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Russia rejects Powell's criticism, joins forces with Israel
World Tribune ^ | Wednesday, September 15, 2004

Posted on 09/15/2004 10:22:50 AM PDT by priceofreedom

Russia rejects Powell's criticism, joins forces with Israel

SPECIAL TO WORLD TRIBUNE.COM Wednesday, September 15, 2004 HERZLIYA, Israel – While rejecting U.S. and EU criticism of its anti-terrorism reforms, Russia plans to adopt Israel's counter-insurgency methods in Moscow's war against Chechen rebels.

Russian officials said the government in Moscow has agreed to increase security cooperation with Israel and focus on counter-insurgency. The officials said the cooperation would include Israeli training and instruction on a range of issues, including aviation security and civil defense.

"We are being helped by your expertise in the field of aviation security," Vladimir Vasilyev, chairman of the Security Committee of Russia's parliament, told Israeli reporters.

Vasilyev and other Russian officials said security cooperation was already taking place, Middle East Newsline reported. They said teams from both countries were arranging meetings in an effort meant to learn the lessons of the Chechen takeover of a high school in North Ossetia in late August. Nearly 400 people were killed in the hostage episode.

U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell, in an interview with Reuters, backed liberal criticism in Russia by saying the changes were "pulling back on some of the democratic reforms".

But Russia's foreign minister said Washington had no right to impose its model of democracy on others.

"First of all, the processes that are under way in Russia are our internal affair," Sergei Lavrov said.

"And it is at least strange that, while talking about a certain 'pulling back', as he (Powell) put it, on some of the democratic reforms in the Russian Federation, he tried to assert yet one more time the thought that democracy can only be copied from someone's model," Lavrov said.

Lavrov met Israeli leaders last week and signed an accord meant to pave the way for a joint effort against Islamic insurgency groups.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Health Insurance for the Self-Employed — Special Offer

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "I want to express my support that you're giving us to solve security isues," Vasilyev told Israeli reporters at an international conference in Herzliya, which ended on Tuesday. "We will also continue cooperation in the field of protecting public places and will use Israel's experience. To be smarter and tougher, we will have to prepare our citizens." Russian officials said Moscow was also examining the Israeli model of a civil guard, or auxiliary police, that can carry weapons and conduct searches.

They said this would require new legislation.

Israel and Russia also agreed to expand their intelligence exchange, particularly in the area of Islamic insurgency movements, officials said.

Officials said Israel would soon send a delegation of intelligence analysts to Moscow.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Russia; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: chechnya; israel; kissinger; napalminthemorning; nixon; russia; wot; yomkippur
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Now lets see if they will cease to fund and cooperate with Iran on their nuclear goals.
1 posted on 09/15/2004 10:22:50 AM PDT by priceofreedom
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To: priceofreedom

Go Putin!!


2 posted on 09/15/2004 10:25:47 AM PDT by nonliberal (With Specter as Judiciary Chair, how do the Bushbots propose we get a conservative onto the Court?)
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To: priceofreedom

cool,i like russia's (new) way and israel's better then powell's..it's time we started dealing with this.."the great Muslim war"


3 posted on 09/15/2004 10:26:20 AM PDT by rang1995
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To: SJackson

ping for hope


4 posted on 09/15/2004 10:27:20 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: priceofreedom

The terrorists need their own left to say to them, "you're driving our enemies together"


5 posted on 09/15/2004 10:28:21 AM PDT by aynrandfreak (If 9/11 didn't change you, you're a bad human being)
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To: priceofreedom

So Israel wants to take on a "russian" reputation?????


6 posted on 09/15/2004 10:28:38 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: Just mythoughts

russian reputation?????

meaning????


7 posted on 09/15/2004 10:30:10 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: priceofreedom

Putin's grab for power makes me nervous, but our government's constant finger shaking is not helping here. We need to give Putin an incentive to retain the democratic reforms, while at the same time joining him in fighting this Islamic menace.


8 posted on 09/15/2004 10:30:57 AM PDT by Brilliant
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To: priceofreedom
President Bush holding up a weekly WORLD TRIBUNE


9 posted on 09/15/2004 10:31:08 AM PDT by freedomson (Baruch habba b'shem Adonai)
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To: Just mythoughts
So Israel wants to take on a "russian" reputation?????

