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Climate Change is 'All about Our Money,' Big Investors Say
Associated Press ^ | May 11, 2005 | Charles J. Hanley

Posted on 05/12/2005 2:06:24 AM PDT by Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit

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To: #1CTYankee

See post 5 for explanation


61 posted on 05/12/2005 4:23:58 AM PDT by Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit (“There is a law – a law of nature. Man is not the ruler.")
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To: kidd

The failure of Kyoto is not the main concern, although Kyoto failed B/C U.S.A said no, the problem is the failure to ATTEMPT to do something.
But I respect your view.


62 posted on 05/12/2005 4:24:17 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: #1CTYankee

Change is the essential process of all existence.

"Let That Be Your Last Battlefield," stardate 5730.2.


63 posted on 05/12/2005 4:28:21 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray

See post 50 - Scientists say that cleaner air will lead to global warming due to increased energy absorbed from the sun.

If we passed Kyoto, wouldn't we be making GW worse? If you say no, why not?


64 posted on 05/12/2005 4:28:46 AM PDT by listenhillary (If it ain't broke, it will be after the government tries to fix it)
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To: All

IMPORTANT NOTE!
My concern is NOT GW or anything of the sort, oil has burned on earth for millions of years.
my main concern is toxic gasses, GW is still not proven and we are currently in a period of time which historicly should be a time of temp. increase.

It would be illogical to assume that all conditions remain stable.

"The Enterprise" Incident," stardate 5027.3


65 posted on 05/12/2005 4:31:46 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray

The air is getting cleaner.


66 posted on 05/12/2005 4:34:11 AM PDT by listenhillary (If it ain't broke, it will be after the government tries to fix it)
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To: listenhillary

I see no evidence of that.


67 posted on 05/12/2005 4:36:23 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray

No. Kyoto is a failure with or without the participation of the United States.

Do you want to reduce human-produced CO2?

Make the NET producers of CO2 plant trees. China and India need to maintain forests in proportion to their CO2 production. The United States can do its part by maintaining its forests so that forest fires don't go out of control.

But Kyoto doesn't call for that. It only focuses on CO2 origins, not NET production. And it exempts over half of the world's population.

Kyoto is not about doing SOMETHING to help the environment. Its about money.


68 posted on 05/12/2005 4:36:26 AM PDT by kidd
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To: kidd

Your arguments of the tree's have been beaten flat long ago, and the sea is the highest produce of H2O and the place where most of the H20 goes to be stored, and it's stored not removed.


69 posted on 05/12/2005 4:39:40 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray
You need to go back and ask Spock to validate your logic...
GW is not science, it is fraud and nothing more than stupid ideologies...corrupted as a tool of collective idiocy.
Same vein as the French work week, second hand smoke, No war for Oil, bin Laden building schools, unilateral disarmament and we are from the guvernment & here to help you!
This was the most ridiculous thread I have read on the subject. I really think immature newbies should be barred from posting for the 1st month and do some research before spouting this pablum on GW/hydrogen/etc...
70 posted on 05/12/2005 4:44:45 AM PDT by iopscusa (El Vaquero.)
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I'm prob. taking the weekend now, so have fun peeps.
but I leave you with these thoughts from Spock.

If I let go a hammer on a planet having a positive gravity, I need not see it fall to know that it has, in fact, fallen.

"Court Martial," stardate 2948.9.

There are many aspects of human irrationality I do not yet comprehend. Obsession, for one. The persistent single-minded fixation on one idea.

"Obsession," stardate 3619.6.

Without followers, evil cannot spread.

"And The Children Shall Lead," stardate 5029.5.


71 posted on 05/12/2005 4:45:23 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray
No said it would be easy, my favourite car is my 63 vette, she ROARS when she runs but she drinks more gas then my wallet can take in the long run.

Cut her up; it's the right thing to do for your wife and child.

