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Tough Assignment: Teaching Evolution To Fundamentalists
Ft. Wayne Journal Gazette ^ | 03 December 2004 | SHARON BEGLEY

Posted on 12/18/2004 5:56:30 PM PST by PatrickHenry

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To: js1138
I'm sure Physicst and Radio Astronomer are quaking in their boots from the blow you have struck. Are you of the opinion that the speed of light has been modified in the laboratory?

That is my understanding. If light can be slowed down that drastically, then one cannot state that the speed of light is necessarily constant or equal when coming from any given source compared to any other source. Between that and the red shift issue, that pretty much blows any confidence in results based on light time and leaves only Geometric projections which are of no confidence over infinite distances. The precision of the angles at base become a guess and thusly precision in general erodes.

641 posted on 12/20/2004 3:47:20 PM PST by Havoc (Reagan was right and so was McKinley. Down with free trade.)
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To: js1138

What's keeping the spotted owl from moving say from the redwoods to the transplanted eucalypti groves next door and turning into kookaburras


642 posted on 12/20/2004 3:49:44 PM PST by D Edmund Joaquin (Karenga says Kwanzaa is an "oppositional alternative" to Christianity - which he calls "spookism")
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To: Havoc
That is my understanding.

What if your understanding is wrong? Have you read and understood the research papers, or are you relying on reports in the popular press?

Are you aware of the difference between the measured speed of light and the theoretical speed in a vacuum? Do you have any understanding of the conditions under which the measured speed is slowed, and can you relate this to interstellar distances?

Do you know anything at all about how interstellar distances have been measured? Do you believe everything depends on red shift?

643 posted on 12/20/2004 3:52:47 PM PST by js1138 (D*mn, I Missed!)
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To: js1138
Jonathan Edwards, perhaps the greatest Christian theologian America has ever produced, died of the side effects of a badly prepared inoculation. Louis Pasteur was a Christian who believed that God was the Creator, as was Joseph Lister, who pioneered modern sanitation in medicine.

Where are the "entire sects" of Christianity that believe that diseases are not caused by germs? As far as that goes, there are atheists who believe in mass murder to promote social justice, called Communists, and there were pagans who believed in mass murder in order to purify the Aryan race, called Nazis. Would you imply that atheists and pagans advocate genocide?

644 posted on 12/20/2004 3:55:39 PM PST by Wallace T.
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To: Havoc

And if you don't intend to answer these questions, at least indicate why.

How old is the earth, and in what way is the scientific estimate "not scientific"?

Where did the water for the global flood come from and where did it go, and how are the scientific calculations on this subject "not scientific"?

What exactly is a species, and how is science wrong in defining species?

What is the biological barrier preventing variation from becoming speciation, and exactly how does this barrier function?

Does selection occur ever? Has it been observed? If so, where does the information come from that makes selection work?

How does the growth of a fertilized egg occur within the confines of the Second Law of Thermodynamics?


645 posted on 12/20/2004 3:56:45 PM PST by js1138 (D*mn, I Missed!)
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To: balrog666

To quote Peggy Lee, is that all there is? To quote John Lennon, you then believe that there is no hell below us, and above us only sky?


646 posted on 12/20/2004 3:58:08 PM PST by Wallace T.
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To: Wallace T.

>>Where are the "entire sects" of Christianity that believe that diseases are not caused by germs? <<

The following is a summary of the basic religious beliefs of Christian Science; it is based on an evaluation of the religious text of Christian Science, Science and Health With the Key to Scriptures (1971 edition) by Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science:


The physical body is not real; it is merely a false idea, or image of the mind - an "error" of the mind.
The only true reality is "Divine Mind," God, Love. However, according to Christian Science, there is a false state of mind called "mortal mind;" this mortal mind or false consciousness then produces the false belief that the physical world and the physical body are real. There is no reality to physical things; they are merely false thought.

Disease, evil and death are opposite to good or God. Only God is real; therefore, disease, evil and death do not exist - except as false thoughts.

Sickness occurs only because false "mortal mind" believes in the existence of the physical body and that the physical body can become sick. Disease only occurs if we believe it can occur.

Sickness, as a false thought, will cease when a person realizes the thought was false: that there can be no disease because sickness is physical and there is no reality to the physical. The only reality is Spiritual, God; God being perfect can only create perfection; man cannot be sick because sickness is imperfection and God cannot create imperfection. Sickness is a false thought. By giving up the false thought and returning to divine mind, the false thought of mortal mind, i.e. sickness, vanishes.

