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2nd Amendment Newbie (vanity)
self

Posted on 10/25/2004 8:21:45 AM PDT by Another-MA-Conservative

Looking for some guidance and advice from freeper 2nd Amendment fans here. I hope it is not inappropriate to post such threads on FR, but it seems like a good audience for it.

I've never owned a firearm before, but I have at least fired long guns before in the distant past(shotguns and a .22 rifle).

Anyway, I'm looking to exercise my 2nd Amendment rights for the first time in my adult life. I'd like a "beginner" handgun, initially to just get familiar with them and for inexpensive shooting-range practice. My research so far has led me towards .22 rimfire semiauto pistols as a good starting point.

That said, I'm thinking about the Beretta U22 Neos 6.0... any good? It's gotten good reviews in the mags I've read so far and is reasonably priced.

I'm also a little nervous about how to go about getting my feet wet in this - I've never even been in a gun shop before. To my understanding, I have to take a training course in order to get a license, and that it's practically impossible to get a CCW license here in MA. Should I join the NRA? How do I find places to shoot? Most seem to be private sportsmens clubs... what's the deal with these?

So... any advice for a 2nd-Ammendment newbie?


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; US: Massachusetts
KEYWORDS: bang; banglist
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1 posted on 10/25/2004 8:21:45 AM PDT by Another-MA-Conservative
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Any advice? From us?!?! Hold on.


2 posted on 10/25/2004 8:24:09 AM PDT by stevio (Bush B* Slapped 'im!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Foreget the handgun, get a double barrel shotgun.

Far more effective for home defense, and skeet is about the most fun shooting "game" I know of.


3 posted on 10/25/2004 8:24:15 AM PDT by Wisconsin
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Both the .22 and Beretta are good choices for starter pistols. It's not too much gun for the beginner. Now, I'm not an expert on firearms courses. I'll let other FReepers guide you through that one.


4 posted on 10/25/2004 8:25:59 AM PDT by writer33 (Try this link: http://www.whiskeycreekpress.com/books/electivedecisions.shtml)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Go to a shooting range and get to know the people there. They can answer most questions you might have and even help you get familiar with various weapons.


5 posted on 10/25/2004 8:26:02 AM PDT by cripplecreek (We've turned the corner and we're not smokin crack.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Call the NRA and they can supply you with a list of certified trainers in your area. They will be able to supply you with some "hands-on" guidance and training so that you can make an educated decision. Good luck!


6 posted on 10/25/2004 8:26:11 AM PDT by FormerLib (Kosova: "land stolen from Serbs and given to terrorist killers in a futile attempt to appease them.")
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
"I'm thinking about the Beretta U22 Neos"

Get a Walther P22. Smaller, lighter, much more standard in it's configuration, and simply a lot of fun. Master it, and you'll have many of the skills and motor reflexes used with larger calibers.

Highly recommended.

Stay safe,

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

7 posted on 10/25/2004 8:26:25 AM PDT by Joe Brower (The Constitution defines Conservatism.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Go to this site.



http://www.goal.org/index2.html


8 posted on 10/25/2004 8:26:42 AM PDT by Redcoat LI ("I am the great and powerful Kerry! Look at my medals!")
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Yeah, move out of MA for beginners.


9 posted on 10/25/2004 8:29:14 AM PDT by eastforker (Maybe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure what I said is what I meant_John Kerry)
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To: Wisconsin; Another-MA-Conservative

I agree. Get a shotgun and make sure you get a rear pistol grip for it. Makes it shorter and easier to manage in tight quarters.


10 posted on 10/25/2004 8:30:20 AM PDT by Bikers4Bush (Flood waters rising, heading for more conservative ground. Vote for true conservatives!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
You anywhere near Attleboro? Try the American Firearms School. I can't recommend them from personal experience, but I've been meaning to go there for ages. You can rent a gun on the premises. It would be excellent for you to try out some before you make a choice, since good guns aren't cheap.

They also do training and video simulation, if memory serves. Unfortunately, I can't check out the site myself. I'm at work, and it keeps giving me the big red hand ;)

11 posted on 10/25/2004 8:31:21 AM PDT by prion (Yes, as a matter of fact, I AM the spelling police)
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To: Wisconsin; Another-MA-Conservative

In fact it should look like this when you're done.

http://www.tjgeneralstore.com/tacstar.htm


12 posted on 10/25/2004 8:31:56 AM PDT by Bikers4Bush (Flood waters rising, heading for more conservative ground. Vote for true conservatives!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Go to a gun-shop and ask questions but do not be in a hurry to buy.

