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New Questions On Bush Guard Duty [CBS USES FORGERIES TO SMEAR THE PRESIDENT!!!!!]
CBS ^ | 9/10/04 | Staff

Posted on 09/09/2004 7:33:57 AM PDT by TastyManatees

New Questions On Bush Guard Duty

CBS) The military records of the two men running for president have become part of the political arsenal in this campaign – a tool for building up, or blowing up, each candidate’s credibility as America's next commander-in-chief.

While Sen. Kerry has been targeted for what he did in Vietnam, President Bush has been criticized for avoiding Vietnam by landing a spot in the Texas Air National Guard - and then failing to meet some of his obligations.

Did then-Lt. Bush fulfill all of his military obligations? And just how did he land that spot in the National Guard in the first place? Correspondent Dan Rather has new information on the president’s military service – and the first-ever interview with the man who says he pulled strings to get young George W. Bush into the Texas Air National Guard.

...

But 60 Minutes has obtained a number of documents we are told were taken from Col. Killian's personal file. Among them, a never-before-seen memorandum from May 1972, where Killian writes that Lt. Bush called him to talk about "how he can get out of coming to drill from now through November."

Lt. Bush tells his commander "he is working on a campaign in Alabama…. and may not have time to take his physical." Killian adds that he thinks Lt. Bush has gone over his head, and is "talking to someone upstairs."

Col. Killian died in 1984. 60 Minutes consulted a handwriting analyst and document expert who believes the material is authentic.

(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Extended News; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2004; 60minutes; bush; camejo; cbs; ccrm; cheney; dubya; edwards; election; forgery; fraud; gwb; kerry; killian; nader; napalminthemorning; nationalguard; pilot; seebsnews; texas
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CBS is apparently using forged documents to smear President Bush, and they aren’t even forged all that well. The 1972-73 memos Dan Rather cites to were not written in the period from 1972-1973. How can you tell? The font they are typed in did not exist back then!

A commenter from the Powerline blog explains:
Every single one of the memos to file regarding Bush's failure to attend a physical and meet other requirements is in a proportionally spaced font, probably Palatino or Times New Roman. In 1972 people used typewriters for this sort of thing (especially in the military), and typewriters used mono-spaced fonts.

The use of proportionally spaced fonts did not come into common use for office memos until the introduction high-end word processing systems from Xerox and Wang, and later of laser printers, word processing software, and personal computers. They were not widespread until the mid to late 90's.

Before then, you needed typesetting equipment, and that wasn't used for personal memos to file. Even the Wang and other systems that were dominant in the mid 80's used mono-spaced fonts. I doubt the TANG had typesetting or high-end 1st generation word processing systems.

I am saying these documents are forgeries, run through a copier for 15 generations to make them look old. This should be pursued aggressively.
Do the experiment for yourself! Look at the memos that CBS cites to:
Memo 1- 1972
Memo 2- 1972
Memo 3- 1972
Memo 4-1973

Now, open Microsoft Word and start a new document. Select the "MS Mincho" 12 pt font (MS=monospace), and type "I’ll backdate, but won’t rate. Harris agrees." Now type the same phrase directly below it in "Times New Roman" 12 pt. font. Compare these two to the memo dated May 4, 1972 that CBS is using as support for its allegations. It's obvious to even a non-expert that the memos were typed in proportionately spaced font that did not exist at the time they are alleged to have been written.

CBS is using blatant forgeries to smear the President, and they are quite confident that you will do nothing about it.
1 posted on 09/09/2004 7:33:58 AM PDT by TastyManatees
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To: TastyManatees

BTTT and Ping THE WORLD!!!


2 posted on 09/09/2004 7:36:10 AM PDT by mingusthecat (Mingus has again opined. Like any cat, she doesn't really care what YOU think.)
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To: TastyManatees
Already posted Are the Killian Memos Fakes?
3 posted on 09/09/2004 7:36:32 AM PDT by jriemer (We are a Republic not a Democracy)
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To: TastyManatees

A show of hands for anybody thinking that a National Guard military post would have access to a 70's "modern", high-end word processing system?? Anybody?... anybody?


