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Truth and Lies (British Muslim sends shocking e-mail to top UK journalist Melanie Phillips)
Melanie Phillips ^ | July 12, 2005 | Melanie Phillips

Posted on 07/12/2005 12:28:26 PM PDT by ToveL

I print below an email message I have received from a Muslim. I do so because I believe this writer to be expressing views shared by many, if not most, mainstream Muslims in Britain, the kind who would be utterly horrified by terrorism and are therefore considered to be ‘moderate’.

'I am a Muslim and a regular reader of the Daily Mail. I much enjoy reading your columns. Today, on the 10th anniversary of the Srebrenica massacre of 8,000 Muslims in Serbia, I ponder to think what on Earth lead to such hatred against a minority group. What twisted mind could have incited it?

'Then I read your article ('No Surrender', Daily Mail, July 12, p 12) and found my answer. My theory is that a continual drip, drip of anti-Islamic propaganda fed to the Serbian population - much the same that I read in your article today - lead to the vicious pogroms against our community and the disaster that befell the Muslims of Srebrenica. This is the same propaganda which says that Islam is a violent religion, that Muslims are not integrated, that they condone violence and that they do not denounce it and take action and so on. The integration argument was employed particularly against the Jews of Poland who comprised nearly a third of all Poles and who were virtually wiped out overnight during the second World War.

'I find your stance on integration and denunciations particularly intriguing coming from someone who cannot make up her mind whether she is British or Israeli. After all, you spectacularly failed to answer a question on BBC TV, coming from a fellow Jew, as to who you would support if there was a conflict between Britain and Israel. You demand that British Muslims account for actions taken in the name of Islam. You should look nearer home. Israel was created (from stolen Arab land) in the name of all the Jews in the world. It is written into Israel's constitution. You should know. Every single atrocity carried out by the Jewish state against her Muslim neighbours since - the continual land theft, the massacres in refugee camps like Sabra and Shatila, the denial that Palestinians even exist - has, is and will be carried out in the name of Judaism and all the Jews in the world. Yet I have not heard any denunciations coming from yourself nor I have heard you call for British Jews to denounce these things.

'I do not think that British Jews, many of whom carry Israeli passports, should have to account for Israel any more than British Muslims have to account for Al-Qaeda. I do not think that Judaism is an inherently violent religion despite every evil committed in it's name by Israel. I do not think that Jews are any different to others even if the only Jewish state in the world is a military monster, a pariah which is becoming increasingly unpopular. I just find it ironic that you of all people demand that British Muslims - who have just a British passport and are truly British - apologise for being the victims of bombings in our own cities as a result of policies in Iraq which we stood against. People are rightly angry at what has happened in the city that I love and in which I live. But I wonder what they would think if London - like Baghdad - was bombed by a coalition which left over 100,000 people dead, or if Londoners were forced to live in refugee camps because some Jews proclaimed London as their holy land and that henceforth, no non-Jew would be allowed to live there. Is it inconceivable that people would be angry? Is it outrageous to think that some people would be driven by revenge to take action? Londoners are not stupid. If were indeed attacked by Al-Qaeda then we know exactly why it happened.

'When the IRA bombed London, there was no commentary about Christianity being a religion of the sword. We sat down with the IRA and we reached an agreement. If we sat down with Al-Qaeda I have no doubt that we would find that they too have similar concerns to the IRA. I think they would tell us that if We stopped meddling with their countries then they would stop meddling in ours (or rather, my country since I do not know your allegiance). I think however, that the main reason why you would be very uncomfortable with a dialogue with Al-Qaeda is because the British people would find out that - to adapt a phrase coined by Bill Clinton - it's Palestine, stupid. Iraq will eventually become a non-issue and we are now hearing leaked plans for a withdrawal of British troops, but the Palestine issue has been a festering sore ever since western powers gave that country away to create a Jewish state in 1948. Israel has created instability not only in the Middle East, but has managed to drag the rest of the world into the conflict. It called for war in Iraq and is now calling for action against Syria and Iran. It is a liability. This realisation by the British people is what you really fear.

