reported the House Majority Leader Tom Delay said "we stated our position before the White House had to ask us... (the White House) knew not to (ask,) because the votes are not there."

Now, following a news conference held by Representatives Michael Castle (R-DE) and Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY), Delay told the daily newsletter Congressional Quarterly "there's no reason to use floor time for a vote just to have a vote on this particular subject," he said. "And unless directed otherwise, I see no reason to bring it to the floor."

The Assault Weapons Ban has enormous public support across the nation. A poll released last week by Penn, Schoen & Berland showed 66 percent of Republicans, 75 percent of Democrats and 79 percent of independents supported renewal.

The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence united with the Million Mom March is planning a growing effort to save the law, with television and print advertising, phone banks, grassroots lobbying efforts across the nation throughout August, culminating in the first week in September.

[Mr. Mojo]

Bang!

[steplock]

The Prez is blocking illegal laws? Sounds good to me.

[1066AD]

Deserves to die. Utterly stupid law, cosmetic appeal (to some) only.

[Redcoat LI]

I read the entire article,and I still do not understand how the Prez. is "blocking" the vote.

I think U.S Newswires could have chosen a more accurate title.

[Southack]

This has got to go down in history as the worst political strategy in American elections...to try to blame Bush, who said he would sign an extention of the AWB, for not getting the votes needed in Congress.

So they are blaming a guy who would sign their bill, and they are bringing up a topic that costs the Dems votes every year, and they've only got 6 legislative sessions left (meaning, they've already lost because a simple filibuster or committee conference deep sixes this puppy now).

Frankly, Bush has beaten the Left hard over this issue by simply forcing Congress to take a stand.

It's a thing of beauty. This will be the SECOND repeal of federal gun control under President Bush (arming pilots was already the first gun control repeal in federal history).

And the 3rd repeal of federal gun control is on deck for tomorrow: the repeal of prohibitions against off-duty cops carrying firearms state to state nationally.

We're looking at 3 federal repeals of gun control under President Bush's first Administration!

Bit by bit we are erasing the nonsense of the 1960's on.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[kcvl]

Good.

As the Hollywood liberals would say, we southern conservative christians only think about Guns, God, Gays, Abortion and a new one OIL.

[krb]

Good!

[ebiskit]

"It makes no sense for assault weapons to be around our society,"

They make sense when you have TERRORISTS in the country. As well as when liberals/marxists are in DC.

Oh please Mr. Terrorist, please don't hurt me.

peace....D

[Dan from Michigan]

Time to call Mike Rogers office and Tom Delay's office to make sure this dies.

[Sofa King]

Misleading headlines are a prime outlet for media bias.

[Itzlzha]

"President Bush is blocking a vote on the Assault Weapons Ban," said Michael Barnes, President of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence united with the Million Mom March.

Here, let me give you a reply that should make you swoon...all warm & fuzzy-like...

"Better put some ICE on that!"

[Jet Jaguar]

He had better let it sunset. Nuff said.

[coconutt2000]

It looks like if it passes the Congress... The President will sign it.

Looks to me like the President isn't the one blocking it. Claiming that the President has the power to push legislation through proves a lack of knowledge about our government. If it was true that Bush could command the Republican votes in the House and Senate, then the Marriage Amendment would not have had any dissenting Republican votes.

The fact of the matter is, this is an attempt to make the President look like he is reneging, when in fact he is not. He is powerless to change the votes in the Congress. What's left is for voters to decide if this is a deal breaker issue when considering who to elect to Congress this November.

Yeah.

[Southack]

"Time to call Mike Rogers office and Tom Delay's office to make sure this dies."

Not even on the list. Tomorrow is the last day before Congress goes on their Summer vacation (through September 6), and the vote scheduled for tomorrow is on the *REPEAL* of the federal prohibition (de facto) of off-duty cops carrying firearms state to state.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[flashbunny]

"It's a thing of beauty. This will be the SECOND repeal of federal gun control under President Bush (arming pilots was already the first gun control repeal in federal history)."

The armed pilot law is a sham. They've made it so difficult for pilots to qualify and carry that they might as well hand out squirt guns.

[Redcoat LI]

Misleading headlines are a prime outlet for media bias.

I guess "Bush wants you,your family and your pets gunned down by AK-47's" was taken.

[NRA2BFree]

Even though he said he would sign it if it crossed his desk, they still blame President Bush. It's going to get ugly in August when the anti-gunners start their massive ad campaign against the sunset.

