US Senate to convene emergency session. (Schiavo) Fox news. Tom Delay speaking now

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[Hildy]

Well..anything to make you happy! :)

[Cold Heat]

Be ready for the hateful messages about to come your way.

I have been getting them! LOL!

Actually, it is all your fault:-)

When you did your OPUS, I decided to get into the brawl and take some of the heat.

So, apparently did Howlin, Big Sky and some others.

We won't be going anywhere.:-0

[Hildy]

LOL! My posse! If you get any good ones via freepmail, as I have, send them my way, would ya?

[Hildy]

See post 1274. I wish I had wrote that!

[Cold Heat]

Euthanasia is a lot older than the Nazis.

I believe it is as old as the human race. of course, they never called it by that name.

But both active and passive(what we are dealing with here) have always been around.

[FBD]

A Dutch hospital has been actively euthanizing retarded, deformed and terminaly ill babies.

They are sometimes not even consulting the parents before they administer a lethal injection to the child.

It has become known as the "Groningen Protocol", from the hospital where it started:

http://www.showmenews.com/2004/Dec/20041202News020.asp

[Hildy]

written...whatever!

[Cold Heat]

Sure, I will share.

[Earthdweller]

"...that is how the husband sees it, and he does not want to keep her in a protracted state of absolute misery with no awareness and constant muscular distress as indicated by the more sensible of assessments and the majority assessment as well."

If it is a case of constant intractable pain I could understand that she might be in "misery" but in most cases muscular distress is intermittent and easily managed with the right medications.

This is a very common problem with brain damaged folks..but I guess you know that.

Still..I refer to that smile as my evidence of her will to live.

[Deo volente]

"I don't understand why others cannot sense this.I really don't. That is what I see."



Well fine, that's what you see.
But I would invite you to look a little deeper into the picture.

Terri's not dying, she's not PVS or in a coma, rather she's "minimally conscious". Her organs are not shutting down (except from the starvation process imposed upon her at the present), she is not suffering from the last stages of a terminal illness, etc.

The reason she hasn't recovered more has plenty to do with the fact that NO therapy whatsoever has been given to her for many years now.
She is held in a dark room with the minimum amount of sensory stimulation.
Nothing has been done to help her recover more of her faculties.

The woman who is recovering after 20 years in a coma, Sarah Scandlin,
was given intense therapy in the years before she came out of her coma.
Terri has been denied all of this, ILLEGALLY. It was the order of the court in the malpractice trial that all monies awarded go into a fund for therapy for Terri. Michael did this for a little while, then suddenly "remembered" seven years later that Terri wanted to die. That was after he met the euthanasia cheer-leading attorney Felos.

They shopped for a legally blind judge who has consistently ignored any evidence that would go against the foreordained conclusion that Terri is PVS and must die. And there has been much evidence to support the conclusion that she is NOT PVS, and could recover given the chance.

Well, I could go on, but you get the picture. I hope.

[Cold Heat]

Hmmmmmmm.....

Still..I refer to that smile as my evidence of her will to live.

I gave up trying to discern things from smiles a long time ago. They mean nothing if a baby does in the womb or if a dog smiles. In her case, it is a natural facial expression IMO. She is certainly not expressing happiness, but that is why the Shindlers put that film together for. They wanted to manipulate public opinion, and they have. It just did not work on me.

I saw a head smiling in 1971.

It had no body attached to it. You learn things as life progresses. Some of the things are not very rosy.

I could give the smile some weight in the argument, if I believed she had any metal acuity to know if she were happy or not.

I see no evidence of that, and neither did the court. I think the anecdotal stuff is hyperbole.

[Momto2]

Please don't. I've been taking care of my bedridden mother in my home for six years.

Well Hildy - I am unsure what you mean by "Please don't"!! I was only responding to your comment about Terri ending up being cared for by strangers. You implied that I had somehow insulted you or implied that you would not care for your own family member - I never said anything like that!

I only pointed out that she has other family (in addition to her parents) who seem dedicated to her. And then I shared a personal experience .... that because her sibling has seen their parents model the behavior of caring for her - they are more likely to do so themselves. That is all I was saying.

[AmericaUnited]

You people are so irrational! One minute you spout off that she is a non-thinking, non-feeling brain-dead vegetable and then you spout this tripe: In this gals case, it is barbaric to allow her to exist like this.

If she's in a state as you claim, then your statement above is utter nonsense.

[Hildy]

I'm sorry...I'm so used to being attacked here, it was a reflex! :)

[Cold Heat]

But I would invite you to look a little deeper into the picture.

I have, and I don't agree.

All I see is many attempts to bring life and personality to what is virtually a breathing corpse. They stretch any truth and make up a bunch of anecdotal evidence that cannot be verified, to convince others that the courts are wrong.

It just is not strong enough for me to change any opinion that I have.

[Deo volente]

"Terri's situation has arguably received more judicial attention, more medical attention, more executive attention, and more "due process," than any other guardianship case in history."



Well, ARGUABLY is a good word to use here. As I read the chronology of the case, I have grave doubts as to whether the judges, and Greer is particular,
have given Terri her "due process" rights.

It seems to me they have bent over backwards to push this thing to one conclusion only, and facilitate Terri's death by starvation.

[Hildy]

I can't believe you two biddies are still talking about my ass wiping comment from a different thread. You say you're offended, how crude it is and then you keep talking and talking about it...you even direct people to the other thread to see it! It's the craziest thing I've ever seen! You guys make LAUGH and LAUGH and LAUGH.

[Momto2]

No problem..... I've been around here for years and respect you - even if I disagree on some point. I hadn't read enough of the thread to realize you were being attacked.

Bless you for caring for your mom!

[Hildy]

THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR YEARS... you might not agree with the outcome, but you can't say she didn't get due process. Come on.

[FBD]

>"Euthanasia is a lot older than the Nazis."<


Of course it is. The Nazis just perfected it, as they viewed retarded and handicapped folks to be a drain on society. It all started with a single case.

Do a google search on "Baby Knauer"
Take a look at this German poster of a healthy man supporting an infirm old man, and a retarded person:


"You also bear the burden"


Hippocrates oath was in response to euthanasia and abortion, as both were very popular in the practice of medicine in 400 B.C.:

http://members.tripod.com/nktiuro/hippocra.htm

"I WILL FOLLOW that system of regimen which, according to my ability and judgment, I consider for the benefit of my patients, and abstain from whatever is deleterious and mischievous. I will give no deadly medicine to any one if asked, nor suggest any such counsel; and in like manner I will not give a woman a pessary to produce abortion. :

But active euthanasia is back in the Netherlands, where they are now giving severely retarded, and handicapped children lethal injections, sometimes even without the parents consent:

http://www.showmenews.com/2004/Dec/20041202News020.asp