'Furthermore, the excuse that young Muslims are somehow inflamed by radical preachers is a convenient excuse used by many to detract from the real causes of discontent. Would-be Al-Qaeda operatives are just as likely to regularly attend mosques as zionists are likely to regularly attend synagogues. Everyone knows that our mosques are finding it difficult to retain youngsters. Like many other religious establishments, our mosques are mainly staffed with conservative establishment figures who have little clue about contemporary culture. Instead, you will find young Muslims in our universities, hospitals, schools, civil service and every other place where Muslims have been a part of Britain for some time now. They don't need radical preachers to inflame them, as the policies of Bush and Blair are doing a nice enough job thank you very much. Commentary of the sort they read in the Daily Mail written by you today will already add to their grievances and sense of injustice. In this, you and Al-Qaeda share one aim, as the aim of Al-Qaeda is also to cause resentment against the Muslim community and divide them from other communities. It is fortunate therefore, that people will not fall for this trick and despite the best efforts of Al-Qaeda and yours truly, will remain united in the face of terror.’

To this reader, and to other Muslims reading this website who may think something similar or worse, I would just say this. It would be futile to try here to correct the distortions and inappropriate comparisons contained in these remarks, which I’m sure were written in the very sincere belief that they are all true and entirely valid. To try to do so would be to pit oneself against a whole culture which misrepresents both the past and the present and insists that falsehood is truth.

While mainstream Muslims persist in subscribing to such a morally warped victim culture constructed on untruth, error, denial of responsibility and, in particular, gross ignorance and prejudice on the subject of Israel and the Jews, they will alas continue to provide, however inadvertently and however much they may deny this in genuine horror, the sea in which terror swims. It cannot be stressed too much that the hatred that fuels Islamic terrorism does not derive solely from religious texts but is incited and inflamed by lies and distortions about the history and present actions of the west and above all about the Jews and about Israel — a world-view based on a wholesale denial and inversion of the truth which has poisoned the minds of millions.

Truth and lies are at the very heart of this terrible problem facing us all. The sense of grievance and injustice to which this reader refers is indeed very real. But it is the grievance of a people who turn their own misdeeds into their own victimology, thus making rational discourse all but impossible. The tragedy is that this reader and I undoubtedly have much in common — but what divides us is unbridgeable, unless the Muslim community starts to unpick the truth from the lies they have been told for so long.


TOPICS: Editorial; Israel; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: americahaters; balkans; bosnia; britain; bushhaters; eurabia; hate; islamaniacs; islamofascists; islamokazis; israel; jewhaters; jihadinengland; koranimals; muslim; palestine; religionofpeace; religionofpieces; religionoftolerance; thenemywithin; trop; ukmuslims
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1 posted on 07/12/2005 12:28:27 PM PDT by ToveL
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To: ToveL

Disturbing as all get out.


2 posted on 07/12/2005 12:30:18 PM PDT by Alexander Rubin (You make my heart glad by building thus, as if Rome is to be eternal.)
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To: ToveL

I can't imagine what could possibly give people the idea that Islam is a violent religion.


3 posted on 07/12/2005 12:31:00 PM PDT by Question Liberal Authority ("There is no terrorist threat! There is no terrorist threat!" - Michael Moore)
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To: ToveL

Islam is a deadly world-wide plague and liberalism is the AIDS virus that prevents our protecting ourselves from it.

Well, after I sifted through all the gobbilty gook, that's what I see...


4 posted on 07/12/2005 12:31:33 PM PDT by FearNoMan
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: ToveL

8,000? I rather doubt that.


6 posted on 07/12/2005 12:33:12 PM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: ToveL

http://windsofchange.net/flashplayer.php?media=alqaeda&w=640&h=480


7 posted on 07/12/2005 12:36:52 PM PDT by radar101
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To: ToveL

"Today, on the 10th anniversary of the Srebrenica massacre of 8,000 Muslims in Serbia,"


He must have missed the part where non muslim troops were protecting their sorry butts.


8 posted on 07/12/2005 12:37:11 PM PDT by cripplecreek (I zot trolls for fun and profit.)
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To: ToveL

Muslims have a 14 century long history of mass murder and can't believe that they aren't seen as the Religion of Peace...HUH!


9 posted on 07/12/2005 12:37:16 PM PDT by ncountylee (Dead terrorists smell like victory)
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To: ToveL; Balkans; Destro; Wraith; Fusion; Jomini; A. Pole; MarMema; Honorary Serb; FormerLib; ...
Good Grief!

Article referred to as posted on FReeRepublic.

