Report: Huge explosion in North Korean province [Crater seen by satellite.]

AP by way of Jerusalem Post ^ | 12SEP04 | AP

[familyop]

A large explosion occurred in the northern part of North Korea, sending a huge column of smoke into the air on an important anniversary of the communist regime, a South Korean news agency reported Sunday.

The South Korean government said it was trying to confirm the report of an explosion at 11 a.m. on Thursday in Yanggang province near the border with China.

The Yonhap news agency carried reports from unidentified sources, with one in Washington saying the incident could be related to a natural disaster such as a forest fire. It also cited a diplomatic source in Seoul as raising the possibility of an accident or a nuclear test.

Yonhap later quoted Kim Jong-min, spokesman for the presidential office, as saying:

"Currently, we are trying to find out in detail the exact character, cause and size of the accident, but we don't think North Korea conducted a nuclear test."

Although North Korea is believed to be developing nuclear weapons, international experts would likely have been able to detect the test if one had occurred several days ago.

"We understand that a mushroom-shaped cloud about 3.5- to 4-kilometer (2.2 miles to 2.5 miles) in diameter was monitored during the explosion," the source in Seoul told Yonhap.

The agency also quoted an unidentified government official as saying there was seismic activity related to two blasts in North Korea at 11 p.m. Wednesday and 1 a.m. Thursday.

Thursday was the anniversary of North Korea's founding on Sept. 9, 1948. Leader Kim Jong Il uses the occasion to stage performances and other events to bolster loyalty among the impoverished North Korean population.

Experts have speculated that North Korea might use a major anniversary to conduct a nuclear-related test, but one analyst said an open test, as opposed to one below ground, would be difficult in such a small country.

"It's difficult to say, but it won't be easy for North Korea to conduct a nuclear test without resulting in massive losses of its own people," said Koh Yu-hwan, a North Korea expert in Seoul. "I think there is a (greater) possibility that it is a simple accident, rather than a deliberate nuclear test."

Yonhap's diplomatic source in Seoul said the explosion took place "not far" from a military base that holds ballistic missiles. North Korea, which has a large missile arsenal and more than a million soldiers, is dotted with military installations.

The damage and crater left by the explosion in Kim Hyong Jik county was big enough to be noticed by a satellite, a source in Beijing told Yonhap.

Kim Jong Il on Sunday met Li Changchun, a senior official of China's Communist Party who was on a goodwill visit to Pyongyang, said KCNA, the North's official news agency. Li delivered a letter from Chinese President Hu Jintao, KCNA said.

KCNA did not mention the reported explosion. China had said that the agenda for Li's talks would include North Korea's nuclear development.

On Saturday, North Korea said recent revelations that South Korea conducted secret nuclear experiments involving uranium and plutonium made the communist state more determined to pursue its own nuclear programs.

The South Korean experiments, conducted in 1982 and 2000, were likely to further complicate the already stalled six-nation talks aimed at dismantling the North's nuclear development. South Korea has said the experiments were purely for research and did not reflect a desire to develop weapons.

On April 22, train wagons at a railway station exploded in the North Korean town of Ryongchon, killing 160 people and injuring an estimated 1,300, according to some estimates. The blast was believed to have been sparked by a train laden with oil and chemicals that hit power lines.

The explosion on Thursday was bigger than the Ryongchon train explosion, which devastated a wide area, Yonhap said.

[familyop]

"he damage and crater left by the explosion in Kim Hyong Jik county was big enough to be noticed by a satellite, a source in Beijing told Yonhap."

[zarf]

Time for SK to get working on their own bomb. A nuke race in the far east might be what the doctor ordered.

Maybe NK could feed spent fuel to their population.

[DB]

This has been reported a number of times now but all the reports are very similar with no additional details.

I don't know what to make of it.

[BookaT]

Can anyone say I think North Korea maight have enough rice to feed all of thier people after all.

2 Birds with one stone. Nuke Test and population control.

The NK's are so Bassackward they don't even know what that was.

[familyop]

"This has been reported a number of times now but all the reports are very similar with no additional details."

