Posted on 08/15/2004 9:05:41 AM PDT by BraveMan
"I think most people here who are critical of Canada are referring to the Canada wrought by Trudeau, which is devolving into Political Correctness (soft totalitarianism) at an alarming pace."
Exactly what do you, or the posters to whom you refer, know about Trudeau? Identifying him with "soft totalitarianism" suggests that you know little or nothing.
Again, I can't blame you if you don't know anything about Canada... but if you don't, stop making sweeping statements about it. They only fortify the opinion of those who stereotype Americans as possessing a unique combination of arrogance and ignorance.
Your response clearly illustrates "why" the deviants haven't started a Rainbow Scout program ... they are only interested in destroying institutions which embrace individuals, honor, duty, country and God.
You're making a very serious (and typically liberal Canadian) error if you think we know nothing of Trudeau.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=3171
Any criticism I may level at Canada is merely due to your nation being 15 or so years further down the road to ruin than ours. You have people stupid enough to vote for Trudeau and Paul Martin. We have stupid Clinton and Kerry voters. You have arrogant leftists judges imposing gay "marriage" on you, and so do we.
We do put up a little more of a fight, though.
Make that "leftist judges", not "leftists judges". Maybe I'm using plural adjectives as in a Romance language! :-)
Your damning reference to Trudeau ties in nicely with another topic dealing with whether imperial powers (UK, France, US) bear some responsibility for the instability in the mid-East.
It so happens that the U.S. government went to great lengths to try to influence the Canadian elections of 1962 and 1963. Their purpose was to depose the *Conservatives in favour of the Liberals*.
http://www.peace.ca/regimechangeincanada.htm
I happen to think that the effect of the U.S. efforts are overblown. The Conservative government probably fell because it couldn't manage a government to save its life.
All the same, the Liberals were elected in '63 and into government came... Trudeau!
And so, another example of interference in a foreign election coming back to haunt you.
Ah, so the "imperial" U.S. is responsible for the trouble in the Middle East! Surprised you failed to mention Israel and those evil Zionist invaders.
I hope you enjoy the arrival of al-Jazeera to your Canadian TV line-up!
Are you really in favor of discriminating against kids based on religion?
The misleading little nugget you slipped in there was "you". Posters are not the ones discriminating against the kids. The real question is "are you really in favor of the BSA discriminating against kids based on religion"? That's a far more fair question, and a less inflammatory one. Since you chose the more inflammatory version, you shouldn't whine about getting a negative reception.
Just don't look for any public funding or special taxpayer treatment.
What public funding do they receive? And what kind of "special taxpayer treatment" do you think they receive that they shouldn't?
You've read one 2-paragraph article on Trudeau!
Of course! I admit my serious error in underestimating your knowledge of him! *sarcasm*
Ironic that you'd say "Any criticism I may level at Canada is merely due to your nation being 15 or so years further down the road to ruin than ours". I remember the same thing being said in Canada about the U.S.
How do you account for our extra-ordinary influence over your society?
Honestly... go about your lives and let us go about ours. Stop making such a fuss about what happens up here.
"Ah, so the "imperial" U.S. is responsible for the trouble in the Middle East! Surprised you failed to mention Israel and those evil Zionist invaders."
That's the subject of another conversation strain on freerepublic.com 'Be glad to take it up there.
"I hope you enjoy the arrival of al-Jazeera to your Canadian TV line-up!"
I won't get it... sigh... since I don't have cable.
Back to the point... your posts are showing less and less knowledge of all things Canadian. If you don't know about something, profer an opinion at the risk of looking like an idiot.
Actually, I addressed your issue directly. I responded to your allegation that we Americans know nothing of Trudeau by providing you with a link explicitly addressing the issue at hand. I could provide you with plenty of others, but I'm not here to do your research for you. Suffice it to say, we know Trudeau all to well.
Your response was to accuse the "imperial" U.S. of responsibility for problems in the Middle East and to whine about alleged Kennedy intereference in Canadian elections 40 years ago.
At that point, I assumed you were a troll who couldn't stay on topic. Thanks for the confirmation.
That's "interference"! I hate typing!
This link is the May 2004 report on scouting in Iraq http://www.scout.org/front/0405Iraq_e.shtml.
