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To: Dr. Frank fan
all emergency room care is basically socialized, right? No one's ever "refused", whether or not they can pay or have insurance, right?

Well, ERs are "socialized" because they're free, or at least free to privileged classes.

But they have NO government budget or other reliable source of constant income, hence, hospitals can and do go out of business.

under socialism, they can't.

17 posted on 09/28/2004 1:53:48 PM PDT by Jim Noble (FR Iraq policy debate begins 11/3/04. Pass the word.)
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To: Jim Noble
Well, ERs are "socialized" because they're free, or at least free to privileged classes. But they have NO government budget or other reliable source of constant income, hence, hospitals can and do go out of business. under socialism, they can't.

And here's the lefty's response: "That's so inefficient, and look at the tragedies that result (communities losing hospitals). Why not cushion things with a true, reliable, nationalized system?" Look how you've now portrayed the difference: under our system, hospitals "can go out of business", under socialism, they can't. Which do you think sounds better to the average joe? Who's going to say "yay, I want a system in which my local hospital can go under"?

Lefties are also big on reminding us that ERs are typically the most costly way to treat someone, and there would be an efficiency savings if the people most inclined to use ERs for small things (poor people) were instead included in some kind of umbrella nationalized system that encouraged/allowed them to make less-costly, regular checkup type visits.

And, call me crazy, but I think lefties are *right* about that. At least, I know of no decent counterargument.

20 posted on 09/28/2004 2:00:23 PM PDT by Dr. Frank fan
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To: Jim Noble
Well, ERs are "socialized" because they're free, or at least free to privileged classes. But they have NO government budget

Another point: Doesn't this just mean that hospitals are the ones administering the socialism?

-Government mandates that hospital ERs treat everyone, regardless of ability to pay.

-This gives all hospitals a budget item they can't avoid.

-Other hospital bills (for regular patients) are, inevitably, raised accordingly. (Or the hospital eventually must shut its doors.)

In other words the government gives hospitals an unfunded mandate (you MUST treat these people) and then sits back and lets the hospitals go ahead and collect the "ER socialism tax" by themselves. And of course there are a web of regulations all hospitals must navigate in doing so.

So while the government is not in charge of the tax collection and distribution directly, it really is just a way of "farming out" the socialism, like I said.

27 posted on 09/28/2004 2:07:15 PM PDT by Dr. Frank fan
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To: Jim Noble

Hospitals have a huge “bad debt and charity” budget. They rarely go “out of business” because of people not paying their bills. They just charge more to cover the cost of people who utilize services, supplies, medication, mind power and time without paying.


148 posted on 10/04/2010 9:03:54 PM PDT by KendraSJ
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