[Southack]

"The armed pilot law is a sham. They've made it so difficult for pilots to qualify and carry that they might as well hand out squirt guns."

Nonsense. More than 1,000 pilots are already armed, with some 3,000 more finishing up their training right now.

That severely reduces the number of flights without either an armed Marshall or pilot, and is hardly a sham.

Moreover, that's the first *ever* repeal of federal gun control. You've got to start somewhere.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[AF68]

U.S Newswires and PR Newswire are nothing but the vanity press. For a fee, special interest groups write their own copy and submit articles promoting their own agendas. It's like Al Franken paying pissant radio stations to broadcast his dreck.

[Dan from Michigan]

Considering how quick Granholm ran away from her Million Mom past(even to the point of signing 3 pro-gun bills - one being a dove bill).....

The smartest thing the dems can do is to let this die. The smartest thing John Kerry could have done(hate to say it) is to miss those gun votes this year.

Neither happnened - two strikes.

[oyez]

A lot of this is due to a narcissistic president who wanted to show his *ss off in an open limo.

[spokeshave]

Note to self....an AK47 and one of those Israeli squirt gun thingies

[Dan from Michigan]

It's going to get ugly in August when the anti-gunners start their massive ad campaign against the sunset.

I'll just counter by exposing their .30-30 ban. Maybe the hunters who aren't pro-2a advocates will wake up and learn that they want to take Grandpa's lever action away - or at least the ammo.

[Southack]

There's something else in play here, too.

The anti-gunners swore that every state that passed CCW laws would "see blood in the streets" from new so-called "gun crimes."

Didn't happen (44 states or so now have CCW, too).

Then the anti-gunners claimed the same nonsense about arming pilots.

Didn't happen.

Now they're saying the same thing about the expiration of the AWB.

Won't happen.

Moreover, we can show time after time that crime and violence either go down or remain the same after each of these pro-gun victories.

In contrast, they can't show squat to support their side.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[fourdeuce82d]

Okay....(flame suit- ON.Deflector Shields- Up) I'm going to stick it in the blender.

I don't think GWB should fight for the sunset of this bill. I think he should fight against the Increased restrictions I've heard about...but mostly I want him to win.

Bad law, stupid law, unconstitutional law- but it will be much, much worse if he loses.

I think this election will set the course of our country for many years to come- if nothing else, we've got a whole bunch of bench positions to fill. If we get them, that will be one thing.

If "those people" get them...it will be another.

I've got a post-ban AR & ten 30 rounders to go along with it, I've got a glock with four "hi-cap" mags, etc.

I can pretty much buy what I want to buy. I don't want to hear a knock on my door because JFK's justice departmen comes calling.

Let the heaping of contumely begin....

[flashbunny]

you may want to do a little research before you claim something. 1% is something to celebrate? And how are 3,000 'finishing up' their training if there is one out of the way training facility that only trains 48 students at a time??? Are there 60 seperate training classes that are all done and they're just waiting for their diplomas to dry???

Here are some of the facts:

Senators say US slow to arm pilots:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/functions/print.php?StoryID=20040407-111335-1734r

"Only 2 percent of 100,000 eligible pilots have been trained to carry guns. They are then forced to carry the weapons in a lockbox, unless they are behind a locked cabin door, and are forbidden from carrying weapons on international flights -- rules pilots have said undermine the program"

Rejected for guns, pilots criticize test

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20040204-100150-3132r.htm

" Pilots already trained to carry guns and operate sophisticated weapons systems are among 100 applicants rejected from a federal program to arm flight-deck officers to protect aircraft from terrorist attacks.
Former police officers, firearms instructors and military pilots have filed written complaints with the Federal Flight Deck Officers (FFDO) program questioning its psychological- and background-test system, as well as its generic rejection letter that doesn't explain an applicant's purported shortcomings. "

KEEPING PILOTS UNARMED

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1066671/posts

"Simply put, the TSA's intimidating background screenings, which involve intrusive psychological tests; its threats of sharing its opinion of the pilot's psychological fitness with the FAA and the pilot's employer; its refusal to issue standard federal credentials to FFDO graduates; its ridiculous requirement that the firearm be carried in a lockbox onto the airplane, instead of on the FFDO's person; its use of only one distant training facility; its instructions to Federal Air Marshals to police the FFDO's; and its arbitrary and unnecessary disqualifications of FFDO candidates, have combined to discourage most of those pilots who would have otherwise volunteered.(3) "

The facts don't back up your rosy outlook on the current armed pilots situation. It IS a sham. 1000 or so armed pilots out of 100,000 - almost 3 years after september 11th??!?!? The process and the rules make getting qualified and stayhing armed as difficult as possible. Thanks to norm mineta and the TSA.