The countries will share intelligence and Israel will teach Russian forces how to fight a counter-insurgency. The story says nothing about Russia teaching Israel about how to get stuck in a boondoggle occupation and then back out after public outcry--the Israelis learned about that in Lebanon.

10 posted on 09/15/2004 10:31:43 AM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: priceofreedom

Good. Powell and State should lay off. Russia will do what it needs to combat terrorism.

I wish W. had more to say in support of Putin and Russia.


11 posted on 09/15/2004 10:31:54 AM PDT by zencat (Magnetic BUSH/CHENEY bumper stickers ---> www.gwbushmagnets.com)
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To: Brilliant

i agree. Powell is always the dove (except when he should be)


12 posted on 09/15/2004 10:32:28 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: priceofreedom; Travis McGee; Jeff Head

the Israeli model of a civil guard, or auxiliary police, that can carry weapons and conduct searches.

They said this would require new legislation.



sounds like a not so bad idea
our people have forgotten this is the purpose of our second amendment. . . every citizen can be his own soldier and soveriegn.

arm yourselves America.
to the friggin teeth.


13 posted on 09/15/2004 10:32:32 AM PDT by Robert_Paulson2 (Robert the "RINO")
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To: priceofreedom; All

Throw off the shackles of Political Correctness and victory is assured.


14 posted on 09/15/2004 10:32:50 AM PDT by olde north church (Ever see a photo of James Carville and Gollum standing next to each other?)
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: freedomson

the aliens were gonna vote for JF'nK before they werent (space suit blamed for change of heart) any1 have those pics?


17 posted on 09/15/2004 10:34:27 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: freedomson

the aliens were gonna vote for JF'nK before they werent (space suit blamed for change of heart) any1 have those pics?


18 posted on 09/15/2004 10:34:36 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: Brilliant
Putin is doing exactly what he's supposed to be doing. So is Powell. So is Israel.

The world is lining up, one way or another, against the terrorists who've flunked the 20th century.

19 posted on 09/15/2004 10:34:48 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg (John Kerry is a GirlyManchurian Candidate.)
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To: priceofreedom
The move is the most logical due to so many Russian speakers in Israel and similarity of the problems.

But in some resent interviews, top Russian officials already said 3 no to Israels polite inquiry (Israelis went so far as to note that its not a request, they were ready to provide any help unconditionally) about Russian help in the Iranian nuclear program, applying some pressure on Syria and cut on support to Arafat.

So, I think Russian government will manage this hypocrisy just fine: will get help from Israel without providing any big steps in return. The only hope is that they will do something behind the scene, maybe...
20 posted on 09/15/2004 10:36:40 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: priceofreedom
Powell should STFU.
21 posted on 09/15/2004 10:38:10 AM PDT by BureaucratusMaximus ("We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good" - Hillary Clinton)
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To: xm177e2
"The countries will share intelligence and Israel will teach Russian forces how to fight a counter-insurgency. The story says nothing about Russia teaching Israel about how to get stuck in a boondoggle occupation and then back out after public outcry--the Israelis learned about that in Lebanon."


Please, of course the story says nothing about Israel taking on a "russian" reputation. HOWEVER, one cannot ignore HISTORY.

Putin first makes nice nice to Israel and then Putin announces he will choose regional governors, no more "free" elections.

We are talking about the man who for a birthday present sent that "MENTAL" IL of N.Korea horses. HELLO!!!

Sorry but Putin Inc., lost out BIG TIME using Saddam and that UN "OIL for rotten Food" program, so they are moving along making friends influencing people.

WHO will be left with the TAB????
22 posted on 09/15/2004 10:39:38 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: BureaucratusMaximus; All

"Israel and Russia also agreed to expand their intelligence exchange, particularly in the area of Islamic insurgency movements, officials said."

for me this was the key quote. even the Mooslims will understant that this means them.


23 posted on 09/15/2004 10:40:29 AM PDT by priceofreedom (On A Roadmap To Hell)
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To: priceofreedom

Well, Powell. Maybe if we have two plane crashes, a subway blow up and an elementary school slaughtered all in one week, then you too will take the war on terror seriously.


24 posted on 09/15/2004 10:43:37 AM PDT by bird4four4
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To: priceofreedom

"Israel and Russia also agreed to expand their intelligence exchange, particularly in the area of Islamic insurgency movements, officials said."

"for me this was the key quote. even the Mooslims will understant that this means them."


