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Billy Grahm denies that Christ is the only way to salvation.
Radio Broadcast of Cross Talk America ^ | May 11 05 | Dr. David DiCano

Posted on 07/01/2005 9:55:00 AM PDT by Rhadaghast

May 11, 2005 Host: Vic Eliason Topic: False Doctrine Guest: David DiCanio Description: Dr. David DiCanio is Pastor of Columbine Free Presbyterian Church in Columbine, Colorado, and is involved in Christian Media, which produces television-style documentaries on religious trends and movements. Vic Eliason presents two audio cuts. One features Robert Schuller being interviewed by Dr. David DiCanio after giving a keynote address at the 2004 National Association of Evangelicals meeting. The other cut features Robert Schuller interviewing Billy Graham. The two discuss their views concerning how people are saved.

Dr. DiCanio interacts with callers to discuss the opinions expressed by Schuller and Graham and the current move of some leaders in Christianity to preach a gospel that teaches salvation apart from a conscious, biblical awareness of Christ as the only way to God.

Contact Info: info@thechristianmedia.com www.thechristianmedia.com

Rare recordings of great preachers of the past are posted by Dr. DiCanio's church at

http://www.sermonaudio.com/columbine Listen: RealAudio Windows Media


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: billygraham; christalone; clergylaityntwk; donargue; donjones; john146; nattlcnclochurches; postedtowrongforum
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You can hear both preachers state they do not know if Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation. If you go to the link, and click on May 11 05, you can down load the audio and listen.
1 posted on 07/01/2005 9:55:00 AM PDT by Rhadaghast
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To: Rhadaghast

Ol' Billy is going out with a whimper, not a bang, that's for sure.


2 posted on 07/01/2005 9:55:54 AM PDT by over3Owithabrain
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To: Rhadaghast

That's not good.


3 posted on 07/01/2005 9:58:39 AM PDT by Jaded (Hell sometimes has fluorescent lighting and a trumpet.)
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To: Rhadaghast
The stage is set for the Antichrist. If you don't believe in anything you will fall for everything. I never expected to see Billy Graham fit this description.
4 posted on 07/01/2005 9:58:50 AM PDT by Mark in the Old South (Sister Lucia of Fatima pray for us)
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To: over3Owithabrain

Billy must not really believe the Bible he's been preaching for some 40+ years.

What happened to the "no man comes to the Father except by Me" clause,Billy?


5 posted on 07/01/2005 10:00:25 AM PDT by madison10
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To: Rhadaghast

One questionable quote versus a gazillion solid declarations of salvation through Christ alone over a 50 year ministry....Frankly, I'm willing to give him a pass here. I'll rely upon 50 years of preaching the gospel of salvation through Christ alone, rather than one comment made in conversation with that charlatan Robert Schuller.


6 posted on 07/01/2005 10:00:37 AM PDT by My2Cents ("In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." - George Orwell)
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To: Rhadaghast
This and his current love affair with the Clintons is evidence that his Alzheimers is really taking its toll.

He does have AZ doesn't he?

7 posted on 07/01/2005 10:01:44 AM PDT by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: Rhadaghast

Jesus said that whosoever confesses Him before men, He will confess before the Father. And he who denies Him before men, He will deny before the Father.

Maybe Billy will evade that Biblical judgment due to what could well be creeping dementia.


8 posted on 07/01/2005 10:02:17 AM PDT by Mad Mammoth
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To: Rhadaghast

what point is that discussion...i dont have an hour to listen in its entirety


9 posted on 07/01/2005 10:03:39 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: Rhadaghast

Jimmy Carter, President turned evangelist must have converted Billy to universalism or was it the other way around?


10 posted on 07/01/2005 10:03:45 AM PDT by cherrytoes (Life is - you know...)
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To: All

Has anyone here even heard it yet.

Wheres the transcript?


11 posted on 07/01/2005 10:04:57 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: Rhadaghast
having trouble finding link.
12 posted on 07/01/2005 10:05:05 AM PDT by since1868
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To: Phantom Lord

The Rev. Graham has Parkinsons & from what someone said yesterday I take it the dementia effect is the same as Alzheimers. His family needs to take him home to the Carolinas...NOW.


