Posted on 09/04/2004 1:32:36 PM PDT by Destro
September 2, 2004: When Chechnya first declared independence from Russia in 1993, the Russians promptly invaded. The Russians quickly tired of getting a lot of their troops killed for what appeared to be little gain. In the wake of their 1994 withdrawal from Chechnya, Russia simultaneously declared Chechnya still a part of Russia (and paid pensions and government salaries there) and left the Chechens to their own devices. But the Chechens could not govern themselves. It was as simple as that. The central government in the province controlled little beyond the capital Grozny. At least six major warlords held sway, and then quite loosely, over the rest of the province. Criminal activity rapidly increased. Between 1997 and 2000, some 1300 Russian civilians from southern Russia were kidnapped for ransom. When the money did not appear to be forthcoming, the victims were murdered. Hundreds of these captives were rescued as Russian troops again advanced into Chechnya in late 1999. But kidnapping wasn't the only racket. There was also auto theft, rustling, drug running and diverting oil from pipelines running through the province. This last scam was abetted by gangsters taking over local oil refineries and going into the fuel business. Add to this the usual gambling, extortion and prostitution rackets and you have a pretty grim place. For while a lot of the victims were fellow Chechens (who didn't belong to a particular gangs clan), most were in neighboring areas.
But what really mobilized public support for another invasion of Chechnya was one gang that specialized in religious fanaticism (in addition to some more secular crimes, everyone found kidnapping and smuggling too lucrative to give up for religious reasons.) Not content with just turning Chechnya into crime central, the Besayev gang decided to turn all the southern Caucasus into an Islamic republic. Most Chechens practiced the more laid back Sufi form of Islam, but Besayev and his followers managed to convert a few thousand Chechens to the more hard nosed Wahhabi form of Islam. It aid in this, non-Chechen fundamentalists came in to join the jihad. A few hundred converts were made in neighboring Dagestan. In the Summer of 1999, Besayev and company decided it was time to stop preaching and start fighting. Several thousand holy warriors invaded Dagestan. The Chechen criminals were bad enough, but this was too much for the Dagestanis, and they fought back.
Some 32,000 Dagestani civilians who fled the invasion, and the 1,500 locals were killed in the fighting, sometimes massacred by the holy warriors for resisting. Twice the Russian police and troops drove Besayev's warriors back into Chechnya. But after the third invasion, the new prime minister of Russia decided to reestablish control of Chechenya.
In February 2000, the senior Islamic cleric of Chechnya, Mufti Akhmed Khadzhi Kadyrov, proclaimed that the Russian occupation of Chechnya was the only way the people were ever going to be free from all the criminal activity. During the late 1990s, the Russian government had basically ignored the pleas of Chechnya's neighbors for relief from the increasing criminal activity. Reassuring press releases and more border guards were all that was sent to paper over the situation. But the local resentments built up, not just in the Caucasus, but throughout Russia. What was going in Chechnya was symbolic of the lesser degree of lawlessness throughout the country. Russians were waiting for someone to do something. But no one wanted a lot of Russian troops to get killed in the process. The 1993 battles in Chechnya had been humiliating for the Russian military, and people as a whole. In 1999, the Russians were more careful, numerous and decisive. This time the Chechens were also divided. The Russians soon occupied the entire country and began negotiating with many of the clan based groups for some kind of deal. The Russians wanted to get a majority of Chechens to agree to keep the crime rate, especially against people outside of Chechnya, down.
Chechen independence was not a major issue, Chechen's disruptive effect on the entire region was. This was nothing new. The Chechen's had, for centuries, been one of the more powerful ethnic groups (out of over fifty) in the Caucasus. The Chechens were used to doing as they wanted, and were tough enough, and ruthless enough, to get away with it. Two centuries ago, this unruly attitude brought the Chechens into violent contact with the expanding Russian empire. The Russians kept killing Chechens until the survivors agreed to behave. But such bloodletting is never forgotten in places like the Caucasus. The Chechens hate the Russians and want to be free to do whatever they want. And that's what the war in Chechnya is all about.
