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MSNBC: Santorum Stabs Us In The Back...AGAIN! Rick "Rounding Up" Judiciary Chair Votes For Specter!
GrassrootsPA ^ | 11/17/04 | GrassrootsPA

Posted on 11/17/2004 10:45:21 AM PST by GeneralHavoc

First he single-handedly cost Toomey the race, and now this!

If this report is correct, Rick Santorum has a LOT of explaining to do...

MSNBC:

Although a staunch foe of abortion and same-sex marriage, Santorum helped Specter win re-election this year and according to Specter, has been rounding up support for him as Judiciary chairman.

"Sen. Santorum has been enormously helpful," said Specter Tuesday. "He's gone above and beyond the call of duty. My number one priority in the next two years is to reelect Sen. Santorum."

For conservative voters who may dominate in the 2008 GOP primaries, one doubts that this would really be an appealing campaign slogan: "Rick Santorum: The man who brought you Arlen Specter."


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; Politics/Elections; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: professionalvictims; santorum; shutup; specter; victimology
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1 posted on 11/17/2004 10:45:21 AM PST by GeneralHavoc
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To: GeneralHavoc

Bummer. At least he is loyal.


2 posted on 11/17/2004 10:46:13 AM PST by Reagan79 (Ralph Stanley Rocks!)
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To: Reagan79

Thanks Rick. You sold us out.


3 posted on 11/17/2004 10:47:06 AM PST by GeneralHavoc (Stop Specter From Blocking Bush's Judges! Visit StopSpecterNow.com!)
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To: GeneralHavoc


I'm the biggest Spector hater here, I know all about his history.


I have thought it over, and I have put my faith in Arlen Spector to do the right thing, re: let Bush's nominees come to vote.

Spector will do the right thing if he has the chair.


(This coming from someone who would spit on Spector if I ever met him, people who know me on here know this!)



4 posted on 11/17/2004 10:47:27 AM PST by Josh in PA
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To: GeneralHavoc
"For conservative voters who may dominate in the 2008 GOP primaries, one doubts that this would really be an appealing campaign slogan: "Rick Santorum: The man who brought you Arlen Specter."

Ditto for the slogan: "Rick Santorum: The man ENDORSED by Arlen Specter."

5 posted on 11/17/2004 10:48:23 AM PST by intolerancewillNOTbetolerated (I suck at my current job, so PROMOTE me. - Peter-Principle Kerry)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Would it be irrational to at least lay out the pros and cons of all this? Is there NO chance that Santorum is making a calculated move in the pursuit of goals we share? The knee jerk is to say he's betrayed us, but are we sure of that?


6 posted on 11/17/2004 10:48:26 AM PST by Huck (The day will come when liberals will complain that chess is too violent .)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Those knives in the back really smarts, right Trent Lott, Orrin Hatch and Rick Santorum? You'll be needing the conservatives once again in just awhile. Remember that turkeys!


7 posted on 11/17/2004 10:49:05 AM PST by lilylangtree (Veni, Vidi, Vici)
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To: GeneralHavoc

I am really a big Rick Santorum fan. When I worked on Capital Hill he was such a nice and passionate guy, and always kind to me. I am a little dissapointed by this, but maybe Specter will step up and let the monkey business slide.


8 posted on 11/17/2004 10:50:18 AM PST by Reagan79 (Ralph Stanley Rocks!)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Well, Arlen, the conservatives might have another agenda in '06, after this double-cross by Santorum. If I were having to beg for my job, I'd have the sense to keep my mouth shut. I'm beginning to suspect Hellery let Arlen have a copy of someone's FBI files in order to help another leftist in his hour of need.


9 posted on 11/17/2004 10:50:43 AM PST by kittymyrib
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To: Josh in PA
Specter (this is the correct spelling) will get the job done for the President. He is totally compromiseed.

Our job is to keep the heat on him, and raise expectations if necessary.

