Posted on 01/26/2005 10:30:20 AM PST by ejdrapes
"Ah, but thats the point did anyone in North Korea even try? You don't get freedom because you want it.
As my tag line says Freedom isn't free. Someone pays a price. That price is certainly treasure and frequently blood. If you are unwilling to try then you deserve the chains you wear."
It is such a closed society we probably will never know. Starving rice farmers don't fare well against tanks and well-trained troops. It is easier said then done was the point I was making. Also, in our revolution, we had the help of France. As much as I cannot stand them now, it is highly likely the revolution would have failed without them. Another nation whose populace wants to revolt usually needs powerful allies in this world to succeed.
Point taken
[a] nation whose populace wants to revolt usually needs powerful allies in this world to succeed.
OK there's my point. If a population wants freedom and is willing to fight for it then I say its time to lend a hand. Or, if necessary, even a few F-14's and a couple regiments of Marines if it comes to that. But first a people has to show the willingness to do something for themselves and that includes shedding their own blood for their own freedom.
Freedom isn't free and the price should not always fall on the same people to cough up the purchase price.
Why thank you. I am also in the Bay Area. :-)
Not at all! Unlike what Chirac is proposing, our administration advocates funding global welfare by stealing only from Americans.
"OK there's my point. If a population wants freedom and is willing to fight for it then I say its time to lend a hand. Or, if necessary, even a few F-14's and a couple regiments of Marines if it comes to that. But first a people has to show the willingness to do something for themselves and that includes shedding their own blood for their own freedom.
Freedom isn't free and the price should not always fall on the same people to cough up the purchase price."
Agreed. We are on the same page my friend.
"Not at all! Unlike what Chirac is proposing, our administration advocates funding global welfare by stealing only from Americans."
You are correct.
I am too outraged to think clearly, thanks for your help.
THAT was specifically the point of my post to you. After reading over 200 posts on the thread, you have seemed to be so obtuse that you didn't understand any of the refutations of your inane comments by other posters. At that point, I figured that it would be most certainly a waste to try to point out facts to you, since others tried and you couldn't or wouldn't comprehend them.
But OK, I'll certainly try to get through your befuddled fog.
Re: your response to RetiredArmy -Do you think then that the 300 million Africans who don't have any clean drinking water are just lazy?- after his statement This Republic got to be what it is through work, not sitting on your lazy ass.
RetiredArmy was addressing the article wherein Chirac promotes the historically proven-wrong notion that taking from those who have worked and prospered and giving it to those who haven't will somehow make a difference. You know, that communist/socialist (now called "progressive") idiocy "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". It has been proven time and again not to be workable, but misguided socialists like you seem to subscribe to being, by definition, insane, i.e., doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
To try to make it very clear to you, so you may actually get some faint glimmer of understanding: "The French leader outlined a number of steps to raise billions of dollars through taxes on international financial transactions, plane tickets or fuel used by airliners and oceangoing vessels." This is, by definition, extortion, i.e., taking something from someone by force (taxation), or that part that says "from each according to his ability". Sorry, if my "ability", or the fact that I am a contributing individual in a country that is prosperous through our labors and intellect, has provided me with modern, 21st century luxuries, then it is mine (and ours) to do what we want with, and not be robbed by some socialist who thinks he knows better what to do with my property.
OK, am I typing too fast for you to understand this? Do I need to slow down? I know socialists and liberals like you have great difficulty in grasping even the basic fundamentals of "freedom", so I don't want to outpace your limited capabilities.
If there are "300 million Africans who don't have any clean drinking water", it seems to me that maybe they should make an effort to do something about it. Why do you and socialist frogs like Chirac think that I should be coerced into providing clean drinking water for the African continent? Not that I would be averse to doing something to help, but voluntarily, not under coercion, which is what "taxes" are. (I wanted to repeat that, since it is a major point, and you seem to miss major points when they are 'splained to you.)
OldMarine tried to gently provide you with some factual information when he said, "America's drinking water is the result of generations of investment labor and sacrifice. Africa has never made any such effort. Any effor made is seen as an opportunity for graft and corruption by the leaders the Africans have hobbled themselves with., to which you replied: " I have never read anything so bizarre! America has plenty of water from a thing you may have noticed called rain."
I don't know where you were "skooled", but your abysmal lack of knowledge about physical and earth science is only secondarily stunning in comparison to your desire to flaunt said lack. Go pick up an elementary textbook and learn how geophysical and ecological systems work, please! None of us here have either the time, the space or the obligation to provide you with the basic education of those things. Rain, indeed!
So a poster questioned you: "What resources do they lack? to which you responded "Clean water and good soil. How would you live without that then? Your exhibition of ignorance is absolutely astounding! The only thing that I can think of that would explain this amazing lack of mentation is being too young to have finished your education and so young that you are still so proud to exhibit your ignorance for everyone to see. Again, I think you should pick up some basic texts and fact books, and learn something before you spout off.
