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The Free State Project...
The Union Leader ^ | May 27, 2005 | NHAntiMassRedRebel

Posted on 05/27/2005 1:28:06 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel

Danger! Unlicensed manicurist on the loose!

FEAR NOT, gentle people of New Hampshire. Mike Fisher has been apprehended. For the time being we can rest easy knowing that this man is unable to file another fingernail without the proper credentials.

On Monday two Concord police officers arrested Fisher for manicuring without a license. In New Hampshire, it is illegal to give someone a manicure unless you have first graduated from high school or obtained your GED, “(h)ave completed a course of at least 300 hours of professional training in manicuring, in a school approved by the (state Board of Barbering, Cosmetology, and Esthetics) and passed an examination conducted by the board” or, as an apprentice in a salon, received experience equivalent to the 300 hours of schooling.

Of course women and girls give themselves and their friends manicures every day, and the police have better things to do than spy on slumber parties. What got Fisher arrested was his civil disobedience. He demonstrated the absurdity of the law by setting up shop outside the state licensing office and giving a friend an illegal manicure.

(Excerpt) Read more at theunionleader.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: New Hampshire
KEYWORDS: fsp
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Okay, I've kept quiet about this long enough. I alluded to it in my last post. Yes, I have a life, it's just my day off.

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU FREESTATERS THINKING! I don't mean to offend all Libertarians, but the extremists in your party are going to make fools out of you!

If you really think that you are going to come to NH, set up compounds disguised as housing developments, and take over the state you might be in for a surprise. NH is a very funny political animal. You might think that we approve of you, but then find yourself stabbed in the back. At the very least, expect to compromise some of your views.

Nobody is getting a haircut in NH from a public-serving barber without a license because NOBODY IN NH WANTS AIDS! DUHHHHH! If you want your buddy to cut your hair and risk your health that's your business. Get it?

1 posted on 05/27/2005 1:28:06 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

I would bet that most States have a professional licensing requirement like this. If the guy did the manicure with the expectation of payment in return, then he engaged in the practice of a regulated profession requiring licensure. I ought to post the "professions" my State licenses...it is good for laugh.


2 posted on 05/27/2005 1:38:12 PM PDT by Lekker 1 ("Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"- Harry M. Warner, Warner Bros., 1927)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
"If you want your buddy to cut your hair and risk your health that's your business. Get it?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't that the entire point of this exercise? That it's none of the government's business?
3 posted on 05/27/2005 1:39:07 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

Licensing is the socialist answer to personal responsibility.


4 posted on 05/27/2005 1:39:29 PM PDT by agitator (...And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

Cutting hair won't give you AIDS, or get you AIDS, either. Cutting the skin under that hair, with an instrument that has been contaminated with the AIDS virus might...

What the heck happened to "Live Free or Die?"


5 posted on 05/27/2005 1:39:37 PM PDT by Old Student (WRM, MSgt, USAF (Ret.))
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To: Old Student

What the heck happened to "Live Free or Die?"

Live Free or Die is the joke they have on their license plates.


6 posted on 05/27/2005 1:40:59 PM PDT by agitator (...And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

OTOH..it probably got a lot of publicity for the FS movement. Ridicule is a very effective weapon against government excess..


7 posted on 05/27/2005 1:41:54 PM PDT by ken5050 (Ann Coulter needs to have children ASAP to pass on her gene pool...any volunteers???)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

The editorial is B.S. It says that anyone doing any barbering, hairdressing, or manicuring to friends or family in the privacy of your own home is breaking the law. Bullcr*p! It's if you do it for PAY that you're subject to licensing. Same applies to lots of other activities.




8 posted on 05/27/2005 1:42:33 PM PDT by LibFreeOrDie (L'chaim!)
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To: agitator

"Live Free or Die is the joke they have on their license plates."

Do you suppose they have the borders sealed so people who don't like the rules there can't leave? It is still possible to leave California, for example, or was last August, when I left there for what is probably the last time in my life...


