Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

FBI investigates allegations of false Boy Scout numbers
http://www.al.com/news/birminghamnews/index.ssf?/base/news/110440170229420.xml ^ | 12.30.04

Posted on 12/31/2004 6:42:33 PM PST by Coleus

FBI investigates allegations of false Boy Scout numbers

Thursday, December 30, 2004

The FBI is investigating the Greater Alabama Council of the Boy Scouts of America to see if membership numbers have been inflated, board members said Wednesday.

Exaggerating membership numbers could lead to greater financial support, board members said.

The council is said to serve 50,000 youngsters in 22 counties in central and northern Alabama. This includes 30,000 enrolled in traditional scout units and 20,000 elementary school students receiving in-class character education using resources provided by the Boy Scouts, said Randy Haines, vice chairman of the council, which is led by paid directors and a volunteer board.

Haines said the FBI contacted the council two weeks ago about allegations of possible inaccuracies in membership figures. About the same time, Haines said he and other scout officials began hearing similar word-of-mouth reports.

"We take the allegations seriously," Haines said. "We are a highly principled organization, and irregularities are totally out of character."

But another board member, Tom Willis, said the charges of discrepancies in membership numbers are not only accurate but widespread across the country and are encouraged by the national Boy Scouts of America organization's pressure on district leaders to keep increasing the number of scouting groups.

`Ghost units' :

There is even a term for fake troops: "ghost units," Willis said.

Willis, a five-year board member, said he recently saw a roster of 135 units in his home Arrowhead District, which includes Morgan, Lawrence and Limestone counties. Only about half of those are real, traditional groups, he contends. "I pretty much know what units are out there," he said.

He said donations garnered through inflated numbers go to funding the central administration and not individual troops or programs for children.

Willis said the FBI investigation follows a growing distrust by some volunteers of the paid leadership of the council. That distrust was magnified by the recent debate over whether to spend $5.6 million to acquire land in Blount County for a super camp to replace smaller, regional camps, he said. He said he and others felt the price had been inflated by the owners.

The emotional issue of shutting down existing camps added to worries about buying a $5.6 million property when the council is $200,000 in debt, Willis said.

While looking into the camp, the council and scouting leaders discussed waning attendance at scouting camps and questions about the number of reported scouts arose among scout troop leaders. When they tried to get answers, they were denied information, he said.

Several concerns :

Willis said he helped organize a meeting in November that grew into three meetings of a group of more than 100 volunteer scouting leaders, who on Dec. 1 presented a list of about five or six concerns to outgoing board president John D. Johns and the incoming president, Willis said.

"The accountability with numbers was one of those," he said. "We asked for an independent audit of those numbers."

Haines said the Boy Scouts are doing an internal audit.

Willis said he believes the FBI investigation will turn up "extremely significant" errors.

"It's sad when our basic foundation is what it is, and we get into something like this," he said.

He said that the volunteer committee has good motives for challenging the council and is not aimed at creating more negative press for the Boy Scouts.

"Our real goal is just to make the scouting program better for our youth," he said. "We want more accountability."

A significant source of money for the Greater Alabama Council is the United Way. The council has asked for $940,855 in 2005, spokeswoman Samuetta Nesbitt said.

"United Way's leadership is aware that the FBI has made an inquiry into the reporting procedures of the Greater Birmingham Council of Boy Scouts of America," she said. "We do not have any details about the inquiry." vabrams@bhamnews.com  wbryant@bhamnews.com  


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: Alabama; US: Florida; US: Illinois; US: Texas; US: Utah
KEYWORDS: al; alabama; boyscouts; bsa; bsalist; chicago; cubscouts; fbi; graves; gravestones; investigation; scouting; tombstones; unitedway
The FBI is investigating a Boy Scout Council?

Hmm, I wonder why. Maybe they get federal dollars from housing authority units?

I could see the county prosecutor's office or the state AG's office investigating a local scout council but not the FBI.

Looks like some of the volunteers are about sore about losing some of their camps. Some of these old timers become very attached to the camps. Many put years of money and sweat equity into them.

