Ed Koch: The New Pope and Anti-Semitism

NewsMax ^ | 4/19/05 | Ed Koch

[wagglebee]

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger of Germany has been elected as the next pope of the Roman Catholic Church and will take the name Benedict XVI. There are some who may criticize the election of Cardinal Ratzinger, since he joined the Hitler Youth at age 14 as a child growing up in Germany. I think any such criticism is unfounded.

How can the decision to join the Hitler Youth corps be the responsibility of a child? The Nazis brilliantly exploited German children with the games and military outfits that most youngsters enjoy. Former New York Times Executive Editor Max Frankel, in the opening paragraph of his book "The Times of My Life and My Life With The Times," summed up a child's feelings at the time:

"I was not yet three years old when Adolf Hitler came to power in 1933, and I could have become a good little Nazi in his army. I loved the parades: I wept when other kids marched beneath our window without me. But I was ineligible for the Aryan race, the Master Race that Hitler wanted to purify of Jewish blood and other pollutants so that it could rule the world for ‘a thousand years.'"

The leader of the Hitler Jugend, Balder von Shirach, was convicted at Nuremberg after the war and sentenced to 20 years in prison. However, the Allies did not find that the Hitler Jugend organization itself was a criminal organization.

If Cardinal Ratzinger had not joined the Hitler Youth, it would have been because his parents kept him out, which some – but very few – parents did. While Germans were not automatically jailed or shot for such conduct, you can be sure that refusing to cooperate with the Nazi authorities would have subjected them to adversity. Very few people had the courage to stand up to the Nazi murderers, especially when their children's lives were involved.

One of the highest priorities of the new pope hopefully will be to maintain a close relationship between Jews and Catholics, an effort begun by Pope John XXIII and vastly expanded by Pope John Paul II. I hope it is seen as a priority by the new pope. Of course, the new pope will continue to seek a reconciliation with other Christian faiths and a continuing dialogue with the representatives of Islam.

Cardinal Ratzinger in his homily delivered immediately before the conclave said he does not believe in syncretism, the attempt to reconcile different faiths. He probably would not attend on any occasion the service of another faith.

He is not alone in this position. Orthodox rabbis (but not Conservative or Reform rabbis) take the same position, as do some Protestant clergy. Indeed, some would go so far as to seek to punish a member of their sect if he were to participate in or even attend a joint service commemorating a public event, including memorializing a tragedy such as 9/11.

Pope John Paul II visited a Roman synagogue – the first pope to do so – and placed a written prayer in a crevice of the Western Wall. That, for me, set the standard. It is my hope that Cardinal Ratzinger as pope will follow in John Paul's footsteps, and that others, Jewish and Protestant, will embrace, as John Paul II did, members of other faiths, remembering that we will all ultimately answer to the same God.

[wagglebee]

Former New York Times Executive Editor Max Frankel, in the opening paragraph of his book "The Times of My Life and My Life With The Times," summed up a child's feelings at the time:

"I was not yet three years old when Adolf Hitler came to power in 1933, and I could have become a good little Nazi in his army. I loved the parades: I wept when other kids marched beneath our window without me. But I was ineligible for the Aryan race, the Master Race that Hitler wanted to purify of Jewish blood and other pollutants so that it could rule the world for ‘a thousand years.'"

I have no doubt that before the week is out, the New York Slimes will have painted Pope Benedict XVI as being more evil than Hitler ever dreamed.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

That's why they're the NY Slimes...

[eastsider]

Hitler's Rottweiler, no doubt ...

[SJackson]

If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

[wingman1]

My wife's uncle was a Hitler youth at a very young age.

He is anything but a nazi.

[Soul Seeker]

If Cardinal Ratzinger had not joined the Hitler Youth, it would have been because his parents kept him out, which some – but very few – parents did. While Germans were not automatically jailed or shot for such conduct, you can be sure that refusing to cooperate with the Nazi authorities would have subjected them to adversity. Very few people had the courage to stand up to the Nazi murderers, especially when their children's lives were involved.

Stalin had a similiar practice i believe. I don't hold children responsible for the assimilation of these entities. They are brainwashed into service, and their parents usually allow it out of fear of reprisal. Clearly as an adult he rejected it, that is what matters.

