India and China agree to form partnership

Yahoo ^ | 11 April 2005 | AP

[Jeff Head]

NEW DELHI - India and China, the world's two most populous countries, agreed on Monday to create a "strategic partnership" in an effort to end their longstanding border dispute and boost trade and economic cooperation.

The agreement signaled a significant shift in relations between the two Asian giants after decades of mutual distrust and suspicion.

"India and China can together reshape the world order," Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said after a welcome ceremony for his Chinese counterpart, Premier Wen Jiabao, at India's presidential palace.

Together the two nations account for one-third the world's population.

The statement announcing the partnership was signed by both premiers and said the agreement would promote diplomatic relations, economic ties and contribute to the two nations "jointly addressing global challenges and threats."

India-China relations have "acquired a global and strategic character," it said.

"The leaders of the two countries have therefore agreed to establish an India-China strategic and cooperative partnership for peace and prosperity," the statement said.

...more

[Jeff Head]

Absolute shades of The Dragon's Fury Series. A little too close for comfort quite frankly.

We'd (the US) best get much more serious about courting India IMHO.

[Jeff Head]

FYI.

[Bahbah]

Jeff, I need to borrow that crystal ball of yours.

[Srirangan]

India would never enter into a strategic partnership with China, as long as China sustains Pak. Same case with America. All these reports is just ignorant media hype.

All India and China have agreed to do is to put their clashing claims of territory in the backseat, maintain peace along the border, and solve the dispute on the basis of the current status quo.

Plus ofcourse boost trade. FTA is being talked about. India is perhaps the only country in the world which has a favorable trade balance with China. Fears of the Chinese Threat of flooding the Indian markets ended long ago and a reverse is being spoken about (See Link).

[datura]

The fact that we may have missed the boat on India is shameful - no, nearly criminal negligence. All for a few al Qaida in custody by Pakistan.

[Jeff Head]

No crystal ball. We have been cozing up to India's perceived most dangrous threat (Pakistan) for years. They (the Indians) have been buying Russian stuff as a counter...and now they are getting closer to China. It was there (IMHO) for anyone to see and now it is starting to materialze, despite reservations and past history.

Nobody thought Stalin and Hitler would get together at the start of WWII like they did...yet they did and until Germany conducted Operation Barbarosa, it drove our military and political planners crazy. This would have the same effect, particularly if it grew into something more.

[anniegetyourgun]

Wish I could get into Condi's head.....

[Jeff Head]

This would indicate differently.

"Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao, left, and India Prime Minister Manmohan Singh shake hands during their talks in New Delhi, India, Monday, April 11, 2005. Indian and Chinese leaders Monday agreed to a strategic partnership between the two emerging Asian giants, sealing it with accords aimed at ending a long-standing border dispute and boosting bilateral trade and economic cooperation. "

Try and read the article, the two foreign ministers are holding up the document. I am afraid that this economic partnership is more than hype...disbelief aside.

[mainepatsfan]

Not as crazy as it drove the British and French at the time.

[Jeff Head]

I hope we haven't missed it yet. We need to make sure that we counter these economic agreements with stronger ones of our own, and then get MUCH closer to them (India) militarily IMHO.

[Jeff Head]

Amen to that...without that other front, D-Day would have been almost impossible.

[Jeff Head]

Well I am off to work and a three-day business trip...if it comes off...will check back on this on Wednesday evening if I go. Otherwise, later today.

[mainepatsfan]

I guess you could say that. One wonders how long Britain could have held out if Hitler had focused on knocking them out before turning on Stalin.

[Jeff Head]

Would have been tough in any case...he had to get across the Channel...best shot at that was very soon after Dunkirk IMHO.

But several million men were thrown at Russia...if he'd taken two million of those and applied them in the west...who knows?

I'm glad the maniac split his efforts. It let us beat him all the quicker...and that was a tough nut as it was.

[indthkr]

Related thread:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1380983/posts

[Saberwielder]

You're right.