9 posted on 05/27/2005 1:43:57 PM PDT by Old Student (WRM, MSgt, USAF (Ret.))
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

My mother and other women her age used to give haircuts to people in college in the 60's for extra money. I guess they were all a bunch of criminals who deserved to do time, huh? What are you, a statist?


10 posted on 05/27/2005 1:45:50 PM PDT by MichiganConservative (Government IS the problem.)
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To: NJ_gent

"If you really think that you are going to come to NH, set up compounds disguised as housing developments, and take over the state you might be in for a surprise. NH is a very funny political animal. You might think that we approve of you, but then find yourself stabbed in the back. At the very least, expect to compromise some of your views. "

The "big L" Libertarians involved in the Free State Project chose New Hampshire over Montana, Wyoming and other states precisely BECAUSE it is a funny political animal... being the closest thing to Libertarian already, among smaller states where their intended numbers (20,000 I believe) might have some hope of swaying the political process. I, for one, find it an interesting political exercise and am glad that they're doing it. What is it about Libertarianism and/or Libertarians that you find off-putting or threatening? They're not going to force anything on you, me or anyone else.


11 posted on 05/27/2005 1:46:03 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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To: agitator

"Licensing is the socialist answer to personal responsibility."

It's also a convenient way to raise money in the form of fees.


12 posted on 05/27/2005 1:46:51 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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To: Old Student

Getting nicked by scissors and breaking the skin because somebody didn't know what they were doing could give you AIDS. It's really no different than getting a tattoo or visiting a dentist, tattoo artist, or body piercer who doesn't practice proper sterilization techniques.

Licensing is set up to protect the public IF THEY WANT TO BE PROTECTED. You have the option of doing all those things informally in your home if you want to, and it's legal in NH. But if you choose to sell that service to the public the state has guidelines that need to be followed for public safety.

And hey, you'll make more money, too! That's some Live Free or Die! You don't have to compromise your long-term health to get that nipple ring!


13 posted on 05/27/2005 1:47:30 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: RegulatorCountry

I think you meant to reply to another poster. :)


14 posted on 05/27/2005 1:49:35 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: RegulatorCountry

The only reason NH maintains any semblence of what it once was is that it has a volunteer (i.e., unpaid) legislature. Nothing happens in NH quickly which is why the massholes/mainiacs and vermont socialists haven't fully trashed the place yet.


15 posted on 05/27/2005 1:49:46 PM PDT by agitator (...And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark)
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To: RegulatorCountry

Well, Gov. Benson lost the election in part because he supported them. That should tell you something right there.


16 posted on 05/27/2005 1:49:49 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU FREESTATERS THINKING!

I dunno, but I belive they're thinking it isn't the governments place to limit competition in the beauty business as well as the fact that government shouldn't be able to collect all those licensing and renewal fees that keep little- headed state bureaucrats employed.

17 posted on 05/27/2005 1:51:09 PM PDT by groanup (http://fairtax.org)
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To: NJ_gent

"I think you meant to reply to another poster. :)"

Oh, sorry about that.


18 posted on 05/27/2005 1:51:43 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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To: MichiganConservative

Friends is the key word in your argument. Selling your services to the general public, meaning complete strangers who don't know you but want some form of assurance in your skills, requires a license.

And it should. I assume that you want all illegal aliens to drive without licenses. What are you, a Mechista?


19 posted on 05/27/2005 1:52:13 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
"Licensing is set up to protect the public IF THEY WANT TO BE PROTECTED. You have the option of doing all those things informally in your home if you want to, and it's legal in NH."

No it isn't; it's simply not enforced when it's done in the privacy of your own home. That's like saying it's legal to carry around baggies of cocaine in the privacy of your own home. Just because the police aren't there arresting you doesn't mean it's any less illegal. Licensing can be done by the private sector if it so chooses. That then gives people the option to go to licensed folks if they make the decision to do so. The only place the state should get involved is in cases where people are fraudulently claiming to be licensed when they, in fact, are not.
20 posted on 05/27/2005 1:52:40 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: RegulatorCountry
[Licensing is] also a convenient way to raise money in the form of fees.

