During this time, Air America also sprayed defoliants for the CIA in combat operations against Thai insurgents on the Isthmus of Kra.
Posted on 12/18/2004 1:06:55 PM PST by Destro
SPECULATION: Before the elections in the Ukraine, from my readings Yushchenko was seen as the pro-EU more so than the pro-American candidate. Yushchenko's party was against the Ukraine sending troops to Iraq (which the man many Freepers call a KGB thug, the current Prime Minister Yanukovich supported) and promised to WITHDRAW Ukrainian troops from Iraq (so he can be more in line with the EU policies).
So maybe Yushchenko was poisoned because some (maybe an agency which has been known to go rogue sometimes and has bungled assassinations in the past) feared Yushchenko would withdraw troops from Iraq like Spain did if his pOrange bloc won the elections? See below:
Ukraine's Supreme Court expected to rule on disputed presidential election; parliament votes to pull troops from Iraq
NATASHA LISOVA, Associated Press Writer
Friday, December 3, 2004
Ukraine's Supreme Court on Friday retired to rule on opposition candidate Viktor Yushchenko's appeal to cancel results of the disputed presidential election, and the parliament voted to pull the country's 1,600 troops out of Iraq.
The recall vote was another indication that President Leonid Kuchma, who ordered the troop deployment, was losing his grip on power amid opposition allegations that he had discredited himself by rushing to Moscow on Thursday for consultations with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
Earlier in the year parliament voted against recalling troops, and earlier this week the body passed a no-confidence measure telling Kuchma to disband the government of Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych, his deputy. The recall vote was nonbinding but pressures Kuchma to act.
"Kuchma's meeting with Putin was humiliating for our society," said Mykhailo Melnichuk, a Socialist Party lawmaker.
(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...
But do not simplify the situation in Ukraine. It is not a struggle of a pro-American opposition against a pro-Moscow political elite. While Yushchenko is unquestionably a pro-American politician, the same can equally be said of the present rulers of the Ukrainian republic.
After all, it was current President Leonid Kuchma who, together with Prime Minister Yanukovich, sent more than 1,000 Ukrainian troops to Iraq. And a number of opposition politicians criticized the sending of these soldiers.
bump
Although some plots against Castro involved attempts on his life, several others were intended to make him discredit himself in public by influencing his behavior.
One of the first methods the CIA considered for "getting rid" of Castro involved contaminating the air of the radio station where Castro broadcast his speeches with "an aerosol spray of a chemical that produces reactions similar to those of lysergic acid (LSD)." The idea was that Castro would flip and trip on the air, making a fool of himself via hallucinogen-inspired ranting. A member of the CIA's Technical Services Department (TSD) discouraged the scheme because they couldn't count on the chemical's effectiveness (IG's Report, p. 10). One can only wonder why they didn't just use some of the LSD which Eli Lilly Company offered to covertly manufacture for the CIA "in tonnage quantities" for use in their MKULTRA program. (3)
Another member of the TSD cited in the Inspector General's report recalled experiments with "psychic energizers", although he could not link those experiments to plots against Castro (IG's Report, p. 11).
One plan that came a bit closer to fruition was the Contaminated Cigar scheme, although it was aimed more at discrediting Castro than killing him. The CIA prepared a box of cigars that had been treated with "some sort of chemical." The cigars were probably "intended to produce temporary personality disorientation," according to the report. "The thought was to somehow contrive to have Castro smoke one before making a speech and then to make a public spectacle of himself." (IG's Report, p. 11)
However, WH/4 Chief J. D. Esterline recalled that the contaminated cigars may have been associated with a scheme to make Castro's beard fall out. Esterline said the cigars were never used because "they could not figure out how to deliver them without danger of blowback on the Agency." Esterline destroyed the cigars in June 1961 (IG's Report, pp. 11-12).