13 posted on 07/01/2005 10:05:52 AM PDT by madison10
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To: Rhadaghast
I'm no Biblical scholar, but I thought that Heaven is uniquely Christian (or Christian derivatives such as Islam)

I can't site Scripture but didn't Christ say "I go to prepare a place for you..."?

There isn't any mention of Heaven before Christ is there?

14 posted on 07/01/2005 10:06:03 AM PDT by bayourod (Unless we get 40% of the Hispanic vote in 2008, President Hillary will take all your guns away.)
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To: Rhadaghast
Without knocking Mr. Graham, there is something seriously wrong with him of late! His son needs to come forth and straighten things out. I can not believe he would say that. Perhaps his sickness has taken over him...I'm baffled!
15 posted on 07/01/2005 10:06:51 AM PDT by RoseofTexas
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To: Rhadaghast
Now his love-fest with the clintons makes sense. If Reverend Graham does not know where he stands and why, it's no wonder he ended up praising those two. This truly is unbelievably sad.
16 posted on 07/01/2005 10:07:16 AM PDT by small voice in the wilderness (Quick, act casual. If they sense scorn and ridicule, they'll flee..)
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To: wallcrawlr

Not yet. I thought I'd listen later.

A transcript would be nice.

It seems like people are automatically assuming this "article" is true.


17 posted on 07/01/2005 10:07:34 AM PDT by k2blader (Was it wrong to kill Terri Shiavo? YES - 83.8%. FR Opinion Poll.)
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To: bayourod

Heaven is in the Jewish tradition,as well, which of course IS the root of Christianity.

You offer a good point of discussion.


18 posted on 07/01/2005 10:07:48 AM PDT by madison10
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To: k2blader

I'm trying to find it from the audio.


I will not speculate like the others here on this thread.


19 posted on 07/01/2005 10:08:47 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: Rhadaghast

I do not know about Billy, but the son Franklin has said on numerious occassions that salvation is only through Jesus.


20 posted on 07/01/2005 10:10:44 AM PDT by 7thson (I think it takes a big dog to weigh a hundred pounds!)
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To: wallcrawlr

Nor will I. Have you found the link?


21 posted on 07/01/2005 10:11:04 AM PDT by since1868
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To: Rhadaghast

Let's see a transcript before we start throwing stones at Billy. God used that man mightily in this world.


22 posted on 07/01/2005 10:11:07 AM PDT by inkling
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To: Rhadaghast

it's about the 11:00 minute mark on WM file....
Billy sounds like he is saying that some people get a consciousness of the truth of Christ without actually knowing Christ...uh....well, that phenomena is not reported in the New Testament documents...ya gotta know about him 'fore you believe in him...that's why preaching and missionaries are needed...otherwise...you can stay at home, and let the "unsaved" come to their own conclusions.....
Sorry Billy, no pass on this one...it is a very weak position...but you are right that people have a sense of
the need for salvation from God, they just don't know where
it is...your job is to tell, and live out, the great news. Let God handle their response...


23 posted on 07/01/2005 10:12:23 AM PDT by Getready ((...Fear not ...))
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To: bayourod

Some may consider me a "heretic" for saying this, but I don't believe it can be said with certainty that people who die *without* ever hearing of Jesus Christ (the gospel message) are going to hell.


24 posted on 07/01/2005 10:12:34 AM PDT by k2blader (Was it wrong to kill Terri Shiavo? YES - 83.8%. FR Opinion Poll.)
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To: Rhadaghast
Please tell me this isn't true. I know it is a trend in the evangelical/mysticism crowd (I am late to this realization). I find it hard to believe that this wasn't just a mistake or something. Oh please let it not be true of BG.

BEWARE all of the new Christian Mystics, Zen Christianity, Christian Buddism, Emerging Church, etc. They teach New Age, occult type practices and are infiltrating and devouring our churches. I am in SHOCK! and appalled. This is the crowd that is introducting this universal salvation theology -- the image of God within you. It is really scary and sick. They worship a flash of light they experience during an altered state of consciousness (see dianetics, scientology, hinduism, buddhism, wicca, occultism, etc..), not the God of the Bible. DO NOT JOIN THEM.