Bingo. The State money grab.

21 posted on 05/27/2005 1:52:49 PM PDT by Lekker 1 ("Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"- Harry M. Warner, Warner Bros., 1927)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
New Hampshire has gone blue.

Just think in Maine he would have been shot. You can get away with just about anything in maine except not paying the state. Failure to have a license paid for annually could result in your being castrated or shot dead.

We nolonger refer to it as vacationland, now it is Taxation Land.

22 posted on 05/27/2005 1:54:48 PM PDT by newsgatherer
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

Licensure for manicuring does not require disclosure of AIDS. The licensed manicurist is just as likely to have AIDS as the non-licensed manicurist.


23 posted on 05/27/2005 1:54:57 PM PDT by Lekker 1 ("Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"- Harry M. Warner, Warner Bros., 1927)
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To: agitator
Licensing is the socialist answer to personal responsibility.

Licensing is the professional politician's (a.k.a. lawyer's) answer to skirting the Constitution(s).

24 posted on 05/27/2005 1:57:04 PM PDT by MamaTexan (Attention *INS*: ~ EVERY year, Illegals murder more Americans than died on 9/11 ~)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

This article is right about licensing. It is a racket to restrain trade. The state has no expertise in cosmetology, funerals or any other biz. I didn't know that until I joined an association of home security biz owners and attended their meetings. Their only adgenda was to get the state to license to keep new people out of the industry.


25 posted on 05/27/2005 1:57:46 PM PDT by ClaireSolt (.)
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To: newsgatherer
could result in your being castrated or shot dead.

Good Lord! I'm not sure which of those I would choose.

26 posted on 05/27/2005 1:59:16 PM PDT by Lekker 1 ("Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"- Harry M. Warner, Warner Bros., 1927)
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To: MeekOneGOP

Sniff?


27 posted on 05/27/2005 1:59:35 PM PDT by Slings and Arrows ("Robert Byrd:He may have 'gone under the water,' but the preacher didn't hold him down long enough.")
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
Friends is the key word in your argument.

Actually, friends wasn't in my argument. My mother had a reputation as someone who could give decent haircuts to longhaired hippies who wanted to be more presentable when they went home to visit their parents. Maybe you should read my posts. I've been saying "mine the border". Licensing barbers and beauticians is stupid. You can walk into their establishment and look around. If they are using proper sterilization equipment, you can observe that. If not, you can walk out. Would you also like the government to license software writers? Bad software can kill people and waste $billions.

28 posted on 05/27/2005 2:00:16 PM PDT by MichiganConservative (Government IS the problem.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

"And hey, you'll make more money, too! That's some Live Free or Die! You don't have to compromise your long-term health to get that nipple ring!"

I think I'll pass on the nipple ring, too, thank you! It is like I said, though: anyone who doesn't like the rules can leave the state. This guy apparently move TO NH to violate this law, which is kinda stupid. I hope he's got deep pockets. He's gonna need 'em.


29 posted on 05/27/2005 2:03:37 PM PDT by Old Student (WRM, MSgt, USAF (Ret.))
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To: NJ_gent
I don't enjoy picking on NH, but this is their plate:

This is what their plates ought to look like:


30 posted on 05/27/2005 2:04:36 PM PDT by agitator (...And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

You're nuts. Getting one of these idiot licenses hardly prevents the barber, manicurist, or whatever from getting AIDS, and there is no requirement that they don't already have AIDS when they get the license.


31 posted on 05/27/2005 2:06:00 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: newsgatherer

You're right about taxationland. In terms of Me. vs. NH as to which is more conservative consider this: Maine is a sanctuary state and NH will arrest illegals for criminal trespass!

