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No more Boy Scouts in Britain
world Net Daily ^ | June 16, 2005 | Hans Zeiger

Posted on 06/16/2005 11:22:21 AM PDT by SandRat

The year 2007 would have marked the 100th birthday of Boy Scouting in England. Unfortunately, the British Boy Scouts, founded by Lord Robert Baden-Powell as the first Scouting group in the world, is now a dead organization.

The recent decision by U.K. Scout Association executives to make chaos of the Scout Oath mangles the program far beyond anything Baden-Powell might recognize. Instead of being required to pledge their loyalty to "God and the Queen," members of the Scout Association can now opt to swear allegiance to any combination of things. Muslims can pledge to Allah, Hindus to Dharma, and atheists to life in "good moral standing." Anti-monarchs can omit the Queen's title and mention instead the state.

But the decision isn't much of a surprise.

In 1991, UK Scout executives decided to give troops the option of allowing equal access for girls and boys to any of its programs. By 1996, nearly 26,000 girls had joined. By 2000, British Scouting authorities required that all newly formed troops be co-educational.

In a statement of special problems that may arise with the integration of young ladies with young men on camping trips and the like, U.K. Scout Association administrators asseverate:

In the instance of physical building constraints, commissioners should first establish whether these problems have been raised as a cover for opposition to making mixed provision. Where these problems are real, commissioners should emphasise that these are NOT gender issues but are resource problems.

That's officialese for saying that tenting arrangements, bathroom issues, and other gender differences are simply relics of a time when males dominated society and filled the ranks of Scouting exclusively. Today, everyone is equal.

At an October 1997 meeting of the executive board of the U.K. Scout Association, a decision was made to admit open homosexuals into troops as leaders and members. "Society has changed considerably since 1907," wrote British Scouting executives in their revolutionary "Equal Opportunities Policy Guidelines." "The Scout Association has had to recognize these changes in how we describe what we stand for." The new non-discrimination code included a prohibition of discrimination on the basis of "marital or sexual status" and "political or religious belief."

The London Telegraph asked Lord Baden-Powell's grandson, a vice president for the U.K. Scout Association, to comment on the decision, but he said only that the board had made the decision without his knowledge. Baden-Powell's 79-year old daughter, Betty Clay, denounced the decisions and political correctness of the Scout Association. "He, in his writings to young men, and in his responses to many anxious young men's inquiries, always made it clear that they should do their best to keep themselves clean in thought, word, and deed ... They should ... look on themselves as guardians of their bodies and minds and to do as far they could according to the will of God."

Today, homosexuals are allowed to become Scout leaders without question, because "there is no link between homosexuality and pedophilia, and therefore there is no justification for restricting membership on this basis." Only a brief note at the bottom of the non-discrimination code clarifies what was clearly considered by executives in discussions of sexual status: "Pedophilia is a bar to any involvement in the Scout Movement."

Aside from pedophilia, sexual relationships are not only tolerated, but encouraged in the confines of the English Scouting experience:

It is important for leaders to help some young people to understand the nature of public and private behaviour, and the need to respect other people's privacy and personal space. When two young people do form an emotional attachment, leaders should both support their need for some privacy together as well as help them to remember their other friends, who may feel rejected by the couple.

Far from the abstinence-based approach of the Boy Scouts of America, British Scouts encourage Scout leaders to discuss "sexual behavior and practices" and "contraception" with their troop members. The only significant restrictions placed on troop leaders are mandatory abidance of the new age-of-consent laws (age 16) passed by Parliament and to avoid allowing "relationships between young people at different stages of sexual development."

Americans, take note of this: Since the UKSA decided to ally itself with the homosexual movement, Scouting membership in England has dropped by close to 20 percent. From 1997 to 2001, membership fell from 500,000 to 400,000. It had been as high as 650,000 in the 1980s.

There are consequences to political correctness. Among other things, it kills movements.


Hans Zeiger is an Eagle Scout, president and founder of the Scout Honor Coalition and a student at Hillsdale College in Michigan. His new book, "Get Off My Honor: The Assault on the Boy Scouts of America," can be pre-ordered from online booksellers

TOPICS: Australia/New Zealand; Canada; Culture/Society; Editorial; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: agendas; badenpowell; boyscouts; boythcouts; britian; bsa; bsalist; degredation; england; girlyboyscouts; hanszeiger; theend; ukscouts
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Riflery? The UK Scouts might be allowed to knit. ....although those needles could be used as weapons, so you never know.
21 posted on 06/16/2005 11:38:03 AM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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To: SandRat
As a supporter of Cub and Boy Scouts, of which my son is a member, what a load of bunk. We will not let that happen here. That being said,

Hindus to Dharma,

If I were a scout in the UK, could I pledge to Greg, instead? Dharma and her whole family are just too liberal.