As I understand it, there was an electin in Chechenia. The result was that the candidate favored by Moscow got the majority of the vote. If that election was on the up and up, it seems the majority of the Chechenian populace favors Moscow rule.
There is no excuse whatsoever for killing innocent citizens, let alone attacking a school full of children.
If I were Russia, I'd break out the ruthless squad and cleanse some nests of sympthazers of this activity.
Good article. Now it's clearer to me than just "Chechnyan independence". It's not that at all, is it, really? Freedom to terrorise their neighbors,they mean.
"The Russians kept killing Chechens until the survivors agreed to behave."
"The Chechens hate the Russians and want to be free to do whatever they want. And that's what the war in Chechnya is all about."
Slightly OT: A Russian acquaintance told me that as soon as any major movie or new video game is released in the US, they can buy it for $2 in Russia. He learned to speak English from these movies and games.
This is very interesting and I thank you for the research.
The Russians need to go in and wash the soil in Islamic blood.
Thanks for explaining.
TIMELINE Beyond Chechnya
Actions outside of Chechnya linked to the conflict.
June 14, 1995
Chechen gunmen take 2,000 hostages at a hospital in southern Russian town of Budyonnovsk, near Chechnya. After failed attempts at force, Russia negotiates the hostages' release in exchange for the gunmen's escape. More than 100 die.
Jan. 9, 1996
Chechen militants seize 3,000 hostages at a hospital in southern Russian town of Kizlyar. Rebels release most, then head for Chechnya with about 100 hostages. Rebels are stopped in a village and attacked by Russian troops. At least 78 die in weeklong fight.
Jan. 16, 1996
Six Turks and three Chechens hold 255 hostages on ferry in Black Sea, threatening to blow up ship if Russia doesn't halt battles in southern Russia. The rebels surrender after three days.
March 9, 1996
Turkish sympathizer hijacks jetliner flying out of Cyprus to draw attention to situation in Chechnya. The sympathizer surrenders after plane lands in Munich, Germany.
Sept. 4, 1999
Bomb destroys a building housing Russian military officers and families in Buinaksk in Russia's Dagestan region. Sixty-four die. Russian officials blame Chechen rebels, but never prove their involvement.
Sept. 9, 1999
Explosion wrecks a nine-story apartment building in southeast Moscow, killing almost 100. Authorities suspect a Chechen bomb, although no evidence is ever provided to support the claim.
Sept. 13, 1999
A bomb destroys an apartment building in southern Moscow, killing 70. Officials blame Chechens, but nobody is ever charged in the attack.
Sept. 16, 1999
Bombs shear off the front of a nine-story apartment building in Volgodonsk, 500 miles south of Moscow. Nearly 20 are killed. Authorities again blame Chechens rebels, but nobody is charged.
March 16, 2001
Three Chechens hijack a Russian airliner leaving Istanbul and divert it to Saudi Arabia. Saudi forces storm plane, killing one hijacker and two hostages.
April 22, 2001
Some 20 gunmen hold about 120 people for 12 hours at a hotel in Istanbul, Turkey, to protest Russian actions in Chechnya. The rebels later surrender to police and release the hostages.
May 4, 2002
Lone gunman holds 13 people hostage at a hotel in Istanbul to protest situation in Chechnya. The gunman surrenders after an hour.
Oct. 24, 2002
Chechen rebels seize 800 people in a Moscow theater. After a three-day standoff, Russian authorities launch a rescue attempt in which all 41 attackers are killed along with 127 hostages who succumb to a knockout gas used to incapacitate the assailants.
July 5, 2003
Double suicide bombing at a Moscow rock concert kills the female attackers and 15 other people.
July 10, 2003
A Russian security agent dies in Moscow while trying to defuse a bomb a woman had tried to carry into a cafe on central Moscow’s main street.
Aug. 1, 2003
50 people are killed in Mozdok, North Ossetia, when a truck bomb smashes through the gates of a hospital where Russian soldiers injured in Chechnya are treated.
Sept. 16, 2003
Two suicide bombers drive a truck laden with explosives into a government security services building near Chechnya, killing three people and injuring 25.