Another CIA plot to discredit Castro involved dusting "thallium powder into Castro's shoes when they were put out at night to be shined" during a trip he made outside Cuba. This diabolical plot co-incided with a Castro appearance on the David Susskind Show. (4) Thallium salts have depilatory effects; the CIA's plan was to "destroy Castro's image as 'The Beard' by causing the beard to fall out." The plan went as far as testing on animals, but it fell through when Castro didn't make the trip (IG's Report, page 13).
What idiocy are you pushing now?
blowback
You continue to undermine your own credibility, but what the hell, if it gets too bad you can just get another user account and start over.
Again.
And maybe the fluoride in my tap water was put there by the Trilateral Commission to undermine LaRouche supporters by sapping their precious bodily fluids and making them more susceptible to alien mind control. If you want to worship a golden statue of Comrade Putin, be my guest, but don't expect Freepers to join you.
During this time, Air America also sprayed defoliants for the CIA in combat operations against Thai insurgents on the Isthmus of Kra.
bump
And which poster is making a complete ass of himself by bringing it up?
As much evidence that the "KGB" did it - and I provided a motive along with a case history.
1,700 troops. That means another brigade needs to be deployed from the US or some other theater. Yup, that was a very pro-American move, well it was pro-West anyways: Franco-Germanic-Spanish West.
Like the Yugoslav mess that Clinton started and the 100,000 dead Albanians that never were. We all know where you stood on that one, right along with Albright and Co.
So maybe rogue Western agents poisoned the man wanting to get kraine troops out of Iraq? Remember this was back in September before the elections here.
-----------------------THREE STOOGES
U.S. authorities say they have verified the authenticity of a recording in which Kuchma is allegedly heard approving a $100 million sale of the sophisticated radar system to Iraq.He's good a comrade of the USA as is Mother Russia.The inspectors' report also mentions that an Iraqi trade delegation visited eastern Ukraine where the Kolchuhas are made in June this year. Ukrainian officials denied that any Iraqi military representatives took part, but documents contradicted that, the report said.
Ukraine also sold at least one Kolchuha system to Russia, according to the report -- raising questions about Moscow's possible role in transferring the sensitive technology to Iraq.
Marxist: the corporate interest did it because yush is for the end to workers exploitation.
New left: bush did it because he wants to pull out of iraq.
Enviro wackos: corporate polluters did it because yush is environmentalist
Islamists: jews did it because of iraq
Space alien true believers: space aliens did it because yush was covering up space alien abductions.
Russians: bush did in plot to weaken russia
The conspiracy theory ideologies allow anyone who is conversant in them to come up with something in 10 minutes that not only demegrates their perceived enemies but strengthens their belief in their particular distorted world view.
Rarely in these particular conspiracy theories is there ever mention of the actual facts of the case. Just a bunch of the old standard boilerplate re-hashed.
Link source. Kuchma and Yanukovych approved of over 1,000 Ukraine troops to go to Iraq and fought the Orange to keep them there- that is a fact
US, UK Worried Over Ukraine Arms Sales
'Kuchmagate' and Iraq (Ukraine weapons sales to Iraq) - Washington accused Ukraine of violating UN sanctions against Iraq by selling it four sophisticated Kolchuga radar system units.
At the centre of the Iraqi arms scandal stand the hundreds of hours of tapes made illicitly in the office of Ukrainian President Leonid Kuchma by security guard Mykola Melnychenko. The portion of the tapes dealing with Iraq was only released in March on the eve of the Ukrainian elections. The existence of the tape of the Iraqi radar sale was reported earlier in the year but at that stage the US still did not publicly back up the accusations. In March, shortly before the Iraq allegations surfaced, Valeriy Malyev, head of the arms export company Ukrspetseksport, died in a mysterious car accident.
The US has been careful to indicate that the re-examination of its policy towards Ukraine is primarily directed against Kuchma, not the country as a whole, which has received $2 billion in aid since 1994 and is the fourth largest recipient of US aid.