4 posted on 09/09/2004 7:36:36 AM PDT by alancarp (Boycott France and anything that even LOOKS French.)
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To: TastyManatees
Ah, yes, the "deadman's memo" gambit.

Then why have they ignored the memos I have from other dead people which prove, variously, that John Kerry is really Fidel Castro's younger brother, or that Kerry is actually a Pod Person here to lead the invasion of Earth. Well??

5 posted on 09/09/2004 7:37:12 AM PDT by pabianice
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To: TastyManatees

I asked a co-worker about this from another thread I can't fins now. This is what I copied from the other thread:
______________________________________________________

The Globe story is itself based on last night's 60 Minutes report: "New questions on Bush Guard duty." The online version of the 60 Minutes story has links to the memos. Killian died in 1984; CBS states that it "consulted a handwriting analyst and document expert who believes the material is authentic." Reader Tom Mortensen writes:

Every single one of the memos to file regarding Bush's failure to attend a physical and meet other requirements is in a proportionally spaced font, probably Palatino or Times New Roman. In 1972 people used typewriters for this sort of thing (especially in the military), and typewriters used mono-spaced fonts.

The use of proportionally spaced fonts did not come into common use for office memos until the introduction high-end word processing systems from Xerox and Wang, and later of laser printers, word processing software, and personal computers. They were not widespread until the mid to late 90's.

Before then, you needed typesetting equipment, and that wasn't used for personal memos to file. Even the Wang and other systems that were dominant in the mid 80's used mono-spaced fonts. I doubt the TANG had typesetting or high-end 1st generation word processing systems.

I am saying these documents are forgeries, run through a copier for 15 generations to make them look old. This should be pursued aggressively.

__________________________________________________

Below is what my co-worker had to say (he's been a computer programmer for years and years and years (in his 60's now) and is one of the smartest people I've ever met:

____________________________________________________

If the photos of those documents are in a proportional font, they are certainly forgeries. Only professional printing had proprotional fonts at that time. It was well into the 80s before proportional fonts came into use and even then few people had them.
__________________________________________________________


6 posted on 09/09/2004 7:37:46 AM PDT by eyespysomething ("...you're not fit to be a prison guard at Abu Ghraib, much less commander in chief.")
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To: mingusthecat

Right off the bat, the use of a superscript in the first memo for "111th" raises a red flag.