Putin has no ability to take these terrorists on, "IF" he did he would not be taking the actions he is.

I do not think you are aware of WHO foots this bill for Israel to do what it does.

Fox News had a report yesterday that WE taxpayers funded the settlements into Gaza and it would be WE taxpayers that fund whatever happens next.

NOW this being the case seems to me Putin is very well aware of how to get $$$$$ and it won't be from Israel. Once again after consolidation of power WE taxpayer will be funding Putin's actions.



25 posted on 09/15/2004 10:49:04 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: priceofreedom
Looks like Putin understands that a secular democracy cannot succeed without first eliminating those who would use it to install a theocracy -- the terrorists.

First things first.

26 posted on 09/15/2004 10:49:26 AM PDT by Eastbound ( "Ne'er a Scrooge or a Patsy be")
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To: Just mythoughts
WHO will be left with the TAB????

Hopefully... Yasser Arafat, HAMAS, Hezb'allah, and Chechen terrorists. They are the ones who stand to lose the most from a Russo-Israeli partnership. Israel gains political credibility when it has Russia's backing and Russia will gain Israeli technique, allowing it to field a force capable of taking on the Chechens.

27 posted on 09/15/2004 10:51:16 AM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: nonliberal

Personally, I'm happy to see Putin thumb his nose at Powell.

What's that old Arab expression? "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" -- isn't that it? Powell should shut up. We need the Ruskies as our friends. They don't have the MSM and the ACLU to worry about.


28 posted on 09/15/2004 10:52:21 AM PDT by Cooltouch
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To: priceofreedom

USA is too "tippy toe" to side up with anymore


29 posted on 09/15/2004 10:58:03 AM PDT by sure_fine (*not one to over kill the thought process*)
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To: priceofreedom
Here ya go.


30 posted on 09/15/2004 11:00:09 AM PDT by ASA Vet (Tourette's syndrome is just a $&#$*!% excuse for poor *%$#** language skills.)
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To: BureaucratusMaximus
DITTO!

(btw, look for Hillary-Powell in '08)

31 posted on 09/15/2004 11:02:03 AM PDT by Condor51 (May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. -- Gen G. Patton Jr)
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To: Robert_Paulson2
"every citizen can be his own soldier and soveriegn."

Great concept! Wonder if it will ever catch on here? ;->

32 posted on 09/15/2004 11:03:02 AM PDT by Eastbound ( "Ne'er a Scrooge or a Patsy be")
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To: priceofreedom

The Bear is awake.

My only fear is that with the massive centralization of power that Putin has done, is that someone will use it to turn Russia back into a dictatorship.


33 posted on 09/15/2004 11:04:27 AM PDT by redgolum
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To: xm177e2
Oh the complexity of the players.

1. Israel could take out Arafat in a heart beat.

2. Israel could make Lebanon and Syria a pile of sand if they chose to.

3. Russian interests have only been the same as US in WWII to destroy Hitler. However, one cannot claim that what replaced Hitler was better or more civilized.

So the big question is why? Why would Putin reach out to Israel when they have operated so stealth fully among the Muslim nations all of these years.

Get Gertz's new book and find out who has been arming the Muslim world.

Putin has not demonstrated that he is about ending terrorism, rather seems to have allowed and used terrorism to regain and reclaim centralized power.
34 posted on 09/15/2004 11:06:09 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.
35 posted on 09/15/2004 11:09:58 AM PDT by SJackson (If you're listening to a rock star…on who to vote for, you're a bigger moron than they are, A Cooper)
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To: daumal; All
Islamic menace first, democratic "reforms" later. We should be doing the same

Any country that realizes that terrorism needs to be defeated now and contributes resources to the task should be embraced as allies. We know how Israel deals with terror on a daily basis. We will all soon learn Russia's resolve. We are at war with the forces of evil that want us dead. All of us need be very aware of that fact. Everything else is secondary.

36 posted on 09/15/2004 11:14:19 AM PDT by afnamvet (USAF Tuy Hoa AFB RVN 68-69 NOT FONDA KERRY!)
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To: priceofreedom

Rest assured when the Russians grab any of those terrorists they would be more than happy to go the American Club Med in Cuba rather than what faces them there ,The Russians know full well how to deal with this Trash.


37 posted on 09/15/2004 11:20:30 AM PDT by Fast1
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To: Tolik
Russia is in a hard spot to be sure.