Dec. 5, 2003
Suicide bombing on commuter train in southern Russia kills 44 people. President Vladimir Putin condemns attack as bid to destabilize the country two days before parliamentary elections. Six people were killed in two blasts on the same railway line in September.
Dec. 9, 2003
Female suicide bomber blows herself up outside Moscow’s National Hotel, across from the Kremlin and Red Square, killing five bystanders.
Feb. 6, 2004
An explosion rips through a subway car in the Moscow metro during rush hour, killing 41 people.
June 21- 22, 2004
Chechen rebels kill at least 92 people, mostly law-enforcement officers and officials, while setting fire to police and government buildings around Nazran, the main city of the neighboring republic of Ingushetia.
Aug. 25, 2004
Chechen suicide bombers blamed for explosions that kill 90 people on board two Russian planes.
Exactly! The problem here isn't just independence. Chechnya has a diverse group of people, many of whom don't want Sharia in their state. The other problem is that these terrorists don't just want Chenchnya...they want neighboring states like Dagestan, as they are crossing borders and inciting violence, elsewhere. They aren't just terrorizing Chechnya, as these people are attacking the heartland of Russia. I'm sorry to say, but where ever [radical] Muslims border a non-Mulsim nation, they are intent on assimulating that neighboring country.
"But what really mobilized public support for another invasion of Chechnya was one gang that specialized in religious fanaticism (in addition to some more secular crimes, everyone found kidnapping and smuggling too lucrative to give up for religious reasons.) Not content with just turning Chechnya into crime central, the Besayev gang decided to turn all the southern Caucasus into an Islamic republic. Most Chechens practiced the more laid back Sufi form of Islam, but Besayev and his followers managed to convert a few thousand Chechens to the more hard nosed Wahhabi form of Islam. It aid in this, non-Chechen fundamentalists came in to join the jihad."
Sound familiar? It is!
ISLAM'S WAR AGAINST THE WEST
By Howard Bloom
http://www.howardbloom.net/islam.htm
Osama Bin Laden, Terrorism, And The Great Crusade Against America
Holy War Goes Global
http://www.howardbloom.net/osama.htm
Not OT at all. The Chechen crime gangs run those bootleg rackets by and large.
That certainly wouldn't be my prescription for peace under normal circumstances, but when it comes to terrorism, the gloves come off. Thanks for the post Destro.
My eyes have become more and more open to the fallacy of Islam as a "religion of peace". That's not even what their own Koran says,I'm learning. Nothing less than subjugation of the world is their intent and what their Koran teaches. I know that sounds grandiose and paranoid,but only the lack of the resources and capability hitherto seems to be what has prevented more action.
It's a scary thought,that they are so indoctrinated in hate,that they would blow themselves up to kill others. That's hard to fight. It can't be negotiated with,because they don't want anything but our destruction.
The only option we have,that they have forced us to,is to destroy them before they destroy us. BEFORE.
One scam the Chechens have run is to negotiate a "reverse mortgage" to buy out the apartments of aged pensioners (typically widows). A monthly payment is set, to be paid for the lifetime of the pensioner, in exchange for the conveyance of the deed of title upon the death of the pensioner.
Then the pensioner mysteriously dies or disappears. Sometimes bodies have been found encased in concrete, in the metro, where Chechen gangs obtained construction contracts.
Excellent, I like the way you think.
"Chechnyan independence" is a code-word for an Islamist breakway republic under Islamic law. Too bad for the Christians, Sufi Muslims, and pro-Moscow people who live there.
From Saudi Arabia. *Funded* by Saudi Arabian oil money.
I have always heard my history teachers describing how horrible it was in the old days, when conquerers would move into an area and kill all the men, leaving the women and children. I think I see the motivation now. Perhaps, after the Irish are finished eating their children, we should pick up where the Vikings left off.
It's time to form a worldwide coalition against these Islamofascists. Initial targets are obvious - their heretofore "off limits" sanctuaries - all the Mosques around the world. Time to start knocking them off one at a time.
mo-slimes do what mo-slimes do.
Moral: eliminate the Chechens.
Bump for later read.