Who's more conservative now, Downeastah! :)


32 posted on 05/27/2005 2:07:35 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: LibFreeOrDie

It's true that it's misleading in that respect, however, the law is still totally idiotic. There is no danger to the public from people setting up a little business to do manicures without 300 hours of government-approved training. These laws exist ONLY to fatten the pockets of the schools providing the training -- those schools lobby politicians and donate to their campaigns in order to get these stupid laws passed.


33 posted on 05/27/2005 2:09:16 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

"Well, Gov. Benson lost the election in part because he supported them. That should tell you something right there."

This is the typical suspicion of outsiders trying to come in and "take over," a sentiment with which I am quite familiar, as a native of a rural southern county next to a growing metro area... we don't care for the yankees coming in and trying to take over, either. But, who poses the greater threat to the unique New Hampshire political culture, though, Free Staters or Massholes? I'd be praying for more Free Staters, to counterbalance the tidal wave of socialist idiots cresting your way from Boston, myself.


34 posted on 05/27/2005 2:19:31 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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To: MichiganConservative

I'll concede that point that I misread "friends" in your argument, and I like the "mine the borders" thing. Reminds me of Korea.

But, I will never agree with the Libertarian notion that every individual is fully capable of governing themselves. For the general public to be fully protected (including those who aren't capable of making those decisions, such as kids and disabled adults) the law needs to step in somewhere. Licensing for anything effectively says to the public that the person providing the service or committing the act that requires that license has gone through the proper guidelines and, according to the state, is capable. I can agree that it's a good way for the state to make money and I'm not really cool with that, but that's the compromise I guess.

Also, it saves the municipality from liability because according to the community at large they met the standards, the customer saw it posted and proceeded to use the services anyway.

I don't want to eat at a restaurant without the proper licensing requirements. I don't want people who don't have the proper licensing requirements to drive 18 wheelers on the highways. I don't want people to fly planes who haven't gotten aviation licenses. I don't think I'm crazy for wanting that. True, just because somebody has a license doesn't mean their free and clear (see Mohammed Atta). But I won't take their word for it either.

Guess I really jammed my hand up the wildcat's ass on this one. WHOOO!


35 posted on 05/27/2005 2:20:59 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: agitator

I like the plates. Which other state has a license plate which can compete with "LIVE FREE OR DIE"?


36 posted on 05/27/2005 2:22:16 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: Lekker 1

If a person hasn't been trained in proper sterilization techniques of equipment that is used on the human body all kinds of bad things can be caught from that equipment, AIDS among them. It's a stretch, I know, but not unheard of. China (and I know I'll get sh*t for this) recently had a huge problem with AIDS being passed in barber shops.


37 posted on 05/27/2005 2:23:52 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: GovernmentShrinker
"Getting one of these idiot licenses hardly prevents the barber, manicurist, or whatever from getting AIDS, and there is no requirement that they don't already have AIDS when they get the license."

But government is the solution to all our problems. Didn't you get the memo?
38 posted on 05/27/2005 2:24:06 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
When our country was a free republic, licensing was for an excise tax on professions that the inept exercise thereof posed a (real) danger to the health welfare and safety of the public, or on a privilege not allowed for the general public granted by the state.

That is to say, a danger to lives. AIDS is a stretch, and so are the other excuses certain professions that have sway on state legislatures use to limit the competition. Any profession or trade could stretch some "threat" to cover their jobs, if a consortium of such have money to spend.

It is about time this malarkey was challenged, by "free staters" or anyone else.

It is rather clumsy to use this joke to try to buttress your fear of these people trying to slow the country's flight toward socialism and fascism. Come up with some reasoned arguments against them.

39 posted on 05/27/2005 2:26:15 PM PDT by William Terrell (Individuals can exist without government but government can't exist without individuals.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
"It's a stretch, I know, but not unheard of. China (and I know I'll get sh*t for this) recently had a huge problem with AIDS being passed in barber shops."

