I thought Perkins was an actor:
Posted on 08/24/2004 5:25:14 PM PDT by wagglebee
DAVENPORT, Iowa - Vice President Dick Cheney (news - web sites), whose daughter Mary is a lesbian, drew criticism from both proponents and foes of gay marriage Tuesday after he distanced himself from President Bush (news - web sites)'s call for a constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage.
At a campaign rally in this Mississippi River town, Cheney spoke supportively about gay relationships, saying "freedom means freedom for everyone," when asked about his stand on gay marriage.
"Lynne and I have a gay daughter, so it's an issue our family is very familiar with," Cheney told an audience that included his daughter. "With the respect to the question of relationships, my general view is freedom means freedom for everyone ... People ought to be free to enter into any kind of relationship they want to.
"The question that comes up with the issue of marriage is what kind of official sanction or approval is going to be granted by government? Historically, that's been a relationship that has been handled by the states. The states have made that fundamental decision of what constitutes a marriage," he said.
Bush backs a constitutional amendment prohibiting gay marriage, a move Cheney says was prompted by various judicial rulings, including the action in Massachusetts that made gay marriage legal.
"I think his perception was that the courts, in effect, were beginning to change, without allowing the people to be involved," Cheney said. "The courts were making the judgment for the entire country."
Addressing Bush's position on the amendment, Cheney said, "at this point, save my own preference, as I have stated, but the president makes policy for the administration. He's made it clear that he does, in fact, support a constitutional amendment on this issue."
Those comments drew criticism from the conservative Family Research Council, with President Tony Perkins saying, "I find it hard to believe the vice president would stray from the administration's position on defense policy or tax policy. For many pro-family voters, protecting traditional marriage ranks ahead of the economy and job creation as a campaign issue."
Perkins added that if Cheney sees a problem with activist judges, "then how can he not endorse the same solution the president and his pro-family allies have proposed? We urge Vice President Cheney to support President Bush and a constitutional amendment on marriage."
Steven Fisher, spokesman for the Human Rights Campaign, a gay and lesbian advocacy group, said Cheney's remarks show a stark difference with Bush's efforts "to put discrimination in the Constitution."
"President Bush is feeling the heat. The administration has been using gay Americans to drive a wedge into the electorate. There are millions of American families who have gay family members and friends, who are offended by the president's use of discrimination," Fisher said.
Last month, Lynne Cheney said states should have the final say over the legal status of personal relationships, a comment that came just days before the Senate failed to back the ban.
Cheney said the amendment did not have the votes to pass, but he also said the federal Defense of Marriage Act, which President Clinton (news - web sites) signed into law in 1996, may be enough.
"Most states have addressed this and there is on the books the federal statute, the Defense of Marriage Act, passed in 1996, and to date, it has not been successfully challenged in the courts and may be sufficient to resolve the issue," the vice president said.
The Cheneys have two daughters, both of whom are working on the campaign. Mary Cheney is director of vice presidential operations for the Bush-Cheney re-election campaign. She held a public role as her father's assistant in the 2000 campaign and helped the GOP recruit gay voters during the 2002 midterm elections.
During the 2000 campaign, vice presidential candidate Dick Cheney took the position that states should decide legal issues about personal relationships and that people should be free to enter relationships of their choosing.
Sens. John Kerry (news - web sites) of Massachusetts and John Edwards (news - web sites) of North Carolina, oppose the amendment. The Democratic candidates also oppose gay marriage, but defend a gay couple's rights to the same legal protections as those conferred in marriage.
I think Dick Cheney couched his remarks well.
Kerry and Cheney have the same position on GAy Marriage....
If he wasn't supportive of his daughter he'd be a jerk in my eyes.
Dads back their kids up, pretty much whatever boneheaded thing they do.
I basically agree that its the states right. I am certain that Cheney would not have said this without Bush's approval.
You know it. Cheney is a stand up guy. IMO, I don't think GWB really has a dog in the gay marriage fight.
The media is making much ado about nothing. He has a right to his opinion and has contributed immensely to this administration.
""President Bush is feeling the heat. The administration has been using gay Americans to drive a wedge into the electorate. There are millions of American families who have gay family members and friends, who are offended by the president's use of discrimination," Fisher said. "
This is so damn annoying. Its okay for the far left to use the courts to impose their radical agenday, but if anyone dares give voice to majority opinon then THEY are being divisive.
I just wish these people would be honest and tell the American people that they couldn't care less what they think; that they fully intend on using the courts to defacto amend the Constitution and impose gay marriage on the entire nation. At least then one could respect their honesty.
People were shocked. But I wasn't. I respected my parents for following through on their convictions and I respected my Brother for following through on his.
Yeah, the let-the-states-decide approach would be fine if not for the courts who have no regard for that option.