No Surrender (The British government is in denial about the dangers of Islam)

10 posted on 07/12/2005 12:37:19 PM PDT by Incorrigible (If I lead, follow me; If I pause, push me; If I retreat, kill me.)
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To: ToveL

As I tried to read through the contents of the email I felt my brain twisting like a corkscrew.


11 posted on 07/12/2005 12:37:27 PM PDT by Bahbah (Something wicked this way comes)
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To: ToveL

Julia Gorin's column this week puts a good historical perspective on the massacre at Srbenika. The writer of the source email in this case does the usual gloss job using a fabric of lies to cover the facts about the "Religion of Peace". In fact their religion is anything but peaceful in word and deed.

We will see if the UK begins to wake up to the real threat. If the police pursue the perpetrators of the bombings as merely criminals that will tell us they aren't serious about confronting the undisguised ambitions of the "clerics" of Islam.


12 posted on 07/12/2005 12:37:59 PM PDT by TeaDumper
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To: ToveL

Start building the bombshelters.


13 posted on 07/12/2005 12:38:04 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: ToveL

I find it unbelievable that a Muslim would hearken back to the eradication of Polish Jews in WWII.


14 posted on 07/12/2005 12:38:10 PM PDT by RushCrush (Booyaka-sha. Check dis!)
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To: ToveL

What a politely well-written load of hogwash.


15 posted on 07/12/2005 12:40:00 PM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common sense is an uncommon virtue.)
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To: 1st-P-In-The-Pod; A Jovial Cad; A_Conservative_in_Cambridge; adam_az; af_vet_rr; agrace; ahayes; ...
FRmail me to be added or removed from this Judaic/pro-Israel/Russian Jewry ping list.

WARNING: This is a high volume ping list

16 posted on 07/12/2005 12:41:08 PM PDT by Alouette (Just when I think liberals can't get any more stupid, I'm wrong.)
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To: ToveL
Maybe the MSM will finally face reality that this enemy is more than the labeled "extremist". I believe the enemy has now turned out to be every Muslim on the face of this earth. This peace by appeasement has been a failed effort by many previous administrations and now if one doesn't believe the enemy is all the Muslims they only risk their and everyone else's life. Muslim Motto; Condemn Today, Celebrate Tomorrow.
17 posted on 07/12/2005 12:41:22 PM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: RushCrush

Nothing is too vile for TROP.


18 posted on 07/12/2005 12:41:51 PM PDT by sheik yerbouty
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To: ToveL

"I think however, that the main reason why you would be very uncomfortable with a dialogue with Al-Qaeda is because the British people would find out that - to adapt a phrase coined by Bill Clinton - it's Palestine, stupid."

50-50 this is a lefty posing as a Muslim.


19 posted on 07/12/2005 12:42:04 PM PDT by Shermy
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To: ToveL

The Serbs learned to be uncompromising with Islam through hundreds of years of experience. That is why they are still not Islamic. The same story is true of the Hindus and Sikhs, and the Russians, among others. These cultures acted like brick walls to Islam, and they don't like it.

Cultures that were more soft, politically correct, and not willing to fight to the death were swallowed up and no longer exist.


20 posted on 07/12/2005 12:43:14 PM PDT by OK
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To: radar101

That was a very, very good presentation.


21 posted on 07/12/2005 12:43:55 PM PDT by PogySailor
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To: ToveL

I'm going to get a t-shirt that says "Nuke Palestine".

I've had enough of this nonsense.

Regards, Ivan


22 posted on 07/12/2005 12:44:21 PM PDT by MadIvan (You underestimate the power of the Dark Side - http://www.sithorder.com/)
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To: Shermy
50-50 this is a lefty posing as a Muslim.

As they have the same goal (destruction of Western Civ.) that could be.

23 posted on 07/12/2005 12:46:20 PM PDT by PogySailor
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To: ToveL
Wow!!!Forget for the moment that the writer of the email is a Muslim and you have still have one sick twisted self-loathing individual. Add in the cult behavior and you have a suicide bomber. You can tell he is not an American Muslim...he didn't blame Bush by name.
24 posted on 07/12/2005 12:46:26 PM PDT by crazyhorse691 ( Heaven on Earth is where the nearest Starbucks is 60 miles away.)
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To: RushCrush

"I find it unbelievable that a Muslim would hearken back to the eradication of Polish Jews in WWII."