Look at it this way: a more conservative chair would operate under a constant, daily assault from the MSM, thus slowing the pace of confirmations. Specter, by contrast, will provide an effective foil for Bush and his nominees.

Strategery.

10 posted on 11/17/2004 10:51:55 AM PST by mwl1
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To: GeneralHavoc
"Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer. "

Santorum is following the above motto. A neutered Specter is better than a jumping Specter.

Politics requires a strong stomach, since in order to accomplish anything, honest politicians must deal with snakes.

And make no mistake. Specter is a snake temporarily defanged. He'll wait for his change to bite us back later.

So, yes, I would have preferred no Specter at all, but I also understand Santorum's dilemma.

11 posted on 11/17/2004 10:52:18 AM PST by george wythe
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To: kittymyrib

My view is that Santorum figures he has to move to the left to be reelected in Pennsylvania, and he has begun that process by backing Specter. And thus another RINO is born.


12 posted on 11/17/2004 10:52:34 AM PST by gaspar
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To: GeneralHavoc
Uh? Specter goes through the wringer, and everyone goes to the mat to save his nomination. Then, perhaps, he's back in the fold for owing something to Bush, etc.

Or, if he gets brutally knocked off, he has a new shiny axe to grind on every other senate vote.

Not saying it's good, but it's politics.

13 posted on 11/17/2004 10:52:51 AM PST by sam_paine (X .................................)
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To: GeneralHavoc
So let me get this straight...we hate it when Sens. Collins, Specter, Snowe, and Chaffe don't take the party line and instead take a stand based on their principles...but we also hate it when Santourum sticks to the party line and abandons his principles. I don't get it...its right sometimes, but not others?

Sen. Santorum is our best ally in the Senate, if he thinks Specter will be an acceptable choice I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.
14 posted on 11/17/2004 10:53:06 AM PST by matymac (The NEA = Neo Elitist A*sholes)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Specter must have something on Santorum. Wonder what it could be.


15 posted on 11/17/2004 10:53:40 AM PST by IM2MAD
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To: Josh in PA
I reluctantly agree.

What is happening here, is that the Senate is closing ranks in the face of special interest interference. They, the Senators believe that it would be perceived badly if they cave.

It was written on the wall in bold marker before this began and is playing out as I suspected.

All in all, Specter has been warned, and in politics a wounded politician is not a good thing, but I have faith that they can keep him in line.

Reality bites, but this mess must come to a conclusion where everyone feels like they won. That is politics.

So it is written.

16 posted on 11/17/2004 10:54:45 AM PST by Cold Heat (There is more to do! "Mr. Kerry, about that Navy discharge?")
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To: IM2MAD

Please. Specter has nothing on Rick. Now that Specter has made his deal to support the President, Rick is doing what he should be doing.

We are a big tent. We accomplish nothing in the minority.

And the President will get his district, appellate and Supreme Court justices with Arlen Specter as judiciary chair. Ain't life ironic and politics interesting.


17 posted on 11/17/2004 10:56:18 AM PST by mwl1
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To: GeneralHavoc

If Spectre tries blocking ANY Bush judge, I'll get the torches if someone else will provide the pitchforks!


18 posted on 11/17/2004 10:56:47 AM PST by trubluolyguy (Pajamajadeen?!!? Hell with that, Freep nude!)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Oh,please give us a break. I was as worried as anybody after the post-election statement Specter made. But since then he's been neutered as an opponent of any conservative judges. Every word he utters in hearings will be analyzed to the nth degree for the slightest back-tracking on his pledge to move every nominee to the floor for a vote.

If we're going to be a majority, governing party we can't be terrified of anyone who may hold differing opinions on specific issues as long as they stick to a basic level of fairness towards the president's nominees.

That's the mistake the Rats have made demanding an ideological purity that's ended up chasing the moderate/conservatives like Zell Miller and others from their ranks. If we do the same we'll suffer the same fate.


