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"Schiavo Case Said Little About 'Right to Die,' Much About Judicial Supremacy" (and INactivism!)
FAMILY RESEARCH COUNCIL.ORG ^ | MAY 18, 2005 | PETER SPRIGG

Posted on 05/17/2005 9:40:33 PM PDT by CHARLITE

Ironically, if Terri Schiavo's feeding tube had been reinserted and she had been allowed to live on, it would have done very little damage to the purported "right to die." It would have set no precedent for cases in which a patient has left written instructions, in which a patient's heart is unable to beat or lungs are unable to breathe without the aid of a machine, in which a patient was already suffering a terminal illness, or in which a patient's closest family members are united as to what the patient wanted. What made Terri's case stand out was not how typical it was of "end-of-life" issues, but how utterly unique.

While allowing Terri to live would have done little harm to the "right to die," the determination of her husband and the entire judicial system of the United States to kill her set some very dangerous precedents indeed. One is what it says about the role of judges in our system of laws.

Liberals who were cynical about legislative intervention in the case gleefully pointed out that the courts that heard various motions in the case could hardly be accused of "judicial activism." This term is often used by conservatives to describe judges who read into the law principles not evident from its language. Indeed, courts in this case might better be accused of "judicial inactivism"--an unwillingness to draw obvious conclusions from newly enacted laws if it might mean questioning the decision of a fellow judge.

The common thread, however, is judicial arrogance, judicial supremacy, and judicial tyranny. Defenders of the courts' refusal to intervene tout the constitutional principle of the "separation of powers" between the branches of government. They are less enamored with the concept that the three branches exercise "checks and balances" upon one another, except in a one-way direction (that is, when judges tell legislators to throw out the laws they have passed through the democratic process).

In the Schiavo case, the defenders of this judicially-mandated death argue that the Florida courts correctly construed the decision-making process which Florida law provides under such circumstances. Even if that is true, it was surely the prerogative of the Florida legislature to change that law in a way that provides additional protections for a fundamental right. The courts would then be under an absolute obligation to obey that law, because legislators write laws, and courts merely apply them to individual cases.

The courts, however, would have none of it. That's why, when Florida legislators passed a law in 2003 that would have granted Terri added protections, the Florida Supreme Court declared it unconstitutional. And when Congress passed a law in March giving federal courts jurisdiction to protect Terri's right to life, the courts simply refused to exercise it. Our branches of government are supposed to be co-equal, but in this case, preserving judicial supremacy over the legislative branch trumped all other considerations, including obedience to the rule of law.

Along with the "separation of powers," another principle gleefully trumpeted by the advocates of Terri's death is "federalism." Why, they wondered, do conservatives who normally defend the powers of the states now want to promote federal intervention in a court case already settled at the state level? However, the conservative concern about "states' rights" arises primarily when the federal government interferes with the states in one of two ways--by exercising a power that is not explicitly granted to it by the Constitution, or by denying states a power that is not denied them by the Constitution. In this case, however, the Fifth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution says explicitly, "No person shall be ... deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law."

The precise question at issue in the Schiavo case was whether Terri was being "deprived of life ... without due process of law." Federal courts have a perfectly logical role in determining whether a state has violated such a clear-cut federal constitutional right. A case like this, in which "life" means "life" and "due process" means "due process," is a far cry from liberal judicial activism like Roe v. Wade. In the latter "life" means "only a life that is wanted by the mother," "liberty" means "abortion," and "due process" means "meeting the approval of liberal elites."

Judges must indeed be independent, but that does not mean that they are sovereign, with the power to write, interpret, and execute the laws. Granting them such power is a recipe for tyranny.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; Politics/Elections; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: allterriallthetime; emotionalhysteria; issues; judicial; righttodie; stilldead; supremacy; terribots; terrischiavo; terriscult
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1 posted on 05/17/2005 9:40:33 PM PDT by CHARLITE
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To: CHARLITE

Who is Terri Schiavo? **S**


2 posted on 05/17/2005 10:27:10 PM PDT by dk/coro
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To: Brad's Gramma; Pegita; floriduh voter; Ohioan from Florida; tutstar; Pepper777; nicmarlo; ...

Never forget PING!