The tape, which has been authenticated by the FBI, is of a conversation between Kuchma, Malyev, and then Security Service chief Leonid Derkach (who is accused of other illegal arms sales) which took place in July 2000. In April 1999, US intelligence sources discovered that Ukraine had signed a secret agreement for military co-operation with Iraq in November 1998. In January 1999, a Ukrainian delegation led by a deputy minister visited Iraq. During the first stage of the agreement equipment identified for customs as 'agricultural' was sent to Iraq.
On the Melnychenko tape of the July 2000 meeting, Kuchma is heard giving the go ahead to sell four Kolchuga units to Iraq for $100 million. Melnychenko claims to know the name of a "high-ranking Russian official" who was also alleged to be present. If this turns out to be true, the US-Russian alliance against international terrorism could come under serious strain.
The scenario of events after the meeting follows a clear pattern that seems to confirm the Kolchuga units were indeed dispatched to Iraq. Only four days after the conversation, the government released the Kolchuga system from any export restrictions. On 9 October 2000, an agreement on trade and scientific and technical co-operation was signed with Iraq. This was ratified by the Ukrainian parliament on 15 November 2001.
Private companies from Jordan, India, France, Italy, Romania, and Turkey seem to have engaged in pos-sible WMD-related trade with Iraq.•
Italy? Our coalition partner?
Procurement Suppliers During the Decline Phase, 1991 to 1996
ISG has identifi ed entities from three countries that began supporting Iraq with illicit procurement during the post-Gulf war “decline” phase in the Regime: Romania, Ukraine, and Jordan. Romania and Ukraine had just emerged from the Soviet bloc with an excess of military hardware and expertise and a need for hard currency. The highest-levels of the Ukrainian Government were reportedly complicit in this illicit trade as demonstrated by negotia-tions conducted in regard to the sale of a Kolchuga antiaircraft radar system to Iraq in 2000.
Guess who was PM of the Ukraine at the time of the sale???? Yushchenko!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oops! You screwed up and bolstered my thesis regarding Yuschenko and Iraq!!!!
Guess who was PM of the Ukraine at the time of those sales to Iraq???? Yushchenko!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BOO-YAH!!
Look who brought up a point and shot himself in the foot?
It was Kuchma who sold Iraq the systems with Russian and Chinese help. Kuchma supports Yanukovych because he doesn't want to pay for his crimes.
And Yushchenko was the Prime Minister of Ukraine at that time and as PM had more power than that president and it was Yushchenko that was forced out of office under a corruption scandal.</p>
Yushchenko had nothing to do with the Kolchuga sale. It was Kuchma, and no Yushchenko did not have more power than Kuchma. he was forced out by Kuchma and his oligarch cronies. Now they are going to get a dose of their own medicine.
That is the facts.
Yanukovych is Kuchma's chosen successor.
Those are the facts.
You deny Yushchenko is against the sending Ukr. troops to the Iraq theater?
Maybe some did not want Yushchenko to carry out that promise?
Yanukovych is on a four-day official visit to Washington focused largely on seeking help to ease the former Soviet republic's economic woes and pressing for the United States to drop Cold War-era commercial restrictions imposed under the 1974 Jackson-Vanik amendment.
In addition to Powell, Yanukovych is to see Vice President Dick Cheney, Treasury Secretary John Snow, Commerce Secretary Donald Evans, Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham, Agriculture Secretary Ann Venemen and Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz.
His trip indicates an easing in strains in the US-Ukraine relationship which was hurt badly last year by allegations, determined by Washington to be true, that Ukrainian President Leonid Kuchma had personally approved the sale of an advanced radar system to Iraq in violation of UN sanctions.
I thank Yanukovych's support for America's Iraqi effort also. Again thanks for supporting my position. Yanukovych was not PM when said sales to Iraq are said to have happened. Yushchenko was PM at that time.
He should have listened to the warning about fair elections.
