Skip to comments.THE MURDER CITY (Compare Glasgow's murder rate to American cities.)
Posted on 01/28/2005 10:53:52 PM PST by Dan from Michigan
THE MURDER CITY Nov 27 2003
Glasgow is the western European killing capital
By John Mceachran
GLASGOW was yesterday branded the murder capital of western Europe by shock new figures. The horror statistic was revealed alongside damning evidence that the number of illegal killings murders and culpable homicides in Scotland has soared while the conviction rate has plummeted.
A report from the Scottish Executive confirmed thatthe number of people dying in violent incidents had rocketed to its highest level since 1995.
Most deadly attacks were fuelled by booze or drugs and stabbings were the main cause of fatal injuries.
There were 125 incidents which resulted in killings in 2002 40 of them in Glasgow alone and 127 people died as a result.
The majority of victims were stabbed to death by friends or relatives who were in a drunken rage.
The statistics showed that 186 people were arrested for the 127 killings. Nine out of 10 werecaughtwithinamonth of the incident.
But convictions occurred in only 71 of the 125 homicide cases, compared to 75 convictions in 113 cases the previous year.
Eight of the killers in 2002 were under 16 and 46 were aged 16 to 20.
According to the report, the typical murderer was male, aged 16 to 29, lived in Glasgow, knew the victim and stabbed them to deathwith a knife during a drunken weekend row.
Yesterday, Justice Minister Cathy Jamieson vowed to crack down on the killer culture which has blighted so many lives.
She said: ''This kind of behaviour and its shocking consequences can no longer be tolerated in a modern Scotland.
''Too many of these cases result when either the accused or the victim is drunk. Most occur at the weekend and involve young men.''
The figures for 2002 showed Glasgow had a homicide rate of 58.7 people per million of population more than twice the level of the other Scottish cities.
Aberdeen was the second most dangerous city, with an average of 21.9 killings per million while Dundee had 15.9 victims and Edinburgh was safest with just 15.6 fatalities.
Glasgow had the highest rate of any city in western Europe, including Belfast, Madrid, Paris, London, Amsterdam and Dublin.
Only the Baltic states' cities had a higher rate, along with American crime centres such as New Yorkand Washington and the lawless Russian capital, Moscow.
Jamieson added: ''I believe reforms to drinking laws now being considered will reduce this potentially fatal connection between over-indulging in alcohol and violent crime.
''On knife crime, we are committed to reviewing the law and enforcement of such crimes. We have alreadystarted work towards that end.''
Willie Rae, chiefconstable of Strathclyde, where nearly two thirds of the killings 81 out of 127 took place, refused to comment.
But Superintendent Mike Dean described the success of Operation Magnet, which seized more than 200 knives in a six-week crackdown centred on Govan, Glasgow.
He said: ''We took in 40 lock knives, 13 steak knives and 25 kitchen knives.
''Operation Magnet has been extremelysuccessful in tackling the carrying of offensive weapons.''
And he added: ''We havealso launched a new initiative which aims to target particular hot-spots.
''At the weekend, nine weapons, including three machetes and an axe, were taken off the streets.''
SNP leader John Swinney MSP said: ''These figures are horrifying.
''Not only are more homicides being committed, but the conviction rate has fallen by almost 15 per cent.
''Scotland as a whole has one of the highest homicide rates in the EU.
''And Glasgow's figure is double that of London and higher even than Belfast. ''Knife deaths alone have almost doubled since 1997.
''These figures leave Jack McConnell without an alibi for Labour's record of abject failure.
''His Executive loves to talk tough on crime, but the reality is they are convicted by their own statistics.''
And Scots Tory justice spokeswoman Annabel Goldie said: ''Unless we adoptazerotolerance stance, Scotland will continue on its depressing descent into more violence, more crime and more human misery.
''This country must be made a safer place to live.''
Comparison to other American Cities and areas.
Michigan:(Source Michigan state Police)
Detroit - 366 murders(2003), 925,000 people
Grand Rapids (2nd largest city) - 11 murders(2003), 197,800 people.