25 posted on 07/01/2005 10:12:41 AM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Legislatures are so outdated. If you want real political victory, take your issue to court.)
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To: k2blader

The contention that Billy Graham said that, is too weird for me. There has to be some kind of mixup or confusion. I refuse to jump on the bandwagon and condemn Rev. Graham because of what someone posted on the Net.


26 posted on 07/01/2005 10:13:24 AM PDT by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: cherrytoes
Jimmy Carter, President turned evangelist must have converted Billy to universalism or was it the other way around?

Ruth Carter Stapleton, Jimmy's sister I think, is a big into this stuff.

27 posted on 07/01/2005 10:13:48 AM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Legislatures are so outdated. If you want real political victory, take your issue to court.)
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To: k2blader

Yeah, I want to know EXACTLY what he said - not what someone thinks he said.


28 posted on 07/01/2005 10:13:49 AM PDT by mlc9852
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To: All

goto min 9 through 11 to hear Billy Graham for yourself.

People will be saved even if they've never heard of Jesus.

Tell me why this is inaccurate.


29 posted on 07/01/2005 10:14:01 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: Getready
Billy sounds like he is saying that some people get a consciousness of the truth of Christ without actually knowing Christ...uh....

Ooo, sounds like the christian mystics have got to him. All of a sudden, you can find god and truth within you. THIS IS TRAGIC!

30 posted on 07/01/2005 10:16:14 AM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Legislatures are so outdated. If you want real political victory, take your issue to court.)
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To: Rhadaghast

I listened to it.

Yes, there is some very complex salvation theory going on...but I will not throw Billy out of the boat on this one.

It does not ring to the level of heresy to me...its simply someone contemplating how people who have not ever heard of Jesus may be saved and go to heaven.


31 posted on 07/01/2005 10:16:45 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: bayourod

I go to prepare a place for you... If it were not so I would have told you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. Thomas saith unto him "But we do NOT know where you go, Lord, and how can we know the way?" Jesus saith unto him "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes unto the Father except by Me." Jhn 14:3-6

I'm not sure that there isn't a way after death to get to meet our Lord and confess his name, but if you deny him in life it's doubtful you get too much leeway in death.


32 posted on 07/01/2005 10:17:07 AM PDT by johnb838 (Adios, liberal mofos!)
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To: Rhadaghast

Didn't you see Ken Starr and
those House Republicans crucify me?
33 posted on 07/01/2005 10:17:15 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth...)
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

ghost. Does not God reveal himself in nature?

please give me a little more discussion so I can know what youre thinking.


34 posted on 07/01/2005 10:17:58 AM PDT by wallcrawlr ( Moderates = You're the wise middle. Like a spare tire around the fat waist of society.)
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To: Getready
Billy sounds like he is saying that some people get a consciousness of the truth of Christ without actually knowing Christ

That's theologically sound.

35 posted on 07/01/2005 10:19:07 AM PDT by johnb838 (Adios, liberal mofos!)
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To: wallcrawlr
There is no other name under heaven whereby ye must be saved.

Jesus said: "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life. No man cometh unto the father except through Me."

"I am the door...."

Jesus has just been downgraded by none other than Billy Graham. Unbelievable.

36 posted on 07/01/2005 10:19:19 AM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Legislatures are so outdated. If you want real political victory, take your issue to court.)
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To: k2blader

The fate of those who haven't heard, or who can't understand (like small children) aren't spoken about in the Bible. We must have faith that God is infinitly just and merciful and will apply those qualities in such situations.


37 posted on 07/01/2005 10:20:40 AM PDT by Tree of Liberty (requiescat in pace, President Reagan)
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To: Rhadaghast

J.C. Saves You.
38 posted on 07/01/2005 10:21:13 AM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (Give Them Liberty Or Give Them Death! - Islam Delenda Est! - Rumble thee forth...)
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To: Getready

"...ya gotta know about him 'fore you believe in him..."