Cardinal Ratzinger in his homily delivered immediately before the conclave said he does not believe in syncretism, the attempt to reconcile different faiths. He probably would not attend on any occasion the service of another faith.

Now that is interesting. I respect that position, because I refuse to reconcile mine to come to a compromised generic belief. Differences exist for reason. While I have no desire to lose sight of the most important component Christians share in common, Jesus Christ, that doesn't mean I'll dismiss where we do disagree.

[EagleUSA]

That's why they're the NY Slimes...
=======
The Communist rag, the NYT and all the rest of the socialist media, was predicted with ultimate precision, that they would attack the choice of Pope, if the Pope was not a flaming leftist, liberal, gay-pandering activist.

Choke on it MSM -- you pathetic losers -- !!!

[spanalot]

I think a German pope will instill a moral compass in that country like it did in Poland and get another big piece of europe steered away from relativistic, nihilistic leftist sop it has been stuck with for a long time.

[Soul Seeker]

IMO, I wouldn't be surprised if that was a consideration in his nomination.

What is Christianity's greatest enemy right now? Islam? No, the president has been handling that problem. Communism? A concern especially in China but the Soviets fell and so can they. The internet playing a major role. The alliance between Australia, Taiwan, japan and the U.S. playing another.

The greatest threat, imo, to Christianity is the secular humanism that has embraced Europe. The Culture of Death. No better place to confront it than in the heart of Germany.

[Bogie]

Yes, he's had plenty of time to reflect. Makes a big difference!

[An American Patriot]

"If Cardinal Ratzinger had not joined the Hitler Youth, it would have been because his parents kept him out, which some – but very few – parents did. While Germans were not automatically jailed or shot for such conduct, you can be sure that refusing to cooperate with the Nazi authorities would have subjected them to adversity. Very few people had the courage to stand up to the Nazi murderers, especially when their children's lives were involved."

Yes, the left is piling on (and not so surprising, already have their "talking points" in order and all are repeating ad naseum, citing "some Catholics") especially with the "Rotweiller" moniker and the Ratzinger's time spent in the Hitler Youth Group.

God, (oops sorry about that. NOT) you would think that he had been a fullfledged member of Heinrich Himmler's SS.

As it turns out, this is what has been reported about this experiencwrote based upon his book, "The Salt of The Earth:"

"In 1941, Ratzinger, 14, and his brother, Georg were enrolled in the Hitler Youth when it became mandatory for all boys. Soon after, he writes in his book, "The Salt of the Earth," he was let out because of his intention to study for the priesthood."

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2005/04/19/international/i121336D98

I don't know how long he "served" in the Hitler Youth Corps, but his having been released due to his intentions of studying for the priesthood, should (but don't hold your breath) put to rest any question about his loyalties for the Third Reich and Hitler.

[wingman1]

"Yes, he's had plenty of time to reflect. Makes a big difference!"

I don't think it took him very long. Defeat has a way of making one refect.

Each time I have been to Germany, I have met men of that generation who have taken it upon themselves to offer an apology for their "history".

[wagglebee]

With the expansion of worldwide and constant news sources (CNN, Fox News, etc.) and the internet, people are far more informed today than ever. During prior conclaves, very few non-Italian Catholics even knew the names of the Cardinals who were likely to become Pope, in 1978 NOBODY knew anything about the future John Paul II. All of that is different now, John Paul's health problems were well known and as a result, the left has had a long time to prepare "talking points" on every Cardinal. What we are seeing now is simply the execution of a plan that has been in the works for years.

[BenLurkin]

If Koch is worried about anti-Semitism I suggest he start in his own party.

When the Howard Dean crowd uses the term "neocon" as a pejorative, consider what they really mean.

[wagglebee]

Over the course of the past year, Ed Koch has impressed me as a man of great integrity who is not afraid to sacrifice his political stature within his party to follow his conscience.

[sirthomasthemore]

I agree as to Koch. Out of all the Dem pols, he was my favorite because he is a pragmatist. For instance, he wrote a piece statng that Jews should support GWB for his efforts in Iraq.

Like the rest of the Libs, he can be off the wall, but at least, he doesn't walk in lockstep.