3 posted on 05/17/2005 11:15:40 PM PDT by STARWISE (Is your voice being heard in Washington? You get the govt. you deserve.U.S. CONGRESS: 1-877-762-8762)
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To: CHARLITE
THE issue in the tragedy of Terri Schiavo is the murder of an innocent woman by the State, purely because she was in no position to defend herself.

It will forever remain a black stain on modern "civilization".
4 posted on 05/17/2005 11:43:35 PM PDT by Aussie Dasher (The Great Ronald Reagan & John Paul II - Heaven's Dream Team!)
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To: Aussie Dasher
And note that the very first response to this posting was: "Who is Terri Schiavo?" There is no more interest in Terri. She's gone and forgotten. During her ordeal, Free Republic was loaded with threads about Terri. Now, nothing. Very sad commentary on how "committed" we really are to tragic stories like this, and to the memories of people who, as you say, was murdered by the State only because she was helpless.

Thousands read and participated in the Terri threads. This evening, only 42 were interested enough to read the article.

Char

5 posted on 05/17/2005 11:47:30 PM PDT by CHARLITE (Not gonna be happy until the Hillster is sent packing, with Billery in tow. on a leash.........)
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To: CHARLITE

I assure you, I will NEVER forget!


6 posted on 05/18/2005 12:00:40 AM PDT by Aussie Dasher (The Great Ronald Reagan & John Paul II - Heaven's Dream Team!)
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To: CHARLITE

Char, I have full confidence that many more people read the title of this article and are still very concerned with this issue. There was no need to read the article because we know the details all too painfully. The title IS the message. I personally am a little frustrated about what to do to accomplish sorely needed meaningful change. I don't know if eliminating the judicial filibuster will help much. Something evil seems to happen to many judges when they're on the bench. An unchecked judiciary is NOT a good thing, and our congresscritters don't seem to have enough integrity to perform their constitutional balancing DUTY.


7 posted on 05/18/2005 12:32:10 AM PDT by 1_Of_We
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To: 1_Of_We; CHARLITE
Char, I have full confidence that many more people read the title of this article and are still very concerned with this issue. There was no need to read the article because we know the details all too painfully. The title IS the message. I personally am a little frustrated about what to do to accomplish sorely needed meaningful change. I don't know if eliminating the judicial filibuster will help much. Something evil seems to happen to many judges when they're on the bench. An unchecked judiciary is NOT a good thing, and our congresscritters don't seem to have enough integrity to perform their constitutional balancing DUTY.

There is always room for argument, but for me, these are the three seminal, defining issues of our times:

-Men(ace) in Black? SCOTUS goes Rogue...--

-Useless Eaters vs The Death Cult--

-Thunder on the Border-- (Minuteman Project)--

A runaway Judiciary, is your life really your own, and can we keep our culture, country, and borders intact? The rest is mere commentary.

8 posted on 05/18/2005 1:15:15 AM PDT by backhoe (-30-)
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To: CHARLITE; amdgmary; EternalVigilance; tutstar; Lesforlife; dandelion; 8mmMauser; floriduh voter; ...

Excellent post.


9 posted on 05/18/2005 1:51:18 AM PDT by TheSarce (Liberalism: The irrational, intolerant cult that dare not speak its name.)
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To: CHARLITE; TheSarce

Thank you for this post. Please do not get discouraged at apparent fading of this event. So different from other stories that come and go, the plight of Terri has touched hearts and continues to do so in a way we cannot yet appreciate.

Hidious evil has been unmasked by this event. People's lives have changed for the better because of what they now comprehend. Much emphasis has shifted to other levels, new email networks springing up, people waking up.

Terri's plight marks a sea change for how we view our country and our world in religious terms and in politics. I predict it will become more apparent as time goes by that much good will be manifest by Terri's suffering.

8mm


10 posted on 05/18/2005 4:23:55 AM PDT by 8mmMauser (www.ChristtheKingMaine.com Jesu, ufam Tobie)
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To: CHARLITE

bump


11 posted on 05/18/2005 5:33:25 AM PDT by tutstar ( <{{--->< Impeach Judge Greer http://www.petitiononline.com/ijg520/petition.html)
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To: CHARLITE

Remember Char, we've got different time zones and early to bed folks too. In general I must agree but let's not be so hard on us just yet.