I thought the word about the "crater" was interesting and ran the word, "crater" in a search through the last post on this story. The word didn't show up, so I thought it was a go.

After posting, I saw that it wasn't. The part of the column with that text was edited out of the other post, probably because it was a Fox News copy of the same AP report.

...sorry about that.

[familyop]

Also, the other post/article used the title, "North Korea Might Have Tested Nuke."

[Rebelbase]

" A nuke race in the far east might be what the doctor ordered."

Yeah, Dr.Strangelove.

[azhenfud]

They misunderestimated the size of the warhead?

[hershey]

Maybe this is NK's idea of population control? Well, they are short of food...

[NativeNewYorker]

Rove is just getting started. /satire

[zarf]

Give me another solution.

[COBOL2Java]

ABC news reported this morning that a cloud, possibly radioactive, has been spotted by satellite over NK. Said this is evidence that they may have done a test.

[Just mythoughts]

"Thursday was the anniversary of North Korea's founding on Sept. 9, 1948. Leader Kim Jong Il uses the occasion to stage performances and other events to bolster loyalty among the impoverished North Korean population."


Interesting tid bit left out is who the "founder" was. Stalin.

[Elsie]

"It's difficult to say, but it won't be easy for North Korea to conduct a nuclear test without resulting in massive losses of its own people,"

Clarification follows....

"It's difficult to say, but it won't be easy for North Korea to USE a nuclear BOMB without resulting in massive losses of its own people,"

[dawn53]

The DUers are screaming for Kerry to "get out in front of this" and criticize Bush for not realizing the threat.

Excuse me but who brought up the Axis of Evil in the first place????

[spodefly]

This is one of those times where you hope the NSA and/or CIA knows exactly what it was. If we don't have surveillance on NK down to the meter, I would be very surprised.

[COBOL2Java]

Excuse me but who brought up the Axis of Evil in the first place????

Wellll...you know it and I know it, but don't forget that for Liberals, History began this morning.

[familyop]

There are still a lot of similar but confusing reports. I agree that the descriptions point to a likely cratering charge, but descriptions can often be a little off. Or it could have been an accidental chain shot of some sort, as the following guesses.

---

http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200409/200409120026.html
Gov't Confirms 'Non-Nuclear' N. Korean Explosion
The Chosun Ilbo

	Related Articles - World Media Focuses on N. Korean Explosion - Massive Explosion Takes Place Near Sino-Korean Border

It was reported that there was a massive explosion Thursday around the town of Yongjo-ri, Kim Hyong-jik County, Ryanggang Province. U.S. Department of State, sources familiar with North Korea and the Korean government all confirmed the explosion.

A high-ranking government official said Sunday, “It is true that a large mushroom cloud about 3.5 to 4 km in diameter was observed by a satellite at around 11:00 a.m. Thursday. It was not a nuclear test, but the explosion seemed to be three times bigger than the one that took place during the Ryongchon Station accident,” and added, “Both U.S. and Korean intelligence authorities are investigating what caused the explosion.”

Chong Wa Dae Spokesman Kim Jong-min said, “We noticed the explosion right after it took place and reported it to the president in writing during a National Security Council meeting. But we cannot decide the nature of the accident yet.”

The accident took place in a mountainous region 1,500 meter above sea level around Yongjo-ri, where it is known that there were many munitions factories nearby. In particular, the exact spot of explosion is only 10km away southwest from the Yongjo-ri base for Rodong 1 and 2 missiles and some 30km away from the Sino-Korean border.

There is much talk about the cause of the explosion. The government official said, “If a nuclear test causes an explosion, we can detect it by reading satellite data. Thus, the recent explosion in North Korea was not caused by a nuclear test.” The intelligence authorities assume that an ammunition depot with over 1,000 tons of dynamite or an ammunition car may have exploded, or there may have been a chain explosion of chemical material or a big fire. Some Chinese sources argue that a massive explosion took pace in a munitions factory. Hong Sun-jik, director at the Hyundai Economic Institute said, “Other than the assumption that it may be a simple accident that took place due to old facilities, we cannot exclude the possibility that the explosion may have taken place due to the lack of control of the Kim Jong-il regime, or it may have been connected to a secret feud over the successor of Kim Jong-il following the rumor of death of Kim’s wife, Ko Young-hee.”

