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Democrats Smell Scandal, Want Rove Removed
CNSNews.com Senior Editor ^ | July 12, 2005 | By Susan Jones

Posted on 07/12/2005 5:23:40 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance

(CNSNews.com) -- Democrats think they've found a way to get rid of President Bush's political adviser Karl Rove, who has long been a favorite target of liberal wrath.

"Karl Rove and his high priced lawyers might disagree, but the truth is Rove betrayed the identity of an undercover officer fighting on the front lines in the war on terror. These actions are particularly egregious in a time of war," said Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean in a statement released Monday evening.

Dean said President Bush should demonstrate his commitment to the war on terror by holding Rove "accountable."

"It is disturbing that this high-ranking Bush adviser is not only still working in the White House, but now has a significant role in setting our National Security policy," Dean said.

Rove, who serves as deputy White House chief of staff, mentioned a CIA agent in passing, during a July 2003 conversation with Time magazine reporter Matt Cooper.

But Rove's lawyer now tells the Washington Post that Rove did not identify the agent by name and had no intention of "outing" her. (It is illegal to deliberately expose a covert agent whose identity the government is trying to conceal.)

Valerie Plame, the secret agent in question, is the wife of Ambassador Joseph Wilson, a man who publicly challenged the Bush administration's claim that Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Niger. Wilson accused the Bush administration of "outing" his wife as retaliation for his criticism.

'Wilson's wife'

Rove reportedly told Cooper that it was "Wilson' wife, who apparently works at the agency" -- who had arranged Wilson's trip to Niger.

A few days later, columnist Robert Novak named Valerie Plame as a CIA operative in a July 2003 column. It was Novak's column that prompted a grand jury investigation into the White House leak.

It's not clear if Rove was also Novak's source. It's also not clear if Rove is a target of the ongoing grand jury investigation

This week, Rove's lawyer told the Washington Post that Rove did not know the name of Wilson's wife when he spoke with Cooper, and he did not mention Wilson's wife to make her identity public. Rove mentioned "Wilson's wife" only to let Cooper know that no one in the Bush administration had sent Wilson to Niger -- and that Time shouldn't believe everything it was hearing from Wilson.

On the other hand, Democrats don't believe anything they're hearing from Rove.

They say his conversation with Time magazine's Cooper "raises a host of new unanswered questions," including:

-- Who told Rove about Wilson's wife? "Rove had to find out about Plame and her job from someone. Where did this information come from? Who else leaked besides Rove?" the DNC is asking.

-- Who in the Bush administration told New York Times reporter Judith Miller about Plame? "The information cannot have come from Rove, since Rove has 'released' Cooper from confidentiality," the DNC said. " If Rove were Miller's source, wouldn't he do the same for her? So who was Miller -- a reporter working on WMDs -- talking to?" (Miller is now serving time in jail for refusing to reveal her confidential source.)

-- Why did Rove previously deny his involvement in the Plame controversy? The DNC noted that in August 2004, Rove told reporters he didn't know Plame's name in July 2003 and did not leak her name.

But the DNC isn't buying that: "Since Wilson obviously had only one wife and everyone knew who it was, Rove unquestionably did identify Plame."

The DNC also is angry with White House Press Secretary Scott McClellen.

In October 2003, McClellan was asked at a White House briefing, "Scott, earlier this week you told us that neither Karl Rove, Elliot Abrams nor Lewis Libby disclosed any classified information with regard to the [Valerie Plame] leak. I wondered if you could tell us more specifically whether any of them told any reporter that Valerie Plame worked for the CIA?"

McClellan responded: "Those individuals -- I talked, I spoke with those individuals, as I pointed out, and those individuals assured me they were not involved in this. And that's where it stands."

"Did Rove commit perjury in front of the grand jury?" the DNC is now asking. "We know his initial public statements and his statements to Scott McClellan were false. And we know that after testifying once, they (the grand jury) called him back. Did Rove change his answers to the grand jury the same way he changed his answers to the press?"

