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Cruel and Unusual -Terri
NY Times ^ | 6/23/05 | Bob Herbert

Posted on 06/22/2005 8:06:02 PM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection

"Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last?" asked Joseph Welch in his famous confrontation with the pathologically cruel Joe McCarthy. "Have you left no sense of decency?"

More than a half-century later, I would ask the same question of Florida's governor, Jeb Bush.

In an abuse of power that has been widely denounced, and has even appalled many of his own supporters in the Republican Party, Governor Bush has tried to keep the Terri Schiavo circus alive by sending state prosecutors on a witch hunt against her husband, Michael.

The state attorney who has been pushed by the governor into pursuing this case told me yesterday he has seen nothing to indicate that a crime was committed. Nevertheless, the inquiry continues.

Governor Bush asked Bernie McCabe, the state attorney for Pinellas County, to "take a fresh look" at this already exhaustively investigated case to determine, among other things, whether Michael Schiavo had perhaps waited too long to call for help after discovering that his wife had collapsed early one morning 15 years ago.

Mr. McCabe did not seem particularly enthusiastic about his mission. "I wouldn't call it an investigation," he told me in a telephone conversation. The word "investigation," he said, "is a term of art in my business."

He then explained: "When I conduct an investigation, it would mean that I have a criminal predicate. In other words, that I have some indication that a crime has occurred. That's my job...

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial
KEYWORDS: falseaccusers; feminists; manhaters; news; pantload; taxwaste; terrischiavo; wackjobs
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1 posted on 06/22/2005 8:06:02 PM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

It IS a witch hunt.


2 posted on 06/22/2005 8:07:35 PM PDT by jess35
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I have no problem at all with forcibly denying the owners, managers, editors and staff at the NYT water and/or food, until they "pass hither".

When can we start?

3 posted on 06/22/2005 8:08:51 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
"...witch hunt against her husband, Michael."

Yep. ...worse than that, actually.
4 posted on 06/22/2005 8:10:11 PM PDT by familyop ("Let us try" sounds better, don't you think? "Essayons" is so...Latin.)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection; RS; Hildy; Howlin; Trinity_Tx; Smartaleck
He then explained: "When I conduct an investigation, it would mean that I have a criminal predicate. In other words, that I have some indication that a crime has occurred. That's my job.

"In this circumstance, that does not exist at this time. So what I'm attempting to do is respond to the governor's request by conducting what I'm calling an 'inquiry' to see if I can resolve the issues he raised." [my emphasis added]


So...in that grand tradition of American leftists, the "life at all costs" crowd pushes for investigation where no evidence exists. Go, Jim Wright!

Sad that this man must twist terminology to try to "see if [he] can" do this.

5 posted on 06/22/2005 8:12:49 PM PDT by Gondring (The can have my Bill of Rights when they pry it from my cold dead hands.)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

I have to agree with the NY Times this time. I like Jeb, but he needs to let this one go.


6 posted on 06/22/2005 8:13:28 PM PDT by Altair333 (Stop illegal immigration: George Allen in 2008)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
"In an abuse of power that has been widely denounced, and has even appalled many of his own supporters in the Republican Party, Governor Bush has tried to keep the Terri Schiavo circus alive by sending state prosecutors on a witch hunt against her husband, Michael.

The state attorney who has been pushed by the governor into pursuing this case told me yesterday he has seen nothing to indicate that a crime was committed. Nevertheless, the inquiry continues.

Governor Bush asked Bernie McCabe, the state attorney for Pinellas County, to "take a fresh look" at this already exhaustively investigated case to determine, among other things, whether Michael Schiavo had perhaps waited too long to call for help after discovering that his wife had collapsed early one morning 15 years ago.

Mr. McCabe did not seem particularly enthusiastic about his mission. "I wouldn't call it an investigation," he told me in a telephone conversation. The word "investigation," he said, "is a term of art in my business."

He then explained: "When I conduct an investigation, it would mean that I have a criminal predicate. In other words, that I have some indication that a crime has occurred. That's my job..."

No prejudice here on anyone's part.

Nothing to see here, folks. Move along.

7 posted on 06/22/2005 8:16:25 PM PDT by NicknamedBob (Okay, I found Texas. Now what do I do with it?)
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To: Altair333
I like Jeb, but he needs to let this one go.

A lot of people need to let it go already.

8 posted on 06/22/2005 8:16:42 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
I hate to agree with Bob Herbert, but he writes pretty much what I've thought. I used to think that Jeb would would have been a good candidate for president (too bad his first gubinitoral election was stolen) but his pandering to illegals (including Haitians who are clambering off the boats), his opposition to Gulf oil drilling (pure and stupid NAMBYism) and now this idiocy...
9 posted on 06/22/2005 8:16:50 PM PDT by MRMEAN ("On the Internet nobody knows that you're a dog")
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Comment #10 Removed by Moderator

To: Tumbleweed_Connection

That poor woman was openly and brutally murdered in front of the whole world. Her husband could have handed her over to her parents and walked away but choose to kill her instead. I hope Jeb gives that bastard hell.


11 posted on 06/22/2005 8:19:03 PM PDT by Nateman (Morality 180 degrees out of phase with reality: welcome to the left side!)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

Mark Fuhrman has given Bush a head's up on the timeline problems. There are very definate timeline inconsistances by Michael's own words, according to Fuhrman.

I heard Fuhrman give an interview on this. He would not say Michael was guilty of anything. But he said there was something wrong with the story of what happened that night. Fuhrman spent a couple of months here in the Tampa area checking this all out. He said Michael is not the man he presents to the world.

We all know what happened on one of his previous investigations - A several decades old murder case was reopened and a murderer brought to justice. The moment Fuhrman's book comes out, there are going to be calls for Bush to investigate. He's getting a jump on it, that's all. Because he knows people are going to be calling for answers for anything Fuhrman brings up in the book, and he better have some. "I don't know" is not a valid response.

It's just a shame this wasn't done properly when Terri collapsed.


12 posted on 06/22/2005 8:19:18 PM PDT by I still care (America is not the problem - it is the solution..)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

It's comforting that the NYTimes believes in allowing the senile to submit pieces for its pages...


13 posted on 06/22/2005 8:19:20 PM PDT by an amused spectator (If Social Security isn't broken, then cut me a check for the cash I have into it.)
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To: Altair333

I'm pleased to see that some sanity has started to prevail on this issue in the aftermath of the autopsy.

I can give Jeb and W a pass for trying to be sure, but Terri's brain was 1/2 the weight of an adult and the autopsy determined that she had long ago lost her sight.

The "responses" she displayed were consisted with a persistent vegetative state. I think further inquiry and investigation is a waste of public resources.

She's in a better place, let it go.


14 posted on 06/22/2005 8:19:33 PM PDT by rwilson99 (South Park (R)
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To: MRMEAN
BTW, like I told the other poster, I'm going to be happy to just step over your body, should the need arise, so get over it ~ it's not about you.

On the other hand, drilling for oil off Florida is a good way to get yourself UNELECTED. Any politician would have taken the same position. At the same time Haitians turn out to make mighty good Republican voters. They are forgiven by all real Freepers!

15 posted on 06/22/2005 8:21:08 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: muawiyah
You are not on the list for resuscitation either.

Thank you! But you're lucky Jeb isn't the governor here...else he'd want to prosecute you for respecting my Do Not Resuscitate bracelet!

16 posted on 06/22/2005 8:21:58 PM PDT by Gondring (The can have my Bill of Rights when they pry it from my cold dead hands.)
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection

I agree with the last comment. She was killed. There is some suspicion. Politically speaking, however, it may have been better for Jeb not to make this move. But it doesn't bother me that he did it. Did anyone hear Schiavo's lawyer (Felos? sp) after the death. Talk about creepy...


17 posted on 06/22/2005 8:24:26 PM PDT by guitarist
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To: NicknamedBob
No prejudice here on anyone's part.

I don't see how you could describe the Schiavo fiasco without using the word "circus".

18 posted on 06/22/2005 8:25:46 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: Gondring
No, you misunderstood. You're also not on the list to check in the hospital even when conscious.

They have this custom in India of just leaving certain people to die in the streets. We will adopt it in cases involving folks who believe compassion is misplaced when directed at those who are near death.

Remember, none of this is about you. We don't care. Don't bother leaving instructions either ~ don't be wasting our time.

Stay in the streets please ~ we need those hospital beds for people who care.

19 posted on 06/22/2005 8:25:58 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: NicknamedBob
I pressed Mr. McCabe, the state attorney. If there's no evidence that a crime has been committed, I asked, then what is the purpose of the inquiry?

"My purpose," he said, "is simply to respond to the emperorgovernor. The governor's asked me to do something, and I'm going to try to do it."

And it's worth hounding a man who has lost his wife and has no evidence of having committed a crime...as long as it responds to the governor's whim. What happened to America where we fought back when government tried to harass people without charges? What happened to innocent til proved guilty?

20 posted on 06/22/2005 8:26:57 PM PDT by Gondring (The can have my Bill of Rights when they pry it from my cold dead hands.)
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To: muawiyah

I live here in FL, and for me it is not a NIMBY issue. It just doesn't make sense to me to do offshore drilling in an area that gets such a large percentage of its income from tourism on beaches. A major spill could destroy the economy.

Desolate areas in AK are a much better idea.


21 posted on 06/22/2005 8:27:54 PM PDT by I still care (America is not the problem - it is the solution..)
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To: Nateman

LOL! I can picure you standing in front of Michael....holding a rock in your hand, begging to cast the first stone.


22 posted on 06/22/2005 8:28:09 PM PDT by jess35
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To: muawiyah

Problem with your comments is that I am the one who cares about Mrs. Schiavo and others' wishes. I'm not like the Schindlers, who admitted they wanted to keep her body alive even if that wasn't what she wanted! I CARE about the INDIVIDUAL, about the PERSON...not just a generic "life"...


23 posted on 06/22/2005 8:28:25 PM PDT by Gondring (The can have my Bill of Rights when they pry it from my cold dead hands.)
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To: I still care

I'd rather use foreign oil first, and leave us with the good reserves when times get tight around the world.


24 posted on 06/22/2005 8:29:26 PM PDT by Gondring (The can have my Bill of Rights when they pry it from my cold dead hands.)
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To: muawiyah

LOL!


25 posted on 06/22/2005 8:29:28 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: Gondring

Unbelieveable.


26 posted on 06/22/2005 8:30:46 PM PDT by Howlin
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Comment #27 Removed by Moderator

To: Gondring

Sounds good to me - as long as we don't have to kiss butt to leftist governments for it. Being beholden to Venezuela rankles me.


28 posted on 06/22/2005 8:31:33 PM PDT by I still care (America is not the problem - it is the solution..)
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To: Gondring
No, you really don't care about anyone's wishes. There was nothing written down, nor any other sort of record made. No one believes young people make such wishes known anyway. It defies our understanding of youth to believe otherwise.

So, go on about your business. This is NOT about you. We don't care about you. Please make sure you die in the streets and don't dirty the sheets. You will be picked up on either Tuesday or Friday.

29 posted on 06/22/2005 8:33:37 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: muawiyah

What's to check out? The investigator has admitted there is no evidence of any crime (except perhaps a misuse of power by Jeb Bush).


30 posted on 06/22/2005 8:35:43 PM PDT by jess35
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Comment #31 Removed by Moderator

To: Gondring

So let's see... in Florida statements on TV about things that are NOT illegal that happened 15 years ago are grounds for "inquiry", yet investigations via search warrants supported by evidence approved by judges are "witch hunts" ... Got it !


32 posted on 06/22/2005 8:37:27 PM PDT by RS (Just because they are out to get him, it doesn't mean he's not guilty.)
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To: jess35

It's a way for people to keep their names in the news at the expense of others. Disgusting.


33 posted on 06/22/2005 8:37:33 PM PDT by Hildy
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To: muawiyah
Stay in the streets please ~ we need those hospital beds for people who care

So you are angry for people choosing how Terri should die, yet you feel you have the right to decide how another person will die?  Bit hypocritical isn't it?

34 posted on 06/22/2005 8:37:37 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: jess35
What's to check out?

You seem to suggest there is nothing at all to check out. Then why should you be concerned. It's just a minor thing ~ obscure really. Humor them.

I will make sure you are not collected before Tuesday. And don't dirty the sheets!

35 posted on 06/22/2005 8:37:42 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: softwarecreator

I feel nothing one way or the other. My concern is with your belief that we should care. This is an obscure little case. It's NOT about you.


36 posted on 06/22/2005 8:39:41 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: muawiyah

You've got a REAL problem with people deciding their own fate. Terri didn't want to live in a PVS state. This was confirmed with multiple witnesses in a court of law. Y'all didn't get your way...you couldn't force her body to continue on. I think it's time for you to move on.


37 posted on 06/22/2005 8:40:36 PM PDT by jess35
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To: muawiyah
It's NOT about you.

When did I say it was about me?

38 posted on 06/22/2005 8:41:51 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: jess35
Hmmm ~ multiple witnesses. We've been over that one so many times I can't believe anyone could possibly bring it up. I said there was NO RECORD.

Pretty simple.

But, again, this is NOT about you. Whatever you do, just make sure that none of it bothers me, or any of the rest of us. I assure you I am fully prepared to simply step over your body if it should come to that.

Don't make a mess on your way out, please!

39 posted on 06/22/2005 8:44:20 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: jess35

Thank you.  What I like is the people who write "I miss Terri so much".  No, you did not know the woman.  You only know what you saw on TV, nothing more.  You are obsessed with the "image" of Terri.  You built her up to be this great martyr and you don't know if SHE wanted your martyrdom.


40 posted on 06/22/2005 8:45:49 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: Gondring
"No evidence of a crime" is not the same thing as evidence of no crime.

If Michael truly believed that Terri was no longer present in her body, why should he care whether her parents wanted to waste their lives tending to a corpse?

In truth, she was not dead enough to suit him. And if he had that attitude this year, what kind of attitude did he have fifteen years ago?

"What happened to innocent til proved guilty?"

What was Terri's crime that she should be condemned to torturous death?

Michael may have the right to scuttle away, and hide in dark shadows. But casting him as the victim? No way.

41 posted on 06/22/2005 8:47:01 PM PDT by NicknamedBob (Okay, I found Texas. Now what do I do with it?)
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Comment #42 Removed by Moderator

To: muawiyah

You are babbling; did you forget to take your meds tonight?


43 posted on 06/22/2005 8:51:17 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: muawiyah
Remember, I don't care about you ~ actually, it's colder than that ~ I am unconcerned with whether or not you even exist

You are a real "one trick Pony", aren't you?

Just repeat the same thing over and over.

44 posted on 06/22/2005 8:51:51 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: softwarecreator
So you are angry for people choosing how Terri should die, yet you feel you have the right to decide how another person will die? Bit hypocritical isn't it?

This is the latest "twist" to this never ending story on FR.

The very people who were in hysterics because a court gave Michael Schiavo the right to decide for his wife now INSIST on telling the rest of us how WE will be permitted to die! They are convinced we're on the road to mass euthanasia -- and that living wills should NOT be permitted in ANY circumstances!

45 posted on 06/22/2005 8:53:40 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: Howlin
I've seen him on other threads, this is what he does.  Talks in circles and repeats them.  Throws very creepy and vague sentences around till you have no idea what he is talking about.
46 posted on 06/22/2005 8:53:58 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: rwilson99
BTW, how's your brain's weight vis a vis that of the "average" adult?

Mine's pretty good ~ bigger than average too ~ much bigger!

Saw where a young lady with about 10% of normal brain mass just graduated from highschool.

However, that's not of any importance here. Rather, this is actually all about you, and if your brain size is deficient, you need to get on with doing the decent thing you know.

BTW, don't be wasting those hospital beds either ~ really sick people need them ~

47 posted on 06/22/2005 8:54:12 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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To: Howlin
Ah, you gotta love the irony of it.  Hypocrits are so cute.
48 posted on 06/22/2005 8:54:57 PM PDT by softwarecreator (Facts are to liberals as holy water is to vampires)
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To: NicknamedBob
"No evidence of a crime" is not the same thing as evidence of no crime.

Wow, that's almost as good as "It's not that the memos were faked, it's what is IN the memos."

Well done!

49 posted on 06/22/2005 8:54:59 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: Howlin

It's still not about you Howlin.


50 posted on 06/22/2005 8:55:12 PM PDT by muawiyah (q)
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