[spanalot]

I think a German pope will instill a moral compass in that country like it did in Poland
"Actually, Poland was very Catholic prior to JP2's elevation but has since dramatically slidden downhill with increased abortion, divorce, contraception, you-name-it, and plenty of homo-molestation scandals"

I did not mean to say that Poland became more catholic.

I meant to say that there was a nationalistic effect that gave the people a sense of direction and a sense of right and wrong - as opposed to leftist , socialist, relativist, nihilist meandering.

[billorites]

My piano tuner was in the Hitler youth.

It's a riot to hear him talk of it.

He's more rabid a Reaganite than I.

[KosmicKitty]

Pope John Paul II visited a Roman synagogue – the first pope to do so

Forgive my ignorance, but ....

If St Peter is considered the first pope, and he was jewish, wouldn't he have also gone to a synagogue, thereby making the above statement incorrect.

Just wondering

[wagglebee]

I have wondered the same thing (also St. Peter's immediate successors), it is possible that the Romans did not allow any synagogues in Rome, but I have no idea. Regardless, John Paul II was certainly the only Pope since the earliest days of Christianity to visit one.

[Bogie]

Yes, me too. But, there was a lot mere than a simple military defeat involved in the reflection. If you get a chance read some of the Nobel Prize author Heinrich Boll.He deals with how people can let their minds be controlled by a sort of "group think" which, of course, in his case, was the Nazi leadership.

[Cicero]

At the time the Pope visited Israel, Ratzinger wrote some important documents on Catholic-Jewish relations. The MSM dismissed his comments at the time as mere "theology," but that was typical MSM stupidity and blindness to religion. In the end, Catholic-Jewish relations will rest upon theology, not diplomatic niceties, and Ratzinger's position was very much pro-Jewish.

I can't put my hands on his statement at the moment, but there's absolutely no question that Benedict XVI will continue PJP II's efforts to improve relations with the Jews and clear up any lingering antisemitism among Catholics. And it won't just be empty PR or diplomatic mouthings. It's solid theological reasoning that will become the basis of the Church's future relations with the Jews.

[wingman1]

"...there was a lot mere than a simple military defeat involved in the reflection..."

Sometimes I wonder.

[Bogie]

Well, certainly the defeat put a stop to the propaganda machine. Hard to think with all that pollution in your ears.

Yes, you're right! First things first.

[Alouette]

Catholic-Jewish relations will rest upon theology, not diplomatic niceties, and Ratzinger's position was very much pro-Jewish.

Catholics and Jews should be cordial and respect each other without abolishing or changing their deeply-held and most sacred beliefs. This means that Christians should not blame all Jews as "Christ killers" but also that Jews should not try to force Christians to deny that Christ is the only means of salvation.

As far as arguing over "who goes to hell" for believing or not believing this or that, that not up to us to decide.

I hope that Pope Benedict XVI will lead his people on the right path.

FRmail me to be added or removed from this Judaic/pro-Israel ping list.

WARNING: This is a high volume ping list

[wideawake]

it is possible that the Romans did not allow any synagogues in Rome, but I have no idea

The synagogue John Paul II visited was in Rome. There have been synagogues in Rome continuously for 2000 years, probably longer.

[wingman1]

Thankfully, things (The master race getting its _ss kicked) worked out as they did. If not, I doubt today's apologies from the Germans would be forthcoming. Human nature and all.

Mr. Boll may have been a different story - all who have tasted war first hand look at things differently. He would be the exception - even in the best of circumstances.

[wideawake]

Thank you.

I will quote from an official document that Pope Benedict XVI published in 2002 in his official capacity as head of the Pontifical Biblical Commission:

"An attitude of respect, esteem and love for the Jewish people is the only truly Christian attitude in a situation[i.e. the disagreement between Christians and Jews as to Jesus' status as Messiah]which is mysteriously part of the beneficent and positive plan of God."

That's from The Jewish People and Their Sacred Scriptures in the Christian Bible.

In the same document he quotes approvingly John Paul II's characterization of the Jews as Catholics' "elder brothers".

[Campion]

Yes, he's had plenty of time to reflect. Makes a big difference!