And bush, their boss, does nothing about it. It's shameful.

[Southack]

"The process and the rules make getting qualified and stayhing armed as difficult as possible. Thanks to norm mineta and the TSA. And bush, their boss, does nothing about it. It's shameful."

You know not of which you speak. President Bush has already fired someone over the delays.

Loy, the former Coast Guard commandant, was named to replace Transportation Security Administration chief John Magaw, whom Secretary Norm Mineta fired last week for failing to implement Bush's law arming pilots

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[Deb]

Yeah, you Lefties...spend that money, burn up those tennies. It's DEAD!!

[Richard Kimball]

That's MY President!

[Southack]

"The facts don't back up your rosy outlook on the current armed pilots situation. It IS a sham. 1000 or so armed pilots out of 100,000..."

More than one thousand armed pilots is no "sham."

Yes, everyone wants there to be 100,000 armed pilots, but simply because our fondest dreams haven't happened overnight is no reason to pretend that arming 1,000 pilots is a sham. 1,000+ armed pilots is a real achievement.

That's the *first* ever repeal of any federal gun control law, ever.

The very first. Yet you paint it as a defeat instead of as a victory by setting your standards so high that no one could ever reach them.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[Deb]

First Barbara Boxer and Dianne Feinstein tried to bully him into expanding the ban by ambushing him at news conferences and Senate meetings. He said, "Nope".

Now he's letting it die in the House and they're losing the whole thing. This is too good.

[flashbunny]

Sorry, the link you gave is two years old.

Two years. Two years and they have trained 1000 out of 100,000 pilots. You call 1% a success? Do you call rules so strict that it makes being armed a hassle and almost useless (to the point that they're NOT armed and the rules leave 'armed' pilots vulnerable) a success???

Do you think allowing a cabinet member and those under him to undermine a necessary law for TWO WHOLE YEARS before actually doing something about it is a great success?????

Seems you have rather low expectations.

[MediaMole]

Good.

[Southack]

"Now he's letting it die in the House and they're losing the whole thing. This is too good."

They didn't even get it through the Senate, much less past DeLay in the House.

Tomorrow is the vote on what will become the 3rd federal repeal of gun control; quite a contrast from a vote on extending the old AWB!

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[Deb]

Where are all those jerks who puked up every gun thread claiming he intended to sign it and they were taking their vote elsewhere? Where are they? Oh, that's right...they're screaming in a hole somewhere at Liberty Post.

[Southack]

"Sorry, the link you gave is two years old. Two years. Two years and they have trained 1000 out of 100,000 pilots. You call 1% a success? Do you call rules so strict that it makes being armed a hassle and almost useless (to the point that they're NOT armed and the rules leave 'armed' pilots vulnerable) a success???"

You made a wild-eyed claim. Your claim was wrong. You claimed that Bush had done *nothing* about Mineta's delays.

My link shows that Bush made Mineta *FIRE* his #2 guy; after which, the DOT immediately changed policy from "no guns" to "arm pilots per the law."

Yet you won't give up. Forget that you've just been debunked, with a source link...oh no, you bash the link for being too old! Oh yeah, like that diminishes the fact that you are talking out of your a$$!

And yes, arming pilots is a success. We've got more than a 1,000+ armed pilots flying in our cockpits today, we're training 3,000 more who are currently enrolled in the program, and we've gotten the first ever repeal of federal gun control laws passed.

Yes, those are pleasant successes...yet you want to shout your defeatisim from the rooftops as if we somehow lost all of these fights.

Sheesh...

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[flashbunny]

"More than one thousand armed pilots is no "sham.""

It is when it's taken 2 years.

It is when the only place you can get training from the TSA is a small town 160 miles by car from lubbock, TX.

It is when they train a mere 48 pilots at a time.

It is when they reject qualified pilots - some of whom also pilot miltary aircraft with enough firepower to wipe out a small town - on the basis that they can't be trusted in the cockpit with a gun.

Did you actually read the articles I linked to? Do you know the roadblocks that have been put up to prevent pilots from getting approved to carry - and also from actually being 'armed' while in flight???

1000 pilots after two years is pitiful.

---

"That's the *first* ever repeal of any federal gun control law, ever."

