PING
Posted on 01/31/2005 9:37:31 PM PST by concretebob
Hillary Clinton changes images with the quickness of Madonna. Like the Queen of Pop, she provokes and reacts, rethinks and reforms, pushes at hot buttons and then cools off with a dip in the mainstream.
Madonna moved from "Like a Virgin" to "Married With Children," and began writing children's books. Hillary went from high-octane lawyer in Little Rock who didn't want to stay home to bake cookies to being a first lady sharing her recipe for chocolate chip cookies. She went from standing by her man in a way that Tammy Wynette might have sung about, to standing up for New York in the United States Senate.
Both Madonna and Hillary have made a lot of stops that women understand. Madonna, who was born Catholic, now seeks meaning in the Jewish mysticism of the Kabala, and has even taken a Jewish name: Esther. Hillary never abandoned the Methodist social gospel, and now she's making noises that fall lightly on the ears of the evangelical swing voters who were turned off by John Kerry's tinny attempt to talk about "values."
Madonna continues to surprise us, but Hillary's reinventions shouldn't surprise us at all. She's on a trip, guided by the road map first used by her husband. She's working at looking "moderate," and learning to feel the pain of others.
When she spoke to the Family Planning Advocates of New York last week, she actually expressed empathy - if not necessarily sympathy - with the fiercest opponents of abortion. "I, for one, respect those who believe with all their heart and conscience that there are no circumstances under which abortion should be available," she said. This from one of the fiercest defenders of uncompromising feminist voices in the cause of abortion rights; she voted against the ban of partial-birth abortion.
She said "common ground" was the best way to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies. She described abortion as a "sad, even tragic choice to many, many women." Hillary is nothing if not calculating and she chose her audience carefully. She was talking not to a pro-life group, but in a lioness' s den of abortion rights advocates on the 32nd anniversary of the Supreme Court decision declaring abortion a constitutional right. Her rhetoric has been characterized as a Sister Souljah moment like that of her husband to the Rainbow Coalition in 1992, rebuking the black rap singer for her hymns to hate. It worked for Bill, and the gasps in the audience, as if those present had witnessed their angel's dainty feet exposed as works of clay, suggest it might work for Hillary.
She expects her base to submit, even if grudgingly, just as the blacks of the Rainbow Coalition submitted to her husband. She knows that feminists have hurt their cause by stubbornly refusing to give any credibility to moral and religious arguments against abortion. Some feminists inevitably see her remarks as a flip-flop, but Hillary is no John Kerry. She was merely changing emphasis, and she's likely to extend the "common ground" theme to good effect.
Even more fascinating was her support of faith-based initiatives. This may have been easier, since it no doubt appeals to the do-good religious faith of her early years. She told a fund-raiser in Boston that religious men and women ought to be able to deliver social services, a bold departure from fellow Democrats who have given the president a hard time on this initiative. America is big enough for people to "live out their faith in the public square," she said. "I've always been a praying person." (We should expect the second President Clinton to seek "a relationship with the Lord," too.)
Hillary has been looking at more than exit polls. In her new book, "God on the Quad," Naomi Schaefer Riley describes the increasing numbers of graduates of religious colleges - Mormon, fundamentalist and evangelical Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox Jewish - whose religious faith governs their search for values. They're very different from their parents. They're savvy, secure, have high academic standards and are difficult to ridicule.
"Unlike their parents, religious college graduates see themselves less as a force outside of American culture trying to fight it, than a force within trying to transform it," she writes. "This is the psychological result of spending four years in an environment that supported rather than attacked their religious beliefs and asked them to make the intellectual connections between faith and politics, culture, philosophy and literature."
They're going into professions and many of them will move into the blue states. These young men and women won't buy into Madonna's reincarnations, but they're likely to listen closely to Hillary on moral values. Democrats would be foolish to ignore them. Hillary Clinton clearly doesn't intend to.
©2005 Tribune Media Services
PING
I'm scared, Sarge.
A good piece, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and say I think HRC is too clever for her own good. Her constant shifting of positions is making her a flip-flopper to make Kerry look like an amateur. I know everyone says to underestimate her at one's peril, but her defeat of Lasio was no political masterwork--it was just a good campaign against a bad opponent--and she has been SO protected throughout her public life. I just think in a primary her opponents will demolish her. She's shallow, she's got no vision the average American cares for, and she's just a politician who sticks her finger in the air and sits quietly, watching both sides fight it out, and after the public is heard from, she jumps in front of the parade and pretends to have been leading it all along.