12 posted on 05/18/2005 5:35:33 AM PDT by tutstar ( <{{--->< Impeach Judge Greer http://www.petitiononline.com/ijg520/petition.html)
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To: backhoe
* bump *

Keep the faith.

13 posted on 05/18/2005 5:38:02 AM PDT by Cboldt
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To: CHARLITE; Ohioan from Florida; STARWISE

I wouldn't get discouraged at that, the thread has a catchy
title, that helps, but it posted after midnight eastern, and
didn't make it onto the sidebar where most people scan for
interesting new articles. The sidebar adds about a 10X bump
to its visability. I think this one would have qualified
as an 'editorial' so it could have been put onto that sidebar.
Pinglists add another big bump too and our biggest pinglist'er
OfF has gone awol, we all pray she is OK.
FUE


14 posted on 05/18/2005 6:26:48 AM PDT by Future Useless Eater (formerly FL_Engineer) (It was wrong to kill her. No other "facts" matter.-JimRobinson)
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To: CHARLITE

My frustration over the way the nation seems to have moved on
matches yours!!

I will never cease to be extremely interested until justice is served
to every wicked person who either aided and abetted in her murder
or failed to spare her life.

Unfortunately, there seems to be a lack of leadership for where we
go from here and it is made all the worse by the fact that those who
do care are scattered all over the nation.

I'm praying that Mark Furhman's and Cheryl Ford's books will jump
start an action plan.

I did read yesterday about a woman who is still protesting at the intersection down the street from Woodside Hospice near the Winn Dixie
store that towed the cars of the protestors. People still care and want to
support and love the Schindlers, IMO!


15 posted on 05/18/2005 8:37:25 AM PDT by Lesforlife ("For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb . . ." Psalm 139:13)
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To: Lesforlife

*I'm praying that Mark Furhman's and Cheryl Ford's books will jump start an action plan.*

I agree, Lesforlife! I've already ordered Furhman's book and will also order Cheryl's book. Cheryl worked so hard to save Terri. I'm sure her book will be an excellent tool for getting more people informed on the issues and facts.




16 posted on 05/18/2005 9:31:11 AM PDT by Pepper777
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To: CHARLITE; floriduh voter; Republic; pc93

Did you see the Schindler's giving the new Pope a framed picture of Terri? I saw it on CNN. Thank Goodness for something positive in Terri's memory. The Schindler's looked real sad! I will NEVER FORGET TERRI.


17 posted on 05/18/2005 12:47:42 PM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: TheSarce; 8mmMauser; backhoe; 1_Of_We; Aussie Dasher; tutstar; Cboldt; Future Useless Eater; ...
Thanks so much to all of you for your sensitive, sincere comments. I spent so much time and energy trying to save Terri. I think of her every single day, and while I know in my heart that she is in a better, freer place than her final earthly condition, I still feel torn, because she was betrayed despite all that so many millions of people tried to do to prevent the carrying out of her murder-by-fiat.

Thanks again to each and every one of you for your replies, and for your obvious concern with Terry's legacy.

Char

18 posted on 05/18/2005 2:53:06 PM PDT by CHARLITE (Not gonna be happy until the Hillster is sent packing, with Billery in tow. on a leash.........)
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To: CHARLITE
Don't worry, Terri's story is not over. It's just the beginning of a new chapter.

The euthanasia culture is celebrating right now because they won a battle and got Terri. But they haven't quite realized yet that good people like yourself and all those who heard about Terri and tried to help have now woken up to what they've been doing in the shadows all these years.

I think many of us had previously thought that our own individual experiences with end-of-life decisions for loved ones were just random, luck of the draw tragedies. But Terri brought out into public awareness the organized methods and mentality of the "quality of life" euthanasia crowd, and I think many are re-examining how their own stories fit in to the bigger picture (that they hadn't even realized was there before). Terri shone a spotlight on how the Deathies think and work, and I think most people instinctively, inwardly cringed, despite CNN telling them it was all just dandy.

The euthanasia movement may find the sunlight now shining on them to be not quite the victory they think.

19 posted on 05/18/2005 3:36:30 PM PDT by TheSarce (Liberalism: The irrational, intolerant cult that dare not speak its name.)
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To: TheSarce
"I think most people instinctively, inwardly cringed, despite CNN telling them it was all just dandy.",br>

.....and will you ever forget the grandstanding of George Felos, having the unmitigated GALL to come out in front of the bank of microphones and "report" to the world that in all of the time he'd ever known Terri Schiavo, "she has never looked so beautiful!"???