This link has stories on the rebirth of Scouting in Iraq and Afghanistan http://search.freefind.com/find.html?id=1135619&pageid=r&mode=ALL&n=0&query=Afghanistan+Scouting&SUBMIT=+Find+.
"At that point, I assumed you were a troll who couldn't stay on topic. Thanks for the confirmation."
Oh no! You won't get off that easily! The topic, if you'll look, is the closure of Scout camps in Canada.
Leaving aside the fact that scout camps are closing for the same reason that many private camps are (the prohibitive cost of liability insurance) my question remains. Why are you, as an American, getting your knickers in such a twist about a country that is, by all American accounts, so irrelevant.
You've suggested that Canada is 15 years ahead of the U.S. in social degeneration (without any authoritative citation), but your argument presupposes that we are, somehow, an influence on your culture.
If it doesn't matter what happens up here... why talk about out it? If it does matter what happens up here... what is your worry?
"That's "interference"! I hate typing!"
Me too! :) I hope our (lack of) typing abilities don't interfere too much with our heated, but friendly debate.
Thanks for a friendly response. I apologize if my tone was harsh.
I don't recall saying that Canada was irrelevant. I think it's quite relevant because what happens there often happens here eventually.
The sixties began a social decline in most of the Western world. It's happening faster in Canada and many European contries than in the United States.
Because of our heritage we've always been more conservative than other Western nations. The northeastern states, particularly New England, were settled by Congregationalists, Puritans, and others with a statist, conformist, collectivist attitude. It's why New England is so liberal today. But most of America was settled by people such as the Scots-Irish who came here seeking freedom from monarchy and a more decentralized society.
That's why socialism has never had the appeal here that it does in much of the West. Our rise to power also imposed security obligations on us. We provided a military shield for Western Europe and Canada, freeing them up to spend more and more on socialist programs.
We've remained a more religious people, as our resistance to abortion, the gay agenda, and the attacks on institutions such as the Scouts attests. This is why the courts have to be invoked by the left to force leftism on our nation. The Scouts would easily win a referendum in all 50 of our states. It's the small elite political & judicial class here that's trying to destroy them.
In that sense, maybe we aren't that different than Canada. Judicial force is being used there as well. But you don't seem to fight it as we do. I don't think your voters would approve the gay agenda, for example, but if a court orders it, your voters seem to just resign and submit to the court's "diktat". Here, at least some of us fight it. We're still fighting the Roe abortion ruling 31 years later, and chipping away at it.
We look at Canada and see people being fined for printing Biblical passages and see something that could happen here in 2017. We'll fight it, but it's still worrisome.
Your Scouts are now destroyed, apparently without much of a fight. We want to protect ours.
What a strawman. I can't think of one organization that is not, in some way or another, discriminatory.
There's much I'd like to respond to in your post, but I don't want to stray from the point.
You, personally, might not have dismissed Canada as irrelevant on this site, but many of your fellow freepers have.
Whether you have or not, the question remains... perhaps I'll rephrase it... Why do you think social developments in a small country like Canada can possibly affect those in a behemoth like the United States?
If Scouting dies in Canada (and it hasn't, by the way), what possible threat does that pose to Scouting in the U.S.?
P.S. I find it ironic that this discussion takes place in the context of Scouting... an institution as British as a cuppa' tea.
It's not that Canada dictates to the United States on issues such as this. Our Scouts won't die because Canadian Scouting is dying.
It's not a cause and effect relationship. But Canada and much of Europe do serve as a warning for what is coming. They're the proverbial canary in the coal mine. When an aspect of their traditional culture dies, it's a warning that ours will come under increasing attack.
Leftism is a disease infecting most of the West. America is more resistant to the disease, because of our constitutional safeguards and the fact that our populace are decendants of rebellious types of people. But we aren't fully resistant. Judicial activism is undermining the Constitution. The media and teachers' unions are brainwashing the kids. Third World immigration is replacing independent-spirited Americans with collectivist-oriented newcomers.
There are forces in every Western nation trying to destroy the culture and traditions that made the West great. When they score a victory in Canada, such as criminalizing opposition to homosexuality, it's a warning sign to us that something like that could happen here. There are more obstacles here for the left to overcome, but unless we are vigilant they will eventually overcome them.
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