What about people who do not possess the mental faculties to understand the message of the Bible? Do you think that they are condemned to hell? Creating a child who is destined to leave a life of dependence and suffering on Earth and who is condemned to suffer the fires of hell for eternity doesn't sound like something a loving God would suffer to happen. Perhaps Billy Graham suspects that there may be much more to God than what can possibly be described in the words of men. For my part, I suspect he's right.


39 posted on 07/01/2005 10:21:34 AM PDT by Avenger
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To: k2blader
Some may consider me a "heretic" for saying this, but I don't believe it can be said with certainty that people who die *without* ever hearing of Jesus Christ (the gospel message) are going to hell.

No. Some think that's the case and use it to bash Christianity, but it's not. The Bible recognizes that not everyone is going to have a chance to hear the good news, but proposes that a man who is righteous will naturally form within himself a semblence of the law even if he does not know the law. This is New Testament Epistle stuff, though I can't quote chapter and verse on it.

40 posted on 07/01/2005 10:21:38 AM PDT by johnb838 (Adios, liberal mofos!)
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To: wallcrawlr
"Tell me why this is inaccurate. "

I don't know that it is, but should people who don't believe in heaven feel insulted if you tell them that they aren't going to heaven?

I don't think that I would feel insulted if a Hindu insulted me by saying that I won't be reincarnated as a cow.

Heaven is specifically described in Revelations. Native Americans (Indians) might read the description of heaven in Revelations and decide that they would rather go to the happy hunting grounds.

41 posted on 07/01/2005 10:21:42 AM PDT by bayourod (Unless we get 40% of the Hispanic vote in 2008, President Hillary will take all your guns away.)
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To: Rhadaghast
Hmmmm. Inflammatory headline, no backup info except an invitation to listen to a couple of audio cuts (which removes all context from the comments) that will be interpreted by a talk show host....

Why do I suspect that this little blurb is full of crap?

42 posted on 07/01/2005 10:21:43 AM PDT by r9etb
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To: johnb838

Scripture quote please for 'consciousness of the truth of Christ' that saves.


43 posted on 07/01/2005 10:22:07 AM PDT by cherrytoes (Life is - you know...)
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To: 7thson
I hope Franklin means what he says. The deception by the universalists goes something like: they are all saved by the work of Christ on the cross even though they may not realize it.

You have to REALLY test people to see if what they say, salvation is only through Jesus, is what they mean.

44 posted on 07/01/2005 10:22:27 AM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Legislatures are so outdated. If you want real political victory, take your issue to court.)
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

Question for you 'The Ghost of FReepers Past'...

If a person is born and due to his geographic location, he never has the opportunity to even hear about Christ, much less accept or reject him, do you believe his soul is damned for eternity?


45 posted on 07/01/2005 10:22:59 AM PDT by MMcC
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To: Rhadaghast

It is one thing to hear of Christ and reject the teeaching, and something else entirely to have never heard of Christ and still not have the opportunity for salvation, even after death. Many have never even heard of Christ while on earth. For example, what about the innocent infants and babies who don't know anything of Christ - won't their souls be saved? I don't understand how this will work and I think maybe that is the context that Billy Graham is also thinking about.


46 posted on 07/01/2005 10:23:16 AM PDT by Kirkwood
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

Can anyone help me find the audio. I've been to the site and there are many on Billy Graham. What is the exact title please?


47 posted on 07/01/2005 10:23:17 AM PDT by sr4402
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

Actually, it is a common belief in Christianity. A person must reject Grace in order to go to Hell. That protects babies and those who never hear the Gospel.

If you hear the Gospel and you do not say "yes", you are condemned. There is no "maybe" or "later".


48 posted on 07/01/2005 10:23:45 AM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: Rhadaghast

I sincerely hope the person posting this information is not bearing false witness against Billy Graham. Transcript?


49 posted on 07/01/2005 10:24:00 AM PDT by inkling
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To: P-Marlowe

Just a FYI, not that I expect to change your mind.


50 posted on 07/01/2005 10:24:43 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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