If this didn't wake us all up to the macabre, twisted mindset of these people, then nothing can, and if this is going to represent "life on earth,"......then we all would be better off dead.

Char

20 posted on 05/18/2005 3:45:14 PM PDT by CHARLITE (Not gonna be happy until the Hillster is sent packing, with Billery in tow. on a leash.........)
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To: CHARLITE
I still feel torn, because she was betrayed despite all that so many millions of people tried to do to prevent the carrying out of her murder-by-fiat.

I still can't believe it happened. I will never forget and I will never be the same.

21 posted on 05/18/2005 4:17:13 PM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: Lesforlife
I did read yesterday about a woman who is still protesting at the intersection down the street from Woodside Hospice near the Winn Dixie store that towed the cars of the protestors.

God bless that woman! She is my hero.

22 posted on 05/18/2005 4:18:18 PM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: CHARLITE

The times when Mary Schindler BEGGED for her daughter's life to be spared HAD to have touched the hearts of all those WHO HAVE A HEART. It was excruciating to watch Mary suffer like that - the whole family.

Like I said, I still can't believe it actually happened. It's like a bad dream I once had but is etched in my memory forever!!


23 posted on 05/18/2005 4:20:50 PM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: Saundra Duffy; CHARLITE

* Did you see the Schindler's giving the new Pope a framed picture of Terri? *

Hi Saundra - Yes, I saw the Schindlers on TV with the Pope too. It was great. I'm so happy they made the trip and got to see the Pope.

Here's a thread that has a few photos on it:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1405501/posts

I still can't believe all the efforts to save failed. Even the Vatican spoke out against her Forced Death, but it wasn't enough. The Empire Journal has a very interesting article about Judge Whittemore.

http://www.theempirejournal.com

Charlite, thanks for this thread about Terri. I try to read everything that is posted here about Terri.


24 posted on 05/18/2005 4:46:57 PM PDT by Pepper777
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To: Pepper777
Excellent references. Thanks so much for adding to the volumes of information about Terri and the ongoing cause to give value and meaning to her otherwise senseless passing.

Char

25 posted on 05/18/2005 5:33:13 PM PDT by CHARLITE (Not gonna be happy until the Hillster is sent packing, with Billery in tow. on a leash.........)
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To: STARWISE
I was going to post an article but a lot of death mongers start out their articles sounding sympathetic but by the end, they are in the camp of forced exits. People in the media are still trying to protect Greer, the evil fat cat Republican.

That is sickening because I think he's the most hated man in America.

26 posted on 05/18/2005 7:21:33 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: floriduh voter
... That is sickening because I think he's the most hated man in America.

And your righteous hate will send him straight to hell!

27 posted on 05/18/2005 7:26:10 PM PDT by 68 grunt (3/1 India, 3rd, 68-69, 0311)
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To: CHARLITE; truepatriot; amdgmary; cyn; tutstar; FR_addict; 8mmMauser; TheSarce; ...
I can sum it up for you. Some of our articles are getting moved to the smoky backroom or to the bloggers section. We are still here but placement is almost completely out of our hands.

If we keep being moved, I'll have to find somewhere else to do my thing. What's more conservative than stopping judicial activism that leads to judicial homicide?

Believe me, we are still active, just not getting traffic at FR because of placement. You should be glad you got to stay in news/activism.

There's a protest this Saturday afternoon outside of Hospice Woodside to emphasize that we have not forgotten. It starts at 4:00 pm until whenever. I've got to make yet another sign. It will be Saturday so we can park in the bank parking lot. A lady named Lisa has been protesting every single day outside Hospice since Terri died and we are going to join here on Saturday.

FV

28 posted on 05/18/2005 7:29:13 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: CHARLITE
And note that the very first response to this posting was: "Who is Terri Schiavo?" There is no more interest in Terri. She's gone and forgotten. During her ordeal, Free Republic was loaded with threads about Terri. Now, nothing. Very sad commentary on how "committed" we really are to tragic stories like this, and to the memories of people who, as you say, was murdered by the State only because she was helpless.

This was one of the complaints I had about the so-called Terribots who where so adamant about what was happening to her.