7 posted on 09/09/2004 7:38:28 AM PDT by Pete
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To: eyespysomething
CBS states that it "consulted a handwriting analyst and document expert who believes the material is authentic."

~~~~~~~~~~~~

I wonder why CBS would feel the need to do so?

8 posted on 09/09/2004 7:39:45 AM PDT by The G Man (I'm mad as ZELL and I'm not gonna take it anymore!)
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To: TastyManatees

Nice work. Your blog?

If accurate, this is very damning for those who produced the memos. I would consider it criminal fraud.

Do you think the main stream media would bother to report this, even though they are willing to report the reckless speculation that they do?

They are more than happy to spin the tone of the memos, but are no longer willing to pursue the Sandy Berger PantsGate story.

What the hell is wrong with the media in this country? It is very frightening how little they care about truth these days.


9 posted on 09/09/2004 7:39:45 AM PDT by bluefish (Holding out for worthy tagline...)
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bump


10 posted on 09/09/2004 7:40:09 AM PDT by mingusthecat (Mingus has again opined. Like any cat, she doesn't really care what YOU think.)
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To: alancarp

The Texas state guard would have been the last place to have modern equipment. I've seen guard units back in the 1980s...which as a active duty-type...it shocked me how badly they were equipped. If they had a typewriter...then they had one and only one...and it would have the squadron orderly room typing anything. And the amount of mistakes would have been easily seen...nothing was ever precisely typed. If this document doesn't have corrections noted on it...I'd be asking questions.


11 posted on 09/09/2004 7:40:47 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: MizSterious; sonsofliberty2000; Grampa Dave; MeekOneGOP; RottiBiz; CitizenUSA; Mia T; Chieftain; ...

Ping for CBS fraud on behalf of Kerry.


12 posted on 09/09/2004 7:41:12 AM PDT by TastyManatees (http://www.tastymanatees.com)
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To: jriemer

Glad it was posted again, or I would have missed it. This should be posted every 10 minutes in my opinion. The blatant criminal fraud perpetrated by the Rats and their media helpers is completely out of control.


13 posted on 09/09/2004 7:41:22 AM PDT by bluefish (Holding out for worthy tagline...)
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To: All

I think we should bring this to the attention of Rush. Does anyone have a link to him? Also to Drudge.

nick


14 posted on 09/09/2004 7:41:40 AM PDT by nikos1121
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To: TastyManatees

We really need to email bomb folks like Drudge and Fox on this. That will be the fastest way to get it out.


15 posted on 09/09/2004 7:41:57 AM PDT by Pete
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To: nikos1121
I think we should bring this to the attention of Rush

I know Rush reads FR. Here's hoping he mentions it on his show. That could get it to Fox. From there, it might make some of the talking head shows on the cable nets.

16 posted on 09/09/2004 7:42:59 AM PDT by Pete
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To: Pete

bttt


17 posted on 09/09/2004 7:43:06 AM PDT by petercooper (All I wanted to know about Islam, I learned on 9-11-01.)
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To: pepsionice

Bingo. Time to change my tag line back to what it was a couple months ago.


18 posted on 09/09/2004 7:45:02 AM PDT by alancarp (When does it cease to be "Freedom of the Press" and become outright SEDITION?)
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To: Pete
01 August 1972

No. 2 ________ and convening of a flight review board IAW AFM 35-13.

What is IAW etc and where is the followup?

19 posted on 09/09/2004 7:45:06 AM PDT by Sacajaweau (God Bless Our Troops!!)
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To: TastyManatees
Very few people under the age of 50 these days have ever even seen a document that was actually typed in a mono-spaced font. And those of us at or over that age haven't seen one for years. I'm certainly willing to believe that this is a "forest/trees" scenario where it just didn't register!

Having said that, this is very damning. CBS is going to have to take a new look at these memos. I'd like to hear what their document expert has to say about this.

20 posted on 09/09/2004 7:46:12 AM PDT by RonF
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To: pepsionice

All the way back to WWII the NG in the Philipines were using WWI equipment.


21 posted on 09/09/2004 7:46:39 AM PDT by tiki (Win one against the Flipper)
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To: TastyManatees
The key to this is not Bush's record 30 years ago, it is the diversion from Traitor John's records 30 years ago.

Kerry's record after Nam is darkly hidden, a secret kept from the eyes of voters. He'd caused US troopers to die because he kept the war going, he met with the enemy in Paris, he was and is a traitor! His 20 years of inaction in the Senate proves he continues to wish ill to our country. That is whta we should be focusing on, not some halucination of Tery McAuliffe!

22 posted on 09/09/2004 7:47:01 AM PDT by Tacis (KERRYQUIDIC - Scandal, treason, dishonor & cover-up!! Benedict Arnold had a few good months, too!!)
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To: 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub

Don't know if you've seen this yet PING!

Now they're resorting to forged documents - 1990's tech to create 1970's documentation.

And CBS tried to cover their tracks by calling in a handwriting mercenary.

Know anyone who's connected to Rush.Hannity, to spread this?


23 posted on 09/09/2004 7:47:46 AM PDT by Old Sarge (ZOT 'em all, let MOD sort 'em out!)
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To: TastyManatees

Look at the memo dated 04 May 1972 and compare the copy noise to the memo dated about 15 months later dated 18 August 1973. Look at it in the same manner one would if they were doing ballistics checks on two bullets.


24 posted on 09/09/2004 7:48:12 AM PDT by steveo (Member: Fathers Against Rude Television)
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To: Tacis
Below is the discharge request. Note the signature of said Lt. Colonel Killian.
25 posted on 09/09/2004 7:48:42 AM PDT by coconutt2000
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To: coconutt2000

I was wondering if anyone noticed the curl of the upper right branch of the "K".


26 posted on 09/09/2004 7:49:33 AM PDT by coconutt2000
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To: stockpirate; governsleastgovernsbest

Pinging my pingers


27 posted on 09/09/2004 7:49:42 AM PDT by The G Man (I'm mad as ZELL and I'm not gonna take it anymore!)
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To: eyespysomething

It was well into the 80s before proportional fonts came into use and even then few people had them.



Yup. I went to college in the early 80s at a very high-tech university on the IT cutting edge. Junior year, I typed my resume on a borrowed typewriter. Senior year, I used a computer system a friend had access to in the Computer Science Department. It was the Xerox Altos system (perhaps not yet for sale to the public), a precursor to the Mac (and which Apple largely copied, including the "mouse" interface.) The resume was in beautifully proportionately spaced fonts.

Prior to the 80s, the only folks using proportional fonts were publishers and the like.


28 posted on 09/09/2004 7:49:52 AM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Your Friendly Freeper Patent Attorney)
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To: eyespysomething

A response to a earlier thread pointed out the IBM Selectric, which were a prevalent typewriter at the time, were capable of this type print. The individual posting used this type of print in a weekly newsletter they were publishing (at the time) so they claim.


29 posted on 09/09/2004 7:50:13 AM PDT by BluH2o
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To: TastyManatees
If all Bush did was miss a physical, I say God bless him.
Bush has proven himself a brave American President.
He knew the liberal press would tear his military records apart with their teeth, yet he boldly released them any way.
What a great man. What an honest man!
The more I learn about George Bush, the more I admire him.

Kerry, on the other hand, is a total coward. He hides his records in shame. He runs. He winces. I can imagine the horrors we'd find in those! Kerry is a small, small, weakling. He 's far from qualified for the Presidency.
If he's afraid to do something as simple as release his military records, imagine how he'd run and hide from a terrorist attack!

30 posted on 09/09/2004 7:51:27 AM PDT by concerned about politics ( Liberals are still stuck at the bottom of Maslow's Hierarchy)
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To: bluefish
Be careful with this.

The IBM Executive typewriter used proportional fonts, and was a staple in the military.

It was first introduced in the late 1950s.

31 posted on 09/09/2004 7:52:20 AM PDT by sinkspur ("Can someone tell me where to find an ordained archpriest?"--Cardinal Fanfani)
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To: All

Bump for an excellent post and information. It should be given to Rush by all means TODAY before he goes on the radio. His program probably hits more sources than we ever could simply because not everyone has a computer. It won't be the last time CBS has told blatent lies but I hope the backlash will put them out of business. We knew Kerry would do anything to win...and apparently he will. We can see that doesn't happen and this certainly will help.


32 posted on 09/09/2004 7:52:20 AM PDT by cousair
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To: TastyManatees

Laura Ingraham just announced that Dan Rather is going public about how he is going to work for kerry campaign par time.

CBS is not welcome in my home.


33 posted on 09/09/2004 7:54:10 AM PDT by JFC
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To: coconutt2000

Oh yeah, the spacing of Killian's cursive signature is different from other documents that he has presumably signed.

I wonder if that makes a difference...


34 posted on 09/09/2004 7:54:38 AM PDT by coconutt2000
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To: jriemer

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1210702/posts

From late last night:


35 posted on 09/09/2004 7:54:46 AM PDT by Howlin (I'm mad as Zell)
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To: TastyManatees

It would not matter to me if Bush was awol , Bush has already proven he is a strong leader and a great commander in chief.
these demacommies can try to smear all they want , fact is Bush is a proven leader in times of trouble.
Lets look at Kerrys senate voting record and realize that under Kerry , America would have the military might of Rangoon.