Suspend Rove's security clearance

Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW), a group with ties to Democrats, has sent a letter to President Bush, asking him to immediately suspend Karl Rove's security clearance, pending the outcome of the federal investigation into the leak of Valerie Plame's name.

"The evidence uncovered so far raises serious questions about Mr. Rove's conduct and his ability to safeguard highly sensitive classified information," Melanie Sloan, executive director of CREW, said in a press release.

"Until those questions are resolved, CREW believes it is not appropriate for Mr. Rove to have continued access to classified information. Anything short of suspension raises an unacceptable risk to our nation's security," Sloan wrote to Bush.

The White House is not commenting on the allegations involving Rove, citing the ongoing grand jury investigation.

President Bush previously said he would deal with anyone in his administration who leaked sensitive information.

"If somebody did leak classified information, I'd like to know it, and we'll take the appropriate action," Bush said on Sept. 30, 2003. He called the investigation into the leak, launched that same day, "a good thing."

The White House is not likely to do anything or say anything more until that federal investigation is complete, but Democrats and liberal interest groups -- furious at the Bush administration for a number of reasons -- are not expected to let the matter rest.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News; Government; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bushhate; cialeak; desperatedems
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1 posted on 07/12/2005 5:23:40 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Dems love to stir a Tempest in a teapot.


2 posted on 07/12/2005 5:27:00 AM PDT by sgtbono2002
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To: Fierce Allegiance

When Sandy Berger goes to jail, that's when i'll ask for Rove to step down.


3 posted on 07/12/2005 5:27:43 AM PDT by Ron in Acreage (It's the borders stupid! "ALLEN IN 08")
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To: Ron in Acreage

Thanks for reading it for me. I don't have the patience to read articles this long, but I thought someone may be interested enough to red it.

RE Berger, it's clear he did something wrong, but I doubt Rove did.


4 posted on 07/12/2005 5:30:50 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance (This ain't your granddaddy's America!)
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To: Fierce Allegiance
This is all being investigated - all well and good. Find the facts and let the chips fall where they may.

But, to make the understatement of the week, I think that in light of all the Democrat-manufactured non-scandals with respect to the Bush administration, a healthy amount of skepticism is in order.
5 posted on 07/12/2005 5:31:17 AM PDT by cvq3842
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Alternate title: "Democrats Break Wind, Blame Rove"

The only scandal they are smelling emanates from themselves, IMO.


6 posted on 07/12/2005 5:32:03 AM PDT by MortMan (Mostly Harmless)
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To: Fierce Allegiance

bump


7 posted on 07/12/2005 5:33:42 AM PDT by lowbridge
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Rove has done nothing illegal. There was no discussion of covert operators. There was a discussion of Wilson's trip to check on uranium. He said that Wilson's wife authorized the trip and that she works at CIA.

1. He didn't use her name.

2. Authorizing travel is not a covert job. It's a personnel activity.


8 posted on 07/12/2005 5:34:51 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: lowbridge

Definitely.


9 posted on 07/12/2005 5:35:40 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance (This ain't your granddaddy's America!)
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To: Fierce Allegiance

The President needs to come out TODAY and say that Karl Rove did not "out" Valerie Plame, and he will be staying on the President's team until the end of this administration. Period. The longer they can make headlines with this non-issue, the worse it will get.
Shame on that old Democrat, Novak, who sits like a sphinx with the real information, and won't give it up until October, when the grand jury term is over. He ought to be horse whipped for causing the President this grief when W should be working on serious issues. If there were real justice, Novak would be sitting in jail instead of Judith Miller.


10 posted on 07/12/2005 5:38:05 AM PDT by kittymyrib
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To: Fierce Allegiance
When has a denial of a crime, when no crime appears to have been committed, a terminatable offense? No one owes this BS liberal MSM any explanation of anything. I still haven't heard any evidence that Rove "leaked" her name. My wife got me a job one time, when I was younger, does anyone here now know her name?
11 posted on 07/12/2005 5:38:21 AM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: xzins
Authorizing travel is not a covert job. It's a personnel activity.