Sooner or later some Amendment will be necessary to stop the courts and their reckless usurpation of power. I guess it need not ban gay marriage; simply and explicitly empowering the states and removing the courts from the issue would probably do. Then the post-Christian states could do as they please, while the South, most of the Midwest, Sunbelt, Rocky Mtn West, Central Plains, etc could keep marriage as it has always been.
Oh puh_leeez. Kerry voted against the Defense of Marriage act and is against a Constitutional Amendment.
With all due respects, Cheney should have just kept silent. He's not going to win votes from the Left and the Right will just get more frustrated.
That is why it passed in Missouri by about 70% of the vote and got conservative to the polls in mass.
I agree. I think Barney's as straight as they come.
I thought Perkins was an actor:
I'm sure glad my dad didn't take this approach. He actually (gasp) took moral stands and made me see that there was a higher road. Silly guy!
So? Missouri will go Blue----again, just like Pennsylvania. Mark my words.
Since you live in Indiana, perhaps you can give us your stance on said issue?
Cheney's remarks are the last thing conservatives should worry about, since he didn't say anything about gay marriages or special rights for gays. Clearly, there are bigger fish to fry.
Not unless Cheney backs court mandated civil unions.
I love Cheney but he should have kept his fat mouth shut on this. VPs aren't supposed to yap about how they disagree with the President on any subject and are supposed to advocate the President's positions not their own.
I like 60-70% of all Americans oppose the concept of gay marriage. People can do whatever they like in their homes, but marriage is what marriage is and always has been. I think the real crime is what the courts are doing in usurping legislative powers, and something must be down to stop it. Our whole system of checks and balances is way out of whack. Judges with life appointments and no acccountability can not be allowed to just make up laws. I would support a Constitutional Amendment to correct this problem, but see it only a band-aid to a bigger problem.
Nonsense. He could have easily thanked her in a private telephone call instead of in front of a campaign rally, if this was truly the case. The last thing Bush/Cheney want to do is get bogged down in the gay marriage issue when Kerry is withering from the Swiftboats attacks and his nonexistant Senate record. Now liberals are going to whine that Bush is intolerant because his own VP is in favor of gay marriages (he's not but the lib media will spin it this way), and far-right whackjobs like Pat Robertson will make more inflammatory statements on how Bush/Cheney isn't doing enough to protect traditional marriages.
Cheney nailed it. Gay marriage is a state's rights issue. That is the conservative (non-dictatorial) perspective.
One for the list.
:-(
Bush and Cheney have much the same position.
Neither wants judges to decide.
The constitutional process lets humans, not oligarch judges decide.
She's made her bed, so to speak, and her parents can maintain a relationship with her or adopt a stand that will assure alienation from their daughter.
I hope I'd be able to do the same thing. I wouldn't be willing to lose my daughter no matter what misguided, ill-advised lifestyle choice she might make.
Parents have only so much influence over grown children. We all have stories to tell in that regard I'm sure.
VPs (and Cabinet Secretaries) are normally expected not to contradict the President on major Administration bills or policies. But in a well-run and non-paranoid Administration, they should have leeway to express differing views on other matters.
Bush has expressed an opinion in favor of a Constitutional Amendment to ban gay marriages, but that's all it is: Bush's personal opinion. The Executive Branch has nothing whatsoever to do with Constitutional Amendments. That is purely a function of Congress and the States.
Hence Cheney is not breaking any tradition or unwritten rule in expressing an opinion different from Bush's on this matter. And if Cheney expressed his honest opinion irrespective of the potential political positives and negatives (which I suspect he has), then he has gone up in my estimation.
He said 'freedom neans freedom for everyone' - he didn't say anything about them getting gov't recognition, marriage licenses, handouts, and special laws protecting them. President Bush also shares this same mainstream position.
Folks - there are BIGGER FISH TO FRY (And I'm dreaming of some nice beer-battered perch from the Wisconsin Northwoods right now washed down with some Leinenkugel's) than to worry about the gays.
Well, you can stay awake at night worrying over what Cheney said.
Nevertheless, the courts have this power. But what has happened in the last 50 years is the most outrageous power steal in history. Interpreting laws and adjudicating laws are two very different things. When the majority of the people in a state and the legislature are in agreement on a law that should remain, unless it can be shown where such a law is explicitely prohibited by the Constitution.
I don't agree with gay "marriage" either. The whole idea of a constitutional amendment is a non-starter though.
I guess you and I are the few here who get it. Thanks for posting and for the stones to do so!
Why? Every state agrees what marriage is. Only the Socialist Republic of Mass is under a court decree, but the people and legislature said otherwise. If all states and people agree what marriage is, why not do so with an amendment? Although it is a sad that we must do so.