They were so and mean spirited in there responses to anyone who dared to differ with them.

Now that the 'story' has passed I bet the majority of these people have moved on to more important things.

29 posted on 05/18/2005 7:31:03 PM PDT by PFKEY
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To: 68 grunt
I can't send people to hell but I know somebody who can.

There's a protest this Saturday afternoon outside of Hospice Woodside to emphasize that we have not forgotten. It starts at 4:00 pm until whenever. I've got to make yet another sign. It will be Saturday so we can park in the bank parking lot. A lady named Lisa has been protesting every single day outside Hospice since Terri died and we are going to join here on Saturday.

30 posted on 05/18/2005 7:31:09 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: CHARLITE
murder-by-fiat.

I followed the story pretty closely and didn't come to this conclusion. I know the court ordered her feeding tube removed but this was what her husband wanted.

It was removed atleast once and then Gov. Bush had Terri's law passed. Ultimately this law was ruled unconstitutional and then the courts proceeded to have her feeding tube removed as was originally intended, requested and granted at her husbands wishes.

Am I remembering the sequence of events correctly?

31 posted on 05/18/2005 7:36:29 PM PDT by PFKEY
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To: EternalVigilance

Howdy, friend.


32 posted on 05/18/2005 7:41:33 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: Aussie Dasher
It will forever remain a black stain on modern "civilization". Aussie Dasher Sadly, what happened to Terri in her execution isn't seen as a stain on civilization ... by the presumed civilized. Thus the wrong will only grow in scope.

As a nation, America now stands at the doorway to cannibalism (our legislators are actually pushing to legislate the exploitation of human embryo aged lives), unaware that such is before us and about to be embraced as 'enlightened application of medical marvels'.

And with government institutionalizing of embryo harvesting for body parts for treating older humans (and the stem cells of embryos are their body parts, the body parts of the earliest age in a human's lifetime), the next drop down the slippery funnel is 'therapeutic cloning' for 'donor matched' tissues.

No, my Freeper friend, we are already too far gone to acknowledge the stain(s) that besmirch our once great nation. Terri's execution, ushered along as it was through an out of control arrogant judiciary and witnessed by a disinterested populace, is but a symptom of a disease already killing the Republic. Sadder still, the patient and the 'attending physicians' are practicing shamanism when cardiopulmonary resuscitation and transplant surgery are called for.

33 posted on 05/18/2005 7:44:03 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: 8mmMauser
I've had company for a few days and haven't been freeping that much. I agree with you that hideous evil has been unmasked. There is a lot of interest regarding what happened here. We have not forgotten. We were a part of American History, a regrettable, inexcusable chain of events whereby the Constitution was sidestepped so that Terri could be killed.

And, it's worth a trip to visit www.theempirejournal.com frequently. Judge Whittemore had a conflict of interest but did not disclose it so that he could put Terri and her family and millions of supporters through more suffering of all kinds. (from TEJ)

J. Whittemore had no interest in a "de novo" hearing. He continued Terri's starvation-dehydration after running the clock out for approx. 10 hrs and two tortuous hearings for the Schindlers. Despicable.

34 posted on 05/18/2005 7:51:49 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: 4Godsoloved..Hegave; 8mmMauser; a5478; Alamo-Girl; amdgmary; Annie03; AnimalLover; atruelady; ...

2nd ping I promised you freepers. See you next week unless there's a bombshell. I hope "ohioanfromflorida" is okay. She's been awol. FV


35 posted on 05/18/2005 7:55:40 PM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: CHARLITE; Aussie Dasher; 1_Of_We; backhoe; 8mmMauser; tutstar; Lesforlife; BykrBayb; ...
>>>And note that the very first response to this posting was: "Who is Terri Schiavo?" There is no more interest in Terri. She's gone and forgotten....

Charlite, I forgot to mention... Notice the '**S**' at the end.

That is a common chat-room abbreviation for either SMILE or SARCASM, i dont recall which, but no matter, he didn't mean it the way you said.

Just remember what one in the Terri-haters-club the (WPPFF) Wannabe Pontius Pilates and Freeper Frauds said, and I'm just paraphrasing from memory...