Bingo! If she was a covert spy, her job would not be in the business of appointing people to special tasks. They would be the one SENT on special tasks. The email about Rove's involvement, clears Rove of the 'crime' the Democrats accuse him of committing.

12 posted on 07/12/2005 5:41:47 AM PDT by ilgipper
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To: Fierce Allegiance; MurryMom
...long been a favorite target of liberal wrath.

Who isn't? RATS may need to get their hate under control...

13 posted on 07/12/2005 5:43:16 AM PDT by Libloather (I trust Hillary as far as I can throw her...)
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Just for a moment, let's give the Dumocrats their LSD induced fantasy. Even if Rove resigns, there is nothing short of a court order that can keep him and President Bush from planning strategy. I would actually like to see Rove resign, but continue with his present duties at no pay. What would the Dums say then?


14 posted on 07/12/2005 5:44:45 AM PDT by Niteranger68 ("Spare the rod, spoil the liberal.")
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To: Libloather

Nothing quite like getting a lecture about loyalty and patriotism from a liberal. I am amazed they can even utter the words.


15 posted on 07/12/2005 5:45:28 AM PDT by Stashiu (RVN, 1969-70)
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To: xzins
Rove has done nothing illegal. There was no discussion of covert operators. There was a discussion of Wilson's trip to check on uranium. He said that Wilson's wife authorized the trip and that she works at CIA.

You may be correct but it does beg the question "Why didn't Rove just tell everyone what he said to whom when the story broke"?

I hope we don't find out that Rove lied to Bush about his involvement. Rationalize all you want but Rove's statements to Cooper were designed to discredit Wilson, not out his wife, and to the MSM this is worse than outing a nobody! They want blood and I see Rove going down for this.

MoodyBlu

16 posted on 07/12/2005 5:45:41 AM PDT by MoodyBlu
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To: Fierce Allegiance
Democrats Smell

At least I agree with the first part of the title.

17 posted on 07/12/2005 5:45:42 AM PDT by linkinpunk
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To: Fierce Allegiance

"Rove reportedly told Cooper that it was "Wilson' wife, who apparently works at the agency" -- who had arranged Wilson's trip to Niger."


So Cooper was wanting to discuss Wilson's trip to Niger with Rove. Got to wonder if Cooper knew WHO set this trip up the sole purpose appears to be the protection of Saddam, at least that is the way his article in the NYTimes reads.

JFKerry ran a whole campaign for president in support of saving Saddam and the French/Germans/Russian oil deals.

Sounds like a set up from the get go. Also got to wonder who gave Wilson and his woman the idea to begin with???


18 posted on 07/12/2005 5:47:20 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: sgtbono2002
Dems love to stir a Tempest in a teapot.

Let'em stir :) When this comes back to bite them on their butts, they'll have no one to blame but themselves. They're getting what they wanted, just not the way they wanted it. I love it. Bwah hah hah hah hah...

19 posted on 07/12/2005 5:49:03 AM PDT by mewzilla (Property must be secured or liberty cannot exist. John Adams)
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To: RacerF150

seriously ... who cares?


20 posted on 07/12/2005 5:49:04 AM PDT by republican2005
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To: ilgipper; lowbridge; Fierce Allegiance
And just because she was once upon a time in a covert job doesn't mean that she will always be in that role.

Listing her new role without mentioning her old is not illegal. In fact, mentioning her old role isn't necessarily illegal if she is no longer going to be used in the that capacity.

The following is from the CIA's own website:

Mr. Goss was a U.S. Army Intelligence officer from 1960 to 1962. He served as a clandestine service officer with the Central Intelligence Agency from 1962 until 1972, when an illness contracted on duty forced him to retire. While in the CIA's Directorate of Operations, he completed assignments in Latin America, the Caribbean, and Europe.

It's about their own director. Should they be charged with "outing" him in in official bio?

21 posted on 07/12/2005 5:49:27 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: RacerF150
I would actually like to see Rove resign, but continue with his present duties at no pay.

I would like to see Rove resign, so that he can serve on the US Supreme Court.