22 posted on 06/16/2005 11:38:49 AM PDT by tnlibertarian ("In my opinion, they have no rights, except a safe return to their homeland. - "Robert Vazquez")
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To: SandRat
If you stand for stand for nothing.

What a shame.

23 posted on 06/16/2005 11:39:12 AM PDT by pollyannaish
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To: SandRat

Good grief! They've turned it into a club for pansies! And they let girls in? What a joke!

24 posted on 06/16/2005 11:44:23 AM PDT by Luna (Lobbing the Holy Hand Grenade at Liberalism)
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To: SandRat

This is incredible.

25 posted on 06/16/2005 11:51:41 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("Children don't need counting, because whatever number you have, you never have enough.")
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To: SandRat

By 2007 another 20% will drop out and eventually the organization ceases. I'm surprised with all PC changes in Britain that they keep the name "Boy Scouts".

26 posted on 06/16/2005 11:53:50 AM PDT by lilylangtree
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To: Antoninus

That is the most disgusting thing I've seen in a very long time.

27 posted on 06/16/2005 11:54:39 AM PDT by Tax-chick ("Children don't need counting, because whatever number you have, you never have enough.")
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To: pau1f0rd

They are your national Boy Scouts holler, scream, yell do what ever needs to be done and get others of like mind to do the same to return Scouting in the UK to what Lord Baden-Powell intended it to be.

28 posted on 06/16/2005 11:55:42 AM PDT by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
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To: SandRat

Isn't there a world jamboree coming up soon that's supposed to be in England?

29 posted on 06/16/2005 11:56:18 AM PDT by Born Conservative ("If not us, who? And if not now, when? - Ronald Reagan)
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To: SandRat

Don't think it's not happening here now.

30 posted on 06/16/2005 11:56:29 AM PDT by CAP811 (One man can change the world with a bullet in the right place)
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To: SandRat

Lesbians are decimating the Girl Scouts in the US as we speak... and pillow biters are trying their best to destroy the Boy Scouts here....

Liberals and Standards... diametrically opposed concepts.

31 posted on 06/16/2005 11:56:50 AM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: CAP811

The attempts to push the agenda is constant courtesy of the ACLU and others of disreputable reputation.

32 posted on 06/16/2005 11:57:30 AM PDT by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
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To: Luna
First it goes co-ed, then it starts promoting liberal sex education. Um, gee...I wonder what starts happening next?

As an old scouter, this is the sadest thing I've seen in forty years. But I agree with TNlibertarian: it ain't gonna be allowed to happen here. Liberty still means something in the US, as opposed to what has happened to "Great" Britain.

33 posted on 06/16/2005 11:58:03 AM PDT by Nevermore (Mad as Zell)
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To: HamiltonJay

Scratch a Liberal. Uncover a fascist.

34 posted on 06/16/2005 11:58:26 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: SandRat

Sad. Yesterday's writeup on the Episcopalian church was depressingly similar. Another organization destroyed by Liberalism, PC and cultural marxism.

35 posted on 06/16/2005 12:07:44 PM PDT by WOSG (Liberating Iraq -
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To: Antoninus

I almost did not notice the "cub scouts" because of the distraction of Dame Elton's roadkill-style hairpiece.

36 posted on 06/16/2005 12:08:43 PM PDT by Sans-Culotte
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To: SandRat; XJarhead

The following is an example of the Boy Scouts at their best (From the website of Buckeye Council in Ohio). Both my brother XJarhead & I achieved fifth-year status in this program. As long as programs like this maintain their integrity, the BSA will live on as a great program for helping turn boys into men.

The Pipestone Camp Honor Program began in Camp Tuscazoar, Zoarville, Ohio in the summer of 1926. The founders of the Ceremony and related camp advancement program which, by tradition, has become the heart of the Summer Camp Program of the council, were George M. Deaver, Scout Executive of the Council; C. L. Riley, a teacher at Canton McKinley High School, who was serving as Camp Director at the time; I. W. Delp, Principal of Lehman High School in Canton; and Charles E. Mills, a Scouter who was skilled in theatrical production.

The program's intent was the rewarding of Scout campers who excelled in advancement and Scouting spirit during their week in camp with an experience, and a token of that experience which would capture their imaginations. An Indian ceremony was a natural choice of a vehicle to convey this message and token. The valley of the Tuscarawas was a prime area of Indian activity as attested by the history of the area.