Keep your chin up
36 posted on 05/18/2005 9:54:19 PM PDT by Future Useless Eater (formerly FL_Engineer) (It was wrong to kill her. No other "facts" matter.-JimRobinson)
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To: Future Useless Eater
"Keep your chin up,"

Thanks so much. I was really referring to the very few readers for this particular article. During the height of the effort to save Terri's life, I saw threads with 2,500+ viewers. This one only found 40+ individuals who were interested in Terri Schiavo. That's why the "Who is Terri Schiavo?" rhetorical question was so symbolic of how vows of commitment are often quite hollow.

Thanks for your concern and support - for Terri's memory!

Char :)

37 posted on 05/18/2005 10:00:52 PM PDT by CHARLITE (Not gonna be happy until the Hillster is sent packing, with Billery in tow. on a leash.........)
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To: floriduh voter
>> I think he's the most hated man in America.

Not among lawyers. The local bar association gave him a special award. Then they wonder why everyone hates lawyers.

38 posted on 05/18/2005 10:23:35 PM PDT by T'wit (T'wit's Second Law: Liberals are always wrong, even when they come down on both sides of the issue.)
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To: PFKEY
"I know the court ordered her feeding tube removed but this was what her husband wanted."

The court ordered the removal of all nutrition and hydration from Terri Schindler, which meant NOTHING by MOUTH. The order never mentioned the feeding tube.

39 posted on 05/19/2005 6:10:50 AM PDT by TAdams8591 (Terri Schindler was NOT in coma, JUSTICE was.....)
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To: Future Useless Eater

** "just wait till she [Terri] dies, the terri-bots [meaning us] will be so fragile that pushing them over the edge will be like taking candy from a baby" **

What an unbelieveable quote, FUE! Sounds like someone was delighting in the pain of others and making jokes about it. I have no words to describe that type of mindset, other than to say, it would be useless to try and reason with a person who was that cruel.

Just the use of the word *Terribot* tells it all and is meant to twist the knife a little deeper, into those who love the Schindlers and are mourning Terri, imo. If I see that word used in a post, I skip right over the post, knowing it's a troll, whose motive is to inflame and ruin the thread.



40 posted on 05/19/2005 6:13:41 AM PDT by Pepper777
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To: CHARLITE
Don't worry. We have NOT forgotten and NEVER will.

For now, people are trying to decide the best way to do something about it.

41 posted on 05/19/2005 6:14:13 AM PDT by TAdams8591 (Terri Schindler was NOT in coma, JUSTICE was.....)
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To: TAdams8591

* The court ordered the removal of all nutrition and hydration from Terri Schindler, which meant NOTHING by MOUTH. The order never mentioned the feeding tube. *

I wonder if that fact has set precedent for not allowing a person to have food and water, who doesn't even have a feeding tube and can still eat by mouth. Interesting.

The progression of what is medical care has fallen over the clift. Actually even that has been happening for years under the cover of darkness. A friend of mine's grandma was dehydrated to death in the 70's by her doctor.

She begged for water, food and even ice chips, but the doctor had told the family it was not allowed. It took her about 10 days to die and it was NOT her choice. My friend can't believe her mom and aunt listened to the doctor and agreed with his orders. I asked what was put on the death certificate, thinking it would be something medical.

It was DEHYDRATION. Needless to say, I was shocked. I hope people have woken up to the fact that doctors are not gods and they should not be obeyed, like they are.


42 posted on 05/19/2005 6:37:25 AM PDT by Pepper777
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To: Pepper777
"I hope people have woken up to the fact that doctors are not gods and they should not be obeyed, like they are."

Pepper you are so RIGHT. I hope so too.

If I might relay a personal experience. When my father had cancer (this was in the mid 80's), as my mother was deceased, it was my responsibility to care for him, which I did gladly. It was an honor and a privilege, he was such a good man. I was 25 at the time.

A Catholic sister who came regularly to give him communion said to me, when I was upset by something that had happened, YOU are your father's ADVOCATE. Until that moment I had not realized that is exactly what I had been doing and the way I should continue to approach his care.

