Posted on 01/11/2005 5:51:29 PM PST by Grig
I am really tired of the implicit assumption in almost all MSM reporting that “evangelicals” and other (non-Moslem, of course) religious fundamentalists are more “moral” than the rest of us. Since when did we secularists (religious and otherwise) cede the definition of morality to them? If you ask me, it’s pretty damn “immoral” to discriminate against gays and working women, or to force a thirteen year old girl who has been raped by her father to give birth to that child. What’s more, I don’t find a literal reading of the Bible, particularly the Old Testament, to be a very useful moral guide. Is slavery really so terrific? Is it right to stone someone to death because they gather sticks on the Sabbath? Well, it’s there in black and white.
In any case, we don’t have to settle that one now, because the fact is that people who profess to teach us this kind of strict morality we should be practicing don’t really practice it themselves. I don’t mean merely Bill Bennett, Bill O’Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, Newt Gingriich, Jimmy Swaggart, Henry Hyde, etc. I mean all of ‘em—or at least most of ‘em. (And just so there’s no mistake, I don’t mind if people want to gamble, fornicate and get high on their own time. Just shut up about the rest of us, please.) Anyway, don’t take my word for it. The following is borrowed from an article by Ronald J. Sider, professor of theology, holistic ministry, and public policy and director of the Sider Center on Ministry and Public Policy at Eastern Baptist Theological Seminary...
(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.msn.com ...
Those of us without religion can and should have ethics.
Morality is the believers brand name for it.
So9
Sanctimoniously self-righteous bigots can be so tiresome can't they.
An accurate critique of today's Christianity...not necessarily of some Christians who really do practice their faith. Overall, why the focus on others' "immorality" when I should be busy just cleaning up my side of the street. I see a lot of very fancy church buildings where people go every Sunday while poverty and suffering is right there around them.
the mention of Ronald Sider was really interesting because I know his son - he's a professor, and my advisor, at Rutgers. Definitely very different from his father - voted for Kerry, not religious - but a pretty nice guy too. I had no idea his dad was so involved in evangelical activism.
You don't necessarily have to be religious to practice the moral virtues. Four of the Seven Cardinal Virtues as defined over the centuries by the Catholic Church were Aristotelian cardinal virtues: prudence, temperance, justice, and fortitude. The pagans developed many other virtues as well, such as patience, honesty, and magnanimity.
Somehow I doubt, on the basis of his writings, whether Eric Alterman knows much about any of this. One might add to the list of virtues other concepts such as truth, which is little valued or practiced by liberal news reporters, as evidenced by their writings.
A fundie would claim all are sinners and that only Christ can save us. The last thing a fundie would claim is moral superiority because that is not biblical.
Secondly, this article makes me believe even more strongly that the left fears morality because of the word "no". Nothing in the world scares a leftist more than the word "no", in fact. The idea that there might be societal limitations to just how much they can "love" their dog in public, to whether or not images of buggery should be allowed on billboards, to whether the public should pay for "artists" to do "interesting" things to chocolate, etc. just frightens them to no end.
I believe a large majority of leftists were spoiled, petulant children who got in trouble for doing something they shouldn't, and decided right then and there they were going to make the world pay for the "injustice" of their parental scolding. The idea anyone, let alone society at large, should be able to say "that's not right" gives them the willies, and brings back that childhood trauma. I half expect a leftist, when challenged on anything, to start in with "I can't hear you, la la la la la" with their fingers in their ears. Hell, they already are using the "adult" equivalent of "you're not the boss of me!" any time morality is mentioned. Alterman is just a prime example of that.
Some of us would hesitate to consider Christianity Today
as party to Evangelical Christianity-- Far too Liberal to
be part of the orthodoxy.sort of like expecting the Episcopals to be thought of a Southern Baptist.Don't know
either the father or son -but suspect there are as many
people "not religious" that seem "good people"Equally suspect Hell is filled with "good people" who neither
believed nor obeyed Scripture.
The leftwingnuts all love "No Smoking".
On the other hand they want "Free Pot".
Or was that "To Free Pot"? Whatever, some one of them will be for that.
The problem with the left is ignorance and drug induced brain damage.
Currently there are no reliable sources of opinion or fact on the left.
"An accurate critique of today's Christianity"
Still Recovering, I see.
The only thing the left considers moral is satisfying their various appetites.
Morality and all of its associated concepts are based on the belief that some higher power is defining the correctness of human behavior.
Anyone who says I am immoral is no different than a preacher or rabbi telling me I am a sinner...
Plato's Euthyphro is a great illustration. Socrates advances the argument to Euthyphro that, piety to the gods, who all want conflicting devotions and/or actions from humans, is impossible.
Likewise, morals are such a construction of idols used by the Left as a rationale for them to demand compliance to their wishes in politics, which most often are a skewed mess of fallacies in logic.
Morals are a deceptive replacement for the avoidance of sin.
If a person believes in a God, it is the conviction of the Holy Ghost by which they are guided and not by the idolatrous vanities of morals constructed by others.
I have also seen a lot of churches that support homeless missions, support a children's home where children are taken away from their families or are orphans, support a maternity center for young women who are pregnant and no where to do. They help arrange adoptions if that's what the woman wants or help her get on her feet if she's going to raise it. Churches do a lot of volunteer community work and help each other. They provide low-cost daycare to women and they see helping others as what Jesus has told us to do. It's kind of like the war, we only hear the bad stuff.
...or to force a thirteen year old girl who has been raped by her father to give birth to that child...
Why do they always cite this as though there are millions of US kids in this condition? Perhaps it is an ongoing problem in ultra liberal homes?
(Yes that was a nasty comment, but I wanted to be on equal terms with Mr. Alterman's caustic bile so that he might rightly understand that his Christianphobia - see homophobia - is clearly unhinging him.)
Which is really all there is to strive to obtain...the rest will take care of itself.
FMCDH(BITS)
The stupid jackass is using material from the last 40 years like he has some new insight. We have heard all this BS before, and this time around we ain't buying. Fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, and shame on me. Go crawl back into your hole Eric The Un-insightful.
Morality and all of its associated concepts are based on the belief that some higher power is defining the correctness of human behavior.
Anyone who says I am immoral is no different than a preacher or rabbi telling me I am a sinner...
Plato's Euthyphro is a great illustration. Socrates advances the argument to Euthyphro that, piety to the gods, who all want conflicting devotions and/or actions from humans, is impossible.
Likewise, morals are such a construction of idols used by the Left as a rationale for them to demand compliance to their wishes in politics, which most often are a skewed mess of fallacies in logic.
Morals are a deceptive replacement for the avoidance of sin.
If a person believes in a God, it is the conviction of the Holy Ghost by which they are guided and not by the idolatrous vanities of morals constructed by others.
One thing an evolutionist cannot answer is if their idea of a "big bang" theory is really an admission the universe is an Immaculate Conception...
DNA is the singularity that evolutionists rely upon by belief to support their theory. This is no different than the Big Bang - - just another Immaculate Conception...
What a lot of people forget when they promote such NONSENSE is the Aristotelian categorical model and scientific method...
Answer...
Click on my name for my FR homepage and find out why...
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.