Also, some strongly argue that it is not a simple accident because it took place on Sept.9, the North’s foundation day, which is considered a very important national holiday. Others argue that with Korea’s nuclear experiments in the past at issue in the international community, it could be a false explosion by North Korea to intensify the Korea’s nuclear issue. In other words, the North intentionally caused the explosion to deliver a message to the international community.

The government official said, “We will be able to know the exact cause only after North Korea makes an official statement or intelligence authorities announces the results of their analysis.”

(Choi Byung-mook, bmchoi@chosun.com )

[mewzilla]

Gee, I didn't know forest fires left craters.

[G.Mason]

Children shouldn't be allowed to play with matches.

[Flavius]

Yeah... wtf blows up with 2.5km diameters... North Korea, First they disover fire... Second they discover flight...

[familyop]

The signature and other details described make it appear to have possibly been a cratering nuke. ...that is, if the crater spotted is deep enough. In the past, we made some that were hundreds of feet deep. We'll see what comes of monitoring for fallout, if any.

Or it could have been a big accident with TNT if the crater is extremely shallow.

That's about all that comes to mind.

[familyop]

" 2.5km diameters..."

I'm wondering whether they were talking about the stem of the cloud or the top of it.

[fieldmarshaldj]

Smokey the Bear says, "Only you North Koreans can prevent nuclear bomb blasts in the forest !"

[Just mythoughts]

"Ethnic Koreans Among Hostage Takers in Russia(terrorism update)
Chosun Ilbo ^ | 09/07/04 | Chung Byeong-seon


Posted on 09/07/2004 9:12:02 AM PDT by TigerLikesRooster



Ethnic Koreans Among Hostage Takers in Russia "




Iteresting????

[GVnana]

Yes it is. Another chapter in the Axis of Evil saga.

[Just mythoughts]

Interestingly, every time Putin and his government get in a tight spot N.Korea squeals.

[GRRRRR]

Ya know....

It's ENTIRELY Possible that these "accidents" aren't such at all...there just might be some saboteurs wandering about the NK countryside...Hmmmmm????

A little COVERT military action??
Is BUSH smiling just a little bit more over his morning coffee with Miss Laura? Heh, heh...

I'm not sayin, just wonderin'....

G

[csvset]

There is a 700+ post thread about this Blast, Mushroom Cloud Reported in N. Korea

[GVnana]

saboteurs wandering about the NK countryside...Hmmmmm????

Who were the VIPs that were killed in the train explosion? Anyone remember?

[R. Scott]

There went all their celebratory fireworks.

[Pearls Before Swine]

The article you've posted includes a map of the explosion's location. Right on the Chinese border. How thoughtful.

[Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)]

My first thoughts were also sabotage once again.

[95Tarheel]

If it was a nuclear blast, we will soon have picked up radioactive traces from our sniffer planes and/or boats (if we haven't already). My guess is that either they had an accident, or they purposefully detonated a large conventional device to calibrate their equipment for an upcoming nuclear test.

[bunkerhill7]

sighted site,sappered same

[Uncle Vlad]

There are two possible explanations for the huge crater:

1. Wile E. Coyote is now in charge of the North Korean Nuclear Weapons program.

2. Jimmy Carter is now in charge of North Korea's economy.

[Sal]

Syrians.

[AmericaUnited]

I think a munitions dump was blow sky high by the resistance, as a nice birthday present to Pajama Boy.

[GVnana]

Syrians.

That's right. My, my. NK is certainly having security problems. /sarcasm>

[Valin]

Update
Report: huge explosion in North Korea; Powell says it was not a ``nuclear event''

CHRISTOPHER TORCHIA, Associated Press Writer
Sunday, September 12, 2004
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2004/09/12/international0901EDT0439.DTL

---

(09-12) 06:01 PDT SEOUL, South Korea (AP) --

A large explosion occurred in the northern part of North Korea, sending a plume of smoke more than two miles wide into the air on an important anniversary of the communist regime, a South Korean news agency reported Sunday.