22 posted on 07/12/2005 5:52:43 AM PDT by VisualizeSmallerGovernment (Question Liberal Authority)
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To: kittymyrib
Don't underestimate the value of distraction. When the SCOTUS appointment(s?) are made they will either drown the Rove thing or the Dems will be so eager to bury Rove that they'll be distracted away from SCOTUS.

Believe me, if either of them thought it would be best, Rove would be gone in half a second. After all, he's a campaign adviser, I would have figured he would have been gone early in 2005, working for campaigns.

Trust me, Bush sees things in the long term.

23 posted on 07/12/2005 5:57:24 AM PDT by AmishDude (Once you go black hat, you never go back.)
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To: Fierce Allegiance

-- Who in the Bush administration told New York Times reporter Judith Miller about Plame? "The information cannot have come from Rove, since Rove has 'released' Cooper from confidentiality," the DNC said. " If Rove were Miller's source, wouldn't he do the same for her? So who was Miller -- a reporter working on WMDs -- talking to?" (Miller is now serving time in jail for refusing to reveal her confidential source.)

This seems to be the key to all of this. If the source was not Rove, it is not likely that it was anyone else in the White House. Novak referred to "Administration Officials", not specifically "White House sources", so it does beg the question, why is Miller willing to go to jail to protect her source? I doubt that it is on principle.


24 posted on 07/12/2005 6:01:51 AM PDT by Rocket1968 (Durbin must resign - NOW!)
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To: VisualizeSmallerGovernment
I would like to see Rove resign, so that he can serve on the US Supreme Court.

Wow, that sure would light a sh!tstorm with the dems!

25 posted on 07/12/2005 6:04:04 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance (This ain't your granddaddy's America!)
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To: MoodyBlu

Of course Rove was discrediting Wilson's trip. That was the whole point and also the reason for wanting anonymity. Wilson went to Niger, drank tea in the capital city for a week, and then came home and filed a report saying Saddam had not sought to buy uranium from Niger.

His report was bogus, and that was Rove's point....to discredit the report. Part of the discrediting was that Wilson had not gone over at the behest of the administration -- he had gone over 'cause his wife had gotten my travel tickets.


26 posted on 07/12/2005 6:04:42 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: MoodyBlu

Of course Rove was discrediting Wilson's trip. That was the whole point and also the reason for wanting anonymity. Wilson went to Niger, drank tea in the capital city for a week, and then came home and filed a report saying Saddam had not sought to buy uranium from Niger.

His report was bogus, and that was Rove's point....to discredit the report. Part of the discrediting was that Wilson had not gone over at the behest of the administration -- he had gone over 'cause his wife had gotten HIM travel tickets.


27 posted on 07/12/2005 6:05:00 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: Fierce Allegiance
...but the truth is Rove betrayed the identity of an undercover officer fighting on the front lines in the war on terror.

When did this happen and how does he know? He's stating fact that Rove is guilty where none has been proven or even charged........sounds like libel to me.......

28 posted on 07/12/2005 6:08:00 AM PDT by Red Badger (The Army makes the world safe for democracy. The Marines make the world safe for the Army.....)
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To: xzins
Listing her new role without mentioning her old is not illegal. In fact, mentioning her old role isn't necessarily illegal if she is no longer going to be used in the that capacity.

I don't think she was a current operative, but her covert status was still secret and can remain so for many years. This is to protect her contacts and others who may still be in the field. This issue still is who revealed her covert status. Who ever it was, is guity of the crime.

29 posted on 07/12/2005 6:12:02 AM PDT by TheOtherOne (I often sacrifice my spelling on the alter of speed™)
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To: MoodyBlu

Stating that someone works at the CIA is not a crime. Janitors and typing clerks work there, too. Revealing the identity of a covert operator is a crime. Ms. Plame was not in a covert capacity at the time......


30 posted on 07/12/2005 6:12:42 AM PDT by Red Badger (The Army makes the world safe for democracy. The Marines make the world safe for the Army.....)
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To: cvq3842

> a healthy amount of skepticism is in order.