Curiously, some former Indian officials and diplomats I spoke to were exceedingly suspicious of China. Their view was that China has always tried to constrain India by proppoing up Pakistan wil nuclear and missile sales. But they feel that given their geographical location, it would be stupid not to take advantage of it for trade.

To paraphrase what one Indian diplomat told me recently - "In essence, the US and China both prop up Pakistan and enable it to get away with sponsoring terorrism against India as well as spreading nukes around the world. The difference is China makes it clear that it won't stop supporting Pakistan while the US patronizes us on democracy and "shared values" while propping up Pakistani dictators behind the scenes. So why should India agree to become an American tool against China? India might as well make the best out of the situation and stay neutral while freeing up business ties with China."

[minus_273]

missed the boat? india was a warsaw pact ally and a socialist state.. they fly migs and use AKs. heck they hate the US so much coke used to be banned there.

[mainepatsfan]

I think even Hitler after 1940 realized a cross channel invasion would be very difficult. Even if the Luftwaffe had established air superiority over Britain it would have been very tough. They probably would have focused on the u-boat blockade and attacking the British in the Mediterranean.

[Srirangan]

No it doesn't. They're just exchanging the the settlement doc's of the border dispute.

[Americanexpat]

Finally, someone who remembers. Use India as a second front? Bullpuckey. These SOBs did not need the excuse of Pakistan to not help us. They have never helped us.

[Americanexpat]

Which means they still would have had to sink American ships and we would have been in the war anyway. FDR was not going to let Germany invade Britain.

[mainepatsfan]

True but I'm not sure the Germans would have needed to in order to get Britain to sign an armistice.

[el_doctor2]

I just checked out the Dragon Fury...it looks like Asia vs. the West in that one.

[sunnysky]

Do we not think the days of the old wars are over? Would countries still try to invade other countries and take them over? I kinda thought we were past all of that nonsense?

No?

[Cronos]

India would never enter into a strategic partnership with China, as long as China sustains Pak.

India has been pushed into this by the US selling weapons to Pak. India may see that they have no choice but to dance with the devil and hope not to get too burned.

[Cronos]

We MUST get very close to India militarily if your books are not to become prophecies. As much as I like 'em, I really wouldn't want them to come true!

[Cronos]

india was a warsaw pact ally and a socialist state..

What are you talking about? India was not part of the Warsaw pact. It say the USSR and Russia as an ally against China. That's why they are still very close to Russia. What you're spouting is cold-war claptrap and that's precisely what is keeping India from becoming our staunchest ally even though we both face the same threats. Cold war dead-beats in the Pentagon who can't think beyond the USSR are calling the WRONG shots.

[Cronos]

I think even Hitler after 1940 realized a cross channel invasion would be very difficult. Even if the Luftwaffe had established air superiority over Britain it would have been very tough. They probably would have focused on the u-boat blockade and attacking the British in the Mediterranean.

If they managed to blocade Britain sufficiently, they could have easily starved her to surrender. The US would NOT have joined in. Remember hitler was a fool -- HE declared war on US, not the other way around.

[mainepatsfan]

I've always wondered what FDR would have done if Hitler had told the Japanese they were on their own after Pearl Harbor?

The u-boats would have brought Britain to the negotiating table eventually. Look at the hell they caused the British even when Germany was also at war with the USA and the USSR.

[bowzer313]

The largest and most destructive land battle fought in Asia in WWII was the Battle of Kohima, in India, between the Chindits and the Japanese. It was considered a second Verdun, with the Japanese force being virtually wiped out to a man. At that time, the British-led Indians and Nationalist Chinese were allies fighting against Imperial Japan.

[sunnysky]

Countries are not going to invade other countries like they used to. This is 2005. It won't happen. The world would not allow it. Perhaps I have my rose colored glasses on?

[Redleg Duke]

And last week or so, Khannie-Boy and another were bashing me about stating this!

Now, where are those boys?

[bowzer313]

"Countries are not going to invade other countries like they used to. This is 2005. It won't happen. The world would not allow it. Perhaps I have my rose colored glasses on?"

