Posted on 03/22/2005 6:13:43 AM PST by sonsofliberty2000
No matter what: you lose because you stand on the side of starving an innocent disabled woman.
PS
I noticed that you failed to address the substantive part of my post regarding conflict of interest????
Noooooooooo....this isn't about starving a disabled woman to death! No way!
It's about marriage, law, lawyers, Judge "kill her" Greer, Michael "Is the b@%*h dead yet" Sciavo, democrats, republicans,congress,etc. but NOT about a disabled woman being starved to death.
You left out saving the democraps' collective face as they push to have a disabled woman put down in the name of right to privacy.
I am wondering if you picked up on my other point?
If Terri dies, we will never again be able to critize
China, North Korea or anyone else on human rights. They
will laugh in our collective faces.
Maybe this whole thing is a lot bigger than originally
thought. Could someone (behind the scenes) be paying off
Michael and the Judges or perhaps scared them to death?
.
Somebody's out there a-watchin us alright.
...After the CLINTONS fooled us into allowing them to send a then Free Little ELIAN back to Communist enslavement in their friend CASTRO's Cuba...
...OSAMA bin LADEN felt empowered to hit us real hard here at home.
...What Price bullying the Vulnerable to death, I wonder?
.
Those affidavits were filed many months after the hearing.
"I also think that he dis-allowed testimony from a friend on Terri that said that Terri did not agree with the decision to end life support for Karen Ann Quinlan."
She did testify, but the judge concluded that those remarks would have been made when Terri was only 11 years old.
"Dr. Hammesfahr's testimony because of a techicality that ..."
Dr. Hammesfahr didn't examine Terri until two years after this hearing. I'm not sure that what he had to contribute was relevant to Terri.
Bump.
So questioning your intellectual honesty is name calling. Now that is rich. You still have not answered the question as to whether or not this man is an adulterer. Is Terri capable of asking for a divorce?
Does Michael Schiavo have any sort of a conflict of interest here? Do Terri's parents? Of course, they both do. Therefor, you must refer back to Terri and there is absolutely no proof that this is what she wanted.
I also seem to recall a scripture that states that which you do to the least of my people, you do unto me.
We must as Christians protect those who cannot protect themselves.
The mother of an unborn child has the legal authority over the decisions of that child, does that make abortion acceptable in your eyes?
Show me any proof that this woman wanted this and you win. The fact is you nor anyone else can. You wanted scripture, you got it. That isn't enough, then there is nothing that I can do. I will pray that you have some clarity on your faith (does that mean I just called you unclear?).
The subject isn't brain dead people. It is PVS (and as you know, that diagnosis is contested .. but even if it was not), and the law is different then. As far as I know, the law looks for an Advance Directive from the living patient. THis is different from looking for the advanced directive of a brain dead patient.
So, do you have a cite for the proposition that somebody other than the PATIENT has a legal right to decide, when the PATIENT is in PVS? I understand that state laws may differ on that point. State law in Florida give the power (to decide) to the PATIENT and NOBODY ELSE.
Yea. I'm sure that's whats going on. I'll file this one a "Schiavo conspiracy theory #238". I'll put it in the file cabinet with all the others. One of them is bound to be right.
Please. Can we stick to the facts?
I remember that Dr. Hammesfahr submitted an affidavit on May 7, 2001 stating that Terri was not in a PVS, but that he didn't personally examine her until September 3rd and 4th, 2002. Google might help you there.
Another source is trinitytx's profile page at: http://www.freerepublic.com/~trinitytx/
On an on going matter like this,you can have motions presented,where the affiant is deposed and that becomes part of the record. The trier of fact cannot ignore relevant facts and he has purposely ignored many relevant facts.That has been his method just not allow anything in the record.
And ther have been many more then one hearing in this matter.
She is not a “disabled woman”. She’s a vegetable. How many courts has this been through? Nineteen Florida State Judges, one Federal District Court judge, the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals, three trips to the U.S. Supreme Court. Are they all in on it? Are they all going to make money off of the death of one woman? If there was any viable reason to believe she had any consciousness left, one of the courts would have noticed it.
And she is not being killed. She has been kept alive by artificial means for 15 years. This is just letting nature take it’s course.
I believe that love is what’s motivating her parents. They love her, and don’t want to loose her. But their overwhelming love and desire to keep her around in any form, is making them blind to the fact that they are being shellfish. They are willing to make her live a half aware vegetable nightmare so they can have her around to love and cuddle. I am not advocating killing disabled or “inconvenient” people. I’m advocating letting vegetative people die naturally, if that is the wish of the next of kin, without court or legislative interference. Huge difference there.
I noticed that you failed to address the substantive part of my post regarding conflict of interest????
I did address it, you just didn’t notice. I was using sarcasm.
Let me try again
How is he going to gain financially compared to how he could gain by walking away? He was offered at least 1 million to do so. Why does no one here want to address that? Because it doesn’t fit their theory, so it must be ignored. What’s motivating the husband? I honestly don’t know. I don’t buy the money angle for the reasons stated above. Covering up a crime? Where’s the evidence. Oh that’s right. It’s being systematically covered up by all the courts and doctors. The level of conspiracy one has to believe in buy this is just not credible. The only thing left is what he stated. She didn’t want to be kept alive like this. And no one can prove she didn’t say it to him. He is the husband. I honestly don't know if I believe him, but it doesn't matter. The fact is that whatever his motive, unless it can be proven in a court of law that her wishes were otherwise, his position as the next of kin must be honored.