Hear hear. Although, I wish Scott had been more forthcoming yesterday. You and I and everyone who has a head on their shoulders knows this is more Demonrat dust kicking up, but not coming out and restating what had been said before (leaker should be fired) makes the President look bad. Not a smart move, IMHO. I would have just said, "the President sticks by his statements". And THEN cut the MSM slobberers off.

When Karl is cleared this will blow over.


31 posted on 07/12/2005 6:13:46 AM PDT by VictoryGal (Never give up, never surrender!)
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To: ilgipper

Plame was "outed" in 1994 to the Russians by Aldrich Ames, that is why she was reassigned to desk duties in DC as an analyst, she was not covert.


32 posted on 07/12/2005 6:13:48 AM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: TheOtherOne

I know that during the time this was hot a few years back, that many reports said that Wilson himself had outed her covert role on a number of occasions at a variety of public gatherings.


33 posted on 07/12/2005 6:14:54 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It!)
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To: Rocket1968
This seems to be the key to all of this. If the source was not Rove, it is not likely that it was anyone else in the White House. Novak referred to "Administration Officials", not specifically "White House sources", so it does beg the question, why is Miller willing to go to jail to protect her source? I doubt that it is on principle

You have nailed it perfectly! ...my thoughts exactly.

And the Old Media is strangely quiet as to questioning her source since hers must be different if she is in jail.

34 posted on 07/12/2005 6:15:15 AM PDT by TexasCajun
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To: xzins
I know that during the time this was hot a few years back, that many reports said that Wilson himself had outed her covert role on a number of occasions at a variety of public gatherings.

I think Rove may have know that, and by mentioning her role in the Niger trip ... started the ball rolling where reporters started to look at her. Then, somone else revealed her status... it is that person who I think is in deep.

35 posted on 07/12/2005 6:17:18 AM PDT by TheOtherOne (I often sacrifice my spelling on the alter of speed™)
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To: ravingnutter

---"Plame was "outed" in 1994 to the Russians by Aldrich Ames, that is why she was reassigned to desk duties in DC as an analyst, she was not covert."---

Do you have a source for that information?


36 posted on 07/12/2005 6:22:43 AM PDT by Rocket1968 (Durbin must resign - NOW!)
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To: Red Badger

Fitzgerald has even said that Rove is not a target in this investigation.


37 posted on 07/12/2005 6:24:20 AM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: Rocket1968
Who in the Bush administration told New York Times reporter Judith Miller about Plame? "The information cannot have come from Rove, since Rove has 'released' Cooper from confidentiality,"

There is an interesting post here which describes the circumstances under which Cooper received his 'release'. Basically, Rove's lawyer told the press that if Cooper is going to jail it isn't to protect Rove. Since Cooper thought he WAS going to jail to protect Rove, that caused Cooper to contact the lawyer who gave him the OK.

The request for release was initiated by Cooper, not Rove. Thus, the fact that Rove released Cooper does not mean that Miller's source is not also Rove.

38 posted on 07/12/2005 6:35:39 AM PDT by madfgurtbn
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To: ravingnutter

Just another sewer backup on the dimwits.

No clues. No integrity. No future.

It gets worse by the moment.


39 posted on 07/12/2005 6:38:00 AM PDT by CBart95
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To: TexasCajun

Where was O'Neil when all this was going on?


40 posted on 07/12/2005 6:42:59 AM PDT by gov_bean_ counter (Conservatives look at Iraqi dual use chemicals and see WMDs. Liberals see tomato gardens.)
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To: Rocket1968
The identity of CIA officer Valerie Plame was compromised twice before her name appeared in a news column that triggered a federal illegal-disclosure investigation, U.S. officials say.

Mrs. Plame's identity as an undercover CIA officer was first disclosed to Russia in the mid-1990s by a Moscow spy, said officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

In a second compromise, officials said a more recent inadvertent disclosure resulted in references to Mrs. Plame in confidential documents sent by the CIA to the U.S. Interests Section of the Swiss Embassy in Havana.