Scout councils, the local District Executives and district committees are notorious for having paper troops and fudging the numbers. They just love to have the Quality district pin on their uniforms.

In 1968 the national bsa spearheaded huge 6-year membership drive where they wanted one out of 3 boys a scout as it turns out a big scandal broke in the 1970's in Chicago where the district executives took the names off of tombstones and registered them as boy scouts so they could make their goals. Some things never change.

1 posted on 12/31/2004 6:42:35 PM PST by Coleus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Coleus

This happens in other organizations as well. It seems when MBA's invade the management the groups core values seems to disappear. Blame it on the United Way, they are usually the ones who are encouraging the business side of organizations at the expense of the traditions of their mission.


2 posted on 12/31/2004 7:07:49 PM PST by MKM1960
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Coleus
I don't suppose they are going to alos investigate Alabamas welfare caseloads too.

Oh and Planned Parenthood gets a whole load of federal $. No falsified abortion billing I'm sure.

But the FBI are too busy chasing the Boy Scouts, so I guess they don't have time for those things.

3 posted on 12/31/2004 7:20:19 PM PST by ElkGroveDan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

I have not heard of this one. Guess its time to go snooping.


4 posted on 12/31/2004 7:23:43 PM PST by crazyhorse691 (We won. We don't need to be forgiving. Let the heads roll!!!!!!!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

Interesting wording:

"Exaggerating membership numbers could lead to greater financial support, board members said."

Financial support? I did NOT hear anything about FEDERAL DOLLARS?

WHY is the FBI waging war on the Boy Scouts then?

The clintonistas in our govt need to be purged immediately! Especially the pigs in the FBI, CIA, the federal courts and the lawyer scums.


5 posted on 12/31/2004 7:25:46 PM PST by steplock (http://www.outoftimeradio.org)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

The FBI has time to check out this nonsense as The Queen of King County steals the governorship in Washington State.

Sheesh


6 posted on 12/31/2004 7:50:39 PM PST by hattend (Liberals! Beware the Perfect Rovian Storm)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: steplock

I'm glad the FBI is investigating ANY orginization where there may be a problem. They don't usually get involved for NOTHING!
At one time everybody trusted the United Way until they found the Pres robbing it blind. Lets just see if they do the same to the NAACP.


7 posted on 12/31/2004 8:00:38 PM PST by hophead ("Enjoy Every Sandwich")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

Nice to see our tax dollars being put to good use. NOT!


8 posted on 12/31/2004 8:02:12 PM PST by airborne (Dear Lord, please be with my family in Iraq. Keep them close and safe.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hophead
They don't usually get involved for NOTHING!

Yeh, right! We can trust the FBI!

Waco, TX

9 posted on 12/31/2004 8:05:34 PM PST by airborne (Dear Lord, please be with my family in Iraq. Keep them close and safe.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: airborne
Yea right, I truly envision the FBI surrounding a local Boy Scout troop at their summer camp trip. Coming in under the cover of darkness only to awaken the troops with bright lights and loud music. Helicopters roar overhead. Black helicopters no less. Headlines: "325 scouts die in a standoff at Camp Wucumup, no survivors, news at 11." Yea right, let me get my foil hat!
10 posted on 12/31/2004 8:16:13 PM PST by hophead ("Enjoy Every Sandwich")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: hophead

Now you're just being snide.


11 posted on 12/31/2004 8:34:23 PM PST by airborne (Dear Lord, please be with my family in Iraq. Keep them close and safe.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: airborne

74 woman, children and men, incinerated in the prime of their lives; who would have thought this would happen in the USA.


12 posted on 01/01/2005 1:53:10 PM PST by Coleus (Keep Christ in Christmas, Christmas is part of our Western Civilization and is a US Holiday for ALL)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

And the MSM just gave Clinton and Reno a pass. Sad!


13 posted on 01/01/2005 2:32:29 PM PST by airborne (Dear Lord, please be with my family in Iraq. Keep them close and safe.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: airborne
And the MSM just gave Clinton and Reno a pass. Sad! >>>

The MSM, the Congress and all of us. I don't recall any mass protests from the conservatives demanding an investigation and prosecution.