Source: http://www.masskids.org/dbre/dbre_a3.html


647 posted on 12/20/2004 4:00:03 PM PST by js1138 (D*mn, I Missed!)
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To: js1138

Why do the eucalypti groves not "sense" a change in the air in Marin county? Don't they know they're going to bulldoze them all down? Now, if they begin to offer the spotted kookaburra owl a haven, they will get to live on, that's evolution, that'sa that thing where two species mutually benefit each other


648 posted on 12/20/2004 4:00:07 PM PST by D Edmund Joaquin (Karenga says Kwanzaa is an "oppositional alternative" to Christianity - which he calls "spookism")
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To: Wallace T.

I was responding to your assertion that "No faith" would deny a hot stove burns. This might be true, but there are faiths that deny physical evidence that most of us accept.


649 posted on 12/20/2004 4:03:18 PM PST by js1138 (D*mn, I Missed!)
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To: Dimensio
Dimensio I do not have time to type all relevant Scripture.

The Book of Proverbs, Book of Ecclesiastes, Matthew 7.

I have had a long day and I will give more thought to a specific test. IF you have access to these and choose to read fine if not that is fine as well.
650 posted on 12/20/2004 4:03:21 PM PST by Just mythoughts
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To: Wallace T.
I close my eyes, only for a moment and the moment's gone.
All my dreams pass before my eyes in curiosity.
Dust in the wind.
All they are is dust in the wind.
Same old song.
Just a drop of water in an endless sea.
All we do crumbles to the ground, though we refuse to see.
Dust in the wind.
All we are is dust in the wind.

Don't hang on, nothing lasts forever but the earth and sky.
It slips away and all your money won't another minute buy. Dust in the wind.
All we are is dust in the wind.
Dust in the wind.
Everything is dust in the wind.
651 posted on 12/20/2004 4:03:26 PM PST by balrog666 (The invisible and the nonexistent look very much alike.)
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To: D Edmund Joaquin
So all Creationists to you, are functionally illiterate? Seems rather, shall we dare say it? Small minded and bigoted

It was not what I think, but what is, that counts.

652 posted on 12/20/2004 4:03:43 PM PST by WildTurkey
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To: Wallace T.
The fact that I accept the propositions of the Bible, in their historical and grammatical context and in light of authorial intent, as the ultimate truth has no bearing on my concept of God or the physical universe.

I made this statement in error. Actually, my concept of God is derived from the Bible. However, my concept of the physical universe is primarily derived from mu observation and my understanding and acceptance of conclusions of scientists, except where there occurs a contradiction, in which case I must choose divine revelation over human. I am in good company: Thomas Aquinas, for example.

653 posted on 12/20/2004 4:05:24 PM PST by Wallace T.
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To: D Edmund Joaquin

I'd appreciate it if you would stop posting to me. You are asking questions that are completely off topic. If you want to ask these questions, please cite a reference from a science journal that indicates evolution predicts what you are asking about.


654 posted on 12/20/2004 4:05:37 PM PST by js1138 (D*mn, I Missed!)
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To: Havoc
Being a YEC requires disbelief in the entire base of scientific knowledge.

An utter nonsensical lie. Do you ever open your mouth to utter other than this kind of garbage?

I think you have major problems with geology, astronomy, physics, biology, ... Right?

655 posted on 12/20/2004 4:05:50 PM PST by WildTurkey
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To: Havoc
Being a YEC requires disbelief in the entire base of scientific knowledge.

An utter nonsensical lie. Do you ever open your mouth to utter other than this kind of garbage?

I think you have major problems with geology, astronomy, physics, biology, ... Right?

656 posted on 12/20/2004 4:06:22 PM PST by WildTurkey
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To: js1138

Welll, you demand that we answer your questions, but I did not realize we don't get to ask any ourselves. We are to be the dumbdumbs. Sorry


657 posted on 12/20/2004 4:07:53 PM PST by D Edmund Joaquin (Karenga says Kwanzaa is an "oppositional alternative" to Christianity - which he calls "spookism")
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To: Dataman
Are you implying that being an evolutionist, then, requires a significant arrogance, bigotry and willful ignorance of creationism?

No. I was implying that being a YEC requires a significant arrogance, bigotry and willful ignornance of scientific query.

658 posted on 12/20/2004 4:08:09 PM PST by WildTurkey
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To: WildTurkey

An I appresate youre seting me strate


659 posted on 12/20/2004 4:08:57 PM PST by D Edmund Joaquin (Karenga says Kwanzaa is an "oppositional alternative" to Christianity - which he calls "spookism")
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To: Havoc
When was evolution first required in public schools?

Still that ignorant huh. Can you add? Subtract? I thought it was Creationists you guys said couldn't do simple math or sum such.

Still evading, I see.

660 posted on 12/20/2004 4:09:39 PM PST by WildTurkey
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