Lacking infostructure and logistics....their Archaic state owned oil/gas pipeline transmission systems.....which is the coin keeping the sickly bear alive...... is vulnerable,vulnerable to terrorism.

So ya.....managing Jihadi types and other brooding ethnics.

Israel will be of help to Russia in managing the crazies.
Russian gangsters and their other buddies in ex Soviet Stans will probably help keep the terror down,

cuz the extorski from the oil/gas is just to good.

38 posted on 09/15/2004 11:20:42 AM PDT by Light Speed
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To: xm177e2
The story says nothing about Russia teaching Israel about how to get stuck in a boondoggle occupation and then back out after public outcry--the Israelis learned about that in Lebanon.

Yes, fortunately the deal does not include the Israelis being trained in the Russian expertise of getting themselves into bloody quagmires.

39 posted on 09/15/2004 11:23:13 AM PDT by montag813 (PLEASE PRAY FOR THE PEOPLE OF NEW ORLEANS IN THEIR TIME OF NEED)
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To: redgolum
You're absolutely right. I'm all for Russia teaming up with Israel, but we need to be careful what we wish for. I think some on this thread have not heard about Putin's proposal that ONLY PUTIN SHOULD APPOINT LOCAL OFFICIALS. Putin wants to do away with local elections!

This terrifies me.
40 posted on 09/15/2004 11:29:33 AM PDT by keats5
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To: Alouette; SJackson; yonif
George W. Bush will be reelected by a margin of at least ten per cent

41 posted on 09/15/2004 11:33:01 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/keyword?k=napalminthemorning)
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To: freedomson

This is HUGE news!!! When did Carville decide to endorse the President?
42 posted on 09/15/2004 11:34:32 AM PDT by CurlyBill (John Kerry is PeeWee Herman in a Frankenstein costume)
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To: BureaucratusMaximus

I agree. This is not the time to bicker over the consolodation of power in Russia or their attitude toward Chechnya. They just lost 350 people including children. We should be supporting their effort to go after our common enemy.


43 posted on 09/15/2004 11:35:52 AM PDT by CurlyBill (John Kerry is PeeWee Herman in a Frankenstein costume)
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To: priceofreedom
Putin is acting as instrument of God.
Something else that should be also in breaking news :

Ivan is approaching New Orleans, moving NW during the past hour (320)

and still we keep hearing that it is moving N !
44 posted on 09/15/2004 11:40:47 AM PDT by Truth666
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To: montag813
Yes, fortunately the deal does not include the Israelis being trained in the Russian expertise of getting themselves into bloody quagmires.

And the IDF will not start issuing rations of vodka to its soldiers.

45 posted on 09/15/2004 11:42:57 AM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: Just mythoughts
However, one cannot claim that what replaced Hitler was better or more civilized.

Yeah, actually, one can make that claim. I certainly would.

46 posted on 09/15/2004 11:44:33 AM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: xm177e2

"Yeah, actually, one can make that claim. I certainly would."

But of course you would.


47 posted on 09/15/2004 11:47:12 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: keats5; redgolum; A. Pole
You are incorrect - Putin is not doing away with all local elections. He is adopting the British and French models were regional officials are appointed by the central govt.

True fact - Don't be shocked - but London's mayor was appointed by the ruling party until 2000 when for the first time the mayor of London had to stand for office via direct election by the people of London - Londoners elected a communist!!

48 posted on 09/15/2004 11:47:50 AM PDT by Destro (Know your enemy! Help fight Islamic terrorism by visiting www.johnathangaltfilms.com)
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To: Just mythoughts
But of course you would.

Yes. Of course I would.

Is there anyone else here who would claim that Gerhard Schroeder is more civilized than Adolf Hitler?

Or, is there anyone else here who thinks the Social Democrats are as uncivilized as the National Socialists?

49 posted on 09/15/2004 11:57:24 AM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: xm177e2

"Yes. Of course I would.

Is there anyone else here who would claim that Gerhard Schroeder is more civilized than Adolf Hitler?

Or, is there anyone else here who thinks the Social Democrats are as uncivilized as the National Socialists?"


Personally I see no difference in Hitler and his slaughtering and the modern day German making $$$$ of Saddam butchering and slaughtering his people under that scam of "OIL for rotten Food" program.


50 posted on 09/15/2004 12:02:01 PM PDT by Just mythoughts
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