I cant wait to see Kerry have to admit his war medals are all frauds. Lets explain this senator Kerry


36 posted on 09/09/2004 7:55:00 AM PDT by LOSERLIBERALS (KERRY WAS FOR THE WAR BEFORE HE WAS AGAINST IT !)
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To: TastyManatees

Fired off to my email lists.


37 posted on 09/09/2004 7:56:19 AM PDT by sc2_ct (This is the way the world ends... not with a bang but a whimper)
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To: TastyManatees

Already posted, but I don't think it matters because if one ACTUALLY READS the full memos, with knowledge of military and national guard matters, you will find that there is nothing damaging in them at all.


38 posted on 09/09/2004 7:56:30 AM PDT by Paradox (Occam was probably right.)
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To: coconutt2000
Compare for yourself:


39 posted on 09/09/2004 7:56:36 AM PDT by The G Man (I'm mad as ZELL and I'm not gonna take it anymore!)
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To: All

Perhaps someone can explain to me why these memos, assuming they are real, are damaging to the president.

This was in 1972 and 73. Bush had full filled his flying requirements. To be proficient you should fly weekly esp on the jet, (the T103?) he was flying as it was a dangerous plane with a poor safetly record. He clearly could not fly weekly to maintain proficiency. So he opted out.

He had logged over 350 hours on this plane. I don't blame him for wanting out of the active flying in the reserves. For one thing, there were more pilots than planes at that time. They did not need him.

This is again a tempest in a teapot but the DEMS want to make something out of it.

THE BOTTOM LINE IS THIS... BUSH HAS PRODUCED ALL DOCUMENTS THAT ARE AVAILABLE. KERRY HAS NOT...SIMPLY HAS NOT... THAT IS THE ONLY ARGUMENT THAT WE NEED TO GIVE. KERRY, PRODUCE YOUR MILATARY DOCUMENT OF ELSE STFU!!!

nick


40 posted on 09/09/2004 7:57:17 AM PDT by nikos1121
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To: TastyManatees

I saw the slimebag Rather this morning on CBS/ABC/NBC. They are all using excepts of it. Up to their same 'ole dirty tricks. It ain't gonna fly.


41 posted on 09/09/2004 7:58:05 AM PDT by b4its2late (John John Kerry Edwards change positions more often than a Nevada prostitute!!!)
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To: coconutt2000

I think that's a period on the upper limb of the K. This document, I presume is legit right?

nick


42 posted on 09/09/2004 7:58:32 AM PDT by nikos1121
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To: TastyManatees

There had to be other members of this unit that received memorandums from this office that produced these documents. Wouldn't it be interesting to compare other documents generated for other purposes at the same time with these Bush documents?


43 posted on 09/09/2004 8:00:28 AM PDT by Toespi
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To: The G Man

Comparing those two signatures, I would say they were not written by the same person. And I do that all the time.


44 posted on 09/09/2004 8:00:34 AM PDT by b4its2late (John John Kerry Edwards change positions more often than a Nevada prostitute!!!)
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To: PhilDragoo; risk; Grampa Dave; 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub; river rat

John FORGES Kerry Ping!


45 posted on 09/09/2004 8:01:26 AM PDT by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: All

Bump for an excellent post and information. It should be given to Rush by all means TODAY before he goes on the radio. His program probably hits more sources than we ever could simply because not everyone has a computer. It won't be the last time CBS has told blatent lies but I hope a backlash will help cut their ratings more than they are today....last! We knew Kerry would do anything to win...and apparently he will. We can see that doesn't happen by getting any and all information to the right sources. One thing we can't do is sit on any information at this time.


46 posted on 09/09/2004 8:01:47 AM PDT by cousair
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To: The G Man

The signatures are not even close. But, I ask again, how are the memos damaging. What is the point that CBS and Barnes wanted to make?

Can someone post the fake memos. I can't seem to open them.

nick


47 posted on 09/09/2004 8:01:50 AM PDT by nikos1121
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To: The G Man

Is this a joke? No way are those penned by the same hand. It's not even close.

Absolutely these are bogus.


48 posted on 09/09/2004 8:02:04 AM PDT by Rutles4Ever ("The message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing...")
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To: Tacis
The key to this is not Bush's record 30 years ago, it is the diversion from Traitor John's records 30 years ago

Absolutely correct.

The real objective here is to keep the Swift Boat Vets & their devastating (& unanswerable) charges out of the news.

Kerry is totally unable to answer their charges. The press must make Bush the issue from here on out, or Kerry loses the election.

They'll do their damnest.

49 posted on 09/09/2004 8:02:38 AM PDT by Republic If You Can Keep It
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To: TastyManatees; hellinahandcart; NYC GOP Chick; Lil'freeper

Good post!


50 posted on 09/09/2004 8:03:28 AM PDT by sauropod (Hitlary: "We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good.")
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