Skip to comments.Kibble for Thought: Dog diversity prompts new evolution theory
Posted on 12/21/2004 8:45:42 AM PST by PatrickHenry
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"It doesn't? Gee, a lot of horse farms will be interested to know that their horses ain't horses."
Don't be silly!
The distinction is, of course, that horses (with the possible exception of, say, Shetland ponies and Clysdales) can naturally breed, and would not have to rely on artificial reproduction, as would a Mastiff and a Taco Bell dog.
The scientific definition of a "species" is well known; it's not mine.
To take the issue to a less emotional topic than inter-primate breeding, Google "Liger" and see what you find.
Pomeranians were bred down from close to 30 pounds in Queen Victorias day to the present 6 or 7 pounds. Mine is a larger weighing in at about 11 pounds but he still thinks hes a giant sled dog of the North as his ancestors were when they pulled sledges in Lapland.
He will take on any dog that offers a challenge, even taking out an adult Rottweiler several years ago when he was much younger and it better shape.
Did you know that there are two kinds of horse-mule crosses? The most useful is when a donkey male meets horse female--but donkey females can carry the offspring of a horse male. The usual sure-footed and intelligent mule is the offspring of a horse female. The other kind is less useful, harder to manage.
That a Irish Wolhound male would produce a killing offspring in a toy poodle female--I don't doubt. But this is a matter of size, rather than breed.
You hate dogs ONLY because you haven't met mine yet. I tell people who hate fish that it is only because they have never caught a fish and eaten it the same day. Those store bought fish are old. Same thing with dogs, mine are so WONDERFUL you would change your mind and want one. ;9)
If you thought things through, you would see how patently ridiculous these assertions are. The evidence screams out against it.
Darwinism really has taken on the mentality of the Left.
While mules are sterile, they can be nominally male and female. The males are called "jacks", the females "jenny."
You can also cross other horse breeds--there have been known zebra-jackass crossings, a useless and misbegotton creature. All sterile.
Oh, I just hate little dogs. I love real dogs. I have a 6 month old rhodesian ridgeback - 45 pounds - on the way to 80-85 pounds. She is the greatest.
"In vitro" is different from "in vivo" from "in the wild." (Seems the Romans were very civilized, no Latin for "in the wild.")"
Doesn't matter, be in IVF or mere artificial insemination (in vivo) ---- any artificial joining necessary for breeding means that animals are not the same species, per the definition.
Now, this is not the ONLY distinction for two species, which is to what I presume you are alluding.
For example, lions and tigers (unarguably two distinct species of cat) sometimes mate in zoos --- resulting in a Liger --- with no artificial help, other than being locked up together.
But, I am keeping the issue simple and not talking about all the other factors that go into defining a "species" --- as natural reproduction is necessary to be the same species.
If one of them is a Calvinist or a Catholic it'd be even more fun. Especially if they were also an immigrant.
What's a Poofist? Does that mean the Big Bang, when everything went Bang and Poof?
I like the pig best.
We use mules and donkeys to protect our sheep from coyotes.
Not all mules are sterile.
Poor Isaac Assimov's was, of course. Best series of books I ever read.
A baby pig is endearing. But he loses his appeal mighty fast.
Mules not sterile? Well, you need to get your jack and jenny together and make some history.
Guess I'd better not tell Hope the Vicious what you said:
What kind of sheep do you raise?
Species is a interesting concept. Ring species shows that "can interbreed with" is not a transitive concept.
Then they become bacon and sauage and bar b que. WoHooooooo!
You forgot salt-cured and Smithfield.
There is a use for everything but the oink.
It's very rare, but it does happen that you get a non-sterile mule.
Note it says "almost always sterile."
Looks like lunch for my Weim!
Yeah, that could be it.
Creationists are basing their "Theory" on the basis of a demonstrably non-linear source. Non-linear implying, outside of our time domain. The 100% accuracy of Biblical prophecy was all the authority needed to convince Sir Issac Newton to take a Creationist perspective in all of his research and discoveries.