Reflect on what? His parents were anti-Nazis, he was anti-Nazi. He was forced to join the Hitler Youth or drop out of the seminary; he attended one meeting to satisfy the local Nazi party leadership. He was drafted into the German army and deserted his post in the closing weeks of the war, thus risking being shot by any SS man who happened to find him. He was then picked up by the Americans as a POW and put in a cage outdoors for a couple of months.

I don't see that he has much to reflect on, or be sorry about.

I know I wasn't brave enough at 18 to risk being shot as a deserter, whether from Hitler's army or any other. Were you?

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet. The Pope had a cousin who had Down's Syndrome, and was murdered by the Nazis. He is literally a relative of a victim of the Holocaust.

Reflect, you say?

[onedoug]

TFTF,A.

Deuteronmy 4:19 and Malachi 1:11.

"...For they all aim to Thee to come." --Solomon ibn Gabirol, Middle Ages synagogue hymn-writer

[Alouette]

THE JEWISH PEOPLE AND THEIR SACRED SCRIPTURES IN THE CHRISTIAN BIBLE

[Bogie]

Geeezzz Champion, I was talking about the uncle of wingman1's wife.

[wingman1]

Bogie was responding to my making mention of my wife's uncle regarding "time to reflect".

It was not until a later message that he mentioned Mr. Boll.

Please reread the thread.

[1st-P-In-The-Pod]

I couldn't agree more with your statements. Thanks for the heads up.

[claudiustg]

---Indeed, some would go so far as to seek to punish a member of their sect if he were to participate in or even attend a joint service commemorating a public event, including memorializing a tragedy such as 9/11.---

Missouri Lutherans.

[FreeReporting]

http://www.teachkidspeace.com/friend.php

[American in Israel]

This means that Christians should not blame all Jews as "Christ killers" but also that Jews should not try to force Christians to deny that Christ is the only means of salvation.

You know Alouette, I have been a Christian for over 30 years in many congregations and have never met a single Christian that blames the Jews as "Christ Killers".

Not one.

There seems to be a perception error showing here.

Blessings...

[Convert from ECUSA]

Good points, Alouette. I've been a Christian all of my life (I'll be 50 in a few months), and I can only recall once where someone called the Jewish people "Christ killers". That person was roundly reamed and rebuked by everyone in no uncertain terms. As someone in the group put it so well, "the sins of every one of us drove the nails into Christ...every one of us, regardless of our background, and Christ said He voluntarily laid down His Life for all of us." BAM!

[BlackElk]

Let's see. Uses the name of a Catholic Saint. Despises the memory of Pope John Paul the Great. Is willing to suggest in public that John Paul the Great willingly promoted in Poland bishops who were pro-homo. My, you guys must really miss JP II who excommunicated your heroes in disobedience, dissidence, and defiance of legitimate authority.

If Ed Koch had ever been baptized, he would be a better Catholic than you.

' Who died and left you God to sit in judgment on JP II? I thought not.

[ninenot]

He put out a paper (I can't find it, either,) showing clearly the commonalities in the Jewish and Catholic belief systems, I think through Cong/Doc/Faith.

About 7-10 years ago, IIRC.

Ben Stein was VERY interested in the paper at the time.

[Nachum]

You know Alouette, I have been a Christian for over 30 years in many congregations and have never met a single Christian that blames the Jews as "Christ Killers". Not one.

LOL.

Than you've never been to Chicago. I grew up there and heard it plenty. :)

[ninenot]

The only time I've heard the term "Christ-killers" here in Milwaukee (in my somewhat faulty and aging memory) was in a sermon denouncing the idiots who used the term...

[tang-soo]

With no disrespect meant, I wanted to pass along a thought offered by a friend during Bible study last night. He referred to the new Pope as "The German Shepherd".

[Nachum]

The only time I've heard the term "Christ-killers" here in Milwaukee (in my somewhat faulty and aging memory) was in a sermon denouncing the idiots who used the term...

Now that I am in California, they simply shout a few other choice epethets like "kike", or "f***ing Jew". Although, I was treated to "Springtime for Hitler" while at the supermarket a few years ago.

[ninenot]

You sure have a lot of luck when you pick a neighborhood to live in, don't you?

[Nachum]

You sure have a lot of luck when you pick a neighborhood to live in, don't you?

Just lucky, I guess.