Posted on 08/13/2004 5:50:02 PM PDT by sinkspur
Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, head of the Vatican’s doctrinal agency, has come out against Turkey’s candidacy to join the European Union.
In an interview with the French publication Le Figaro, Ratzinger said that Turkey has always been “in permanent contrast to Europe,” and that it should look instead to play a leadership role in a network of Islamic states.
“In the course of history, Turkey has always represented a different continent,” Ratzinger said, giving as an example the Ottoman Empire, which once invaded Europe as far as Vienna.
“Making the two continents identical would be a mistake,” he said. “It would mean a loss of richness, the disappearance of the cultural to the benefit of economics.”
Ratzinger comes from Germany, where Turks make up the most numerous component of a growing Islamic minority. He said Turkey “could try to set up a cultural continent with neighboring Arab countries and become the leading figure of a culture with its own identity.”
The comments echo those of then-Archbishop Jean-Louis Tauran, at the time the Vatican’s foreign minister, in a May 2003 interview with Corriere della Sera.
Tauran said that in the current European Union, “All the countries share the same patrimony of values that are dear to Europe.” Rather than adding Turkey, he suggested that it might be “more opportune” to consider membership for Ukraine and Moldavia, two countries with an Orthodox Christian heritage.
It should be noted, however, that neither Ratzinger nor Tauran expressed the Holy See’s official position. When diplomats put the question to senior Vatican officials in the Secretariat of State, they are always told that the Holy See is “not necessarily opposed” to Turkey joining the EU. The two caveats usually mentioned are: the need for guarantees of religious liberty, including the country’s Christian minority; and the need for Europe to formally acknowledge its Christian roots.
Within broader circles of Catholic opinion, the pro-Turkey argument usually is that Turkey, where secularism is enshrined by law and policed vigilantly by the military, is the last, best chance for the emergence of a moderate Islam. There are powerful national movements, sometimes numbering in the millions, of faithful Muslims interested in reconciling Islamic values with modernity. (One example would be Fethullah Gulen and the “Turkish Islam” movement). The West, according to this view, should be doing everything in its power to ensure that the Turkish experiment does not fail.
The other view holds that Europe is already fatally confused about what it represents, and adding a nation with a scant five percent of its land mass in Europe, which represents a different cultural, historical and religious tradition, would simply add to the fog. If Turkey joins, why not Israel, as has sometimes been suggested? Why not any of a number of African nations? The urgent European project, according to this line of reasoning, is not willy-nilly expansion, but the recovery of a sense of what Europe stands for – what do Europeans believe? What are the values for which, if necessary, they would be willing to lay down their lives?
At a practical policy level, the prospect of Turkish membership poses several challenges:
Turkey’s population is already 71 million and is disproportionately young. By 2025, it would surpass Germany as the largest single member-state in the EU. How could the union admit Turkey, under its current rules, without Turkey becoming the 800-pound gorilla in the room?
Can the totalitarian style of rule to which Turks are accustomed really be tweaked sufficiently to bring it into compliance with the “Copenhagen criteria” on human rights and religious freedom, without letting loose the contagion of Islamic fundamentalism?
Would adding Turkey to the EU exacerbate the immigration problem that many European nations already perceive? Under EU rules, a migrant who reaches Turkey would theoretically be entitled to move freely practically anywhere in Europe.
Obviously, these are complicated questions that require some political heavy lifting. The EU is scheduled to decide in December if Turkey should become a formal candidate for membership, and certainly the Vatican will be watching. Comparing Ratzinger’s interview with what one hears from the Secretariat of State, however, it seems less clear what the Vatican will be saying.
Will there be an outburst from Jacques Chirac?
The debate over Israeli membership would be lively, to say the least.
Why not any of a number of African nations? The urgent European project, according to this line of reasoning, is not willy-nilly expansion, but the recovery of a sense of what Europe stands for – what do Europeans believe? What are the values for which, if necessary, they would be willing to lay down their lives?
Well, that leaves the French out of the discussion. And allowing more Turks, etc. to immigrate freely is insane given Europe's much lower birth rate. It's Europe's call, and it will be interesting to see how much further they will walk out on that plank.
One could do worse than stating the obvious. If EU wants to protect its civilizational identity (per Huntington's thesis), then admitting "Ukraine and Moldavia, two countries with an Orthodox Christian heritage" would be just as bad - they are members of different civilizational tradition.
I wouldn't say just as bad, because the Ukrainians and Moldavians aren't world reknown for their mad bombers. And after all, they are Christian although that could possibly be obnoxious to a post-Christian Europe. After trying to commit suicide twice in the twentieth century, Europe may be trying again in a different way.
According to the CIA World Fact book
The TFR of Turkey is 1.98
We did. He posted the article.
LOL!!
I'm not sure where I stand on this issue.
Perhaps Turkey should be admitted with conditions that it continue to control the radical Islamist elements in it.
Perhaps the degenerate, cojoneless, Godless Europeans can learn something from the Turks.
An economically strong Democratic, secular Turkey is a bulwark against fundamentalist Islamists.
Will the Cardinal be told to "butt out" by the ultra secular, faith supressing pro socialist, anti catholic European elite or will they simply nod in agreement that an Islamic country does not share the deep rooted judeo-christian heritage that makes up the very fabric of Europe? Is Europe beginning to realize that in order to protect and defend what it is to be European (Judeo/Christian ideals), they risk the Islamization through this Trojan horse called Turkey?
Est pop of Turkey 2050: 150m
Est pop of Germany 2050 65m
Est pop of USA in 2050 450m
Est pop of Europe 500m
If Turkey is accepted into Europe, it would be the largest country! I don't think the Germans or French would take that very well.
"One could do worse than stating the obvious. If EU wants to protect its civilizational identity (per Huntington's thesis), then admitting "Ukraine and Moldavia, two countries with an Orthodox Christian heritage" would be just as bad - they are members of different civilizational tradition."
Per Huntington's thesis Orthodox civililation could merge into the West.He said Russia is a "cleft" country that has one foot in the West and another in the Orthodox traditon.Russia could one day join the West .The result would be Orthodox civilization collapses into the West.He said it is not impossible that Latin America could join the West in the future and unite Christendom. Orthodox Christians are still Christians and a far cry from Muslims.
"The result would be Orthodox civilization collapses into the West."
Well, let them collapse first. I have been born and lived for 26 yrs in Moscow, Russia - and it is not a good place (judging by way of life practiced there), let me tell you.
The Turks left our 4th. Infrantry Division floating around in the Mediterranean Sea for the entire beginning of the war in Iraq, jeopardizing our whole mission is Iraq.
That is why I could not believe President Bush told the EU to admit Islamic Turkey. Turkey was not our friend at the beginning of the war in Iraq, plus they have tormented the Europeans for centuries.
An Armenian woman told me horrible stories about how the Turks raped all of the Armenian Christian woman.
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