So along comes Conservative Goddess, who offers a little something to show you how the real world works, saying "Somehow we not only have clean drinking water, but sanitation, electricity, roads, schools, churches, grocery stores...etc. There is a pervasive view on the left that this is a zero sum game and that other countries can't provide for themselves unless we give up some of our wealth. That's just bologna." To this you respond with the brilliant non sequitur: "I'm glad you find children dying funny. So much for the famed American compassion. Anyone...?" WTF??? Just how obtuse are you?
Just to summarize here, CG then answers that people should organize and maybe... ummmm... gee, dig a well. Something that has happened forever. But you have another brilliant rejoinder: "So you and your "citizens" (eh?) get together and take up a collection of...what? You have no money. Then with this imaginary money you buy imaginary drilling tools. Then you find the water....how? It has not rained for a year how do you know where any water is? How do you solve these problems?". I just find it inconceivable that someone such as yourself could be so dense, when people are attempting to educate you. Do you not see the sheer stupidity of your reponses here? I guess not.
About that time, TChris comes along and seems to have gotten the same impression of your complete lack of functional brain cells, and he just attempts to use a little obvious sarcasm, pointing out to you "Why don't we just give millions of dollars of aid and volunteer labor to Africa. Oh, wait... we already do.". But just as obvious as your lack of intelligence, so is your lack of understanding sarcasm- another indication of youth. So, without understanding his sarcasm, you say "Who said you stole the water? Who said it was bad to have clean water? What is wrong with wanting everyone to have the basics of life? Oh and you are not the only country to give aid and labour. So don't get all self-righteous.".
Is it any wonder by this time that just about everyone responding to your posts considers you a functionally illiterate moron? They only do so because you seem to want to flaunt said moron-ism. (And since you don't get sarcasm, you won't "get" that language play and will probably point out that there ain't no such word is "moron-ism", so I just wanted to point it out to you.)
It's getting late and this is getting long, so I'm gonna have to miss some points others made and you so obtusely didn't understand, so I'll touch on the main ones. You first said that Africa doesn't have any rain, that's why they don't have any clean drinking water. An OldMarine says: "Well lets take a minute and look in my trusty little Rand Mcnally Almanac right here..... Hmmmm Average rainfall in North America (a continent just to keep all things equal) is 27.3 inches In Africa its 33.2 inches.". To which you, again so brilliantly respond: "Exactly, if people are born in dry areas and have no money how do they get clean water. Their government doesn't care, the west doesn't so how do they do it? Why are you so angry against people who do you no harm and are dying. Would they starve and/or die of disease by choice, if it meant just to go out and dig a well?".
Again, either your youth or seriously dysfunctional brain cells are on exhibit once again. Go look up non sequitur. Learn it. Don't do it.
So then An Old Marine gently replies to you with "I'm not angry. You miss the point. OK we dig a guy a well. But then how about health care? and lunch? and shelter? and protection from the genocide? and education? The list is endless. Once again. The only solution is for people to work out their own problems.". And once again, your brilliant reparte: "What you say is true, but you are missing the realities." NO, John, YOU are missing the realities. Everyone, especially the knowledgable and exerienced are gently trying to help educate you, but you consistently want to exhibit your lack of knowledge and experience. An American, Will Rogers, said something that seems to be extremely applicable to you: "There are three kinds of men. The ones that learn by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves." John, you are certainly in that last group. If you don't quite understand his point, I suggest you go find an electric fence about the time you have to urinate... if you haven't already.
Geez, only so far to 80 or so comments. You just keep on exhibiting your intelligence, doncha?
Here's The Great Yazoo trying to point out the fallacy of your "rain" theory: (you)"If it does not rain in America there is no water underground to pump. (I can't believe I need to say this!)" TGY: "I can't believe you said that. Most water comes from aquifers of non-salt water that lie under the surface of the earth. Storm water intrusion is considered "bad." Again, go get an elementary science book and read, read, read!
John, I could go on and on, pointing out your obtuseness and lack of knowledge. It might be entertaining for some, even myself, but I have better things to do, such as discussions with intelligent people, reading, that sorta stuff.
I'm sorry you took umbrage at my post pointing out your obvious lack of intelligence and mental ability. I originally did want to take the time to refute all your ridiculous statements, but after 200 or so posts where you exhibit such a total lack of intellect by ignoring all those who tried to educate you with facts and information, I was so exasperated by your idiocy that I could only try to point out your mental deficiencies. I see that even that couldn't get through to you and you just don't have the mental abilities to handle either facts, information or descriptions of your density. Or should I say, "moron-ism"? Like I said, John, take up "lurking". You don't have the intellect to post on this forum.
There are some learned men who seemed to know about people of your intellect:
"There are two ways by which all men may reform themselves, either by learning from their own errors or from those of others; the former makes a more striking demonstration, the latter a less painful one."
--Polybius
"Most men would rather die than think. Many do."
--philosopher Bertrand Russell
"Life is hard. But it's harder if you are stupid."
--John Wayne
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity."
-- Martin Luther King, Jr.
CHIRAC made his show in DAVOS(SWITZERLAND)trying to appear as a good man on the side of the poors.
Doing that i think he knows exactly what he is doing.
With those good words he want to appear as an international leader of leftists and antiamerican(islamists for example)in opposition with the BUSH vision of freedom and democracy in the world.
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