The country with more government than just about anyone has problems with something, so the solution for other nations is more government?
40 posted on 05/27/2005 2:27:50 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: RegulatorCountry

I hate 'em both. Most of us do, actually. I resent that they feel they can take over, and what they'll find is that if they are going to come to power they will have to compromise their views a bit. Legalized drugs and prostitution? WE CAN'T EVEN GET E-Z PASS!


41 posted on 05/27/2005 2:30:00 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: agitator

Gee, are you one of them? If you are you wouldn't even have license plates, guy! Nice try though.


42 posted on 05/27/2005 2:31:33 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
...huge problem with AIDS being passed in barber shops...

What were they doing there? AIDS transmission requires certain bodily fluids to be transferred. Perhaps if they were shaving people one after another with the same blade, some small amount of blood could be transferred. This is why I shave myself and never share my blade with anyone else. I remeber a store about a family with 3 hemophiliac sons. One got AIDS from a blood transfusion. The other 2 from sharing a razor with him.

43 posted on 05/27/2005 2:32:59 PM PDT by MichiganConservative (Government IS the problem.)
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To: NJ_gent

See, I knew it. Health affects everybody, that was my point. There are plenty of cases before standards were put in place of people getting diseases from trips to dentists and tattoo parlors. I'm sure barber shops, too. I just hadn't heard about it in this country, only China. That's why I used them for an example.


44 posted on 05/27/2005 2:34:05 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: MichiganConservative

Perhaps the details are wrong as this was a while ago. Three sons in the family and at least 1 hemophiliac; not necessarily 3 hemophiliac sons. And store should be story.


45 posted on 05/27/2005 2:35:29 PM PDT by MichiganConservative (Government IS the problem.)
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To: MichiganConservative

Um-hmm, my point exactly. You don't know who was there before you in a public setting. So, for the general good, states pass laws that require certain standards be met before the business is opened. I know that isn't a 100% guarantee on anything, but it is for the general good and in my opinion shouldn't be done away with.

I don't want to pay taxes for somebody else's food stamps. I don't want to support some old fart through social security when it won't be there for me. But I don't mind paying into the general safety of the public. Licensing somewhat insures this and shouldn't be done away with in my opinion.


46 posted on 05/27/2005 2:39:34 PM PDT by NHAntiMassRedRebel (Our only fault is that we're 40 minutes north of Boston.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

And here's a story about a dentist in Florida that intentionally infected several of his patients with HIV, including a 13 year old girl. No mention of him not having a license.
http://www.aegis.com/news/ads/1993/AD931763.html


47 posted on 05/27/2005 2:39:47 PM PDT by MichiganConservative (Government IS the problem.)
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To: NJ_gent

"The country with more government than just about anyone has problems with something, so the solution for other nations is more government?"

If you're a hammer, after a while everything starts to look like a nail, LOL.


48 posted on 05/27/2005 2:40:18 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel
"Health affects everybody, that was my point."

If bigger government made a positive difference in things like regulating the private sector, then I might be inclined to agree with you. However, the one gift from socialist and communist nations around the world to the rest of us is a plain and simple warning of just how poorly government functions for most things compared to the free market.

Perhaps that's why China is beginning to deregulate small areas of the country to allow them to grow as mini-free market areas. Perhaps that's why those areas are booming compared to the rest of China. It's so obvious that government does a poor job of regulating the free market that even communists are waking up to the fact.
49 posted on 05/27/2005 2:42:10 PM PDT by NJ_gent (Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.)
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To: NHAntiMassRedRebel

"I hate 'em both. Most of us do, actually."

I'm willing to venture a guess that, over time, you'll begin to hate less those whose views are least inimical to your own. So, if I were in your position, I'd probably reserve the condemnation for the socialists who'd really muck things up, and good. Does this make any sense?


50 posted on 05/27/2005 2:45:17 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry (Esse Quam Videre)
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