Go to a range and talk to them. Most will rent by the hour and provide instruction.

Find a buddy or two that are into pistols but be aware that they may have personal biases.

You will hear a lot about the 22 not being a defense gun but you did not say that was your goal.

OTOH, I started my wife off with a 357 Ruger GP loaded with 38's. You can get reasonably priced 38's although not as cheap as 22s.

Check out Ruger 22s. They are lots of fun.


13 posted on 10/25/2004 8:32:27 AM PDT by WildTurkey
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

I like my Baretta 9mm Mini cougar, but it's a pain to reassemble. My husband's full-size Baretta is nicer.


14 posted on 10/25/2004 8:35:09 AM PDT by SandyInSeattle (Official RKBA Landscaper and Arborist, Pajama Duchess of Green Leafy Things)
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To: Wisconsin
Foreget the handgun, get a double barrel shotgun

I disagree emphatically. For someone just getting into shooting, a shotgun is the worst possible introduction due to its intimidating recoil.

It's much better to develop good skills with a minimum of flinch and fear, then move into larger firearms such as the double-barrel shotgun.

When I teach complete newcomers, I use the .22 pistol exclusively.

15 posted on 10/25/2004 8:35:21 AM PDT by Chemist_Geek ("Drill, R&D, and conserve" should be our watchwords! Energy independence for America!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

I learned handgunning with an old .38 special double action revolver. Safer and less complex that an auto. Has real knockdown, and can be shot relatively cheaply with remanufactured low power wadcutter loads. If you're stuck on a .22, I'd still consider a revolver.


16 posted on 10/25/2004 8:36:08 AM PDT by conservativewasp (Support John Kerry......... Ho Chi Minh would.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative; WildTurkey
Yep Ruger Mark II. Like this. Fun and affordable.


17 posted on 10/25/2004 8:38:03 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (Ignorance, bigotry, envy, and gluttony are a few floor joists in the democratic platform.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
Take a concealed weapons course in your state. They will teach you all about the laws in your state, even if you don't want to get a permit. Then go to a gun range and take a safety course.

IMHO - Pistol newbies are best served with revolvers -- either a 22 LR or 38 special S&W would be my recommendation. If you want an auto to shoot for life, get a 1911 -- to get started buy the 22LR conversion kit. You only need one 1911 and it will last a lifetime.

If you want a rifle, a 22LR lever action is a good starting point. Shotgun, a Remington 870 pump will do all you need with a shotgun.

I'm cheap ^_^ --- be safe.

18 posted on 10/25/2004 8:38:29 AM PDT by snooker
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
I'd like a "beginner" handgun, initially to just get familiar with them and for inexpensive shooting-range practice. My research so far has led me towards .22 rimfire semiauto pistols as a good starting point.

Yes, they are. I agree.

That said, I'm thinking about the Beretta U22 Neos 6.0... any good? It's gotten good reviews in the mags I've read so far and is reasonably priced.

I don't know; I have no experience with it. I have a P22, and it's worked well for me.

I'm also a little nervous about how to go about getting my feet wet in this - I've never even been in a gun shop before. To my understanding, I have to take a training course in order to get a license, and that it's practically impossible to get a CCW license here in MA. Should I join the NRA? How do I find places to shoot? Most seem to be private sportsmens clubs... what's the deal with these?

Well, I can't comment on the legal situation. Definitely join the NRA, no matter what. They maintain a list of firearms-friendly attorneys as well as clubs and ranges. They also sponsor training courses, which I heartily recommend. In fact, I recommend that you take the Basic Pisol course before you do anything else.

19 posted on 10/25/2004 8:39:02 AM PDT by Chemist_Geek ("Drill, R&D, and conserve" should be our watchwords! Energy independence for America!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Speaking as a former USMC rifle & pistol coach, range record-setter and current gun owner, I'd concur with your choice of the .22 for a first caliber pistol and would add a proviso not to over-spend (you'll gain opinions as you gain practice & will soon want a different, more personally suitable pistol). For home defense there's really no doubt but what a short-barreled shotgun or (my choice) a .45 Colt Automatic Pistol is most preferred. Every burglar on the planet knows the sound of those rounds ramming home to the chamber, and 9 out of 10 turns tail. And never forget: that pistol is ALWAYS LOADED.