The spontaneous enthusiasm for the program led its founders to set it as a five year series, this being the maximum number of years attendance in Summer Camp which could be expected of a Scout in the late 1920's.

The reader is reminded that the Pipestone Ceremony itself is not intended to be, or conducted as an initiation or a hazing, and it is not to be represented to scouts as such!

The basic theme of the five years' ceremonials have withstood the test of the years, being as viable now as they were in 1926 when the program was conceived.

A significant effect of the Pipestone Program is the encouragement of the return of Scout campers to Summer Camp for three, four, five years and beyond, in percentages which lead the country. Pipestone, however, does not deal in percentages ... its concern is boys!

Traditionally, no Scout Leader has pointedly been required to commit his unit to participation in the Camp Honor Program.

Since its founding, the worth of the Program as an incentive to scouts has been universally apparent to unit and council leadership, eliciting almost unanimous voluntary participation in the program. Likewise, Scouters, responsible for the Pipestone Camp Honor Program share the conviction that Scouting can be eminently successful in exerting a positive influence on young men's lives if they can be kept within the sphere of influence of Scouting between the ages of 14 to 17 years.

The worth of the Program is verified by the fact that, at the time of this writing, 14% of all campers using the Council Summer Camp have attended for 5 or more years.

The Pipestone Camp Honor Program is a five year one of progressively more advanced work in Summer Camp in those areas of Scouting advancement which deal with the safety of a Scout, his ability to deal with emergencies ... emphasizing skills which develop an awareness of nature, and the ability of the Scout to live out-of-doors and be self-sufficient at it. The progression of the requirements is closely related to an acceptable rate of advancement through Scouting ranks with emphasis on development of proficiency in Swimming and Nature, and leadership, which will enable the older Scout to assist his younger brother Scouts.

The Camp Good Turn requirements are intended to foster in each Scout and Leader a sense of sharing in the ownership and care for our Camp through the investment of a responsible share of his time during the week in camp on a group, or individual improvement project on the grounds and facilities of our camp.

The swimming requirements have as their purpose, the same objective which governs Scout Swim Requirements ... the safety of the Scout in the water, by developing in each Scout a confidence and true sense of his own ability. Thus, the rule toward Pipestone Swimming Requirements has been an ever-constant, rigid adherence to the letter of the requirement. To give a boy the "benefit of the doubt" and grant approval of his inadequate performance of a swimming requirement might be the most fateful decision a leader in camp will ever make.

All Pipestone requirements are kept relevant to National Standards in Skill and Merit Badge requirements.

Finally ... the Camp Spirit Requirement in each of the five years challenges each Scout to live with his brother Scouts in camp in a spirit of good fellowship, and good sportsmanship. It requires each Pipestone candidate to exemplify the very qualities which he pledges to uphold in the Oath and Law, and it requires his leader to evaluate his fulfillment of this requirement with equal importance to the Skills, Swim, and other requirements.

Fulfillment of Pipestone Requirements

Every Pipestone Requirement is well defined, as are the options, procedures, and time limits for completion.

As an adult leader, you share in the responsibility to insure that the value of the Pipestone Camp Honor Award is upheld, so that future Scouts will find the same motivation, the same rewarding thrill and excitement which comes to those who now journey to The Council Fire of The Braves.

No honor is respected by its recipient or his peers if that honor is gained through deceit or unfair practices. Striving towards the annual Camp Honor Award encourages the Scout to advance both in Camp and in his Unit. It is a valuable learning experience, and it emphasizes character development and builds self-confidence as well.

Remember, the Pipestone cannot be awarded on the basis of effort alone!

The candidate must have fulfilled the established requirements as written. To reward a Scout when he is less than deserving, for emotional or other reasons, may do him a greater disservice than to encourage him to try again. Scouting's role is to prepare a boy to face life. Your own experience tells you that the most meaningful values are not always the easiest to attain!

Registered Scouters who qualify by reason of service to Scouts as leaders in the Summer Camp are encouraged to participate fully in the Pipestone program with their Scouts, that they may better understand the purpose, and effect of the program on the Scouts whom we are all seeking to serve.

The Pipestone Camp Honor is awarded only to Scouts and Scouters who attend and participate in the program of the Buckeye Council Summer Camp.

Things You Should Know and Understand to Assist the Pipestone Program

As a unit leader, it is important for you to understand that the Pipestone Camp Honor program can only work with your help and understanding. The Camp Staff supervises the day-to-day operation of the program, but you, the unit leader, must keep accurate records on your boys. The Camp Staff can help you with some record-keeping forms.