Cheney said, "at this point, save my own preference, as I have stated, but the president makes policy ...". He was wrong to open his mouth and state his personal preference on a policy issue and publicly disagree with the President. I'm not hyperventialiating over it. I love the guy. I think he's great. But he screwed up on this one, he should be called on it and the President should chew his ass out. He's just the friggin VP.
- Homosexual Agenda PING -
Oh brother.
Just out of curiousity...is there a conservative, religious politician in the ENTIRE WORLD who has the GUTS to stand up and call homosexuality for what it truly is? What's with all this walking-on-eggshells-around-the-issue BS?
Good grief...grow a pair, stand up, expose this sin for what it is, and call a spade a spade! Unreal - all this pandering and namby-pamby language over a group that makes up only roughly 5% of the entire US population.
Being weak-kneed and half-asleep is what got us into this mess in the first place.
WAKE UP!
If we're soldiers in His army...why aren't we marching?
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Baloney. It is NOT just Bush's opinion. The President of the U.S. has stated he supports a constitutional amendment. That is the administration's policy on this issue. All laws are written by Congress. So I'm not following your logic.
The VP publicly disagreed with the President on an important public policy issue. Not good form. Hopefully Bush will give him an earful and redirect Cheney to areas he can handle more appropriately like beating up on Kerry.
You are very welcome! Nice to find the TRUE conservatives here on FR. So many are too welded to their own truths. IMO.
Because, as I have already said, it is a non-starter. I want a constitutional amendment against abortion with some very few exceptions, since it is already Federally protected. I could give a damn about my gay accountant and her partner who have lived together for 20+ years. Let's worry about genocide and not screwing.
Great perspective!
Cheney will NEVER be president after those statements. He is an extraordiarily gifted administrator/organizer/task manager. He's a tremendous presence when in the camera's eye....he's easy spoken and very simple to understand.
At the same time, it is not UNWISE to ask why we are not grooming someone to replace President Bush in 2008. I would understand anointing someone as 2008's front runner.
After these statements, that will not be Cheney in today's Republican Party.
As a lifelong conservative Republican I am very troubled by Cheney's comments. For lack of a better analogy, he has been seduced by the Darkside. The problmes of the legitimacy of Gay Marriage are profound for this society. Every textbook in school must be changed to reflect gay parents. Gays as guidance counselors in schools, where mixed up teens seek refuge. The Bible becomes hate literature. Pastors who quote Biblical references to homosexuality must be censored. It is one thing to love your daughter, but it is quite another to give approval and support to behavior which is immoral, and in men, tends to be very unhealthy, if not deadly. (ok only 30% of gay men in large cities are getting Aids,(despite Billions in awareness programs) so I am probably exaggerating the link). So Cheney wants her daughter to be held up as a role model...given visibility in the campaign...etc. For many of us, there comes a point where holding your nose to vote for the lesser of two evils is no longer palatable. Cheney is moving the Bush-Cheney ticket closer to that point.
At least give the appearance of listening AND comprehending the English language. He's already said he's not running.
Mr. Cheney is of course way off base with this statement imo......the human heart is deceitfully wicked who can know it......
Pedophilia...the incremental lowering of the age of consent...People ought to be free to enter into ANY relationship they WANT to...
Incest...brothers with father....fathers with sons and daughters...mothers with daughters and sons...
Bestiality...People ought to be free to enter into ANY relationship they want....
BONDAGE...Discipline...humiliation....sexual perversions of any type..because weak people...abused children who pass the age of consent...through deep wounds enter into ANY relationships they want or desire...or are pulled into...by predators...
If this is the conservative republican position......I want NO PART OF IT...or them.....
PEOPLE OUGHT TO BE FREE TO ENTER INTO ANY RELATIONSHIP THEY WANT....THEY WANT -THEY WANT-..
The problem is The "WANTERS" of these people are perverted...bent...evil....sick...demented... 180 degrees off what God the Creator made us for....
And God the Creator and His Son Jesus Christ...made America for HIS PEOPLE and NOT for perverts...the demented...the sick...those who love evil and death and hate God...
To turn the nation over to such "liberalism" is simply inviting the wrath of God....you cannot spit in the face of the Almighty one without dire consequences...not Clinton not Cheney not me not you...in the end...America will pay dearly for her foolishness...
Dick's gravitas just dropped off of the charts.
"Because, as I have already said, it is a non-starter."
Not only is an amendment on Marriage a non-starter, it SHOULD be a non-starter. The fact that any self-proclaimed conservative would WANT to expand federal power and authority over the states is ludicrous.
There are so many issues of genuine import facing this nation. It boggles my mind that so many on the right have nothing better to concern themselves with.
That's a common statement among those not running for President....and also among those who end up running for President.
My point...again....is that it is NOW an impossibility.
"Whoever puts wife or family before me is not worthy of me."
--Jesus
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