Those two and all involved should have been arrested and prosecuted for torture and murder.
They even firebombed thier escape tunnel, what a shame.
14 posted on 01/01/2005 2:41:57 PM PST by Coleus (Let us pray for the 125,000 + victims of the tsunami and the 126,000 aborted Children killed daily)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Coleus
The MSM, the Congress and all of us. I don't recall any mass protests from the conservatives demanding an investigation and prosecution.

You are absolutely correct.

Hopefully things are changing. I am very interested to see what the public in Washington state will do about the election fraud.

15 posted on 01/01/2005 2:48:00 PM PST by airborne (Dear Lord, please be with my family in Iraq. Keep them close and safe.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: MKM1960

This happens in other organizations as well. >>

The FBI coming in or boards selling and consolidating camps.


16 posted on 01/10/2005 7:13:38 PM PST by Coleus (Let us pray for the 150,000 + victims of the tsunami and the 126,000 aborted Children killed daily)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Coleus
Organizations outside the Boy Scouts. When the Management teams apply Business strategy that don't jibe with the Core Values of the organization. There are typically a lot more charities in the United Way mix than there were when the United Way started. United Way has to slice the pie many more times than it did in the past. To the volunteers the core values of the organization are it's mission and when the Management drops core values for business strategy the problems begin. Basically the Management ends up trying to serve two masters the United Way and the Volunteers. I have a feeling what is going in this case is that the Council's Management has been playing to the United Way side without the Board of Director's knowledge or approval. This in turn has ignited the volunteers ire because of the core value of being morally straight. This is played out across the country in charitable organizations. The volunteers take it very seriously when these things happen especially where money is involved. One case I am familiar with because of moral turpitude and very bad financial controls two secretaries with check writing privileges nearly bankrupted a local chapter of a national charity. The Executive Director accepted the phony financial reports submitted by one of them and the National organization with the local Board of Directors had to call the police into investigate. It was a very sad business. I talked with an old friend who involved in a charity on a regional letter and he said this more prevalent than it appears. Often he said that the national charity will handle the situation, but it is becoming more likely to turn it over the proper law enforcement agencies. There must be federal funding involved for the FBI to be coming into this one.
17 posted on 01/10/2005 8:15:02 PM PST by MKM1960
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Former Military Chick; paltz


18 posted on 01/28/2005 10:51:40 PM PST by Coleus (God gave us the right to life and self preservation and a right to defend ourselves and families)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: MKM1960

This happens in other organizations as well. It seems when MBA's invade the management the groups core values seems to disappear. Blame it on the United Way, they are usually the ones who are encouraging the business side of organizations at the expense of the traditions of their mission.

The United Way does do some good too. I don't think any of this applies to the Boy Scouts as a whole, but in a funny way, there might be a ring of truth. This stems from a something that happened when I was a boy scout. My dad was scoutmaster and two boys had stopped coming. My dad tried to get them off the rolls, but was told by the boy scout council that they had to be dead. So that is what my dad declared them. The next week one broke his arm in a motorcyle accident and the other broke his leg. I do hope the policies have changed since then or other ex-boy scouts could be hurt:).


19 posted on 02/01/2005 5:58:06 PM PST by moog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: moog

Scouts are registered and are listed on the charter for one full year at a time whether they quit or not.


20 posted on 03/10/2005 5:57:56 PM PST by Coleus (Roe v. Wade and Endangered Species Act both passed in 1973, Murder Babies/save trees, birds, algae)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Coleus

Yes I know that. I am excited to be involved in scouting for the first time in many years. I am as vigorous in my defense of scouting as I am of education. I do hope that those (e.g. scouting for all) do not succeed in their liberal agendas against scouting, much as I do not suppor the education liberals in their agendas against education.

Both of my parents were longtime scout leaders and my 5 brothers and I are all Eagle Scouts. Scouting led to my first job and to a job that supported me during college. My excellent scout leaders were great role models and I still have fond memories of them. I owe a great debt to scouting and will always support it.


21 posted on 03/20/2005 11:55:46 AM PST by moog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson