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Tonight we are no longer a free country (vanity)
6/23/05 | Self

Posted on 06/23/2005 8:06:55 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants

Everybody knows about the shot that was heard around the world as the birthing pains of this once great nation. Today, sadly, we may have heard it's death knell.

It did not come with violence or shots fired. It came with the virtual elimination of personal property rights.

Our founding fathers knew how important the ownership of property was and sought to protect the right to be secure in the ownership of property to the extent that they enshrined the guarantee that property would not be taken for public use without due process and just compensation.

For over 200 years it was understood that "public use" meant that the ownership would transfer from the private owner to the local, state, or federal government for things such as military bases, roads, schools, prisons, etc. Now, the meaning of "public use" has been altered by 5 people who were never elected to office and in all reality, are completely unaccountable to anyone, to mean privately owned condos, shopping centers, and business parks under the thin guise that those enterprises would contribute more tax money to the coffers, thus increasing the "public good"

Justice Stevens, writing for the majority said that judges should give city councils and state legislatures "broad latitude in determining what public needs justify the use of the takings power," he added. To make sure that he wasn't misunderstood he added, "The city has carefully formulated a development plan that it believes will provide appreciable benefits to the community, including, but not limited to, new jobs and increased tax revenue," and just destroyed any pretence that you have any recourse whatsoever if the government or county decides that they want your property for any reason at all.

Sandra Day O'Connor writing a scathing dissent correctly said that now rich and politically land developers and businesses could basically take your land away from you with the help from the local government. Yes, you could fight it in court, but it is now fruitless as you are guaranteed to lose in a fixed fight.

For years the people have for the most party sat quietly as the government stole more and more freedoms from us. Prior to 1914 and fool could take any drug he or she wanted and kill themselves, thus increasing the quality of the gene pool for the rest of us. Before 1918, the government had no claim to your wages and could not tax them. Prior to 1934, Sears sold machine guns from their catalog and nobody thought anything about it. Prior to the 1950's preachers could freely endorse or denigrate any political candidate they wanted, just as had been done since the very first town government was formed in this country almost 350 years prior. Since 1986 it has been illegal to manufacture and sell a machine gun to a civilian despite the fact that in the past several decades the number of people int he US murdered by a person with a machine gun has been exactly one, and the person doing the shooting was a police officer using a gun issued to the police department.

But hope is not lost however, ownership of real property does a funny thing to people. It is a spot that a person can say, "This land is MINE!" with a dedication and a fierceness that is somewhat scary. Religion and politics and abortion and the WOT all take a back seat when two neighbors are faced with having their property stolen by the government.

Maybe that bell sounding isn't the death knell but the alarm.

Maybe this will awake the sheeple to realize that the socialist have gone too far.

Maybe the bell is just signalling round two of the Revolutionary War.

Will this war be fought with bullets or ballots?

We shall see.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: court; crime; domain; eminent; kelo; landgrab; property; rights; supreme
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To: Blood of Tyrants
You make excellent points. There are so many freedoms we have already lost. I hope, along with you that people will be alarmed .

I noticed the MSM is reporting on the ruling. It appears even they (news media) are a little shocked by it. While they are reporting what happened, I noticed they wouldn't name the "justices" who voted FOR this outrage. They seem to be down playing the fact that they are all liberals, while the Conservatives dissented in the strongest possible terms.

For any democRAT voters lurking- let's make sure you understand what has happened: You work hard, save your money, buy a house. You put money into that house, and you want to leave that house to your children.

Guess what? That house that you worked so hard to get, is only yours until the govt. along side a big corporation, decides they want your property. They can take YOUR house away from you.

Oh, they have to offer money, but does that equal what you put into your house? Does it make up for the fact that you wanted to leave your home to your kids?(Some of the houses involved in the case had been in the owner's families since the early 1800's- several generations of family members were born in them). This really means that you don't own that propery at all.

THE UNELECTED SUPREME HIGH OVERLORDS OF THE USSA HAVE DISPENSED WITH YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS.
WAKE UP AMERICA! WAKE UP!

This is the most serious threat to the United States that has occured in my life time. I don't know what to do. I'm beyond outrage. Maybe we should send tea bags to the court and congress? This is on a par with the Boston Tea party, or it should be. What is the congress going to do about this? This is what leads to Civil War and states seceeding from the Union.

I was surprised at one conservative talk show host who, while acknowleging the seriousness of the issue, suggested that the solution was to " elect City Council members who won't take your property away". I was thinking What? This goes way beyond electing city council.

In fact, if this abomination is allowed to stand, there won't be a point to having elections or voting. The Judicial branch of government will officially establish itself as an unelected dictatorship. It's that serious.

I am fed up with republican's cowering over judicial nominations, and being to lazy to take thE democrats on. i.e. not making the rats filibuster for real, or using the constitutional ammendment, or whatever you have to.

Note to all Republican elected officials-

YOU WERE NOT SENT TO WASHINGTON TO "GET ALONG" WITH THE DEMACRATS.

YOU WERE SENT THERE TO STOP THEM. YOU WERE SENT THERE TO PREVENT THIER SOCIALIST AGENDA FROM BEING IMPLEMENTED.

251 posted on 06/24/2005 12:23:12 AM PDT by Pajamajan ("Where there's life there's hope"-Terri Schindler's message to the world.- Never Forget.)
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To: k2blader

It is up to each of us to take action to overturn this obviously unconstitutional decision. If you take your support from a Party that is not doing the will of the people, such as sealing the borders, and there are many other examples so it isn't one issue, then it has a consequence to them! Without a consequence they will keep marching happily along ignoring the people. The Senate Democrats and Republicans have been playing with this distraction about nominees for how long??? Like 4 YEARS now?! It is meant to keep us distracted while the activism continues until the Government has taken away all the rights given to us by our creator. Do something or resign yourself to the government seizing your property when ever THEY feel like it.

If this occurred, see post 218 this thread, over a few month period with even a few million across the country it would shake up the status quo and change the course of this nation which is straight to international socialism from what I can see from here unless something is done to change that direction.

Ravenstar


252 posted on 06/24/2005 12:32:03 AM PDT by Ravenstar (Reinstitute the Constitution as the Ultimate Law of the Land)
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To: texaslil

Well said!


253 posted on 06/24/2005 1:11:01 AM PDT by txnativegop (God help the people of the United States!)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

People greatly underestimate the ability of the American citizen to do what is required (taking up of arms). Any such action taken by citizens WOULD NOT BE QUELLED QUICKLY by the government, you give the beaurocrats too much credit and do not credit the members of the military enough. No service member that I have ever known would ever fire on an American citizen for any reason. How many millions of Americans are military veterans? To be successful, citizens would have to use low-intensity warfare over a long period of years. And the Citizens would be successful. Casualties would be horrendous. Who doubts the Constitution is worth that price?


254 posted on 06/24/2005 1:39:36 AM PDT by txnativegop (God help the people of the United States!)
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To: nygoose

Taking for private use isn't even mentioned, so apparently it's left up to the states and localities, which is the gist of of the Supreme Court opinion.


255 posted on 06/24/2005 1:44:36 AM PDT by AZLiberty
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To: AZLiberty

I think the point is that the court allowed a taking for private use. That's what used to be un-constitutional


256 posted on 06/24/2005 2:12:23 AM PDT by nygoose
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To: TheOtherOne
"Because if the property has that "potential" value allowing the court to justify the taking, likewise, it should have that same value in 'just compensation' to the property owner. In other words, if the price being offered were truly fair, the owner would sell. Obviously it is not a fair price to convince the OWNER of the property to sell.

Excellent point. A fair price is what the seller decides, not the buyer. What the Supremes just did was say the buyer determines the fair market value of property. If the seller doesn't agree the buyer can have the governement intervene to force the sale. Compare it to ebay. Image if ebay allowed buyers to set the market value of items and could intervene to force a sale if a seller didn't meet a buyer's price. What a scam.

257 posted on 06/24/2005 2:29:35 AM PDT by Justa (Politically Correct is morally wrong.)
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To: Smokin' Joe
nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

I GUESS if could be even worse. The Supremes could have stated the just compensation could be required only if the land is taken for private use, and that if its taken for public use, no compensation is required.

You know, their tricky wordplay again.

258 posted on 06/24/2005 4:26:17 AM PDT by bobhoskins
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To: Pajamajan
THE UNELECTED SUPREME HIGH OVERLORDS OF THE USSA HAVE DISPENSED WITH YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS. WAKE UP AMERICA! WAKE UP!

I hate to argue against thios, but technically the Supremes didn't do away with these rights ... the legislatures and city councils that took private land for other private use did away with our rights ... The Supreme Court just didn't do its job and slap down these actions of the perversion of eminent domain.

So, there's a LOT of blame on this issue.

259 posted on 06/24/2005 4:31:54 AM PDT by bobhoskins
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Another right trampled under for the sake of socialism. Sad things is that most Americans don't even realize what has just transpired, or if they do, don't even care.


260 posted on 06/24/2005 4:34:31 AM PDT by PigRigger (Send donations to http://www.AdoptAPlatoon.org)
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To: bobhoskins
IMHO, if the land is taken for public use and not used for the stated purpose within 3 years, the compensation (fair market value) should be tripled and the land returned to the former owner intact.

The Supremes decision is merely a reallocation of wealth.

If home depot (or anyone else) wants my land for 10% of their store, I want 10% of the gross, not some lowball sum and an eviction notice.

The dodge here is that they want the location but do not want to pay fair market value for the property. What is "Fair market value"?

Whatever I can get.

If something like this were coming my way, I'd do my damndest to sell to a competitor of whoever is putting the squeeze on me, just to screw them.

261 posted on 06/24/2005 5:07:02 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (Grant no power to government you would not want your worst enemies to wield against you.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

In a perfect world, the Headlines this morning would read, US Congress announces Impeachment Proceedings to start immediately against the 5 Black Robed Scoundrels. The WH backs this move in full faith and credit. In a perfect world. Blackbird.


262 posted on 06/24/2005 5:13:52 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: Blood of Tyrants

I agree. I feel a Boston Tea Party is in the making. The DUers are just as upset with this as we are. The American people are completely behind us. We need to do something.


From time to time, the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of
tyrants and patriots.
Thomas Jefferson

For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well-organized and
armed militia is their best security.
Thomas Jefferson


The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the People.
Tench Coxe

A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.
Edward Abbey


Rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God.
Benjamin Franklin

Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops that can be, on any pretence, raised in the United States. A military force, at the command of Congress, can execute no laws, but such as the people perceive to be just and constitutional; for they will possess the power, and jealousy will instantly inspire the inclination, to resist the execution of a law which appears to them unjust and oppressive.
Noah Webster


Rights don't defend themselves. People have only those rights they are willing and able to unite to defend, with armed force if necessary. If you don't defend others when their rights are violated, don't expect anyone to defend yours, and those rights will be violated if they are not defended.
Jon Roland



Moderation in the protection of liberty is no virtue; extremism in the defense of freedom is no vice.
Barry Goldwater


263 posted on 06/24/2005 5:21:27 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/canadahealthcare.htm)
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To: Hank Rearden
"Nine out of ten voices in my head are telling me to clean my guns."

Only nine out of ten? It's unamimous in mine! Blackbird.

264 posted on 06/24/2005 5:22:31 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: Pajamajan

Applause


265 posted on 06/24/2005 5:22:36 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/canadahealthcare.htm)
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To: AZLiberty
Like it or not, the constitution already seems to allow the taking of private property, with "just" compensation, whatever that is.

The difference now, it's no longer negotiable. Blackbird.

266 posted on 06/24/2005 5:35:37 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: mylife
even the Libs at DU are angry about this

Seems a good time to quote Wm. Pitt. Not their Wm. Pitt...

The poorest man may, in his cottage, bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storms may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter; all his forces dare not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement."

267 posted on 06/24/2005 5:37:47 AM PDT by Graymatter
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To: Humal

Golf course? How about a shooting range?


268 posted on 06/24/2005 5:42:24 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Today, sadly, we may have heard it's death knell.

I disagree. We may have simply heard the first shot in the coming battle. Perhaps a new nation will be born. The process of birth is always a painful one.

We shall see.

269 posted on 06/24/2005 5:44:17 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Remember that great love and great achievements involve great risk)
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To: thchronic

Signed! I would urge you to post that link on every thread you visit on FR until Congress acts. Blackbird.


270 posted on 06/24/2005 5:45:31 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: montag813

I don't know the answer to that question. But I do know that IF the three branches of the government are co-equal, then the other two have no obligation to obey the judges.


271 posted on 06/24/2005 5:46:54 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: thchronic

Done.


272 posted on 06/24/2005 5:49:14 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Well written. Good post.

"This country belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it." --Abraham Lincoln

273 posted on 06/24/2005 5:49:24 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Remember that great love and great achievements involve great risk)
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To: FreedomAvatar

Five. The other four were as furius as we are.


274 posted on 06/24/2005 5:51:04 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: mylife; cyborg
They even suggested aligning with freepers on this one issue.

Excellent idea.

275 posted on 06/24/2005 5:54:07 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Remember that great love and great achievements involve great risk)
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To: traviskicks
I feel a Boston Tea Party is in the making.

As I understand it, this ruling does NOT exempt government land. Why not band together, obtain financing, and through eminent domain take the land on which the Supreme Court sits and build an amusement park?

276 posted on 06/24/2005 5:55:28 AM PDT by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin (Freedom is the freedom to discipline yourself so others don't have to do it for you.)
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To: longfellow
If this man stands his ground with a gun in his hand is he a criminal ? I say no.

No, not in my eyes, should I sit on a jury. Here's the catch though, he could very likely be determined by the State to be a TERRORIST, ferreted away to some secret location and never heard from again. Does this scenario make the Patriot Act any more onerous to those who are clamouring for it? I don't own tin foil, this is the reality of such power in the hands of tyrants. Blackbird.

277 posted on 06/24/2005 5:58:35 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: Hank Rearden
Nine out of ten voices in my head are telling me to clean my guns.

Keep your powder dry.

278 posted on 06/24/2005 6:00:01 AM PDT by Tolkien (Life is something that everyone should try at least once.)
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To: Razz Barry

Yes, it will get people killed. The first will probably be the poor bastard who has to try to physically evict a crotchety old fart who just refuses to leave. The second will be the old fart for daring to stand up to the almighty government to protect what he now no longer has a right to.

The first to die ought to be the city councilmen and women who were bribed to take his land and the second ought to be the tyrants in black robes who allowed it.


279 posted on 06/24/2005 6:02:24 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin

As I understand it, this ruling does NOT exempt government land. Why not band together, obtain financing, and through eminent domain take the land on which the Supreme Court sits and build an amusement park?
---

I'm sure they would find some 'technicality' to prevent us form doing this. Another option would just say to hell with it and torch the scotus building...



280 posted on 06/24/2005 6:04:54 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/canadahealthcare.htm)
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To: Ravenstar

I want to seriously urge you to start a new, seperate post stating what you just did. Now is the time for action.


281 posted on 06/24/2005 6:05:23 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Hank Rearden
"Nine out of ten voices in my head are telling me to clean my guns."

I haven't been this depressed since Babe the pig found out that humans---even his beloved farmer---eat pigs.

"Don't you know what pigs are for? Why you are here?"
"Why are any of us here?"
"The purpose of a pig is to be eaten."
"They eat pigs?"
"Pork, they call it, or bacon. They only call them pigs when they're alive."
"But I'm a sheep pig."
"Believe me, sooner or later, every pig gets eaten."

282 posted on 06/24/2005 6:07:26 AM PDT by Graymatter
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Every one of the 5 Supreme Court persons that made this obviously unconstitutional decision need to be impeached for violating their oath of office. If there are no consequences they will continue to rip liberty from us until we are no better than slaves.

Ravenstar


283 posted on 06/24/2005 6:09:00 AM PDT by Ravenstar (Reinstitute the Constitution as the Ultimate Law of the Land)
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To: Ravenstar

This might be a good place to start:

http://www.clubforgrowth.org/why.php


And as far as political parties... Only the libertarian party truly believes and practices limited governmnet, as practiced in this country until after 1907.


284 posted on 06/24/2005 6:09:33 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/canadahealthcare.htm)
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To: cyborg

They may be liberals, but they at least understand the importance of property rights. There is hope for them at last.


285 posted on 06/24/2005 6:13:54 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: nygoose
It's not for private use, only public use.

The public use is what's been redefined. Now that means if it helps the town's finances, then it's a benefit to the public at large. Blackbird.

286 posted on 06/24/2005 6:17:43 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: oceanperch
I wonder what those living in Hawaii would comment on your subject matter?

Care to be more specific? Blackbird.

287 posted on 06/24/2005 6:24:07 AM PDT by BlackbirdSST
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts

To paraphrase Lincoln: "Government's power comes from the assent of those governed. Oh, you don't assent to my government? Here comes the Grand Army of the Republic to kill you."
This is only the fruit of 1865.


288 posted on 06/24/2005 7:16:00 AM PDT by warchild9
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To: Blood of Tyrants

"How about a shooting range?"