I think you can go back further to find the roots of the conflict over Chechnya:
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/History%20of%20Chechnya
The Russian strategy used in the past two Chechen wars- and the genral trend of world events- seems to have contributed to its conversion to (or usurpation by) radical islamization.
<< There is no excuse whatsoever for killing .... a school full of children.
If I were Russia, I'd break out the ruthless squad and cleanse some nests of sympthazers of this activity. >>
Time to go medieval on they arse!
"their heretofore "off limits" sanctuaries - all the Mosques around the world."
All wars with Muslims are open to radical islamization. The Soviets deported the Chechens because of fear they supported the Nazis? Well, Americans deported the Japanese.....
Bump!
Deported? To which country?
Me, too. Unfortunately, when you're doing that, no one admits they sympathize--the bad guys try to blend in with the population. The Russians will thus have to completely clean house, taking out everyone, including the not-so-bad, to be sure. There will be repercussions, and it will go on. I'd still clean house, though if I were Putin, and say it was too bad about the collateral damage.
The US was just as bad as Stalin? We deported the Japanese after the attack on Pearl Harbor? You mean like- Roosevelt sent the entire Japanese-American population to Kazakhstan, let 25% of them die, and Eisenhower didn't let the survivors come back until 1957?
Is that why the Japanese-Americans have joined with islamo terorists to attack America? /sarcasm
My son is serving with the US Army in the boondocks of Afghanistan. He told me that they can buy DVDs of new movies within two weeks of the initial movie release in the theaters. They can buy them at the local market.
. . . like killing kids, murdering infidels, beheading a christian who refuses to submit (Islam means submit in Arabic, not peace), or make women wear burqas, beat women, take 5 wives, rape male children of christians, invade the Muslim Holy City of Moscow . . . etc, etc, etc . . .
Yes Brian, it certaiinly appears that it is.
The other day I advocated that when terrorists can be identified after an event, corpse identification etcetera, that the authorities might consider going after every immediate living family member.
These terrorists might not value their own lives, but the wife, children, parents, brothers, sisters might mean something to them. Announce that those memebers would forfeit their lives, and all property owned by them would be destroyed. Houses would be leveled. All other personal property destroyed or returned to the financial institution that held the paper on them, vehicles or other.
If this is where legitimate governments need to head, then those governments should announce this new policy far and wide. Any terrorist that carried out an attack would be damning their family to extermination. The governments wouldn't.
Just pointing out that while the Soviet example was brutal it was not unprecedented - and can not stand as an excuse for their actions. By the way - how many American Indians died upon removal to reservations? "Trail of Tears", anyone?
Historically, this has been the only effective way to handle muslims.
By definition, deportation is the banishment of a person from one country to another country. Do you maintain that Arizona and California are not in the same country?
If you know the answer to that question, then why would you seemingly not know that the Japanese-Americans during WWII were interned (confined), not deported?
So the Chechens were internment not deported.
By the way internment means to confine. What English word would you use for the actual process of REMOVAL and TRANSPORTATION from their homes (with internment being the end result)?
So the Chechens were "intered" not deported as wer ethe Japanese? (typo correction)
By the way internment means to confine. What English word would you use for the actual process of REMOVAL and TRANSPORTATION from their homes (with internment being the end result)?
It's hardly "off topic" to correct the false claim that Japanese-Americans were "deported" during WWII. They were not. Nor is it "off topic" to question the absurd claim that Arizona is somehow not part of America.
The "topic" was introduced by Destro and I stayed right on his topic. These citizens were subject to internment here in America.
And I'm well aware of Destro's other "point."
It was certainly not "deportation."
It was certainly not "deportation."
Ha! You evacuate when you are in danger and the Feds used it to mask their deed! What is the non propaganda word for forced unwilling removal?
School's out for today, Destro. Your homework is to get yourself a dictionary and learn to use it.
I got a dictionary - what was done to the Japanese requires two words in the imperfect English language. "Forced removal" and then "internment". The Chechens were also forcibly removed and interned in Soviet Asia.
Good summary. Bookmarked.
Thank you for posting this.
It sounds like it is simply time for the Russians to incinerate the whole place. Ruthlessly and mercilessly.
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