Navy Documents for 1st Purple Heart PROVE Kerry is lying (VANITY)

28 August 2004

[igoramus987]

Schachte said that there was no after action report on the first Purple Heart incident, because there was no hostile fire.

This time the Navy "documentation" backs up the Swift Vets.

No hostile fire = No After Action Report

No After Action Report = No hostile fire

So if there was no After Action Report, it means that there was no hostile fire, and Kerry fradulently got the 1st Purple Heart.

Kerry claims that he was the OinC (Officer in charge) with two other enlisted men.

If Kerry was the OinC on the mission as he claimed he was, and there was hostile fire, he would have had to file an After Action Report. Now the onus is on Kerry to produce an After Action Report, to prove that there was hostile fire, otherwise he is lying.

Presently there are no After Action Reports for this incident. Hence NOW the Navy documentation supports the Swift Vets.

Gotcha!!

[NavVet]

Do you have a link to the article?

[igoramus987]

This is a link to the Admirals comments...

http://www.nationalreview.com/document/document200408280010.asp

However, using logic, whenever there is hostile fire, an After Action (Spot Report) must be submitted. Now, since Kerry was the Officer in Command as he claimed, he would have had to submit an After Action Report.

If he can't product the report, it means that he was lying about the hostile file occuring.

[leadpenny]

Did you start this Breaking News thread based on another Breaking News thread?

[Casloy]

I don't think there is a gotcho on this. I think it is small doubts, leading to questions, leading to bigger doubts, leading to even more questions, and eventually a nagging but convincing feeling this guy Kerry is a fraud and a liar.

[igoramus987]

I don't think there is a gotcho on this. I think it is small doubts, leading to questions, leading to bigger doubts, leading to even more questions, and eventually a nagging but convincing feeling this guy Kerry is a fraud and a liar.

It is a gotcha. If Kerry was OinC as he claimed, he would have had to file an After Action Report if there was hostile fire. If he can't produce the report, then it means he is lying about either being the OinC for the mission, or he was lying about the hostile fire.

[Qwinn2]

I kinda agree with you, and that's not a bad summary of what the medal controvery is, but IF there's -any- "gotcha" within the medal controversies, it's in the 1st Purple Heart.

Qwinn

[Bob]

However, using logic, whenever there is hostile fire, an After Action (Spot Report) must be submitted. Now, since Kerry was the Officer in Command as he claimed, he would have had to submit an After Action Report.

Ahhh, there's the rub. This operation was a training mission for Kerry. He was being trained by Schacte. Kerry wasn't the OIC; Schacte was.

Any after-action report submitted could only be submitted either by Schacte himself or with his approval. Kerry knew he couldn't get Schacte's approval to submit one and, given his description of the incident, Schacte certainly wouldn't submit one.

That's why Kerry waited so long to apply for the first PH. He had to wait for enough transfers to take place so that nobody present at the time (Elliot and Schacte particularly) could dispute his claim for it.

[Casloy]

I hear what you are saying, but since the media don't treat this with a headline as a "smoking gun" (which is exactly what it is) it takes a lot of time for the elements in the story to get out. It's taken 3 weeks of constant efforts by the Swiftboat vets to give this story real legs. This new fact we are talking about could have been discovered by a good reporter in a couple of days.

[igoramus987]

I kinda agree with you, and that's not a bad summary of what the medal controvery is, but IF there's -any- "gotcha" within the medal controversies, it's in the 1st Purple Heart.

The Christmas in Cambodia lie was the opening.

I truely believe that we have got Kerry with the 1st Purple Heart now. He is either lying about being the OinC (because if there was hostile fire he would be able to product the After Action Report), or if he was the OinC because he can't product an After Action Report, there was no hostile fire.

[igoramus987]

Any after-action report submitted could only be submitted either by Schacte himself or with his approval. Kerry knew he couldn't get Schacte's approval to submit one and, given his description of the incident, Schacte certainly wouldn't submit one.