BEWARE: This woman is both evil and dangerous.
Anyone who doesn't take her seriously does so at everyone's peril.
Can't be scared, but we can be ready.Bump and save.
I have added you to my infrequent, but usually interesting, PING list.
From Ghosties and Ghoulies
From Long Leggity Beasties
And Things That Go BUMP in the Night
(Like Hillary)
Oh, Lord Deliver US!
A river in Egypt.
After what happened in Buffalo, it should be "Reviving Hillary Clinton"
How so?
I just don't think she can take being exposed on a national level when we have SwiftBoatVets and FOX and the simple fact that HRC will be defeated by the men's vote.
Yes, you're right that "listening tour" really worked for her, in addition to Rudy not running. I do think the liberals are losing their enthusiasm, and our country is leaning towards God and conservatism. The only problem for us, is if Hillary takes that whole centrist view, and people don't see through the deception, it could happen. But, 2008 is alot different than 2000. We'll be exposing her lies like a forest fire. I like Rick Santorum for Prez in 08, what about you?
I don't think Hillary's gonna be able to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. The young voters would be her natural constituency, but look at polls (I know, but they're a good indicator)--more and more college kids are going conservative. And everyone knows who Hillary is, and her Road to Damascus moments aren't gonna fool anyone. I think she's a lot of hat with no cattle.
Thanks for the ping!
Click here or on the pic for the article.
She has a LONG way to go to turn THIS ship around (voting record):
Senator Hillary Clinton (D)
New York
Democrat, Years of Service: 3
ACU Ratings for Senator Clinton: Year 2003 10 Year 2002 10 Lifetime 11
I just think in a primary her opponents will demolish her.Then you didn't watch the last Dem primary. They've learned to be nice to each other in order to win the WH. No one "demolished" Kerry in the '03-'04 primary --- although he was highly vulnerable --- and Kerry went on to run a fairly close campaign.
I think it's wishful thinking to say that Hillary will be demolished in the primary. However, it's also wishful thinking to say she'll make it to the WH. We don't know who the Republican will be in '08, but whoever it is, s/he won't be afraid to apply direct pressure. And even though the press will provide maximum cover for Hillary, just as they did for Kerry, the pressure will be there. Unlike in the NY Senate election.
I don't think Hillary will survive the pressure of a general election.
A good piece, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and say I think HRC is too clever for her own good.
No, while I utterly disagree with her on political and moral grounds, she is an extremely tough politician who has the vision to see what she has to do and the determination to do whatever it takes. She is not as good a campaigner as her husband, but she is much smarter.
To all those who start to "soften" in their attitude toward the new Hillary, I will say only two words: "Lani Guinier."
"I've always been a praying person"
"I've always had respect for people who beleive abortion is wrong"
She's gonna be toast.
Looks like Hillary's mighty busy with her Campaign 2008 Extreme Makeover. The question is ---in light of the resounding 2004 Values Voters Victories---how "conservative" will Hillary get?
Let's see. After she opens a charge at Wal-Mart, enrolls in divinity school, and gets a lifetime membership in the John Birch Society, she'll need to get a shopper's card at Sam's Club, and schedule daily morning prayer services in her Senate office.
And just to cover all bases, Bill will take an anti-adultery pledge in the vestibule of the National Cathedral, when Hillary takes her minister's vows.
Oh, and Hillary will campaign wearing the official DNC apron, and give cookie-baking demonstrations while on the stump, and pose with an aresenal of firearms while engaged in target practice.
Then all their expensive education hasn't taught them to reason ... and their "moral values" come down to, "We need legal abortion, because our professions come first!
Hillary scares me. We came far too close to a Kerry victory. Despite her flaws, Hillary doesn't have the baggage Kerry does. The Swift Boat Vets won't be gunning for her.
Speaking of shifting:
Do you happen to know if any media outlet actually showed Hillary faint? It was ok to show G.W.'s father barf in Japan, I just wonder if anyone showed her go down.
HILLARY - as she tells her well-known lie to a group of school children who innocently ask, "Mrs. Clinton, how did you get the name, 'Hillary?'" Her straight-faced reply was along the lines, "Before I was born, a man named Sir Edmund Hillary became famous for being the first person to climb Mount Everest. My father named me after him as a symbolic message that I could achieve anything I wanted in life....that I could climb ANY mountain (barf alert)......" Sounds great, and typically Clintonesque. The problem is........well it is a total LIE. Hillary was over five years old when Sir Edmund Hillary climbed Mount Everest. No one had ever heard of him before then!!