Saginaw - 16 murders(2003), 61,799 people (2nd in state and higher than Glasgow and Flint)
Southfield(Majority black) - 2 murders, 78,000 people
Other Cities (FBI report, includes non-negligent homicide as well - 2003)
Tuscon AZ - 47 murders, 514,618 people
Denver CO - 63 murders, 565,909 people
Washington DC - 248 murders, 563,384 (Total gun ban)
Jacksonville FL - 92 murders, 776,417 people
Indianapolis - 107 murders, 800167 people
Baltimore MD - 270 murders, 644544 people
Charlotte NC - 66 murders, 668003 people
Columbus OH - 109 murders, 726151 people
Oklahoma City - 49 murders, 521,681 people
Portland OR - 27 murders, 545271 people
Memphis TN - 126 murders, 653,858 people
Nashville TN - 74 murders, 554,888 people
Austin TX - 27 murders, 682,319 people
El Paso TX - 21 murders, 586,392 people
Fort Worth TX - 57 murders, 576339 people
San Antonio TX - 85 murders, 1,212,789
Seattle WA - 34 murders, 576,296
Milwaukee WI - 109 murders, 594,269
There are others with both higher (Philly) and lower rates(San Jose). I mostly stuck with those cities about the same size as Glasgow.
And my "gun infested" (6000+ NRA members) Livingston County - 0 murders(2004), 178,000 people
It's not the guns. It's the people. Else Washington DC wouldn't be worse than Detroit, and Glasgow wouldn't be five times higher than El Paso TX which is about the same size.
Now that's not to say that we don't have our own problems here. Detroit, Baltimore and DC for example all have higher rates. There are several factors in each area.
"70,000,000 gun owners in America behaved peacefully today..." -- relayed by Shonda Ponder
-- found at http://freedomkeys.com/r2kba.htm (quotes on gun rights)
Wow. Good info Dan. Bumped and Bookmarked.
Glasgow isn't exactly a town that you'd want to spend a night in. It reminded me of driving through Detroit. Another town...which some folks may not figure in the same crowd is Limerick, Ireland. Once you arrive at Shannon Airport...which is one of the best and cheapest in the country...rent your car and drive for at least an hour away from Limerick...its simply not safe after dark in the midst of town. Highest number of knifings per year of any major European city. I ended up staying in a hotel on the outskirts of Limerick...and you could tell they had extra security built into the lobby and the entry way. Europe may advertise itself as extremely safe...but there are still places that you'd best stay away from.
How many butter knives did they conficate?
How about ice picks?
They call Moscow "lawless" in this article, but I've been there in june and felt completely safe. Most of the murders there are over business deals/mafia related, I beleive, not just some random street crime. The city is beautiful.
Hmmm. How about banning weekends?
You have to distinguish between murders and homicides. Murder means the intentional taking of a life. Homicide includes justifiable (self-defense), manslaughter, negligent manslaughter as well as intentional murder and a few other meaningless categories.
My wife (Russian) remarked that the crime in Russian tends to stay aimed at Russians. Tourists are pretty safe except for certain areas around town where you will get robbed for being a rich american.
Never noticed myself as I just dressed down and everyone over there said I looked like a russian criminal ;)
This is sad as I order my Cambridge KJV Bibles from there.
We had a family wedding in Co. Limerick in 2002. I was the designated driver in a rented van in which we crammed nine people/two weeks' worth of luggage. First stop was a multi-story car-park in downtown Limerick. All of us were pretty nervous. And speaking as a native born Detroiter, I didn't think Limerick was all THAT bad.
They also call New York a "crime center" which it simply is not these days. It was at one time but it isn't any more.
My guess is these murders are done by Scots on Scots, not by any kind of immigrants. Which is how London-metro is.
Well, crime there is mostly mafia related.. So, unless you own a business there, you are pretty safe.
Dan, are the Michigan state Police statistics and the 2003 FBI homicide data report on the web? If so, please could you post links to them, because I wish to pass these stats onto some British liberals who will not believe that the murder rate in Glasgow (where they are trying to ban the sale of sporting and combat knives), is over 5 times higher than the murder rate in Austin, Texas (where there is CCW) - unless I cite official reports. Thanks for your help.
The FBI one is http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_03/pdf/03sec2.pdf - It starts on page 123 and has most cities with 10,000 or more people. I tried using cities about the size of Glasgow for most of my examples.
You also may want to tell the liberals that NYC, Chicago, and Washington DC all have handgun bans as well. DC is the nations murder capitol almost every year.
States have varying laws on guns. Massachusetts, Illinois, Maryland, and California are strict. Michigan is in the middle. Texas, the Dakotas, Alaska, Vermont, New Hampshire and Kentucky are very lenient. The Michigan state Police one is http://www.michigan.gov/documents/Offenses03_106249_7.pdf
The FBI one has almost all US cities.
Sorry you had to use misleading info to bolster your case Dan. Even quoting your own source there were 40 murders in Glasgow. The 127 you quote was for the whole of Scotland. Do the math Dan. Changes your comparison figures somewhat.
Wasn’t my math and watch your tongue...
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.