The documents were supposed to be sealed from the Cuban government, but intelligence officials said the Cubans read the classified material and learned the secrets contained in them, the officials said.

Washington Times

First, the C.I.A. suspected that Aldrich Ames had given Mrs. Wilson's name (along with those of other spies) to the Russians before his espionage arrest in 1994. So her undercover security was undermined at that time, and she was brought back to Washington for safety reasons.

Source: Nicholas Kristof w/ the NY Times

Also reported by Newsmax:

"The C.I.A. suspected that Aldrich Ames had given [Plame's] name [along with those of other spies] to the Russians before his espionage arrest in 1994. So her undercover security was undermined at that time, and she was brought back to Washington for safety reasons."

Newsmax

41 posted on 07/12/2005 6:46:36 AM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Amazing title - Dims stay neck-deep in their own excrement and can't smell sh*t, but consider someone's response to clarify left-wing lies and deceptions to be a stinking scandal.


42 posted on 07/12/2005 6:49:01 AM PDT by trebb ("I am the way... no one comes to the Father, but by me..." - Jesus in John 14:6 (RSV))
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To: ravingnutter
Plame was "outed" in 1994 to the Russians by Aldrich Ames, that is why she was reassigned to desk duties in DC as an analyst, she was not covert.

Really? Got a source on this? Would be interesting if true!

43 posted on 07/12/2005 6:56:59 AM PDT by Bommer
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To: ravingnutter

Cool. Thanks for the links


44 posted on 07/12/2005 6:59:29 AM PDT by Bommer
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To: Fierce Allegiance

Rove has committed no crime, no immoral act, nothing wrong. Even if he did inadvertently or intentionally mention a former CIA agent, so what. My wife went to college with two guys who went to work for the CIA. Would it be a crime if she said their names.

Now I know why the RATS are called DUmmies.


45 posted on 07/12/2005 6:59:42 AM PDT by Neoliberalnot (Conservatism: doing what is right instead of what is easy)
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To: Fierce Allegiance
"Wilson' wife, who apparently works at the agency"

It's pretty clear what happened here. Cooper asked why Wilson was sent to Niger, and Rove said the trip was arranged " . . . by his wife, who works at the agency." Many in Washington apparently knew Wilson's wife worked at the agency, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was the loudmouth Wilson who was the original source of the info. At any rate, this exchange makes it clear that Rove wasn't trying to "out" Plame or "punish" Wilson - in response to a question, he was just explaining what happened. Some scandal. (sarcasm)
46 posted on 07/12/2005 7:05:34 AM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: MortMan
The only scandal they are smelling emanates from themselves, IMO.

Yep. They're smelling their upper lip and hoping the stench is coming from somewhere else.

The Dims are DREAMING if they think Rove is going anywhere.....

Wouldn't it be nice if the Dims actually cared about representing their consituents and actually doing the country's business instead of playing "gotcha" politics? Wouldn't it be nice if just once they'd offer a plan of action that didn't involve hanging a 'Pubbie? Opps, wait, now I'm dreaming........

47 posted on 07/12/2005 7:09:59 AM PDT by Thermalseeker
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To: linkinpunk

Some of them have a rotten fish smell about them.


48 posted on 07/12/2005 7:11:43 AM PDT by Piquaboy (22 year veteran of the Army, Air Force and Navy, Pray for all our military .)
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To: VictoryGal

McClellan has never been very good, and yesterday he was at his worst. He should have put that little prick David Gregory in his place and said, "We are not going to comment further on an ongoing investigation. Mr Rove's attorney has made a statement, the President is satisfied with that statement, and we are not going to add to that at this time. Period."


49 posted on 07/12/2005 7:13:31 AM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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To: ravingnutter

People seem to have forgotton how Grand Jury's work. The original intent of their being convened may be far from their final outcome. If they uncover side issues that they deem worthy of investigation they will investigate. A person that is totally irrelevant to the original investigation may wind up getting indicted on an un-related charge......


50 posted on 07/12/2005 7:14:54 AM PDT by Red Badger (The Army makes the world safe for democracy. The Marines make the world safe for the Army.....)
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