72 posted on 05/12/2005 4:46:36 AM PDT by niteowl77
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To: XavierXray
Nearly all plastics are made from oil.. some 80-90 percent of the oil we use is for product, not energy...

While I agree that electricity can be used more effectively, hydroelectric power is finite.. limited.. in the case of US power production, hydro contributes only a small percentage..Biofuels actually contribute more than hydro does..(1990 stats)
As for diesel, it's still grossly inefficient, but if you're going to use it, why waste the direct energy for producing electricity?
Diesel is a fuel created for transportation..why waste energy refining diesel when you can simply use the oil?

While none of my arguments hold ground under scrutiny, I would note you didn't seem to bother "scrutinizing" any of them.. just a blanket dismissal..

If you want to make life better for your children in the future, more power to you..
Leave him some land and money.. Your Own, Not Mine..
Just being brutally honest here, but I'm not as interested in making the world a better place for someone else's kids.. on my dime..
Charity begins at home..
When I'm "darn" sure my kids will be OK, I'll look beyond my front door...

I've got nothing against making the world a better place.
I'm all for alternative energy, energy conservation, environmental conservation, etc..
But I want some Common Sense to preside over such activities, not pseudo-science, and not politics and economic policy determined by false science..

73 posted on 05/12/2005 4:47:06 AM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: iopscusa
Freedom of speach to all, except those who disagree with me huh?

see post 65
What I think of your comments will go unanswerd
74 posted on 05/12/2005 4:48:56 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: XavierXray

You are not looking for evidence of cleaner air. You're looking for evidence that validates your view. The air is indeed cleaner, much cleaner than it has been for quite some time.

Typical, can't back up your argument so you run away.

Kyoto treaty was about the redistribution of wealth.


75 posted on 05/12/2005 4:49:46 AM PDT by listenhillary (If it ain't broke, it will be after the government tries to fix it)
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To: XavierXray
Star Trek was a TV show, that is, a work of fiction.

Now, if you want to quote from it, keep in mind it was the creation of Gene Rodenberry, who was not a scientist. A good writer, but I'm not geeky enough to treat his works as some sort of religious truth. All his stories were written to have an outcome within 60 minutes, and see Kirk victorious. Real life doesn't work that way.

The future is unknown for all of us. Even for writers of fictitious television shows.

76 posted on 05/12/2005 4:51:57 AM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!

Star Trek = "Wagon Train" in space...


77 posted on 05/12/2005 4:54:35 AM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: Einigkeit_Recht_Freiheit
"When in comes to climate change, logic dictates that denyers can only be wrong."

Well let's see...

"Harvard University environmental scientist John Holdren gave the more than 300 participants an update on the latest climate research, saying it's increasingly clear that rising global temperatures caused by emissions of carbon dioxide and other "greenhouse gases" would intensify heat waves, storms, floods, droughts and wildfires in the 21st century. "

What scientific principle says that as the temperature increases on the order of 0.3%, that the fluctuations in the system would increase by 2 orders of magnitude, or more?

"If 99 people are saying the sky is yellow and you are the only one saying it is blue, even if you are right, you still look crazy. "

So Goebbel's students would say...

78 posted on 05/12/2005 4:58:43 AM PDT by spunkets
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To: listenhillary; Alas Babylon!

LH:
I never run, neither did I run in Afghanistan, but then again I never did tell anyone here that I did my part for us all.
I may not agree with what you have to say but I fought for your right to say it!
Actually, what you say is border line to offensive but just comes across as childish.
Where is your evidence btw?

As for Trek, it's fiction, I know it's fiction, warp drives are offensive to Einstein, but what I like about the show is it's positive futuristic view, although most capitalists will disagree since money does not exist.


79 posted on 05/12/2005 4:59:10 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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To: edskid

Nah, she moves about 2km a decade, she's just a satisfaction of my material needs ;)


80 posted on 05/12/2005 5:00:48 AM PDT by XavierXray (Don't mind the dyslexia)
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