Parsiphal


20 posted on 10/25/2004 8:40:13 AM PDT by Parsiphal
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

My son just bought an Israeli military hand gun, unfortunately I can't remember the name of it. It has the best balance of any hand gun I've ever held, easy to disasemble and put back together. Shoots 38 shells, it's got a long range...only draw back it's pricey. I think he paid like $5-600 for it. But it is one of the best designed guns I've ever held.


21 posted on 10/25/2004 8:42:52 AM PDT by Jewels1091
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Ruger Mk. II - great for competent beginners.


22 posted on 10/25/2004 8:43:03 AM PDT by ctdonath2
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
Just remember that the Second Amendment is not about hunting.

BTW, Have fun.

23 posted on 10/25/2004 8:44:27 AM PDT by oyez (¡Qué viva la revolución de Reagan!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
I recommend learning Jeff Cooper's 4 rules of gun safety until you can recite them forwards and backwards. I can't tell you how many times I've had "experienced" gun owners point loaded guns at me out of carelessness. If you are a safe shooter, you will be welcome everywhere.

RULE 1

ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED

The only exception to this occurs when one has a weapon in his hands and he has personally unloaded it for checking. As soon as he puts it down, Rule 1 applies again.

RULE 2

NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT PREPARED TO DESTROY

You may not wish to destroy it, but you must be clear in your mind that you are quite ready to if you let that muzzle cover the target. To allow a firearm to point at another human being is a deadly threat, and should always be treated as such.

RULE 3

KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER TIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET

This we call the Golden Rule because its violation is responsible for about 80 percent of the firearms disasters we read about.

RULE 4

BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET

You never shoot at anything until you have positively identified it. You never fire at a shadow, or a sound, or a suspected presence. You shoot only when you know absolutely what you are shooting at and what is beyond it.

24 posted on 10/25/2004 8:45:08 AM PDT by rob3006 (We don't rent pigs.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Visit Kim du Toit's "Nation of Riflemen" forum:

http://www.kimdutoit.com/dr/forum/index.php

They have a whole forum section for gunowner "newby" questions.


25 posted on 10/25/2004 8:48:18 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog (The Hog of Steel)
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To: Joe Brower

I almost bought a P22 a few weeks ago. Ended up buying a PPK/S .380. I find the Walther's simplistic and good for novices, like my wife. :)


26 posted on 10/25/2004 8:48:48 AM PDT by L98Fiero
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

I carry a Bersa Thunder .380 APC. It is cheap ($215.00), reliable and .380 ammo is cheap and easy to find. Anything smaller will not measure up in personal protection.


27 posted on 10/25/2004 8:48:56 AM PDT by Pointblank
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To: Bikers4Bush

"Get a shotgun and make sure you get a rear pistol grip for it"

Just never sight it down the barrel by holding it up level with your face, least wise the kick will punch you in the mouth.

(happened to my brother one night taking care of a pack of wild dogs)


28 posted on 10/25/2004 8:50:53 AM PDT by Rebelbase (President Jimmy Carter is a complete idiot .)
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To: Conspiracy Guy

Yep! I've got one similar to that. A brick of ammo is about $10. Cheap afternoon entertainment!


29 posted on 10/25/2004 8:51:01 AM PDT by Ladysmith (Uhhh, can I get me a huntin' license here?...)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Go to your local gun store, ask their advice, take a training class from an NRA certified instructor and you're on your way. You'll get a lot of advice from Freepers, some good, some sarcastic, some bad, so get professional help and then you can start making up your own mind.


30 posted on 10/25/2004 8:52:08 AM PDT by dljordan
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

You can check out the Massachusetts Club and Range listings, I believe they have a web site. Be forewarned, this is not an inexpensive hobby. If you shoot even once a month, the ammo cost can really add up. I'm not trying to discourage you, just want you to be realistic. Go to web sites and talk to shooters. Check out dealers in your area, they are good sources of info. Also, many have ranges.
As to the pistol, the Sig Hammerli 22 Long Rifle is good but it starts at $380.


31 posted on 10/25/2004 8:54:19 AM PDT by unbalanced but fair
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To: L98Fiero
"I find the Walther's simplistic and good for novices, like my wife. :)"

Great minds think alike! $;-) My wife is exactly whom I bought a P22 for two Christmases ago.

Funny thing, she hardly shoots, but out to fifteen yards she does extremely well with the .22lr. Give her anything bigger, though, and she's immediately all over the map. A very profound demonstration of how blast and recoil can affect a shooter's performance.

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

32 posted on 10/25/2004 8:54:35 AM PDT by Joe Brower (The Constitution defines Conservatism.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Good morning.