"Poofists" with the only rational, intellectually honest perspective on reality.
Is that short for Weimaranerrammerjammeriner?
Most modern domesticated sheep breeds can no longer shed their wool. If they are not shorn regularly, they will die from the weight and burden of the long wool.
A recent example from the news: Shrek, captured after six years on the run, before being shorn.
We mainly have Delaines, but we also have some meat sheep.
Actually, we've been making the most money off of goats lately. Send a lot to the middle east for them to sacrifice to their moon god.
Do you have a source for this?
I read the assertion in the link with some interest. I note that the terminology here is different from what I heard around the farm. But what is done with this non-sterile mule mentioned therin? Who's his baby?
There's a lot of Angora goats in West Texas...I seem to remember Sam Donaldson getting a nice tax break from the little horned poodles.
My lab would play with them all unless I tossed them in the air and shot them over the water. Then she'd wait for me to signal and go get them.
Don't know. Never saw it happen myself.
Ironically, I learned that mules are not always sterile in Asimov's Foundation series --- had to go look it up, because, like you, I thought mules were always sterile.
Angora = Emu, 10 years later, IMHO.
Not that I don't raise them and sell them to people with "ranches" outside of Houston, mind you.
I don't suppose that could be due to breeding choices of the owners???
There's one not quite this bad on a route I travel--being kept as a pet, I fear, with no knowledge that they're going to have to get it shorn! I've been wondering whether to play the busybody and give them a call. Then they might expect me to find them a barber. Did you know that some wool producers now have a hormone they can inject into the sheep which will cause all the hair to fall off in a convenient fleece? I thought it would revolutionize wool production, but it is not widely used. I suspect it may harm the meat...?
Something my Biology Professor said years ago and Michael Moore does not count......
I believe, though, that they have studied populations of feral dogs, and their diversity.
Mutts do, after a few generations, tend to lose the non-dominant breed specific traits, and all tend towards the characteristics that match coyote/wolf traits.
So I would be hard pressed to say that specific breeds is a tendency in evolution. Those breeds were selectively bred for the desired trait. Evolution tends to support a more general purpose mutt.
Thanks for the ping!
The only limitation here is physical, same as with some humans, Pygmies and Zulus, comes to mind, but no one would claim that they both are not the same species. A dog in heat is a dog in heat, regardless of size, shape or demeanor. The attempt would be made by them in spite of size difference. And if successful would produce viable reproductive offspring....
If I am not mistaken, it was Cokie Roberts who said recently that Michael Moore hurt the democratic ticket (paraphrasing, probably erroneously)..."just by his physical appearance."
I have two GP Mutts and two pure breds, Retriever and Chihuahua. My GP mutts are smarter and easier to train. The pure bred Retriever just wants to play fetch, which is what he was created for. The Chihuahua just wants to be petted and lay around all day, for the same reason....
Not handy, but you can Google "humanzee" or various combinations of "hybrid" or "chimera" and come up with it pretty easily.
Also, nutcase biologist Newman (?) filed a patent on human-chimp cross in the US, I think.
Interesting, but terribly disturbing.
> What's a Poofist?
A more accurate description of the fariy-tale of Creationism. God said "Ummm..." and all the critters of the world went "poof" and there they were. The fossils went "poof" and there they were, already made, and made old, showign clearly evidence of evolution (God apparently playign a little prank). The stars and galaxies went "poof" and there they were, billions of lightyears apart, but wioth the light already travelled between.
Yes, it's silly... but that's Poofism for you.
> Darwinism really has taken on the mentality of the Left.
Somehow, you misspelled "Creationism" as "Darwinism."
My girl ridgeback is a ridgeless as well, she was the sweetest dog of the litter, and without the ridge she was a good 700 dollars than the good dogs with ridges. There is a great breeder of champion ridgebacks 10 minutes away from me in OK, that is where I got her. If you are ever in the market for a ridgeback again, I would be glad to put you in touch with the breeder.
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