The success of the Pipestone experience for your scouts also requires your complete cooperation in the following specific ways during your week in camp:

Pipestone Wood

Between 200 and 250 Scouts and Scouters will go through the Pipestone Ceremony each week of the summer. To be most effective, the Ceremony circles need the kind of firelight that comes only from the clean, smokeless burning of dry, naturally barkless wood. Each Scout must consider it part of his requirements to gather one cubic foot of Pipestone wood for use in the Ceremonies (many years ago it was the duty of the Fifth Year Candidates to gather the wood on Friday afternoon). Wood should be straight, about 12" to 16" long, no thinner than your little finger and no thicker than your thumb. Please read your Leader's Guide for More information.

Sunday Night Campfire

The Sunday Night Campfire is a spirited way to start the week. After the songs and skits, the campfire will end with a serious talk about the history and meaning of the Pipestone Camp Honor Program. After these reflective moments, everyone will be instructed to leave the campfire without talking, and without lights.

This simple act will help Pipestone candidates when they return from the Friday Night Ceremonies. You can help by directing that only your adult leaders should take flashlights to the Sunday campfire. Scouts will also be directed to go directly to bed without talking, unless you want to have a meeting with them. This can help set the tone of self-discipline for the week. It can also help you to have a quiet first night in camp after a long check-in day.


This is not an old-fashioned idea at Seven Ranges Reservation. The self-discipline that is demanded during the week will make the Friday night Pipestone experience much more enjoyable for the boys. During the week, the staff will ask that everyone enter and leave the dining hall quietly, with arms folded. Being on time for appointments and merit badges is also a growing experience. The morning clean-up and inspection should be "by the boys, and for the boys". You are encouraged to participate in the spirit of the program. Be a part of the contests, songs, patrol and troop activities, and fellowship with other units.

This is all in integral part of the "Scout Spirit" Requirements.

Friday Activities

As a Unit Leader, please take care in following the instructions and filling out the Pipestone Qualification forms. The Camp Staff will give you instructions at the Leaders' meeting. Your care and concern will insure an equitable and safe experience for everyone. After dinner on Friday all campers will be instructed to return to their campsites until it is time for the Pipestone Ceremonies to begin. The Pipestone flag will be flown after retreat, as a solemn reminder of the evening's activities. Please take this time for quiet activities, and preparation for the evening! The boys must realize that they are about to be honored in a very serious and rewarding Ceremony!

The Camp Staff will give you complete information on times, places, and proper attire. Please check your Scouts thoroughly before they leave your campsite to make sure that they have on the proper clothing, and have their Pipestone, if they are Second Year or higher Candidates!

Wearing of, and Care of the Pipestone Camp Honor Token

The Pipestone is to be worn buttoned under the right shirt pocket flap of the Scout Uniform. Only one Pipestone can be earned each year, and it must be taken to the next year's Ceremony to be exchanged for a higher award if the wearer has qualified for it.

Caution your Scouts not to wear the Pipestone in rough games or outdoor activities where it may be lost.

The Indian polished Pipestone with the natural oil from the side of the nose.

Source: Buckeye Council brochure, Pipestone in the Buckeye Council Camp.

37 posted on 06/16/2005 12:09:32 PM PDT by You Dirty Rats (Forget Blackwell for Governor! Blackwell for Senate '06!)
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To: pau1f0rd

FWIW, I lived in Colchester, UK in 1970-1976 as a young boy.

when I was there, I was in scouting.

I even remember going around trying to get neighbors to let you do chores for them, in exchange for - I forget what - to give money for the cause, I guess. and the "job well done!" stickers that would be displayed when you did the job.

We had some good camping trips and other trips. I also btw went to Colchester Royal Grammar school. not co-ed.

A co-ed Politically Correct organization would not be the same thing.

38 posted on 06/16/2005 12:13:14 PM PDT by WOSG (Liberating Iraq -
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To: SandRat

The only thing George Orwell got wrong was the date.

39 posted on 06/16/2005 12:13:45 PM PDT by joebuck
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To: Nevermore

"But I agree with TNlibertarian: it ain't gonna be allowed to happen here. Liberty still means something in the US, as opposed to what has happened to "Great" Britain."

Liberty hasn't prevented many organizations in the US from being infested with the same noxious ideas that eventually kill it.

The Girl Scouts today is a very feminist-oriented PC organization. didn't they try to let Planned Parenthood give sex ed material to teenagers?

Our local Boy Scouts reached an 'understanding' with the United Way of the local area to cut off BSA funding because of 'discrimination'. The homosexual agenda over-rides all other considerations.

40 posted on 06/16/2005 12:17:38 PM PDT by WOSG (Liberating Iraq -
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