19 posted on 11/17/2004 10:57:04 AM PST by Neville72
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To: GeneralHavoc

I wouldn't worry about Specter anymore.
He's been forced back on his heels to make concessons.
While it is apparent Specter will get the chair, the grassroots movement accomplished its goals.

Now we have the best of both worlds.
Specter will not be an obstacle to Bush's appointments, but he will give a "moderate" face to the proceedings. When Bush's appointments get through Specter, the Democrats will have no basis to block them. They won't be able to call them "extremists" who got a rubber stamp from a compliant conservative panel.

After giving it much thought, I have come to the conclusion that Specter chairing the judicial committee will be for the best. Thanks to the efforts of conservatives, and the defense of Specter by his senate collegues, Specter will be sure to be a team player, knowing that he is in debted to his fellow Republicans for giving him the chance. In the end, confirmation will actually be quicker and easier. With the "maverick" Specter's approval, the Democrats will be defanged.


20 posted on 11/17/2004 10:57:37 AM PST by counterpunch (The CouNTeRPuNcH Collection - www.counterpunch.us)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Got a beef? E-mail here:

http://santorum.senate.gov/emailrjs.html


21 posted on 11/17/2004 10:58:03 AM PST by shiva
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To: GeneralHavoc

Of course, one would have to actually believe what Spectre is saying in order to believe he is helping.


22 posted on 11/17/2004 10:58:21 AM PST by SoDak (Home of Senator John Thune)
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To: george wythe
A neutered Specter is better than a jumping Specter

I buy that. If Specter was denied the chairmanship then he may opt for payback. This way, nonpublic promises will bridle him. He can always be removed if he POs hsi fellow GOPers.

Mike

23 posted on 11/17/2004 10:58:26 AM PST by MichaelP
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To: Josh in PA

Mt friend, I agree with you. While I'm NOT happy, I do believe that Santorum merits the benefits of our collective doubts. Yes, we can indded rationalize this, sayig that Specter has boxed himself in, and thus, having Arlen as point person may give some Dems "cover" to vote for the president's nominees.<P. One point to rememebr.. I assime that the nomination for the new AH will be the first on the committe calendar..How he does with THAT one will be important..


24 posted on 11/17/2004 10:58:29 AM PST by ken5050
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To: GeneralHavoc

Well, golly, surprize, surprize, surpriZe!


25 posted on 11/17/2004 10:59:17 AM PST by 68 grunt (3/1 India, 3rd, 68-69, 0311)
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To: GeneralHavoc

If they give specter the chair and he so much as looks at any of the nominees sideways they should remove him.

If they don't and he derails a conservative appointment then the GOP majority will end in 2006.


26 posted on 11/17/2004 11:00:32 AM PST by Bikers4Bush (Flood waters rising, heading for more conservative ground. Vote for true conservatives!)
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To: GeneralHavoc
Where are the Bishops who wanted to deny Communion to Kerry? How many of them have been bold enough to advocate the denial of the Eurcharist to Sen Santorum and every other Catholic Senator who would vote for Specter?

Voting for pro-abortion Specter is no different than voting for pro-abortion Kerry, in fact it's worse - Specter could do more damage to pro-life.

27 posted on 11/17/2004 11:01:04 AM PST by ex-snook (Moral values - The GOP must now walk the talk - no excuses.)
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To: GeneralHavoc

Yet one more piece of proof that Washington politicians really operate as a separate and distinct class from the rest of us, when push comes to shove.

MM


28 posted on 11/17/2004 11:01:36 AM PST by MississippiMan (Americans should not be sacrificed on the altar of political correctness.)
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To: ken5050

I remember back in Feb. 2000, GWB was being bashed for betraying the conservatives that had put him in office. Here we go again!


29 posted on 11/17/2004 11:01:53 AM PST by WildTurkey
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To: GeneralHavoc
Spectre is relatively contained. He can even be useful to us by providing a liberal seal of approval on conservative nominees.