The best gun for self-defense is the one you have when you need one. That said, why not just start with the best and not stop buying. You can never have enough firearms and ammunition.
John Browing's 1911 in .45 ACP is still the best choice for a handgun. It requires training to use well but you should get training anyway.
If money is an issue the Makarov is a real deal. You can find them for less than $200.00 and Russian ammo is cheap. The 9x18 round is probably close to the minimum for a defense weapon but the gun goes bang every time and is accurate and easy to fire. The main drawback is the tiny sights but that just leads back to the need for training and practice.
I carry a Series 70 Colt or a Makarov. The Mak is great for hot days .
Whatever weapon you choose get training from someone who knows how to teach.
I would love to see firearms skills taught in school, balanced with constant lessons in social responsibility and common sense.

Michael Frazier


33 posted on 10/25/2004 8:58:21 AM PDT by brazzaville
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To: Ladysmith

I hunt rabbits with my Mark II. Almost my autoloaders are Ruger. I have P97DC's in 45 ACP and in 9mm. I have a Colt M1911 variant. I have several revolvers from S&W. Long guns and shot guns too many to mention.


34 posted on 10/25/2004 8:59:22 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (Ignorance, bigotry, envy, and gluttony are a few floor joists in the democratic platform.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
First: I would suggest you to go to a firearms safety class if you are unfamiliar with firearms.
Second; Then go to an organized range and observe and ask questions. You will find that most firearm people are more than willing to answer questions about their firearms and allow you to try theirs. this will give you a feel of what is comfortable for you.
Third: Owning a certain firearm for protection is your personal choice and hinges on what you feel most comfortable with, be it shotgun, rifle or handgun.
Forth: You have to consider if the firearm is to be used for protection in a dwelling, that the projectiles do not carry through walls to other rooms or dwellings possibly injuring innocents. Shotguns with bird shot are fine so are handguns with the proper ammunition.
Fifth: Know your firearm and it's capabilities.
Happy shooting!
35 posted on 10/25/2004 9:01:17 AM PDT by rem22-250 (Evil usually prevails...Unless Good is very strong...."Bones")
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To: Parsiphal
Wow, averaging two replies per minute so far! Guess this is a pretty good audience for my question overall - thanks everyone! (Did I mention I love FR? :-)

Several folks have mentioned shotguns; I can see that angle for home security, but it's not really what I had in mind to start out with. Is this thing even legal?

I realize revolvers are simpler, but I'm not intimidated by the mechanics of a simple blow-back semi-auto; I'm pretty mechanically inclined and I don't think I'd have any trouble breaking it down. Actually, the fascinating mechanics of semi-autos are part of their appeal to me, silly as that may sound.

I know a .22 isn't much good for personal defense, but it's still better than a Louisville Slugger or a kitchen knife, no?

The Beretta looks good at $310 for the 6" barrel version... I'll also look more closely at the Ruger and Walther 22s. Maybe a Colt 45 or 1911 clone down the road...

36 posted on 10/25/2004 9:01:28 AM PDT by Another-MA-Conservative
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

I also vote for the Ruger MKII (that's what I learned on) but be wary of aftermarket magazines. Many don't have enough sping tension to raise the bolt stop completely when the mag's empty which caused damage to the bolt stop which eventually got so mangled it caused the gun to jam. Also It is a bit tricky to take down and re-assemble. After 24 years I finally figured out what I was doing wrong....


37 posted on 10/25/2004 9:10:07 AM PDT by logic ("all that is required for evil to triumph, is for good men to do nothing")
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To: Redcoat LI

Thanks for the goal.org link! I hadn't seen that site yet, most helpful.


38 posted on 10/25/2004 9:10:44 AM PDT by Another-MA-Conservative
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To: Conspiracy Guy

The Mark III is even better!


39 posted on 10/25/2004 9:10:48 AM PDT by Sweet_Sunflower29 (FReeper #82885 rocks!)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
1st, move to a more 2nd amendment friendly state.

2nd, take a class from an reputable instructor.

3rd, get an expensive .22 revolver / pistol (you can pick them up inexpensively at a lot of pawn shops).

4th, go to a range and practice practice practice. You should burn through at least 1,000 rounds. Work on gaining accuracy, calmness while shooting, range etiquette and MOST IMPORTANTLY - SAFETY!