How about a landfill? That would fit right in with the PREVIOUS owner. ;-)


289 posted on 06/24/2005 7:18:58 AM PDT by Humal
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To: Tobor
The Constitution limits the government, not us.

We are Free, the government is contained by the constitution, not us.

Our Rights do not come to us from the government. Go figure.

But, the government's rights do come from us, and our consent.

We the People are the final check in our system and the Second Amendment was intended to insure that the People always matter and have a say in what happens here.

Best post in the thread. And that's saying something.

290 posted on 06/24/2005 7:32:56 AM PDT by Semper911
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To: Domestic Church

It was during a Republican administration true. However, it was due to 5 liberal justices. This underscores the absolute need to break the Democratic Senatorial movement to keep conservative judges from the bench. Forget SS, forget taxes, forget everything. This is the number one problem, because even if the majority want freedom, laws, and common sense, it only takes 5 liberals to trump it. This is the war that needs to be fought.


291 posted on 06/24/2005 7:36:36 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Hank Rearden

George H W Bush's presidency grows smaller and smaller with the passage of time........Souter is his shameful legacy.


292 posted on 06/24/2005 7:43:58 AM PDT by MamaLucci (Mutually assured destruction STILL keeps the Clinton administration criminals out of jail.)
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To: Mulder; Blood of Tyrants
Sounds like your head's outlook upon the whole world is one big "Fear Factor." Liberty and self-governance are only scary things when in the hands of untrustworthy people.
293 posted on 06/24/2005 8:10:09 AM PDT by Cultural Jihad
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To: warchild9
"Here comes the Grand Army of the Republic to kill you."

The one question still remains. Will a standing army comprised of US citizens open fire on US citizens standing up for their God given rights? I have no doubt that the orders willbe given but will they be carried out?

294 posted on 06/24/2005 8:10:47 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Remember that great love and great achievements involve great risk)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
There have been more than several threads on this.

The weird thing is that nothing has changed. Property has been taken forever. Is it suddenly legal?

No, it was legal all along.

If there is to be a Constitutional amendment, it should state explicitly what property is, what private property is, where it comes from, what part the gov't plays in maintenance of property rights, and extend the domain of property into outer space.

I am serious about all of that because we have been playing with only this planet all this time and now we ought to look toward new land.

The debate on the nature and origin of property will be interesting. BTW, the US has already claimed all of outer space, this in case somebody wants to ignore that fact just like they ignored eminent domain.

295 posted on 06/24/2005 8:17:22 AM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts

That's a tricky question. I've seen anonymous polls of service people (including a recent one at UNC Chapel Hill--you can probably find it on the net soon, if it isn't there already...I know one of the modelers of the poll) which indicate that 60% would shoot Americans to "maintain order." On the other hand, NO service person whom I know personally would consider this, unless shot at first. On the other hand, increasing numbers of combat personnel are foreign-born, and (this is the historian in me coming out) a foreign-born army is the first tool of tyrannizing a free people.
It's a complicated matter. Who can say?
Personally, my Kentucky ancestors fought for their freedoms (right or wrong) in a Tennessee regiment for four years, and they lost, and so did all of us today.


296 posted on 06/24/2005 8:17:35 AM PDT by warchild9
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Will this war be fought with bullets or ballots?

Ballots. And we'll win.

297 posted on 06/24/2005 8:21:00 AM PDT by GOPJ (Deep Throat(s) -- top level FBI officials playing cub reporters for suckers.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Melodramatic.
298 posted on 06/24/2005 8:22:08 AM PDT by verity (Big Dick Durbin is still a POS)
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To: RightWhale
BTW, the US has already claimed all of outer space

Kind of like an ant claiming ownership of the entire earth, isn't it?

299 posted on 06/24/2005 8:23:38 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

It would result in bloodshed without political action-- but political action will right this wrong, mark my words. The Supreme Court is no longer any better than Mugabe. They've killed 40 million unborn, and now they are empowering local governments with so much power that all the wealthy will bow and scrape before them. In fact, the wealthy now can use local govt. stooges to punish men who don't share their wives. It's complete tyranny. That's why we can win this politically. Sure, I advise anyone with sufficient savings to buy at least one gun, just in case. But they won't be needed.


300 posted on 06/24/2005 8:24:48 AM PDT by Arthur Wildfire! March (<<< Ad Campaign for Durbin the Turbin in profile)
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