If one didn't know her though, they may assume she IS a centrist. Our (FReepers and the new media, because you sure can't depend on the old media) job over the next 4 years is to remind those old enough to vote but too young to remember ALL of the klintoon-speak, and klintoon-esque way of spin and damage control.
I have a nephew who is 20 years old and I feel sometimes like shaking him like a rag doll to get some sense into his thick head. He's 20 years old, just barely graduated high school, doesn't want to go to college because, why should he? He already knows EVERYTHING! He's bouncing around from one dead end pizza delivery/fry cook/stockboy job to the next, gets his NEWS from the daily show, and thought J eFfin K was the greatest thing since sliced bread. Brother in laws kid or not, if he walks into my home in 3 years and says he's voting for the Beast he's getting one of my old Army boots up his backside, and tossed right back out of the house. My wife will back me up on that too, even though it is her brothers son. She hates the beast more than I do, which I thought was almost impossible!
I didn't see any such footage, and am not sure if any exists, though I am assuming it does. Good point.
Kerry wasn't demolished in the primary not because of politeness but because he had no record to demolish, and they wouldn't touch his Vietnam position.
HRC is a lot of smoke and mirrors. The general public hasn't cared because it never affected them. It'll be different when she tries to run their country.
Sorry, I don't know how to post photos, but this is one of HRC before her faint. Not a gag, btw. Yikes!
I have a haunting feeling that you're going to have to use that boot!
;-)
Lock him in the bathroom on election day!
The Ds will fall all over themselves to nominate Hillary, both because she outpolls any of the alternatives, and because they might wind up dead if they don't. She is expertly tacking to the right to pick up all the voters in the middle, and will even outflank the Rs to the right on issues like immigration. She can probably beat nearly anyone the Rs would run.
Hitlery is a fund rasing dream for the GOP. They better start early to counter the witches hypocrisy.
Outpolling anyone this far out of an election is worthless. Al Gore was going to win the 2004 election at this point in the election cycle, if I recall correctly.
No but a lot of other folks WILL BE gunning for her, and she has baggage, we just have to make sure it gets unpacked at the righ moment.
Why thank you. I am certain to enjoy it. Just prepare yourself for my replies! LOL!
Al Gore never had the kind of lead Hillary has. You are in denial.
Yeah, whatever, I heard you the first time and you jsut keep saying it without any kind of discussion. Al Gore surely did have the edge at this point--you are in denial. Bye now.
Ahem.
http://www.pollingreport.com/2008.htm
"I know it is early, but if the Democratic primary for president were held today, which of the following would you support for the Democratic nomination for president? . . . " N=399 registered voters who consider themselves Democrats or lean Democratic, plus independent and undeclared voters who say they generally vote in Democratic primaries; MoE ± 4.9
Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton 33%
http://www.harrisinteractive.com/harris_poll/index.asp?PID=217
A nationwide Harris Poll of 2,525 adults surveyed online between January 11 and 15, looks at attitudes to some possible Democratic contenders.
When asked which candidate they would prefer, Al Gore wins the support of 44% of Democrats, and 24% of Independents.
OK, so let's review:
January 26, 2001 Hillary Rodham Clinton 33%
November 18, 2002 (when Gore's support was FALLING) Al Gore 44%
So...who's the one in denial? ;)
You criticize me fairly for posting conclusions without data; here's some from:
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=16636 (reporting Fox News Poll)
The Fox News poll tested Hillary against several possible 2008 GOP contenders and found that she ran ahead of Florida Gov. Jeb Bush by 46-35, ahead of New York Gov. George Pataki by 41-35 and ahead of Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-TN, by 40-33.
Nor is there any basis for believing the conventional GOP wisdom that a Hillary candidacy would trigger a backlash among men, conservatives and Republicans.
When Fox News matched the former first lady against Jeb Bush in a trial heat, Hillary’s numbers were similar to those former presidential candidate Kerry racked up in a parallel test.
Among men, for example, Hillary defeated Jeb Bush by 44-39 while Kerry broke even, 42-42. While 23 percent of conservatives supported Hillary against the president’s brother, only 21 percent backed Kerry in a similar contest.
Geographically, Hillary beat Southerners Jeb Bush and Frist in the South, beating Bush in the red-state region by 42-41 and Frist by 38-37. And, in the critical Midwest, where most swing states are located, Hillary ran 11 points ahead of Jeb Bush, 10 ahead of Frist and six ahead of Pataki.
As I said, don't believe they Hilarhype!
I hope you're right, but fear you aren't.
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