Secretary of State Colin Powell said the explosion Thursday was not a nuclear test but that it was not known yet what caused it.

"There was no indication that was a nuclear event of any kind. Exactly what it was, we're not sure," Powell said, speaking on ABC's "This Week."

Powell said there were "some activities taking place and some sites that we're watching carefully, but it is not conclusive that they are moving toward a test."
(snip)

[gilliam]

Inside JoongAng Daily says there were 2 explosions:

Two massive explosions took place in North Korea's border area with China on Wednesday night and early Thursday morning, Roh administration officials revealed yesterday, confirming earlier reports from Beijing. Thursday was the anniversary of the 1948 foundation of North Korea's communist regime.
The first official confirmation of the incidents came from Chung Dong-young, head of the National Security Council, during a media briefing yesterday morning. "I was informed about the explosions and am in the process of confirming the incidents," Mr. Chung said, but dismissed the possibility that Pyeongyang had undertaken a nuclear test. Another Roh administration official added. "It would be absurd for the North to conduct a nuclear test near the Chinese border."


http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200409/12/200409122230437009900090209021.html

[rintense]

The DUers are probably ignoring the fact that this is another Clinton appeasement gone wrong. They can blame Jimmy Carter and Clinton for signing a treaty with NK that resulted in NK laughing at us as soon as the ink dried.

[texas booster]

NK has kept their most sensitive military work near China as a defensive position. In case of war, they can dismantle and be across the border in days.

[Pearls Before Swine]

NK has kept their most sensitive military work near China as a defensive position.NK has kept their most sensitive military work near ChinaNK has kept their most sensitive military work near China as a defensive position.

While that makes sense for research, I can't believe the Chinese would be happy with a radioactive cloud on their border. Setting off an above ground test is a lot different from spinning some centrifuges. Are the prevailing winds so strong they don't need to even consider it?

[texas booster]

Are the prevailing winds so strong they don't need to even consider it?

Remember that Jong Il IS the heavens and the earth. The very winds obey him.

Besides, how could such an advanced civilization ever have an accident?

[Dan Evans]

Time for SK to get working on their own bomb. A nuke race in the far east might be what the doctor ordered.

This where the nuclear non-proliferation treaty has led us. All the thugs in Asia -- China, North Korea and Pakistan have nuclear weapons programs. The good guys like Japan, South Korea and Taiwan don't.

[Dan Evans]

...they purposefully detonated a large conventional device to calibrate their equipment for an upcoming nuclear test. I was thinking the same thing. Before the Trinity test, the Manhattan project scientists did exactly that.

[ridesthemiles]

A forest fire is a forest fire.

An explosion is an explosion.

Trees burning and "crowning" make a hell of a noise, and send up a crest of fire and smoke, but nothing that is "miles wide". We have had enough fires in Calif in the last 3 years that have been televised for all to see that there shouldn't be any such cross-reference such as stated in this piece.

More of the Jerry Springer School of Journalism. It's is an absolute travesty what passes for "journalism" in schools these days.

[grey_whiskers]

You wrote:

"More of the Jerry Springer School of Journalism. It's is an absolute travesty what passes for "journalism" in schools these days."

Or deliberate disinformation . . .?

I think it is interesting that early reports had
a mushroom cloud 4 - 5 km diameter (consistent with
low kiloton yield device, according to other posters,
using the HOTSPOT code from Lawrence Livermore); and
yet, no references to 'national technical means' that
the observed characteristics ARE NOT THOSE of a nuke.
If they had suspicions it was, but proof it wasn't,
these proofs would be trumpeted.

Depending on what happened, different types of spin make sense:

US or allies take out nuclear site--the "who, us?" defense
also good for strike
on Taepodong-2 ICBM
sites -- the ones which
can reach continental
U.S. -- to buy us time.

NK nuke test--want to fuzzy things up, if you *announce*
a test, then Kewwy campaign would try to
run with it; if you slowly leak a test,
Bush campaign has time for counter-spin

NK nuke accident -- mix "what the hell happened" with
convulsive giggles.

[Snapple]

Didn't you guys ever think to check the DRP's official site?

http://www.korea-dpr.com/