Gee, you're wrong again. How surprising. Yet again, try a little research. The 1986 GOPA repealed many earlier gun laws.

---

"you paint it as a defeat instead of as a victory by setting your standards so high that no one could ever reach them. "

You set your standards so low you'd probably be thrilled if 100 pilots were armed.

Listen, it's great they 'allowed' pilots to be armed. Whoopee. A law was passed. But very little was actually DONE once it was passed. There has been roadblock after roadblock put in place to arming pilots, and bush has waited 2 years to do something about it. That's pitiful as well.

You seem to be adopting the liberal mindset in defense of this: "Who cares what is actually accomplished, as long as our intentions are in the right place and we pass a law for it!"

If a group of terrorists rush the cockpit, the fact that a law was repealed means very little. What matters the most is how likely it is that there will be an armed pilot inside. After two years, the likelyhood of that happening is one percent.

One percent.

After two years.

By any measure but your own, that would indicate to everyone that the armed pilot program is a failure..

[Southack]

"Gee, you're wrong again. How surprising. Yet again, try a little research. The 1986 GOPA repealed many earlier gun laws."

GOPA '86 is a *repeal* of gun control in your world?!

The Devil's in the Details...Know the Law!

The Gun Owners Protection Act of 1986 (GOPA 86): A somewhat vague statement was added to this bill that has been interpreted by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (BATF) and some Federal Courts to mean no machine guns registered after enactment (May 19, 1986) can be built and sold to private individuals. BATF further concluded that SOT payers cannot receive "post-May" guns without first presenting a letter from a qualifying government agency that has requested to see the firearm. These rulings do not apply to other types of NFA firearms. Transfers to government agencies having law enforcement or military functions are allowed. SOT payers who are also licensed as manufacturers are allowed to produce machine guns from scratch, from kits, or by means of conversion. They cannot transfer them to private individuals. They can be transferred to other SOT payers or government agencies only as described above. Post-May guns cannot be retained by a SOT payer who fails to renew his SOT annually.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[ladyinred]

Oh HORRORS! LOL

[flashbunny]

"Yet you won't give up. Forget that you've just been debunked, with a source link...oh no, you bash the link for being too old! Oh yeah, like that diminishes the fact that you are talking out of your a$$!"

Hey genius, you may want to check the story in the link you posted.

You know why I attacked it for being two years old?

Because the senate hadn't passed the bill yet.

And bush couldn't have fired someone for getting in the way of arming pilots BECAUSE THERE WAS NO ARMED PILOTS LAW YET!!! BUT THAT'S WHAT YOU QUOTED IN THE LINK.

DUHHH!!!

Let me state this again in case it's not clear:

You posted a quote with a hyperlink.

The quote wasn't in that article.

The article pertained to the debate on armed pilots because at the time the article was written, the law wasn't passed.

Since the law wasn't passed at the time that article was written, the link had nothing to do with your claim that bush had fired someone for impeding the arming of pilots. Because again, there was no law for that person to be impeding.

Got it???

---

"You made a wild-eyed claim. Your claim was wrong. You claimed that Bush had done *nothing* about Mineta's delays."

No, I claimed that bush did nothing for 2 years. That isn't wild eyed. That's the truth. Although it may technically be less then two years by a number of days, but I can't tell, because you never linked to the story you quoted.
-----

"And yes, arming pilots is a success. We've got more than a 1,000+ armed pilots flying in our cockpits today, we're training 3,000 more who are currently enrolled in the program, and we've gotten the first ever repeal of federal gun control laws passed."

Yeah. Before you said - here, let me get the exact quote: "with some 3,000 more finishing up their training right now."

Which I proved to be ridiculous. Do you still stand by that wild-eyed claim? 3,000 just finishing up. Class size is 48. Classes are held weekly. 3,000 divided by 48 is 62.5.

We have 62.5 classes full of students 'finishing up' right now? If they're 'finishing up', why is a class from 62 weeks ago not allowed to carry guns yet?

Or is just that maybe you were the one, as you so cleverly put it, "talking out your a$$"???

---

"we've gotten the first ever repeal of federal gun control laws passed."

Once again, since you repeated this lie, I must direct you to your ignorance of the 1986 GOPA act, which repealed many aspects of federal firearms law, ranging from interstate transportation of firearms (safe passage) to ammunition purchases (no signature required) to easing hassles on FFL dealers.

----

"Yes, those are pleasant successes...yet you want to shout your defeatisim from the rooftops as if we somehow lost all of these fights."

