Posted on 02/13/2005 8:46:21 AM PST by Scenic Sounds
M aya Keyes loves her father and mother. She put off college and moved from the family home in Darnestown to Chicago to be with her dad on a grand adventure. Even though she disagrees with him on "almost everything" political, she worked hard for his quixotic and losing campaign for the U.S. Senate.
Now Maya Keyes -- liberal, lesbian and a little lost -- finds herself out on her own. She says her parents -- conservative commentator and perennial candidate Alan Keyes and his wife, Jocelyn -- threw her out of their house, refused to pay her college tuition and stopped speaking to her.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
It also happens when grown children take up living with a boyfriend/girlfriend, or get married, or even change colleges/degree field. When you're an adult, people expect you to pay your own way. How ODD!
It's not uncommon - I've had it happen to friends of mine. Usually because they got MARRIED to a guy mom and dad didn't care for...
The first: a homosexual child is portrayed as a warm, vulnerable human being, whose parents wisely and lovingly approve of his choice to embrace his homosexual passions. These are good parents. There are (in the media's eyes) a lot of these.
The second: a homosexual child is portrayed as a warm, vulnerable human being, whose parents hatefully, narrow-mindedly, ignorantly and irrationally reject his choice to embrace his homosexual passions. These are evil parents. There are (in the media's eyes) a not many of these.
There is no third category.
Oy vey!
Why is it that when an adult child is expected to get out and support themselves - the media chooses to portray it as "throwing out?"
aside from the fact that it's just PC in this case.
I see this sort of thing in many conservative families. Sometimes when you push kids too hard, they go the other direction. Look at Cheney. I look around me and see all the troubled kids whose parents go to the local Baptist church. Then I see the neighbors, Buddhists, who have two wonderful daughters, both on college scholarships, both virgins and neither on drugs. I watched them interact. They were strict but loving and never forced their beleifs on their kids. I hate to say it, but my Christian friends, who FORCE their kids go to bible study and youth group, most have rotton kids always up to no good. They exhibit authoritarian leadership, which gives kids no sense of power or individuality. Kids want to make their own choices as teens (it's natural), and if parents let them, while modelling good moral behavior, they have a better chance of not falling into degeneracy. I know only a few Christian families whose teenage (and older) kids follow the path. One comes up to visit us monthly (we have a cabin on the property). Their boys are a dream, the kind of boys people wish they had. They actually volunteer to help out when they see us cutting wood, bathing the horse, working in the garden, etc... They are not fundamentalists, but pray daily and are very kind, considerate, open minded people. They don't pressure their boys to be good, nor are they authoritarian. They show trust for them and respect their individuality. They raised their kids the same way the Buddhist neighbors did. Both sets of kids are well-balanced and wise for their age.
Pointing them in the right moral direction, rather than dragging them, kicking and screaming, down your path, is the key to helping them grow spiritually and making the right choices in life.
On Thursday, the Point Foundation, a San Francisco-based charity that provides scholarships to students "who have been marginalized because of their sexual orientation," decided to pay Maya's expenses so she can begin her studies at Brown.
I guess they do that for economy. In other words, instead of saying "removed from the household premises with instructions not to return" they just say "throwing out."
In this case, dad has apparently also discontinued his support for her education and apparently even refuses to speak with her at all. It must be a very difficult thing to do, don't you think?
Being Jewish I can comment from a different point of view. Parenting is hard work, and we don't always get things right, and this has nothing to do with how strict or strong our religious beliefs.
We insisted our son go to classes leading to his Bar Mitzvah. He was reluctant, but did have his friends who felt the same way in class. After resisting for several years, he came through for us and himself in the last 6 months and did a good job. He also has not set foot inside a synagogue since, (well once in college to check out for Jewish girls in the new community). But we feel it was our job to provide the experience and he does not regret it now. On the contrary, a Jewish student I had in High School said he did regret dropping our of his class. So you have these choices to make. We did not force him to continue music lessons, (maybe that was a mistake?)
Moral behavior cannot be imposed. It must come from within.
What about a radical, belligerent anti-Christian, anti-family activist? Should someone be unwillingly coerced/compelled/forced to subsidize that which is anathema to one's deeply-held religious principles? Additionally, there is the funding/financial issue. If you write the check, that creates a responsibility and entails certain rights.
An adult lives with one's parents at the grace and mercy of the parents. If the adult child is a belligerent radical homosexual activist, the parents are clearly within their rights to kick out the activist, with an aim to save their lost soul, if possible. Hopefully the errant and deviant child will "come to their senses" like the Prodigal Son, repent and straighten out and fly straight.
[Why I chose principles, not values: Forget "values", Nietzsche taught us that "values" are relative and can change or be changed, let's stick with unchanging Biblical Principles instead. Values are vacuous, values change.]
the site is down, so I can't get details..
how old is said "child"?
If she is still college aged, and actually DID drop out to help her father's campaign, then I would think that short of some catasthropic event, her parents would be happy to fund her education and get her out of the house. Or help her find her way.