We have got him either way. If Schacte wasn't OinC, and Kerry was the OinC as he claimed, then he would have wrote an After Action Report if there was hostile fire. Where is the report?? If he can't produce one, that means he is lying.

[sgtbono2002]

Kerry needs to apologise to the Veterans he slandered with accusations of atrocities, he needs to apologise for lying to Congress about atrocities he committed, when even the Swiftees say he didnt commit them. He needs to apologise to POW/MIA's for concealing documents about their existence so his cousin could get a trade deal with Viet Nam.He needs to apologise to the Swiftees for calling them liars, and he needs to apologise to the people of Massachusetts for taking Senatorial pay and not showing up for work.

We have seen slimeballs in politics before , but this guy is pathetic.How did he get this far? Who knows we do know that Kennedy has been covering for him,that Massachusetts has a record of voting for whomsoever the Kenndys tell them to vote for,We know he has kept himself on the backburner of politics for many years. But obviously the Dem party didnt vet this guy at all , how could they be so stupid as to put this guy up for President? Is it really Hillary's plane for her 2008 run?

[Casloy]

Perhaps in some ways it could turn out to be a gotcha. If some element in the media can pick one provably lie then they can pound him with it. This could be the one. It's really a difficult situation for him. Once the public accepts he lied about it, then his Vietnam record is totally tainted and he has nothing to run on. You can't switch gears this suddenly in a campaign without losing.

[kabar]

There is also no casualty report for the first PH, unlike the other two.

[igoramus987]

Perhaps in some ways it could turn out to be a gotcha. If some element in the media can pick one provably lie then they can pound him with it. This could be the one. It's really a difficult situation for him. Once the public accepts he lied about it, then his Vietnam record is totally tainted and he has nothing to run on. You can't switch gears this suddenly in a campaign without losing.

All some one has to do, is say, you claim to he the OinC for the 1st Purple Heart mission. Therefore, because there was hostile fire, and because of Navy procedures, you must have submitted an After Action Report. Where is the After Action Report that you wrote to prove that there was hostile fire on that night? If you can't produce one, that means you were lying about there being hostile fire.

[Casloy]

All some one has to do, is say, you claim to he the OinC for the 1st Purple Heart mission. Therefore, because there was hostile fire, and because of Navy procedures, you must have submitted an After Action Report. Where is the After Action Report that you wrote to prove that there was hostile fire on that night? If you can't produce one, that means you were lying about there being hostile fire.

ok, my point is...Who is that "some one." I wish someone in the MSM media would do it, but I don't think they will. So, as someone else said, it will be death by a thousand cuts. I don't disagree with anything you say except the part about someone confronting him.

[igoramus987]

ok, my point is...Who is that "some one." I wish someone in the MSM media would do it, but I don't think they will. So, as someone else said, it will be death by a thousand cuts. I don't disagree with anything you say except the part about someone confronting him.

You don't have to confront him, just ask his campaign. I think either Carl Cameron, who broke the Christmas in Cambodia lie, or that African American guy (Delvon?... can't remember his name) who said on air "sign Form-180" would do it.

[Bob from De]

I heard John O'Neill say, I think on Rush's show, that Kerry got an officer in Saigon, who is now deceased, to approve Purple Heart #1. I don't think O'Neill and his crew are anywhere near finished!

[libs_kma]

Honestly. I don't know why all you meanies are even daring to talk about a decorated war hero like this. Isn't it enough that he "says" he's a war hero and then we can move on, since that "fact" has already been established? /truly, complete, heavy sarcasm

After all, this hasn't been made an issue in 20 years of parading this record all over Mass-a-freakin-liberal-chusetts!!

Are you all part of some...oh, I don't know...vast right wing conspiracy or something?

[snopercod]

If the 1st purple heart was awarded fraudulently, then his early release was also fraudulent.

I say we send Kerry back to Viet Nam.

His politics are more suited to a communist country, anyway.