He even got that wrong. There were around 3.5 million Jews in Poland at the outbreak of war in 1939. That was roughly 10% of the overall population and not 33% as he suggests.


25 posted on 07/12/2005 12:49:17 PM PDT by ToveL
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To: ToveL

To anti Semites, London is considered a "Jew town" in much the same way that New York is.


26 posted on 07/12/2005 12:51:56 PM PDT by GOP_1900AD (Stomping on "PC," destroying the Left, and smoking out faux "conservatives" - Take Back The GOP!)
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To: Shermy
Or it might be one of these guys or their recruits. Sounds like a convert to islam to me. Wasn't the 2nd pic from GB? Can't remember exactly back to when the original article was posted.



In response to their banners, I'd just like to say, only when pigs fly.


27 posted on 07/12/2005 12:52:42 PM PDT by F15Eagle
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To: PogySailor

Use of the word "dialogue" with AQ and "it's all about Palestine" and peculiar specific knowledge about media appearances, all lefty obsessions.


28 posted on 07/12/2005 12:52:47 PM PDT by Shermy
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To: tobyhill

" I believe the enemy has now turned out to be every Muslim on the face of this earth."

Interesting point of view and one shared by many here I suspect. If you believe Muslims to be the enemy then do you also think that the Iraq war a waste of lives and money. After all this war to liberate and set free muslims - your enemy. Why go to all that trouble to free the enemy, sure we've killed a fair number of them but far more of them will end up with an improved lifestyle in the end. Would not it have been better to leave Saddam in charge, after all his government was secular and he was doing a good job of killing Muslims


29 posted on 07/12/2005 12:56:12 PM PDT by Ignatius J Reilly
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To: MadIvan
I'm going to get a t-shirt that says "Nuke Palestine".

Never fear; FReepers will get the bail money to you, when the PC constables arrest you for breach of civility, or creating a disturbance.

Do you take PayPal?LOL

30 posted on 07/12/2005 12:56:29 PM PDT by ApplegateRanch (The world needs more work horses, and fewer Jackasses!)
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To: AppyPappy
8,000? I rather doubt that.

I doubted that to and looked it up. But most resources give the total at 7000-8000 men and boys. But the "massacre" took place over a three plus year time period.

31 posted on 07/12/2005 12:57:07 PM PDT by Between the Lines (Be careful how you live your life, it may be the only gospel anyone reads.)
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To: ToveL

"The tragedy is that this reader and I undoubtedly have much in common — but what divides us is unbridgeable, unless the Muslim community starts to unpick the truth from the lies they have been told for so long."

Quite a bit to swallow.

The only way they can start to unpick is if our MSM stops feeding it.


32 posted on 07/12/2005 12:57:45 PM PDT by timsbella (Mark Steyn for Prime Minister of Canada!)
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To: ApplegateRanch

Some disturbances are worth creating. Some messages are worth saying. I am absolutely, totally fed up with the whole "pity the poor Palestinians" rubbish. They made it clear what kind of people they are when they cheered September 11th. I don't normally favour genocide, but anyone who celebrated that event deserved a bullet in the head.

Regards, Ivan


33 posted on 07/12/2005 12:58:51 PM PDT by MadIvan (You underestimate the power of the Dark Side - http://www.sithorder.com/)
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To: Between the Lines

If I remember correctly, they couldn't find the mass burial sites to verify the numbers.


34 posted on 07/12/2005 12:59:33 PM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: Alexander Rubin
I do not think that Judaism is an inherently violent religion despite every evil committed in it's name by Israel.

Playing the Israel is at fault card I see.

35 posted on 07/12/2005 12:59:57 PM PDT by RetiredArmy (The U.S. government and courts are stealing your freedom & liberty!)
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To: OK

"The Serbs learned to be uncompromising with Islam through hundreds of years of experience. That is why they are still not Islamic."

Right on! Something to consider as our friends the Saudis build mosques across America.


36 posted on 07/12/2005 1:00:05 PM PDT by clearlight
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To: tobyhill
This peace by appeasement has been a failed effort by many previous administrations...

Casper Wineberger, on Hannity yesterday, related a fantastic story about Pres. Reagan. After making the infamous "Evil Empire" speech, a career diplomat came up to him and said, "Congratulations, Mr. President, you have just destroyed 20 years of carefully lied diplomacy". To which, the president replied something along the lines of, "Good, look where your 20 years of carefully laid diplomacy has gotten us".