Just what he did...throw her out. I'm sure there is more to this than the sanitized WP version. The MSM always leave out the salacious details and reduce homos to a "loving partnership", when usually it is all just about deviant sexual activity.
From the article:
I don't think dad has any legal obligation to provide her with shelter, financial support or even conversation. However, the father-daughter relationship cannot be dissolved - she will always be his daughter and he her only father. So, I guess the question is not what must he do, but instead what should he do, under the circumstances.
It's funny how kids, once they hit 18, squawk and squeal that they must be treated as adults, but when that's exactly what they get, they whine about it as unfair.
Which one are you today?
The parable of the prodigal son comes to mind in these situations.
I don't know about the rest of you all, but I know I disappointed my parents many times in my young adult life. Yet, they were always glad to see me and would never have turned me out of their home.
They often expressed their disappointment with a path I had taken, but always in loving terms.
Another excuse for the Washington Post to print anything negative about a conservative.
I wonder what the ration of Conservative kids to Liberal Kids end up in prison.
Bet the liberals win hands down.
Another excuse for the Washington Post to print anything negative about a conservative.
I wonder what the ration of Conservative kids to Liberal Kids end up in prison.
Bet the liberals win hands down.
Note that she's not just a lesbian, she's "a liberal queer". The politics inform the sexuality, it seems. The WaPo wants to make it seem like her politics are a result of how her nasty father treated her. My suspicion is that it's just the opposite and she's a thoroughly unpleasant person to be around.
"What about a radical, belligerent anti-Christian, anti-family activist?"
The Buddhists next door are non-activist, non-belligerent, but anti-Christian. They support virtually all liberal causes. The other week when I was there, the daughter (who is still at home) was expressing support of gay marriage. The dad came unglued and actually called gays "little faggots" (with a proper English accent). Funny thing is, they home-schooled their girls (but support more funding for public schools) and were very strict, but not authoritarian. Perhaps this has something to do with the fact that the children of European parents tend to be better behaved because despite politics, parents there are still recognized as the heads of the family.
I asked them about their opposition to Christians. They truly believe a high percentage of Christians try to seek God, but are unenlightened, preaching but not practicing. The dad explained that so many skip over Christs' message and forget about the charity and compassion He espoused. I agree with him there. I mentioned to him a man who told me he went to India and met a guy at the market whose live chickens had their legs cut off instead of binded. His explanation to the shocked tourist was that the "chicken was a bad man in a former life." His reply was that it's the "human condition."
My wife knew a woman in college who was a fully commited Lesbian ...she is now married to a Doctor (male)lives an upscale middle class existance and has 5 grown kids.
Excellent post!
Right on the mark!
Well, of course. LOL.
And, even though the child has "hit 18" and become, in the eyes of the law, an adult, outside observers still tend to expect that the fiftyish parent will approach these kinds of issues with more maturity than the daughter. Is that fair?
I couldn't read the article becuase the WP site was apparently down, but I find it sad that her parents won't talk to her. I'm a big advocate unconditional love.
Is there some link between lesbianism and conservative politicians?
It seems like a Lot of Repubs have lesbian daughters, sisters, etc.
Bizarre. All this advice to Dr. Keyes! I think it's pretty safe to assume he knows what he is doing.
On the other hand, if you really respect someone you will try to understand their beliefs and emulate their behavior.
Can't access the entire access because Washingtonpost.com is undergoing maintenance, but here is my two cents: The public may never really know what happened. Sad story.
Her side of the story (from the article):
"As long as I was quiet about being gay or my politics, we got along," she says. "Then I went to the Counterinaugural," last month's protests in Washington against President Bush. "My father didn't like that."
Maya returned from the demonstration to find that she had been let go from her job at her father's political organization.
She says she was told to leave her father's apartment and not to expect any money toward attending Brown University, where she was admitted but deferred matriculation to spend a year teaching in southern India. "In my father's view, financing my college would be financing my politics, in a sense," Maya says, "because I plan to be an activist after college."
She wrote to her parents to tell them about tomorrow's speech, but says she got no response.
Dad's side of the story (again, from the article):
Some children are just naturally rebellious. The very best parents can rear a child who chooses values 180 degrees opposite theirs.
Thanks. There are always two sides to every story. Even though I may not agree with Keyes and his political views, like I stated to an earlier poster, very sad.
Good observation.
Tell them you love them, that you care for them, but that if they want your support, especially money and staying at home, they have to live by your rules.
Nobody bought me a college education.
To live at home, I had to live by my parents rules, although the rules were reasonable.
And that's life.
AS my daddy likes to say, cut bait or fish.
My oldest had this choice, and chose to move out (although no bridges were burned.) I expect him to go wild for awhile, decided it's not as fun as it seems, and then settle down.
That's normal.
To continue one's adolesence by saying "Mommy and Daddy hate me" is a sign of not enough hard lessons about life learned.
I've always maintained that I've never seen a child of overly strict parents who didn't become an accomplished liar. I've yet to see a single exception, although I'm sure one exists somewhere.
It's one thing to come out, it's another to come out on stage in the spotlight; fashions change, soon there will be a rash of "old-time-revivals" and the wheel will turn and turn...