5th, save up your $$$s for your next - ahemm "Toy" :-)
40 posted on 10/25/2004 9:11:52 AM PDT by taxcontrol (People are entitled to their opinion - no matter how wrong it is.)
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To: Sweet_Sunflower29

I am not familiar the Mark III. Does it have a target barrel and adjustable sights or some other differences? My Mark II has been through the ringer and never fails. Probably had a couple of thousand rounds through it. I keep it clean.


41 posted on 10/25/2004 9:15:30 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (Ignorance, bigotry, envy, and gluttony are a few floor joists in the democratic platform.)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

For quality and price it's tough to beat Ruger.Don't let anybody tell that a 22 doesn't have enough power to stop someone.In my life I've met 3 people that were accidentally shot with 22s in every case if they had not immeadiately sought medical attention they would have died.These guys were all shot one time, one in the foot, one in the leg, and one in the chest.They survived but imagine if they were shot multiple times in the chest or head they would be just as dead as if they were shot with with the lastest and greatest hand cannon.I prefer autos but Ruger also makes an excellent single action revolver that's damn near indestructable,simple,very safe and has an alternate cylinder for 22 magnum.


42 posted on 10/25/2004 9:16:03 AM PDT by edchambers (Where are we going and why am I in this hand-basket?)
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To: Conspiracy Guy
Dang you! Now I want to head to the range and do a little shooting!

So how is the M1911? My brother bought a Kimber this summer and what a hoot!! I figured that a .45 would do a number on my wrist, I was stunned to find it was less stressful than even my 9mm or the .38special. And accurate! Brother! Given a little time and practice, I think I could point-n-shoot pretty accurately in no time.

43 posted on 10/25/2004 9:16:26 AM PDT by Ladysmith (Uhhh, can I get me a huntin' license here?...)
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To: Another-MA-Conservative
Actually, true story:
I was someplace in an agressive environment and brought my Ruger MKII with a bull barrel for protection incase violence erupted.(I was young and stupid and now know better than to even go in the first place) A week later someone I was with told me that the next day someone told them if they had known my Ruger was a .22 they would have started something..... funny how stupid some people are. No a .22 is not nearly as devastating as the .45 (1911 clone) I carry now, but DEAD is DEAD. The moffia made .22's famous for one shot kills to the head....
44 posted on 10/25/2004 9:19:52 AM PDT by logic ("all that is required for evil to triumph, is for good men to do nothing")
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To: taxcontrol
Your five-step plan is just want I was planning, well, except for #1. Can't move out of MA. Besides, isn't it better anyway to have folks like us working to change things in places like MA, rather than just let the commies go unchallenged?

Heck, part of the reason I'm eager to exercise my 2nd amendment rights IS the fact that I live in MA!

Look like it's going to be a long process though - first I have to find and take the class, then apply for the license to carry, which I guess can take up to two months. Sheesh!

And I thought it was a pain in the butt to get my motorcycle license!

45 posted on 10/25/2004 9:25:10 AM PDT by Another-MA-Conservative
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To: logic

"A week later someone I was with told me that the next day someone told them if they had known my Ruger was a .22 they would have started something..... funny how stupid some people are"


You must have been at a DemonRat function. :o)


46 posted on 10/25/2004 9:25:55 AM PDT by rem22-250 (Evil usually prevails...Unless Good is very strong...."Bones")
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To: Ladysmith

In my opinion the M1911a1 is the finest pistol ever designed and still takes the cake as gunpowder's number one single-handed man-stopper. Boy, will I get an argument on that. It was created as an answer to the failure of government issued .38 revolvers to bring down drug-induced tibesmen during the Phillipine insurection. Not so user-friendly perhaps as the 9mm, it remains compact, powerful, reliable and more "pointable" than any other pistol, with the possile exception of the Peacemaker or Lugar.


47 posted on 10/25/2004 9:26:13 AM PDT by Parsiphal
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To: Parsiphal

God Bless John Moses Browning 1911 inventor


48 posted on 10/25/2004 9:27:42 AM PDT by rem22-250 (Evil usually prevails...Unless Good is very strong...."Bones")
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To: Another-MA-Conservative

Yes, that short shotgun with front and rear pistol grips is legal, even in the Peoples Republic of Maryland.


49 posted on 10/25/2004 9:28:49 AM PDT by Stashiu ( Yeah, I am a Vietnam Vet, not a War Criminal.)
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To: Wisconsin

Good for geese in Ohio too......


50 posted on 10/25/2004 9:32:12 AM PDT by showme_the_Glory (No more rhyming, and I mean it! ..Anybody got a peanut.....)
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