I’ll tell you what scares the crap out of me. A precedent could set that anyone can challenge the spouse’s right to speak for the medical treatment of a spouse who is not able to speak for themselves, simply by drumming up enough publicity and using unproven accusations of abuse and greed and lord knows what else. That scares me. This kind of situation is faced by thousands of people in this country every year. And the only reason we are so worked up about this one is because of the publicity. I do not want these matters handled in the courts, the legislature, or in the media. It is a family matter. That means the spouse first, adult children next, and parents and sibling last, as prescribed by law in EVERY state. The parents tried to show evidence why the husband should be removed as guardian. They failed. Repeatedly, over several appeals the courts have found no reason to overture the husbands decision. The evidence is not there.
If this kind of thing should happen to me, my wife is in charge because she is next of kin. My body belongs to her. The bible says we become “one flesh”. My unconscious or vegetative body is hers to do with what she will. I trust her completely. I do not want anyone interfering with her authority. I do not want to be kept in some sort of half conscious living hell of a life in a shell of my body, because some person or group decide to make my case a front for there agenda. No mater how much I agree with the pro-life movement, I do not want to be used by them in that way. Trust me. I’m more radically anti abortion than 90% of the people on FR. There is no reason for abortion in my view, except if it can be shown that the mother will likely DIE. Not incest, rape or anything else. So don’t give me this “You must be for abortion” crap either. This is not that same thing. But it has wrongly been seized upon by the pro-life movement to advance their cause. And it needs to be advanced, just not this way. There is much more involved here.
Actually almost all your facts are wrong she is not a vegetable,there is no such diagnosis in medicine perhaps you meant PVS, which she is not either and there are substantive medical opnions to that effect.
She is not on life support she has a feeding tube.
Which by the way is not essential for her survival since she can swallow.
What is going to kill her is the fact that tha sadist judge Greer has ordered that she is not to get any food or water by mouth not even ice cubes.These are the facts as they are ,not as you write them, and therefore you are indeed condoning the execution of this helpess of that woman by means of dehydration and starvation.
YOU aree not letting a woman die you are advocating the active killing of her.
Just a thaught,what do you think would happen to you if you were denied all food and water by mouth?
Ther will be one more hearing today
Swallowing is not an indication of consciousness. It's an unconscious reaction like breathing.
I never said she is on "life support". A vegetable can be kept alive artificially without, "life support".
Are you just incapable of posting anything to me that doesn't try to vilify me by accusing me of supporting "execution of this helpless woman" or other such nonsense? Is it a possibility in your mind that I could disagree with you on this matter without me being wicked, evil or just plain bad in some way?
I notice that, once again, you didn't address the husbands refusal of the money to walk away from her. How does this square with his killing her for the money? You seem to refuse to see this in any other way than everyone opposed to you is greedy, sadistic or evil.
Man, i really have to stop this not. I've spent WAY too much time here.
Schiavo Parents Seek Review of Ruling
"AP
ATLANTA - Racing against time to save their brain-damaged daughter's life,"
Media cracking under the pressure.
NOTE AP NOW admits Terri is brain damaged, NOT brain dead.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1368946/posts
Only ONE "court" has looked at the facts of the case, asked for tests (some from a pro-euthanasia activist) and made a judgement. No other courts other than the one of Greer has looked at the case in this way. The Congress tried to remedy this, but the Federal judges have so far refused to look at the facts of the case.
All the other courts have done is determine that Greer had the power to make the call.
Once again she is not a vegetable. The medical diagnosis of PVS is being debate(which is a big part of the Congressional Act to get de novo trial, so that modern medical tests can be used to determine her exact condition)
Your persistent calling her a vegetable is way more insulting then anything that I have said to you.
Once again if you understand anything about the court system,once the trial judge created the factual record(ie the facts,like her statements, who to believe. the conflict of interest, her condition) all the appellate courts can do is review where Greer made mistakes of law not mistakes of fact. Even if they find that his ruling on the facts are wrong there is nothing they can do it is outside their jurisdiction,So it is not a conspiracy.
Once again, she is not being kept alive artificially,she is being denied food and water that she can swallow just like you.The feeding tube she had was in because it is faster and easier for the staff to do daily feedings.
So stop misrepresenting the facts.
Finally, on the subject of the financial gains the husband stands to get,the truth of the matter is no one knows because Terri's records are sealed. The amount left from the medical settlement is unknown.What also is unknown is if there is a life insurance on Terri's life,because that is also under the seal order.
So there is definitely a financial component.
Personnally,I believe that if he is removed as guardian he stands to have a big lawsuit against him for all the money that did not go to Terri's rehabilitation which has been stopped in '94.(her wheelchair broke in 1999,Schiavo refused to replce it)
Finally i will call anybody evil and sadistic that orders and ensures that a defenseless innocent woman is being starved to death.
And I will fight those who think they can sit in judgement of the value of one human life over another.
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