Now Ukraine has Yanukovychgate. This scandal involves a large number of audiotapes related to Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych. These tapes, which are of far better quality than those made by Mykola Melnychenko in 1999-2000, were made by the Security Service (SBU) and leaked to challenger Viktor Yushchenko days after the presidential runoff on November 21.
The audiotapes provide information as to how voting was conducted and massaged, "who directed this process and how, and why the voting dynamics changed so intricately during the presidential elections in Ukraine" (Zerkalo nedeli, November 27). The tapes also provide insight into how the Yanukovych campaign added upwards of 2 million votes -- and raised turnout by 19% -- in Donetsk oblast between rounds one and two. In comparison, turnout increased by only 3% in Lviv, Yushchenko's base.
The audiotapes provide information as to how voting was conducted and massaged, "who directed this process and how, and why the voting dynamics changed so intricately during the presidential elections in Ukraine" (Zerkalo nedeli, November 27). The tapes also provide insight into how the Yanukovych campaign added upwards of 2 million votes -- and raised turnout by 19% -- in Donetsk oblast between rounds one and two. In comparison, turnout increased by only 3% in Lviv, Yushchenko's base.
Unlike some of the Melnychenko tapes, the voices on these new recordings are clearly identifiable. These figures include Kluyev, Viktor Medvedchuk (head of the presidential administration), Sergei Kivalov (chairman of the Central Election Commission [CEC]), Sergei Kluyev, "political technologist" Yuriy Levenetz, and long-time Yanukovych adviser Eduard Prutnik.
One of the most interesting sections on the tapes is a conversation about how the official results in round two were to be "massaged." One conversation, early in the evening on election day and three days before the official results were released by the CEC, describes how, "We agreed about 3-3.5% difference to our advantage". It is unlikely that it is a mere coincidence that the CEC declared Yanukovych victor with a 2.72% lead.
The audiotapes provide concrete evidence of the existence of a "transit server" whose purpose was to manipulate the results as they were sent from local Territorial Election Commissions (TECs) to the CEC. The "transit server" was based in the presidential administration. - LINK
So what? Kuchma is on his way out. And Yushchenko was PM at that time.
Another thing, where was NATO during 911? Most of NATO gave us their "moral" support and that was it and that was also it on Afghanistan and still is.
Yushchenko was poisoned a long time ago. Yanukovych adopted Yushchenko's anti-Iraq deployment position (he was for it before) when he saw how popular an issue it became in the Ukraine as the election tightened.
The United States has changed its attitude to Ukraine several times during the presidential election campaign.
On the one hand, some top-ranking Americans must have been disappointed in what they called Viktor Yushchenko’s indistinct position. On the other hand, solid PR agencies must have played a considerable role in whitewashing Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych’s image. Besides, Yanukovych demonstrated the “desirable” position with regard to the Iraqi issue.
Many Ukrainians believe that the Ukrainian troops were deployed to Iraq to buy indulgence for Leonid Kuchma after the “tape” and the “Kolchuga” scandals. As you know, Yushchenko promises to withdraw the Ukrainian contingent from Iraq as soon as he is elected President. And Yanukovych only talks of cutting troops and only after the Iraqi election. Whose position is more acceptable to the United States?
The United States has repeatedly expressed gratitude to President Kuchma and the Verkhovna Rada for the wise decision to join the coalition in Iraq. We believe that terrorism is not only a threat to America, but also to the entire civilized world, including Ukraine. We understand that the deployment of the contingent was a step by the government which really contributed to improving relations between our countries, and that it aroused debates in Ukraine. We highly appreciate the Prime Minister’s position with regard to Iraq, but we also understand that neither candidate is ready to withdraw the Ukrainian contingent immediately. They both are well aware of the need to consult their allies before making a decision. And we also appreciate this in both candidates’ positions.
Not exactly the same position. From an American standpoint who would you want to win?
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