You mean, it won't happen, like when the US invaded Afghanistan and Iraq?

[Jeff Head]

They said the same thing after WWI...the war to end all wars. We are foolish if we think that totalitarian governments, particularly if they are big enough (like China) will not invade other countries of they think it is to their ultimte advantage.

Saddam tried it a few years ago...and he wasn't that big and it took half the world to put that one back. If China were to work out economic and or military agreements to preclude enough nations from "not allowing it", then they might well make a move. Eternal vigilance is the answer, and being prepared.

The quote of Thosmas Payne comes to mind when he spoke of why it was important for the people to remained armed. He said that while it would be a great world if no one was armed and every one treated each other equitably, he ended up by saying, "because some will not, we dare not"...go unarmed. The same principle applieson the macro scale with nations.

The Rising Sea Dragon in Asia

[mainepatsfan]

Another front of World War II that most people don't know about. The Japanese got their clocks cleaned.

[razoroccam]

You are right about this being over-blown. As well as the Paki problem. Surprising how many naive folks at FR will believe that India and China will form an alliance. Who was it who said "there is a sucker born every minute"?

However, you are incorrect regarding trade. China has a trade imbalance not only with India but also with Brazil, Argentina, Australia, Indonesia, and a few other countries.

[reluctantwarrior]

WE have agreed to sell F-16s to the Indian Air Force the chinese would love to get their hands on the avionics. The Chinese are purchasing the Su-30 series airframe from the Soveits and it is an airframe that with improved avionics would eclipse the F-16 and even the cahrlie model F-15 and the basic F/A-18

[razoroccam]

Exactly. India is being very pragmatic about it.

[minus_273]

i didnt say india was in the warsaw pact, they were allied with the soviets against us.

[ekidsohbelaas]

And you got what grade in World History 101?

[minus_273]

the indian national army joined japan and fought against nepal and the UK in burma.

[minus_273]

wait, are you claiming india was not a soviet ally? next you know, you are going to claim that subas chandra bose didnt lead the indian national army as part of the axis. Have you ever wondered why india does not celebrate V-J day like the rest of us?

[Arjun]

"These SOBs did not need the excuse of Pakistan to not help us. They have never helped us."
Your Ignorance amazes me. For a decade before 9/11 Indian Intelligence kept warning the US regarding extremism in Afghanistan and pakistan and we were told that it was Indias problem. If CIA had listened 9/11 could have been prevented.
It was India along with Russia that were supporting the northern alliance who fought the taliban rule. Even after 9/11 India wanted to participate in afghanistan operations but was prevented by the US due to paki influence. US still doesnt see the light here.

[Alamo-Girl]

Jeepers. Thanks for the ping!

[Jeff Head]

Surprising how many naive folks at FR will believe that India and China will form an alliance. Who was it who said "there is a sucker born every minute"?

Stranger things have happened...and economic issues and agreements can led to military ties if they are successful and if the participants feel that success is somehow threatened.

As to it being naive...the same thing would have been said about any warnings of Stalin and Hitler getting together in the late 30's...and yet it happened to the horrble chargin of all of Europe at the time. What is naive is to ignore historical precedence and think it cannot happen here.As Sophocles wrote well over 23 centuries ago :

Far-stretching, endless Time
Brings forth all hidden things,
And buries that which once did shine.
The firm resolve falters, the sacred oath is shattered;
And let none say, "It cannot happen here".

[knarf]

read later

[NormsRevenge]

Well, this stickies up the wickets a bit..

'62 was a busy year,, Cuban crisis, India-China border war .

Have a good trip.

[ekidsohbelaas]

No offence, but you ought to hit the books. Incomplete knowledge can be a dangerous thing.

Happy revelations kid.. :)

[Americanexpat]

People do not agree with you they are ignorant huh?

life must be simple for you.

[NormsRevenge]

Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh (L) with Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao. China and India signed a historic accord setting out 'guiding principles' to resolve their decades-old border dispute, a move expected to boost economic cooperation and bilateral ties between the two Asian giants.(AFP/Prakash Singh)