Don't take it out on Santorum. That's called eating your own.

30 posted on 11/17/2004 11:02:41 AM PST by JohnnyZ ("Thought I was having trouble with my adding. It's all right now." - Clint Eastwood)
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To: All

I became a big fan of Rick Santorum this last year. I just have to accept that he and Frist and others have decided that it would be better to put Specter at chairman than fight the crap they would face from MSM.

There was a press conference this morning and ALL the media asked about was Specter and the press conference was not about that. Then, after it was over, the media surrounded Santorum and kept asking him over and over questions he couldn't answer. He was getting so frustrated and finally just had to walk off. When the media smell blood, they just won't let go.

Since I make it a priority to watch C-span, I will be monitoring what they LET US SEE. Unfortunately, a lot that goes on is behind closed doors.

I think we all just need to hope Santorum knows what he is doing and wait and watch Specter.


31 posted on 11/17/2004 11:04:25 AM PST by Txsleuth (Proud to be a Texan)
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To: Josh in PA
I have thought it over, and I have put my faith in Arlen Spector to do the right thing, re: let Bush's nominees come to vote.

I'm curious, why do you believe this? I only ask because you seem to hate Specter, so for you to say that, seems like you know something.

32 posted on 11/17/2004 11:04:46 AM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: ex-snook
Thats stretching it...IMHO
Kerry would have appointed th Judges, Specter will not be doing any appointing. He's wounded and in no position to deny any judges an up or down vote. Lets trust our allies in the Senate and if Specter proves to be a problem...he gets booted. Better to have him in a corner than grinding an Axe!
33 posted on 11/17/2004 11:04:50 AM PST by matymac (The NEA = Neo Elitist A*sholes)
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To: GeneralHavoc
lunchtime bump for later read

see the Anti-DNC portal at;

http://www.noDNC.com
34 posted on 11/17/2004 11:05:39 AM PST by woodb01 (Take out the 'dnC'BS "news" trash... SEE ---> http://www.noDNC.com)
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To: Neville72

Oh,please give us a break. I was as worried as anybody after the post-election statement Specter made. But since then he's been neutered as an opponent of any conservative judges. Every word he utters in hearings will be analyzed to the nth degree for the slightest back-tracking on his pledge to move every nominee to the floor for a vote. "

True. This is a 'win by losing' moment, where the cage is rattled enough to serve notice.

The downside is that Specter is untrustworthy and wrong on far more than just judges... we need a solid GOP majority in the committee to get good tort reform legislation, etc.


35 posted on 11/17/2004 11:05:49 AM PST by WOSG
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To: Josh in PA
Spector will do the right thing if he has the chair.

That, and two bucks will get you a cuppa coffee.

36 posted on 11/17/2004 11:06:56 AM PST by JesseHousman (Execute Mumia Abu-Jamal)
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To: matymac

I agree with you. I will defer my judgement at the moment. Santorum will do the right thing.


37 posted on 11/17/2004 11:07:04 AM PST by jbstrick (This tagline has passed the "Global Test")
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To: FourtySeven

Perhaps Specter cares more about the Chairmanship than he does the shape of the judiciary???


38 posted on 11/17/2004 11:07:21 AM PST by katieanna (Beloved, let us love one another.)
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To: Josh in PA

Why do you believe this? Specter will not run for relection and he has an agenda. So why would he possibly do the right thing now when he hasn't before? I would love to believe what you're saying, but I see no logical reason to. Unfortunately.


39 posted on 11/17/2004 11:07:36 AM PST by twigs
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To: GeneralHavoc
If Arlen is FOR you, there is something wrong with you..
Rick:... whats next.. is Al Gore in your camp too ?..
40 posted on 11/17/2004 11:08:25 AM PST by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to included some fully orbed hyperbole....)
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To: Cold Heat

"What is happening here, is that the Senate is closing ranks in the face of special interest interference. They, the Senators believe that it would be perceived badly if they cave."