We need a statesman, on the national level to come out and denounce Islam for what it is, and totally destroy all the appeasement that has gone on. We need to start from scratch and say once again, to every Muslim, "You are either with us, or against us. If you are with us, reform Islam, now. If you are against us, continue down the path you've taken so far." We should then treat them accordingly.

37 posted on 07/12/2005 1:01:03 PM PDT by Turbo Pig (...to close with and destroy the enemy...)
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To: ToveL
Israel was created (from stolen Arab land)

I quit right here. The rest, I'm sure, is totally predictable. I don't think there will be grounds for cooperation with moderate Muslims anymore although I believed it at one time. I'm no longer interested in root cause analysis, mutual understanding, or anything of the sort. Israel has the right idea building barriers and keeping them out. They have no place in the civilized world.

38 posted on 07/12/2005 1:01:07 PM PDT by johniegrad
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To: RetiredArmy

Yep.


39 posted on 07/12/2005 1:01:12 PM PDT by Alexander Rubin (You make my heart glad by building thus, as if Rome is to be eternal.)
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To: ToveL

out of the mouths of terrorists comes their own condemnation


40 posted on 07/12/2005 1:01:39 PM PDT by NoClones
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To: Incorrigible; Lion in Winter; Destro; Honorary Serb; jb6; DTA; ma bell; joan; vooch; ...
Yeah, it was propaganda that led to Srebrenica and had nothing to do with terrorists raiding Serb farms and villages out of this UN "Safe Zone" (safe for whom, we might ask)!

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

And if you believe that, I have a couple dozen acres of prime real estate in Southeastern Kosovo to sell you. Prospective buyers are advised to wear a Kevlar vest, not to wear any Christian or Judaic symbols, and not to speak in any Slavic-sounding language.
41 posted on 07/12/2005 1:02:55 PM PDT by FormerLib (Kosova: "land stolen from Serbs and given to terrorist killers in a futile attempt to appease them.")
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; ...
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

..................

42 posted on 07/12/2005 1:04:57 PM PDT by SJackson (On the second try, I got that jug off, but then I had a bear tied to a tree)
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To: Shermy
50-50 this is a lefty posing as a Muslim.

Its both interesting and increasing frightening how indistinguishable they have become.

43 posted on 07/12/2005 1:05:44 PM PDT by usurper (Correct spelling is overrated)
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To: F15Eagle

IMHO the flying pig would be a potent weapon in the WOT.
Of course, it would not be PC to use the aerial porker cause its use could be considered as profiling as it is ROP specific.


44 posted on 07/12/2005 1:06:44 PM PDT by Straight8 (I am unique, just like everyone else.)
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To: Ignatius J Reilly
Would not it have been better to leave Saddam in charge, after all his government was secular and he was doing a good job of killing Muslims.

Only if one wishes to ignore the fact that he was actively funding and facilitating terrorists. And you won't find anyone stupid enough to buy into that around here, unless they're just some DUmmie disruptor, that is.

45 posted on 07/12/2005 1:06:51 PM PDT by FormerLib (Kosova: "land stolen from Serbs and given to terrorist killers in a futile attempt to appease them.")
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To: Incorrigible; FormerLib

Destro has been banned or suspended.


46 posted on 07/12/2005 1:07:55 PM PDT by joan
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To: ToveL

Gives speaking out of both sides of the mouth a whole new dimension, doesnt it?


47 posted on 07/12/2005 1:09:11 PM PDT by Alkhin ("Oh! Oh!" cried my idiot crew. "It's a ghoul - we are lost!" ~ Jack Aubrey)
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To: timsbella
The only way they can start to unpick is if our MSM stops feeding it.

Our MSM...and their imams.

The e-mail is a veritable monument to misinformation.

48 posted on 07/12/2005 1:11:46 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: IGNORANCE ON PARADE)
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To: Shermy

Hmmmm?? That's what I thought too - when I read that statement.


49 posted on 07/12/2005 1:12:09 PM PDT by CyberAnt (President Bush: "America is the greatest nation on the face of the earth")
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To: johniegrad

When you sleep with the vipers and do not expect to get bit you are one stupid piece of humanity and totally dangerous to the entire world! aka London


50 posted on 07/12/2005 1:12:26 PM PDT by Tannerone
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