When his doctor made an error about the amount of injection medication to give him and went on vacation (I didn't have enough medicine and fortunately was able to convince the hospital pharmacy of the mistake and they gave me more), I told my uncle, my father's brother, about the doctor's mistake. My uncle responded that someone so educated would not make such a mistake. I told my uncle EVERYBODY is capable of making mistakes even doctors and explained to him how the doctor miscalculated. My uncle insisted the doctor would NOT have made that mistake (I can assure you my father would have disagreed with my uncle.) and was concerned that perhaps I was taking the drugs. I was incredulous. My uncle would rather have believed I was taking drugs (drugs have NEVER been a weakness or even a temptation for me) than that the doctor had made a mathematical mistake. It was then that I realized many people are of the erroneous opinion that doctors are infallible. This is one of the many facts of life I was to find astounding as a young adult.

There were many times throughout his illness that I had to advocate for the proper adjustment for his care as in more pain medication, and eventually pain medication delivered intravenously, etc. Had I NOT done so my father's suffering would have been far more severe. Fortunately, no one at that time suggested any measures to shorten his life. And had they, I would NOT have been fooled. But I understand from my conversation with my uncle many people might be.

I continued to care for my father at home (I had had some nursing training), despite pressure from a close family member, who had just put his father-in law in a nursing home, that I put mine in one, and despite pressure from the very same uncle I mentioned above (whose family cared for him at home when he became ill with cancer), that I put my father in the hospital. I had worked in both and knew I was capable of delivering better and more constant care. I NEVER doubted those decisions, but as time progresses and I read more and more horror stories regarding medical institutions, including the story you relayed, I am even happier we stuck to the original strategy we decided as a family before my father became so ill.

How sad for your friend.

"I wonder if that fact has set precedent for not allowing a person to have food and water, who doesn't even have a feeding tube and can still eat by mouth. Interesting."

Greer's order has most certainly established precedent and a MOST dangerous one. It was DELIBERATE and INTENTIONAL on Greer's part. Terri's case was used for this purpose by Euthanasia enthusiasts, and was ordained from the outset.

43 posted on 05/19/2005 7:56:34 AM PDT by TAdams8591 (Terri Schindler was NOT in coma, JUSTICE was.....)
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To: floriduh voter
A lady named Lisa has been protesting every single day outside Hospice since Terri died and we are going to join here on Saturday.

Our sincere thanks to all!! Keep us posted.

44 posted on 05/19/2005 8:22:01 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: Saundra Duffy

Saundra, the Terri Dailies got stuck in bloggers & personal. Nobody can find it. If someone is looking for the May 11th Dailies, please have them freepmail me and I'll ping them there. Thanks, floriduh voter


45 posted on 05/19/2005 8:29:20 AM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: Lesforlife

Les, we are joining protester Lisa Saturday at 4:00 pm at the intersection of 66th St. and 102nd Ave. N. and parking at the bank pkg lot. I don't know how many are going to be with her but I have another sign to make. FV


46 posted on 05/19/2005 8:31:09 AM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: Pepper777

Thank you for posting links to those two articles.

CHILLING!!!!!!!!!


47 posted on 05/19/2005 8:31:34 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: Pepper777; 8mmMauser; eeevil conservative; Lesforlife; Sun; amdgmary
The books are going to blow the lid off of some of the coverups. There are layers of coverups and the opposing side has no idea who's going to be implicated. Things are getting testy here too. Greer got in a congressman's face at one of his award ceremonies.

I've heard that if you disagree with Greer or leaders who voted for Terri, he will get in your face, no matter who you are. Guess that's what happens when you go over to the dark side, you just keeping veering off track.

Greer's future: I'm seeing him flipping out at some point. Can you imagine being responsible for someone's death?

Once the awards stop, he's going to experience inner turmoil from his deliberate actions to starve and dehydrate Terri to death.

48 posted on 05/19/2005 8:36:17 AM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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To: floriduh voter

I agree. Greer will "flip out". He knows he blew it and most people know it, too. He made the fatal judgment error. Now he has to live with it. An innocent disabled American paid the price with her life.


49 posted on 05/19/2005 9:09:54 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy (Terri Schindler was murdered - IMPEACH JUDGE GREER!!!)
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To: T'wit; All
Here's a good opinion on Nat Hentoff's, opinion.

FR nitpickers, don't bother flaming me for not using html for this. I won't reply to your kind.

http://www.michnews.com/artman/publish/printer_7760.shtml

50 posted on 05/19/2005 9:10:28 AM PDT by floriduh voter (www.terrisfight.org & www.theemppirejournal.com... The Schindlers "Never again.")
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