I agree totally with you.

Unfortunately, as was proven in the Clinton impeachment, the Republican House members have all the backbone and cojones. The Senate Repubs, for the most part, are a bunch of spineless eunuchs.


41 posted on 11/17/2004 11:09:33 AM PST by ZULU (Fear the government which fears your guns. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: GeneralHavoc
Now of course we will hear from the "But if he does anything wrong we will have him removed as chairman", as I see it most so called Republicans have the backbone of a jelly fish. It's this very sort of attitude that gave us CFR. But that's ok, come next election cycle the ones that voted for Specter will be looking elsewhere for work.

Not that I expected the Vote Whores to do what we elected them for anyway. This on top of them wanting to raise the Debt. ceiling tells me all I need to know about most of the idiots in power.

42 posted on 11/17/2004 11:11:00 AM PST by JustAnAmerican (Being Independent means never having to say you're Partisan)
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To: katieanna
Perhaps Specter cares more about the Chairmanship than he does the shape of the judiciary???

An interesting point. Wouldn't put it past the shmuck to be so child-like. I find it difficult to trust him though when right after the elections, I mean right after, he came out and virtually said that there could be some problems with Bush's nominations. I mean, Bush campaigned hard for him, and this is how he repays him.

I find it hard to trust a man who would so quickly stab the back of one of his allies. Along those lines, if I were Rick Santorum, I wouldn't really be counting on Arlen's support when it comes time for reelection, if even the slightest, scandalous news is attached to me in the intervening time.

43 posted on 11/17/2004 11:12:29 AM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: JustAnAmerican

Senator Santorum
202-224-6324


44 posted on 11/17/2004 11:13:00 AM PST by GeneralHavoc (Stop Specter From Blocking Bush's Judges! Visit StopSpecterNow.com!)
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To: GeneralHavoc
Sen. Santorum has been enormously helpful," said Specter Tuesday.

My '08 ticket was Bush/Santorum. Who's left?

45 posted on 11/17/2004 11:14:31 AM PST by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Huck; Josh in PA

I think you and Josh are on to something -- Santorum will not sell conservatives out. You can bet he has extracted a pretty hefty price from Specter in order to become Chairman. I know Inhofe stated that if Specter crosses the line, the votes are there to oust him, and he will lead the charge.

Bet the Bush nominees sail through the Senate with everyone watching Specter -- he either gets on board with the Bush agenda or gets out of the way. Believe he decided that getting with the agenda was a better option.

Like Josh, I don't like Specter either.


46 posted on 11/17/2004 11:15:13 AM PST by PhiKapMom (AOII Mom -- Thanks Oklahomans for giving Pres Bush the win in all our counties!)
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To: Aquinasfan

I am starting to like Hagel. Maybe Sanford?


47 posted on 11/17/2004 11:15:23 AM PST by GeneralHavoc (Stop Specter From Blocking Bush's Judges! Visit StopSpecterNow.com!)
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To: PhiKapMom

Santorum not sell out conservatives?

Pat Toomey anyone?

That man lost to Specter BECAUSE of Santorum!


48 posted on 11/17/2004 11:16:32 AM PST by GeneralHavoc (Stop Specter From Blocking Bush's Judges! Visit StopSpecterNow.com!)
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To: gaspar
My view is that Santorum figures he has to move to the left to be reelected in Pennsylvania, and he has begun that process by backing Specter.

My guess too.

49 posted on 11/17/2004 11:16:40 AM PST by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Josh in PA
Aahhh...a voice of reason! There is wisdom in picking one's battles. The "moderate" and "extreme" right wings both need to understand that NEITHER of them singlehandedly elected the President; either one without the other would have failed. Don't let the oppostion drive a wedge between us!
50 posted on 11/17/2004 11:17:45 AM PST by Ike
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