You seem to want to interpret into my comments what you want to see. And you also want to see what is there.

They repealed the law against armed pilots. Yay. But we have a meager 1% of pilots armed after 2 years. And the links, which you have apparently ignored because they disrupt your strange reality, back up my claims 100% that the process is horribly titled against arming pilots.

Sorry for crashing your uptopian view of the armed pilots law with a dose of fact based and provable reality.

[flashbunny]

"GOPA '86 is a *repeal* of gun control in your world?!

The Devil's in the Details...Know the Law!"

Gee, I do know the law...since I've been running a website focusing mainly on the 2nd amendment for the past several years. It sort of comes with the territory.

And it's funny how you accuse me of 'focusing on the negative' and yet when it comes to your turn with the GOPA, the only thing you post about is the machine gun portion.

The facts of the law, if you actually know anything about it, is that the machine gun ban was part of a compromise with a republican controlled congress to repeal (yes, REPEAL) portions of previous laws that were causing serious harm to FFL's and gunowners.

So, contrary to your claims, and proving mine, the armed pilot bill is not the 'first repeal of federal firearms law ever'.

You don't know what you're talking about at all.

[Southack]

"And bush couldn't have fired someone for getting in the way of arming pilots BECAUSE THERE WAS NO ARMED PILOTS LAW YET!!! BUT THAT'S WHAT YOU QUOTED IN THE LINK."

Once again, you are incorrect. President Bush signed *TWO* bills into law arming pilots. The one prior to that article was the same bill that nationalized all airport security workers.

You really do talk too much for someone who knows so little though, I will say that much about you.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[Southack]

"The facts of the law, if you actually know anything about it, is that the machine gun ban was part of a compromise with a republican controlled congress to repeal (yes, REPEAL) portions of previous laws that were causing serious harm to FFL's and gunowners."

Nonsense. GOPA '86 banned new machine guns for private citizens.

That ain't no repeal of federal gun control, kid.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[flashbunny]

"Nonsense. GOPA '86 banned new machine guns for private citizens."

I didn't say that it didn't do that.

You said the armed pilots law was the first time federal gun control had been repealed.

It wasn't.

You are ignoring the part the proves you wrong just because it's incovenient for you.

Getting back to your pie in the sky world, let's summarize:

1% of pilots armed after two years: Dismal failure.

Your claim of 3,000 trained pilots "just finishing up": Utter BS.

But I haven't seen you adress that claim again. Gee, I wonder why.

[Advil]

Yes, I do call it a success. A rousing one? A huge one? NO! But unlike 2 years ago we have the law on the books. Now we can slowly start expanding the rights again.

It's taken many decades to get to where we are. It MIGHT takes many decades to undo all the mess. But until you are willing to accept a small victory as a VICTORY we're never going to win the war.

Did I say it's good enough? NO! But getting pilots armed, ANY PILOTS, is still a success by itself.

[Southack]

"I didn't say that it didn't do that. You said the armed pilots law was the first time federal gun control had been repealed. It wasn't. You are ignoring the part the proves you wrong just because it's incovenient for you."

I'm ignoring nothing. It's you who have failed to post what specific magic *federal* gun control was somehow "repealed" in the GOPA '86 Act that banned new machine guns from civilians.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[Southack]

"Your claim of 3,000 trained pilots "just finishing up": Utter BS. But I haven't seen you adress that claim again. Gee, I wonder why."

TSA spokeswoman Amy Von Walter said her office could not release exact numbers of applicants or trainees because of security considerations, "but I can tell you that thousands of pilots have applied for the program. Thousands of pilots have already been trained. ... The agency expects to train every pilot who has applied for the program by Oct. 1, the beginning of the next budget year, she said."

Oh, and that article from back in April claims that 2%, i.e. some 2,000+ pilots were already armed by that point, a figure much higher than my old stat of 1,000+ armed already.

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires

[flashbunny]

"I'm ignoring nothing. It's you who have failed to post what specific magic *federal* gun control was somehow "repealed" in the GOPA '86 Act that banned new machine guns from civilians."

For a person who isn't ignoring something, you're sure doing a good job of not responding to the debunking of your ludicrous claim that 3,000 pilots were 'just finishing up' their training.

[Southack]

"For a person who isn't ignoring something, you're sure doing a good job of not responding to the debunking of your ludicrous claim that 3,000 pilots were 'just finishing up' their training."

Uh, just read post #48.

Sheesh...

6 Legislative Days Left Until The AWB Expires