I was thinking the same thing. I could see pulling the purse strings, but not talking to the child just seems incredibly wrong to me.
"Being Jewish I can comment from a different point of view. Parenting is hard work, and we don't always get things right, and this has nothing to do with how strict or strong our religious beliefs.
We insisted our son go to classes leading to his Bar Mitzvah. He was reluctant, but did have his friends who felt the same way in class. After resisting for several years, he came through for us and himself in the last 6 months and did a good job. He also has not set foot inside a synagogue since, (well once in college to check out for Jewish girls in the new community). But we feel it was our job to provide the experience and he does not regret it now. On the contrary, a Jewish student I had in High School said he did regret dropping our of his class. So you have these choices to make. We did not force him to continue music lessons, (maybe that was a mistake?)"
God Bless your boy and I bet he isn't a screw-up because you loved him right let go when it was time. These days, being a successful parent means your kid works, doesn't do drugs and hasn't been in jail.
Correct me if I am wrong, but my observation of Jewish families is that many of the kids from conservative backgrounds turn out to be liberal atheists. My best friend in high school was (and still is, as far as I know!) a Jew. She was a staunch atheist and absolutely refused to attend synagogue. But she was a kosher vegetarian and after college, was very conscious of dating only Jewish men.
This is unrelated, but I've got to relay this funny story about us. One day she called me and told me she went to a party. The man whose house it was at (he was in a band)apparantly shoved her. She didn't know this, but he was a drug dealer. She went into the bathroom, came out and noticed all the lights were out and said "What's going on?" There was a cop across the street, but instead of telling her to duck down, he shoved her, to the ground, and told her to shut up. He never apologized. She was humiliated, and we discussed how to regain the power she lost that night. I talked her into something this good girl would have never otherwise done, as I was apparantly Gentile a corrupter of nice Jewish girls. These were my atheist days, so revenge was very much on the table. I mentioned that in the back yard was a doggie poop bucket with an airtight lid. I was determined to make this man pay for hurting my friend. So we took out the plastic bag containing the moist, moldy dog poop and placed it in my trunk (something I regretted for the next 3 months). We went to the store and picked out a card that said "Just wanted you to know how I feel about you..." We drove by, dressed in disguises (black Celtic cloak and ball cap for me), and before we passed his house I said "wouldn't it be proof of God's existence if the windows in his van were rolled down?" We had planned to place the poop at his doorstep, but as fate would have it, his van (with all of his band equiptment) was open with the windows down. We parked a block away and snuck around like criminals, casing the area and trying to keep our voices low. The lights were out. She was so scared of being caught. I proceeded to take the dog poop and toss it around his van (with gloves on of course). She then got her courage, placed the card in his window and took the bag and started rubbing the dog poop in his seats. I then got a little nervous and insisted we leave. She then pulled out some eggs from her pocket and started throwing them at his windows as we retreated, like a couple of covert soldiers tossing grenades. But soldiers don't giggle and laugh as they retreat, but we did, even after his lights went on. She and I laughed for months over this. We imagined him leaving for work the next day and discovering this scene as he sipped up his coffee. We discussed what technique he used to remove the moldy dog poop from his guitar box. We never even heard of this incident, not even through the local band scene. My mom told me that the end doesn't justify the means, but my friend got her dignity back after this. It was well worth it.
"In my father's view, financing my college would be financing my politics, in a sense," Maya says, "because I plan to be an activist after college."
The gay issue aside, why would he finance someone adverse to his political views and goals, i.e. finance the enemy?
I doubt this is first time she has openly proclaimed her homosexual lifestyle in spite of being aware of her father's belief that it is morally wrong..
No, I don't think you're wrong. Although many Jews marry outside the religion, and this results in more secular people and fewer Jews. Most Jews, as you know, are liberal and think and vote in an almost secular manner. Conservative (political not the religious sect) Jews have to contend with all their kid's friends being liberal and a liberal message from the Rabbi. We are not liberal in the slightest and therefore are a minority within a minority.
I don't think of taking revenge quite as strongly as you did, (and I am glad you did not get caught).
My wife (before she met me) was living in a apartment with several roomates, one who moved out and her boyfriend stayed in. My wife called the police and the cop came and searched his stuff and found drugs. "Did you know about this? he asked her, "say no" he added. They told him to get out and he did.
Well, it may seem strange, but it does happen. Some parents put family ahead of politics. Some people put a whole lot of things ahead of politics. ;-)
This is the adult daughter's view of the situation. Why might it not just as fairly be said she quit talking to them?
As for the parents' refusing to pay for her education when she has made it clear to them she intends to use that education to become a liberal activist to undercut her parents' values and beliefs, I would say the parents are making a rational and fully justifiable decision.
I have no issue with paying her way. It's the removal the familial support that troubles me.
Sad story.
I find it hard to believe her mother won't talk to her either.
Good post.
As the saying goes, Christian nurture and education is to enable the children to see with their own eyes, not give them our own.
And what is *your* take on this story, Scenic? :-)
BTW, I clicked the link to try to read the whole story before commenting, but at the moment it is "under maintenance".
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